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turtledove
2014 Jul 10, 7:45am
Rin, is it possible that the reason you feel the need to flesh out your feelings on the matter of having children is because you, yourself, are feeling conflicted about it? I have no doubt that people respond with shock that you don't want children. But if you truly, beyond any shadow of a doubt, don't want children, you realize you own your choices and aren't required to explain anything to anyone? You shouldn't have to talk yourself into definite feelings about having or not having children. And also realize that it's okay even to change your mind. You don't have to have all your life's choices laid out like an irrevocable contract.
Rin
2014 Jul 10, 7:48am
I have no doubt that people respond with shock that you don't want children. But if you truly, beyond any shadow of a doubt, don't want children, you realize you own your choices and aren't required to explain anything to anyone?
I've come here because my current job, being in sales for a hedge fund, is slowly driving me insane.
Thus, it's a good way of getting therapy for my real problem and that's that I'm some *Bobcat of Wall St*, which isn't my real nature.
I promise that when this job is over, I'll only come here and boast about how great my life is.
Interesting topic that really doesn't have a right or wrong answer. I too decided not to have kids but I have friends who do and one of them who I never imagined in a million years had a kid a few years ago and he is a different person. Totally devoted loving family man. I can appreciate that. Its everyone's personal decision really.
As far as women, I can't help that some of you are too bitter. The reason is because some of the over-generalized comments about women- like the ones about US women- for starters isn't going to win you any dates. Second of all its just stupid to make that assumption. I too started dating fairly late. In fact I never had a GF all through high school of college. It wasn't until I was in my late 20's that I started dating and I dated A LOT of women. Some were good experiences, some were not. Ultimately people are very different from one another and if one person isn't an ideal match then try and try again because its just a matter of finding the 'right' person.
Being bitter is the best way to stay single. Look at every date and every person as a fresh opportunity. Looking back to past relationships and assuming that other people are like that too is pointless and counterproductive.
Rin
2014 Jul 10, 7:58am
over-generalized comments about women- like the ones about US women- for starters isn't going to win you any dates. Second of all its just stupid to make that assumption. I too started dating fairly late. In fact I never had a GF all through high school of college. It wasn't until I was in my late 20's that I started dating and I dated A LOT of women.
I work for a hedge fund. I'm hounded by women, all of the time. I didn't realize that being a full time BS artist was so attractive. I also practice Martial Arts and stay in excellent shape.
And yes, since I'd crossed that age of innocence, 26-29, the good ones were already settled and what's left are the Alanis Morrisettes, aka damaged goods.
Being emotionally independent, I don't need 'em and at the same time, they find me so attractive (because I don't need 'em), that they ditch other *nice guys* to follow me around. This is almost akin to the "bad" boy syndrome except that I don't take advantage of women, only our clients' funds.
Heraclitusstudent
2014 Jul 10, 8:19am
What it is is this middle class lifestyle ... work & then, raise a family with spouse. One trip to DisneyWorld per year. Story over.
Vs independently wealthy ... work (which now means writing, research, martial arts, teaching, etc) and then, rest & recreation (diving, seeing strippers, etc).
Having kids is a middle class pattern? I was confused into thinking it's a pattern of life for the past few hundred million years.
The middle classer above is orthogonal to the Renaissance man below because it's not the stripper per se, but the fact that he has control over his time and resources.
This is not about an overdeveloped sense of control for every seconds. Control is what let's you choose what to do with this time and resources, including having kids. You cannot define control as avoiding anything that truly impacts your life. I'm pretty sure many renaissance men had kids.
Besides if you are rich, you can pay a couple of nannies to do a lot of the work, and leave you most of your time.
As far as money is concerned, what other good use of it is there? A bigger car? A larger TV? more luxurious vacations? There comes a point where almost everything you can do with money is meaningless.
Heraclitusstudent
2014 Jul 10, 8:21am
what's left are the Alanis Morrisettes, aka damaged goods.
You are looking for perfection and you won't find it.
Find one who is damaged in an interesting way.
Strategist
2014 Jul 10, 8:24am
Family is all that matters. Everything else is just noise.
This.
I used to not want to have kids, but last year I got married and we now have a 6 month old girl.
It's the best thing to ever happen to me. I absolutely love it.
Wonderful. The baby now starts playing, responding and owns daddy.
Welcome to slavery. It's awesome.
Rin
2014 Jul 10, 8:44am
Rin, do you know kids love ducks.
Nice try.
If you said that the kid wanted to be my research assistant, then you've got something.
Strategist
2014 Jul 10, 9:11am
Family is all that matters. Everything else is just noise.
This.
I used to not want to have kids, but last year I got married and we now have a 6 month old girl.
It's the best thing to ever happen to me. I absolutely love it.
Wonderful. The baby now starts playing, responding and owns daddy.
Welcome to slavery. It's awesome.
Have you all noticed, even though we only see black and white words here, we can still sense the emotions behind the words?
What I sense from CrazyMan is delight, love and surprise.
I bet he comes home as soon as he can from work just to play with the baby. And when they go shopping, the first place is the baby section. And when he is with friends, baby is all he can talk about.
he he he. Been there done that.
Strategist
2014 Jul 10, 9:21am
Family is all that matters. Everything else is just noise.
This.
I used to not want to have kids, but last year I got married and we now have a 6 month old girl.
It's the best thing to ever happen to me. I absolutely love it.
Wonderful. The baby now starts playing, responding and owns daddy.
Welcome to slavery. It's awesome.
Ha Ha...the baby is 6 months old, he only has 17-1/2 years to go...
Let's see what he says when she becomes a teenager and the hormones kick in!!
He he he :)
Eman
2014 Jul 10, 9:24am
Family is all that matters. Everything else is just noise.
This.
I used to not want to have kids, but last year I got married and we now have a 6 month old girl.
It's the best thing to ever happen to me. I absolutely love it.
Rin,
To echo what Crazyman said, you don't know what you don't know. InhVe been married for almost 13 years. We have a 4.5 year old daughter. I would trade all of my wealth for her. Your kids have 1/2 of your DNA. The way they talk, behave, their personality, etc. remind you of your own self. It makes you appreciate your parents. But then again, you will not know what I'm talking about until you have experienced it.
Peter P
2014 Jul 10, 9:33am
My friend, what took you so long to decide? :-)
Kids is a terrible investment, in ANY interest-rate environment.
Unless they are goat kids. At least you can make cheese.
Rin
2014 Jul 10, 9:35am
They are using just a few small representations, mostly from some not so good situations and anecdotal observations
You mean like over 2/3's of the ppl I know.
Kinda like your mother saying "try it, you might like it"..
Last time my mother did that, I got heartburn.
Peter P
2014 Jul 10, 9:39am
Many that have spoken out here about NOT wanting kids don't know what they don't know.
We never fully know what we do not know. But not wanting kids appears to be epistemically robust.
Rin
2014 Jul 10, 9:41am
My friend, what took you so long to decide? :-)
This is more the Declaration of Independence to the PatNet community.
After all, it is that time of year, however, the analogous Boston Massacre, leading up to the Congress, was years back.
Heraclitusstudent
2014 Jul 10, 9:43am
You mean like over 2/3's of the ppl I know.
Are your friends also working on WS and dating gold diggers?
Just saying... not a promising starting point.
Heraclitusstudent
2014 Jul 10, 9:44am
We never fully know what we do not know. But not wanting kids appears to be epistemically robust.
Unless people don't know what they really want :-)
Dan8267
2014 Jul 10, 9:48am
Your kids have 1/2 of your DNA.
No, you are thinking of bananas.
Some random guy on the other side of the world has over 99.9% of your DNA.
At this point in time, you're not significantly helping to make copy of your genes by reproducing. Every time anyone has a kid, that kid contains over 99.9% of your genetic code.
Rin
2014 Jul 10, 9:56am
Kinda like your mother saying "try it, you might like it"..
Last time my mother did that, I got heartburn.
How about the other things you tried that you DID like?
Well, here's the thing, my mother told me that fruits and vegetables were good for me.
Since I already liked raspberry sorbet and celery with blue cheese along with buffalo wings, it didn't exactly come across as a startling revelation.
Plus, I hated it when she put lettuce on the burgers.
Heraclitusstudent
2014 Jul 10, 10:08am
you're not significantly helping to make copy of your genes by reproducing.
99.9% sounds like a lot, but I wouldn't want to leave things to a guy who is 98.4% chimp DNA.
Besides when your kid smiles to you with your eyes, it's beyond analytical reasoning.
Dan8267
2014 Jul 10, 10:36am
99.9% sounds like a lot, but I wouldn't want to leave things to a guy who is 98.4% chimp DNA.
We are ALL 98.4% chimp by DNA. Conversely, chimps are 98.4% human by DNA. If you are defining yourself in terms of your genes, there is no line between humans and non-humans. It's all fuzz.
MisdemeanorRebel
2014 Jul 10, 10:40am
Two songs every teenage boy should commit to memory:
Nuthin from Nuthin by Billy Preston
Sundown by Gordon Lightfoot
The lyrics are key, and if remembered during any encounter, will save a lot of tears/headache/child support later.
BTW, the person that inspired Sundown not only threw Gordon a curveball, but went on to push Belushi over the edge.
Strategist
2014 Jul 10, 10:43am
99.9% sounds like a lot, but I wouldn't want to leave things to a guy who is 98.4% chimp DNA.
We are ALL 98.4% chimp by DNA. Conversely, chimps are 98.4% human by DNA. If you are defining yourself in terms of your genes, there is no line between humans and non-humans. It's all fuzz.
Many humans would be better off with more of the chimp genes, especially here.
Dan8267
2014 Jul 10, 10:46am
Two songs every teenage boy should commit to memory:
Nuthin from Nuthin by Billy Preston
Sundown by Gordon Lightfoot
I disagree. This is the song every teenage boy should commit to memory...
New Renter
2014 Jul 10, 11:12am
Kinda like your mother saying "try it, you might like it"..
Last time my mother did that, I got heartburn.
Plus you HAVE to buy to try whether you like it or not.
John Bailo
2014 Jul 10, 11:14am
The more I read stories about teen mothers smothering their babies the more I think every human female should get an IUD after her first period.
These can then be removed, by court order, after proving she and whoever wants to help her, have at least 2 million in the bank for the care, feeding and education of the kid.
After that the IUD goes right back in.
New Renter
2014 Jul 10, 11:24am
Family is all that matters. Everything else is just noise.
This.
I used to not want to have kids, but last year I got married and we now have a 6 month old girl.
It's the best thing to ever happen to me. I absolutely love it.
Rin,
To echo what Crazyman said, you don't know what you don't know. InhVe been married for almost 13 years. We have a 4.5 year old daughter. I would trade all of my wealth for her. Your kids have 1/2 of your DNA. The way they talk, behave, their personality, etc. remind you of your own self. It makes you appreciate your parents. But then again, you will not know what I'm talking about until you have experienced it.
It can go the other way too.
There has been many a time I have seen someone with a severely disabled child. In most cases the person looks like s/he is in a permanent state of wishing someone would put a bullet in his/her head and end the misery of a lifetime of 24/7/365 caretaking.
Rin
2014 Jul 10, 11:25am
In most cases the person looks like s/he is in a permanent state of wishing someone would put a bullet in his/her head and end the misery of a lifetime of 24/7/365 caretaking.
Ouch! New Renter, you've really got the STEM/slam dunk maneuver down to an art. I was going easy on the optimists :-).
Rin
2014 Jul 10, 11:30am
BTW, the person that inspired Sundown not only threw Gordon a curveball, but went on to push Belushi over the edge.
Gordon Lightfoot, man, that's my parent's generation!
Even I can't remember him, though I've heard covers of 'If You Could Read My Mind'
I guess in some way, classic rock radio needs some more variety, not just Led Zep, Deep Purple, Grand Funk, etc, since I know all the more heavily played artists.
MisdemeanorRebel
2014 Jul 10, 12:27pm
I guess in some way, classic rock radio needs some more variety, not just Led Zep, Deep Purple, Grand Funk, etc, since I know all the more heavily played artists.
It's always been that way, at least since the late 80s. Hour after Hour of Led Zep, Queen, and Cream.
When I was a kid trying to play bass, the only music available at the Guitar Store was Stevie Ray Vaughn or Led Zep. Now I find the most obscure songs on the internet are tabbed.
True Story: During my first and only guitar lesson back around 1990, I told the teacher I wanted to learn to play some RHCP songs.
He said, "What is that crap, Red Hot Tamales or whatever. How about Inna Gadda Da Vida?"
It's too bad that the parents of everyone on Patnet didn't seriously consider ABORTION.
Strategist
2014 Jul 10, 12:47pm
It's too bad that the parents of everyone on Patnet didn't seriously consider ABORTION.
What would we do without you, Hey You?
1. If you think your friends' kids are not good enough, try your hand and make better kids;
2. Having kids and having a wife are two different issues. Make babies, and take good care of them and the mother(s); just don't marry them. That's all.
New Renter
2014 Jul 10, 1:14pm
In most cases the person looks like s/he is in a permanent state of wishing someone would put a bullet in his/her head and end the misery of a lifetime of 24/7/365 caretaking.
Ouch! New Renter, you've really got the STEM/slam dunk maneuver down to an art. I was going easy on the optimists :-).
Pollyannaism is a pet peeve of mine.
turtledove
2014 Jul 10, 1:23pm
I can't speak to all kinds of disabilities, but I've known several parents with Down's children. Not a single one wished that the kid wasn't a part of their lives. Of course, they were very worried when they learned that they were having a child with problems. But they unilaterally say that the child has given them more than they thought possible. I've never seen a parent of a Down's child wishing for a bullet in his/her head. I think that's an over-reach.
Eman
2014 Jul 10, 1:28pm
InhVe been married for almost 13 years. We have a 4.5 year old daughter. I would trade all of my wealth for her.
Sorry, not buying it because the timing looks like it was early in life.
You don't have to buy it, and I'm not trying to convince you. I dated my wife for over 7 years. Married her at the age of 28. Had our first baby girl at 36. I haven't had a full time for almost 5 years.
As you know, I invest in real estate. Now, I make my money from real estate syndications, referrals, and passive income from real estate investments. I don't go to work. I spend most of my time with my daughter. We go eat, shop, park and hang out together at snack shops. How cool is that being able to be a stay at home dad while 98% of other dads have to go to work? I wouldn't trade it for anything.
I never knew of this miracle feeling until my wife gave birth to my daughter. I was so happy when she came out of my wife's womb that I cried.
Like I said above, you don't know what you don't know, and I'm not going to waste my time trying to convince you. You do what makes you happy. At the end of the day, you don't know what you don't know.
Cheers. 😜😜😜
Strategist
2014 Jul 10, 1:34pm
I never knew of this miracle feeling until my wife gave birth to my daughter. I was so happy when she came out of my wife's womb that I cried.
Like I said above, you don't know what you don't know, and I'm not going to waste my time trying to convince you. You do what makes you happy. At the end of the day, you don't know what you don't know.
Cheers. 😜😜😜
When's the next baby coming?
E-Man, get your wife to make another one while she is still under 35.
Who is doing the disliking to my two posts? I'm telling him to take good care of the woman and the children, just don't say yes to the legal formality of marriage. You can spend 80+ hours a week with the children, heck even live with the mother if you wish; MA is one of those states that reject common law marriage. So long as you do not sign the marriage papers, there is no legal marriage, so you can have the children and the woman you love without her taking over your life via divorce threat. Marry her when you are ready to die, so she can inherit all your assets without having to pay taxes.
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Ok, it's been said before but I'll say it again.
I see myself as a creative and intelligent person who, if born rich, would be a Renaissance man doing my own research, engaging in numerous activities.
Thus, my goal in life is to become independently wealthy and do the above.
Now, since many of my pals have had children and so forth, I'm absolutely astonished at how lame and boring these kids are. At best, they parrot TV shows and break toys, to the best of their abilities. In contrast, when I was a kid, I was dreaming of writing screenplays, inventing a lightsaber, and so forth.
Yes, my parents squashed my dreams and made me think of engineering, accounting, and so on but at least when I got started, I had bigger dreams.
But now, I've come to accept these facts. Yes, for the most part, children are lame and at best, one can hope that they don't get in trouble with the law or sleep in your basement for life. Those parents, whose kids are the next Alexander Hamilton or Buckminster Fuller, are the fortunate ones.
With that said, I have no incentive nor motivation to have my own. When I'm an old man, I'll be like Frank Lloyd Wright, constantly writing down ideas and working on things of interest without having a lifelong kid/adult sleeping near my study spaces.