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commercial real estate


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2013 Aug 22, 5:12am   4,420 views  79 comments

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Was wondering if anyone had any helpful advice they could share.

In my hometown, a friend is looking to clean up some of his debts, in order to take on other new debts to expand his business venture. His brother told me that he figured he'd sell this building in town, if there was a good offer.

So I'm trying to determine first, what a good offer would look like, and second, where to go to shop for a loan for commercial RE. Also, was wondering what are the general parameters and requirements

The building is fully rented

3 - 1 br apt @ 450
1 - 2 br apt @ 550
1- retail shop @ 1000

For a total monthly income of 2900

He said the building appraised for 244k a year ago

#housing

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41   Eman   2024 Feb 17, 6:48am  

AD says

A Chicom company abandoned these high rises in Los Angeles : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oceanwide_Plaza

Now they are victim to graffiti vandalism : https://laist.com/news/downtown-los-angeles-graffiti-taggers-high-rise

Wonder if these high rises will get bought out by an American firm or organization and will be finished.

What's your opinion on these abandoned high rises, Eman ?

The lender(s) will have to foreclose and take a hit. A developer will buy it for the right price and complete it. High cost to build, high interest rate, and the weak housing environment started in the 2nd half of 2022 had basically killed these projects.

During time of crisis, liquidity = value. Our regional/portfolio lenders require us to submit our Personal Financial Statement (PFS) and Schedule of Real Estate Owned once a year to verify we’re still in good standing financially.

Unlike residential real estate, every step I take in commercial real estate has to be measured. No reason to take on unnecessary risk at this point in my life and create a fiasco. People who ask for the repeal of Prop 13 actually want to see others suffer and turn people’s life upside down without putting thoughts into it. They’re thinking like the communist. Be very careful of them.

In my circle of acquaintances, we try to help everyone get ahead regardless of our political differences. Real estate and finance are our daily exchanges. We talk about politics and religions, but we know where everyone stands. We don’t let these ruin our friendship and business ventures.
42   FortwayeAsFuckJoeBiden   2024 Feb 17, 6:55am  

Eman i understand, if you guys short half mil, you got an interested investor here.
43   Eman   2024 Feb 17, 7:04am  

FortwayeAsFuckJoeBiden says


Eman i understand, if you guys short half mil, you got an interested investor here.

Consider open a money market account with Fidelity or Interactive Broker and make 5-5.25% safely for not doing anything if you haven’t done it already. The money is liquid and earning income while you’re looking for a deal. That’s like $2k/month. That can pay for a lot of nice lunches and dinners with your spouse.

Good luck Fort Wayne 🤞
44   Eman   2024 Feb 17, 7:16am  

Seeing the debate on both sides why Trump should be fined $357M, or whatever, for inflating the value of his assets, etc…. The people who are anti-Trump are clueless IMO. Banks do their due diligence before they lend. They ask for bank statements, tax returns, etc… They hire an appraiser to assess the value of the asset/collateral and only lend a portion of the loan amount based on the appraised value, not whatever Trump claims. Also, the banks will verify that his cash flow/income can support the debt in addition to his living expenses, etc….
45   GNL   2024 Feb 17, 7:24am  

Eman says

People who ask for the repeal of Prop 13 actually want to see others suffer and turn people’s life upside down without putting thoughts into it. They’re thinking like the communist. Be very careful of them.

I do not agree at all. I do not live in Cali but it blows my mind how it is fair for people to be taxed differently. Can a person in California lock in prices for anything else? Can I lock in the price of gas when I bought my first car back in 1980? Or lock in my car insurance bill from 1980? Why not, seems as fair as locking in my property tax bill.
46   Eman   2024 Feb 17, 7:34am  

GNL says

Eman says


People who ask for the repeal of Prop 13 actually want to see others suffer and turn people’s life upside down without putting thoughts into it. They’re thinking like the communist. Be very careful of them.

I do not agree at all. I do not live in Cali but it blows my mind how it is fair for people to be taxed differently. Can a person in California lock in prices for anything else? Can I lock in the price of gas when I bought my first car back in 1980? Or lock in my car insurance bill from 1980? Why not, seems as fair as locking in my property tax bill.

If you believe people move every 7 years, then Prop 13 is not an issue.

If you want to ban Prop 13, I’m all for it. However, there must be a process to do that. You have to phase it in over a period of time while. special assessments, which are included in the property taxes at this time, which were not there pre-Prop 13 must be phase out.

As I previously mentioned, I’m fine with banning or phasing out Prop 13. Give me a proposal. Cricket. Banning Prop 13 without phasing out special assessments AND getting rid of rent control and all the city fees (these didn’t exist before rent control and Prop 13) is THEFT.
47   Eman   2024 Feb 17, 7:41am  

Everyone is giving a fair chance to but NOW and keep Prop 13 on their property taxes.

I came to this country without speaking the language. I bought my first house without knowing anything about Prop 13. Wife and I bought our 2nd house without knowing about Prop 13. We bought our 3rd house, for 4.5x the amount of our first house and 3x our 2nd house, and pay a lot in property taxes each year. We don’t complain. Everyone is giving a fair chance to start NOW. Stop whining and start working and getting ahead
48   Eman   2024 Feb 17, 7:55am  

Just looked at this deal last week. 12 units. See what rent control does to this building? The tenant who is paying $523 has been living here for 47 years. See how the 5 high paying tenants are subsidizing for the 7 low paying tenants?

Let’s ban Prop 13. Let’s also ban rent control. Let’s also ban the city rent control housing department and ban all the associated fees that go with it. Oh, and don’t forget to ban all the special assessments that the city has been tagging on the property taxes all these decades. Let property owners have their rights and charge these tenants market rents. Does this proposal sound fair?


49   GNL   2024 Feb 17, 8:00am  

Eman says

If you want to ban Prop 13, I’m all for it.

But you said people who want to eliminate Prop 13 are thinking like the communists.
50   Eman   2024 Feb 17, 8:04am  

GNL says

Eman says


If you want to ban Prop 13, I’m all for it.

But you said people who want to eliminate Prop 13 are thinking like the communists.

They are because they don’t offer solutions. They just want to ban it. TAKE, TAKE and TAKE. That’s what communists do.

I asked for a proposal/solution but none was given.
51   GNL   2024 Feb 17, 8:07am  

Eman says

Stop whining and start working and getting ahead.

I certainly do not disagree with this statement but, I do find it weird to be so nonchalant about fairness in taxation. In fact, it seems you are nonchalant about most things. This is how those in power are given room to fuck everything up. Just look at California and the absurdity it is. Free healthcare for the invaders? How many billions in debt? No gas cars beginning, what is it, 2025/26? Wookie is absolutely correct, Cali is a shithole. At some point, it will be a fullblown communist state. They will take everything from you if this keeps going.
52   Eman   2024 Feb 17, 8:11am  

If I were KING, I would eliminate state income tax so retirees don’t have to move out of CA to save money.

If I were KING, I would consider eliminate property taxes for all retirees too. At a minimum, I would encourage retirees to downsize in exchange for eliminating their property taxes.
53   Eman   2024 Feb 17, 8:26am  

GNL says

Eman says


Stop whining and start working and getting ahead.

I certainly do not disagree with this statement but, I do find it weird to be so nonchalant about fairness in taxation. In fact, it seems you are nonchalant about most things. This is how those in power are given room to fuck everything up. Just look at California and the absurdity it is. Free healthcare for the invaders? How many billions in debt? No gas cars beginning, what is it, 2025/26? Wookie is absolutely correct, Cali is a shithole. At some point, it will be a fullblown communist state. They will take everything from you if this keeps going.

Fairness in taxation? CA is one of the states with highest taxes and they want more tax revenues? Those, who agree with the State, are calling for eliminating Prop 13. CA doesn’t have a revenue problem. It has a spending problem.

You don’t live here so you don’t understand the local politics. I can’t explain the complexity of Prop 13 and rent control here for you. In short, the cities make landlords pay for all kinds of fees and use the fees to support the tenants fighting against the landlords in court if there’s ever a dispute.

Check out this short video clip. It’s a true story. I have 2 friends, one went through this last year, and one is currently going through this. Tenant hasn’t paid rent for 3 years. Now, he has to pay the tenant to leave. We run our rentals very carefully so we don’t have to deal with this stuff. Also, we’re in Santa Clara County where the laws are being enforced unlike San Francisco and Alameda Counties.

https://www.instagram.com/california.insider/reel/C2DoI-auPnl/
54   GNL   2024 Feb 17, 8:32am  

Eman, even more proof that California is a shithole. You should have sold everything between 2021/2022 and left. Just my opinion. You and your progeny will be trapped there forever.
55   Eman   2024 Feb 17, 8:37am  

Due to the Covid moratorium, couldn’t evict the tenant until it was lifted in July. The court was backed up with files. Finally got to the judge. The tenant claimed the place is uninhabitable. If the place is uninhabitable, landlord can ask the tenant to vacate so he can remodel the place, but he has to pay relocation fees in the teens thousands in Alameda County I believe.




56   Eman   2024 Feb 17, 8:40am  

GNL says

Eman, even more proof that California is a shithole. You should have sold everything between 2021/2022 and left. Just my opinion. You and your progeny will be trapped there forever.

Not all CA is a shit hole. It varies from county to county. Once in the Central Valley, it gets very red. Along the Bay, very blue. The blue people believe they’re “smarter” and “know better” than the red people.
57   Eman   2024 Feb 17, 8:41am  

It’s the land of opportunity if you know how to navigate the landline. Jealousy folks are the ones who stir up more problems without offer solutions. That’s why most of them, or their kids, with tattoos and blue hair work at Starbucks and fast food places.
58   Eman   2024 Feb 17, 8:53am  

GNL says

Eman says


Stop whining and start working and getting ahead.

I certainly do not disagree with this statement but, I do find it weird to be so nonchalant about fairness in taxation. In fact, it seems you are nonchalant about most things. This is how those in power are given room to fuck everything up. Just look at California and the absurdity it is. Free healthcare for the invaders? How many billions in debt? No gas cars beginning, what is it, 2025/26? Wookie is absolutely correct, Cali is a shithole. At some point, it will be a fullblown communist state. They will take everything from you if this keeps going.

2035 I believe. I don’t know how much of CA Wookie has been to to make that statement. Just like people who have only been to South Chicago saying Chicago is a shithole.

I have billionaires living within 30 minutes of where I live. Mark Zuckerberg, the two Google founders, Meg Whitman, John Sobrato, George Marcus, the Spieker brothers, just to name a few…. The reason I know the latter 4 persons because of real estate.

If we compare, I believe we have more billionaires living in CA compared to any other states, or even the world. Elon Musk used to live in Palo Alto before relocated to SoCal. Most VC live in the Bay Area too. How could anyone say CA is a shithole? Of course it’s Wookie. He knows….everything.
59   GNL   2024 Feb 17, 10:25am  

Eman says

It’s the land of opportunity if you know how to navigate the landline. Jealousy folks are the ones who stir up more problems without offer solutions. That’s why most of them, or their kids, with tattoos and blue hair work at Starbucks and fast food places.

That was funny. And true, I'm sure.
60   GNL   2024 Feb 17, 10:28am  

Eman says

How could anyone say CA is a shithole? Of course it’s Wookie. He knows….everything.

Ok, you've made me laugh twice today now. I say the whole state of Cali because the state is ruled by the blue people from above. The state can do the most damage, no?
61   Blue   2024 Feb 17, 12:45pm  

California rich commies would always defend 1978 Prop 13 to loot the state!
No example is enough to convince rich to stop looting.
https://calmatters.org/california-divide/2022/04/california-prop-13-neighborhoods/
The owner of a 6,740-square-foot mansion in San Francisco estimated to be worth $9 million paid $5,625 in property taxes in 2020, according to the Tax Fairness Project, which analyzed county tax records and market values in home buying websites such as Zillow. Across the bay in Richmond, the owner of a 991-square-foot home worth $331,000 and in need of repairs paid almost as much tax at $5,240.
Where-else this kind of tax out of control disproportions exist at state, these numbers are much wider for businesses!
https://www.taxfairnessproject.org/
62   Eman   2024 Feb 17, 1:10pm  

Blue says

California rich commies would always defend 1978 Prop 13 to loot the state!
No example is enough to convince rich to stop looting.
https://calmatters.org/california-divide/2022/04/california-prop-13-neighborhoods/
The owner of a 6,740-square-foot mansion in San Francisco estimated to be worth $9 million paid $5,625 in property taxes in 2020, according to the Tax Fairness Project, which analyzed county tax records and market values in home buying websites such as Zillow. Across the bay in Richmond, the owner of a 991-square-foot home worth $331,000 and in need of repairs paid almost as much tax at $5,240.
Where-else this kind of tax out of control disproportions exist at state, these numbers are much wider for businesses!
https://www.taxfairnessproject.org/

Keep repeating like a parrot while offering no comprehensive solutions.

For old Patnet timers, remember Iwog’s wife, who inherited a SFH in Lafayette, an affluent part of the Bay Area, and also the low property tax basis? They live there. Iwog is as left as they come wouldn’t anyone agree? Did you hear the whining a bitching from this immigrant about Prop 13? Thank god I don’t look at the world from your viewpoints. Phew…..
63   GNL   2024 Feb 17, 1:45pm  

Blue says

California rich commies would always defend 1978 Prop 13 to loot the state!
No example is enough to convince rich to stop looting.
https://calmatters.org/california-divide/2022/04/california-prop-13-neighborhoods/
The owner of a 6,740-square-foot mansion in San Francisco estimated to be worth $9 million paid $5,625 in property taxes in 2020, according to the Tax Fairness Project, which analyzed county tax records and market values in home buying websites such as Zillow. Across the bay in Richmond, the owner of a 991-square-foot home worth $331,000 and in need of repairs paid almost as much tax at $5,240.
Where-else this kind of tax out of control disproportions exist at state, these numbers are much wider for businesses!
https://www.taxfairnessproject.org/

Kind of shitty reporting that it's White neighborhoods that get the tax breaks. While I agree Prop 13 is a terrible idea, I loath racist reporting. Btw, those who benefit from something will NEVER disagree with it.
64   ForcedTQ   2024 Feb 17, 1:58pm  

Blue says

California rich commies would always defend 1978 Prop 13 to loot the state!
No example is enough to convince rich to stop looting.
https://calmatters.org/california-divide/2022/04/california-prop-13-neighborhoods/
The owner of a 6,740-square-foot mansion in San Francisco estimated to be worth $9 million paid $5,625 in property taxes in 2020, according to the Tax Fairness Project, which analyzed county tax records and market values in home buying websites such as Zillow. Across the bay in Richmond, the owner of a 991-square-foot home worth $331,000 and in need of repairs paid almost as much tax at $5,240.
Where-else this kind of tax out of control disproportions exist at state, these numbers are much wider for businesses!
https://www.taxfairnessproject.org/


How does wanting to limit the amount of money the Gov takes from you yearly based upon a perceived valuation that utilizes currency that is manipulated with continuous negative adjustments make one a commie?
65   RWSGFY   2024 Feb 17, 2:05pm  

Eman says


Due to the Covid moratorium, couldn’t evict the tenant until it was lifted in July. The court was backed up with files. Finally got to the judge. The tenant claimed the place is uninhabitable. If the place is uninhabitable, landlord can ask the tenant to vacate so he can remodel the place, but he has to pay relocation fees in the teens thousands in Alameda County I believe.







Landlording w/o being connected is such a waste of time and money, lol.

3 years to evict some deadbeat asshole? Jeezus!
66   Blue   2024 Feb 17, 2:21pm  

GNL says


Btw, those who benefit from something will NEVER disagree with it.

Yes, those with poor ethics would degrade CA like 3rd world over the period of time.
67   Eman   2024 Feb 17, 5:42pm  

RWSGFY says

Eman says



Due to the Covid moratorium, couldn’t evict the tenant until it was lifted in July. The court was backed up with files. Finally got to the judge. The tenant claimed the place is uninhabitable. If the place is uninhabitable, landlord can ask the tenant to vacate so he can remodel the place, but he has to pay relocation fees in the teens thousands in Alameda County I believe.







Landlording w/o being connected is such a waste of time and money, lol.

3 years to evict some deadbeat asshole? Jeezus!

Another friend went through it with over 2 years of rent not collected before the eviction. His tenants were UC Berkeley football players. No need to mention the color of their skins.

On the day of eviction, the sheriffs showed up, opened the door, and found a dog and bunch of puppies. They turned his house into a dog breeding place. Had to hold off everything and called animal control.

While he wasn't getting his rents, these guys were partying hard with cash allover the floor and posting their stuff on Instagram wearing $1.5k Dior shoes and driving a Tesla Model X.

He had to spend tens of thousands to remodel the place. He wanted to sell and gave me the money to 1031 exchange into something. This was last summer/fall. Bad timing. No deal to be had so he re-rented the place.

Check out this short video clip. It happened to quite a few landlords in SoCal and NorCal. Thankfully, this didn’t happen to us with just over 100 units. 🙏

https://www.instagram.com/california.insider/reel/C2DoI-auPnl/
68   WookieMan   2024 Feb 17, 8:07pm  

GNL says

Eman says


How could anyone say CA is a shithole? Of course it’s Wookie. He knows….everything.

Ok, you've made me laugh twice today now. I say the whole state of Cali because the state is ruled by the blue people from above. The state can do the most damage, no?

First off I do know everything ;) I still don't think you've answered me the last time you've left CA. I travel regionally, nationally and internationally almost every month. CA is a shit hole, though I'll give SOCAL and NOCAL some credit. Talking the tips of the state. The rest is pure shit unless you're into Disney and other theme parks, an orange bridge that guides you into a city filled with shit, a bunch of homeless, an island prison, a bunch of illegals, tons of gays, Hollywood (Jesus Christ....), fires, power outages, earthquakes, and did I mention gays.....

There's other shit too. Be protective of your assets there. I don't care how many rich Asians move in. The game is coming to an end. Asians and foreigners are running out of money faster than we are. Chicago is a cold weather city, but it has stabilized from its worst era. CA and specifically LA and the Bay area the fun is just beginning. You'll see.

You might have been lucky so far, but if you're in the business long enough you'll get burned. Some times enough to make you broke. I saw enough in 15 years of RE. Don't get greedy or a big ego. It will eat you and your wealth. I'm an anecdotal guy. I've seen it over and over. That includes my own father. Just because you're hot now down't mean you will be in 5 years.
69   AD   2024 Feb 17, 8:38pm  

WookieMan says

You might have been lucky so far,


Yeah, I wonder what percentage of Eman's net equity (or net gain) is in real estate, and how much is total net equity is (which would include stocks, ETF's, CD's, etc.).

Is all of Eman's real estate equity in shithole California ?

I also extend a lot of heartfelt gratitude to all the Patnet members who are posting that California is a 3rd world shithole.

.
70   AD   2024 Feb 17, 8:48pm  

WookieMan says

You might have been lucky so far,


Also the value of California housing is a lot dependent on foreign buyers. When that money dries up for various reasons, then the value of California housing goes down. Also housing prices are dependent on the growth of technology companies and Hollywood.

When the stock market does not do well, then the California state government finances goes to shit as well.
71   Eman   2024 Feb 17, 9:32pm  

GNL says

Eman says


It’s the land of opportunity if you know how to navigate the landline. Jealousy folks are the ones who stir up more problems without offer solutions. That’s why most of them, or their kids, with tattoos and blue hair work at Starbucks and fast food places.

That was funny. And true, I'm sure.

I’m not kidding. Check out this 30-sec video clip, and I’m not a Christian. 😅

https://x.com/bennyjohnson/status/1759028111851635173?s=46&t=5lEEPaezr6Ic-W4Z6huZ5Q
72   WookieMan   2024 Feb 18, 1:38am  

AD says

Also the value of California housing is a lot dependent on foreign buyers. When that money dries up for various reasons, then the value of California housing goes down. Also housing prices are dependent on the growth of technology companies and Hollywood.

There for is going to be a shift. It is dark everywhere in the winter. We've been fortunate with a warm one here in IL. Most my buddies have moved to MT and CO. I don't know a person that's moved to CA. Only outbound.

I don't think Asian migration will fill the gap. CA is losing people making $100M+ The Raiders moved to Vegas. That's a massive loss. CA is losing some massive taxpayers. Silicon Valley doesn't need to be there. They can recreate it in Florida or Texas. CA is not in a good spot is all I'll say as an outsider.
73   GNL   2024 Feb 18, 6:19am  

Eman says

I’m not kidding. Check out this 30-sec video clip, and I’m not a Christian. 😅

https://x.com/bennyjohnson/status/1759028111851635173?s=46&t=5lEEPaezr6Ic-W4Z6huZ5Q

That's California? All I can say is, get out now.
74   FortwayeAsFuckJoeBiden   2024 Feb 18, 4:13pm  

i don’t think ca is shithole, but culture there is why everything is the way it is. love of money is root of all evil, and i lived there long enough and seen that love of money ruin it.
75   stereotomy   2024 Feb 18, 5:08pm  

To get women, it takes time and money: W = T X M
But, as we all know, time is money:: T= M
Thus, a woman is the product of time and money: W = T X M = M X M = M ^2
Now, as we all know, money is the root of all evil, namely: sqrt(E) = M
That leads to: W = M^2 = (sqrt(E) X sqrt(E)) = E

Women are evil = QED.
76   Eman   2024 Feb 18, 5:39pm  

FortwayeAsFuckJoeBiden says

i don’t think ca is shithole, but culture there is why everything is the way it is. love of money is root of all evil, and i lived there long enough and seen that love of money ruin it.

Like anywhere else, we have to take the good with the bad. I don’t see myself moving anywhere as both sides of the family are rooted here in the Bay Area. All other in-law siblings are also here.

I know people who have gotten very wealthy with startups and company stock options. I also know people who have been making good money, but haven’t struck the same luck so it sucks for them to make $150-200k/year and can’t get ahead.

Love Bay Area weather. Love the food and conveniences. Love the opportunities. HATE the politics. SoCal has slightly better food choices though. Love SoCal too.

My trustee sale mentor is from SoCal/SD area. He moved to NC in 2015 to be close to his daughter and grandkids. Her hubby got a job promotion and had to relocate. He’s close to 80 now. Time flies.


77   Eman   2024 Feb 18, 5:44pm  

GNL says

Eman says


I’m not kidding. Check out this 30-sec video clip, and I’m not a Christian. 😅

https://x.com/bennyjohnson/status/1759028111851635173?s=46&t=5lEEPaezr6Ic-W4Z6huZ5Q

That's California? All I can say is, get out now.

Don’t see it happening in my lifetime.
78   GNL   2024 Feb 18, 7:22pm  

Eman says


HATE the politics.

A person's conscience leads their life. If you are doing good in the world, good on you.
79   Eman   2024 Feb 18, 7:47pm  

GNL says

Eman says



HATE the politics.

A person's conscience leads their life. If you are doing good in the world, good on you.

Seeing some people in my circle and folks on BiggerPockets suffered during the Covid moratorium while I have more units without feeling the pain, I told myself my karma is paying off. 🙏

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