patrick.net

Yep, more proof that the left and the right are the same. That's why they are both equally conservative.

Dan8267 says

Obviously you haven't paid attention to the last election. This is quite normalized.

In contrast, Kathy Gifford made a tasteless and unfunny joke. Sure, criticize her for that, but it does not compare to the serious threats of violence by conservative. And yes, both the conservative left and the conservative right are violent.

Are you kidding?

If Sean Hannity had done the same thing to Obama's head, he would have been prosecuted and served time in prison.

Also, wtf is "conservative left". Are you trying to call Kathy Griffin a conservative?

Goran_K says

If Sean Hannity had done the same thing to Obama's head, he would have been prosecuted and served time in prison.

Bullshit.

Goran_K says

Also, wtf is "conservative left".

Leftists are conservatives just like the right. The left and the right are virtually identical differing only in unimportant and arbitrary cultural preferences. Their core beliefs are the same, specifically
1. People should not be equal under the law. Some people should have privileges. The left and the right will want different privileges for different people, but they still want privileges, not rights.
2. People should not be allowed to do things even if those things do not violate other people's rights. Again, the left and the right will have different list of prohibited things, bu they are still following this principle whether it's banning flag burning or hate speech.
3. There should be secrecy in government actions. The left and right will keep different secrets, but they both are for this.

Clearly, the left and the right are both conservative. To say otherwise is a bold face lie. And these two tribes are not alone. ISIS, pseudo-feminists, Christian fundamentalists, creationists, and whale eaters are also conservative tribes. Put simply, conservatism comes in different flavors, but they are all made from the same ingredients.

The person hanging an effigy of Trump is no different than the person hanging an effigy of Obama. And anyone who says that either is more like Henry Fonda or Noam Chomsky than the other hangman is simply lying or a fool.

The violence of anti-Trump protesters is the same as the violence of the Trump supporters. They are both thugs. They use the exact same tactics. They hold the exact same beliefs as stated in the list above.

This is not a hard concept to grasp, but I'll draw a picture for you.

Dan8267 says

Leftists are conservatives just like the right. The left and the right are virtually identical differing only in unimportant and arbitrary cultural preferences. Their core beliefs are the same, specifically

1. People should not be equal under the law. Some people should have privileges. The left and the right will want different privileges for different people, but they still want privileges, not rights.

2. People should not be allowed to do things even if those things do not violate other people's rights. Again, the left and the right will have different list of prohibited things, bu they are still following this principle whether it's banning flag burning or hate speech.

3. There should be secrecy in government actions. The left and right will keep different secrets, but they both are for this.

So name people you believe are left liberals.

Goran_K says

errc says

I cashed out, bigly. Free money

Sure you did.

Posted here at patnet.

Bought Hilldog-300
Bought Trump +420

See there's this thing called arbitrage, but it seems thats a little beyond your pay grade.

But very honest of you to quote my post with the Clinton wager, and not the Trump one. You win!

Goran_K says

So name people you believe are left liberals.

A liberal, by definition, believes
1. All people are equal under law. We are a nation of rights, not privileges, and everyone has the same right.
2. People should be allowed to do what they want as long as they aren't infringing upon the rights of others. There should be no victimless crimes.
3. Government should be transparent and accountable for its actions.

The people you call "leftist liberals" do not meet this definition and therefore are not liberals. Since they disbelieve in the above principles, they are, by definition, conservatives. The entire liberal vs conservative fight has always been about these three principles, not about arbitrary cultural preferences like do you listen to Garth Brookes or Adele.

These three principles are the core issues in every debate on U.S. policy from climate change to warfare to legalize pot to same sex marriages to Wikileaks to gerrymandering to the war on drugs to voting rights and voter ID laws to the draft to the rich-poor gap. Unless you are talking in terms of these principles, you aren't talking about the core issues.

And the bottom line is that the left and the right are virtually identical on these issues and are the exact opposite of liberals. You don't get to impose deliberately misleading labels. The left and the right have almost everything in common. Their only differences are arbitrary and unimportant. No labeling will change this critical fact.

Dan8267 says

A liberal, by definition, believes

1. All people are equal under law. We are a nation of rights, not privileges, and everyone has the same right.

2. People should be allowed to do what they want as long as they aren't infringing upon the rights of others. There should be no victimless crimes.

Therefore you are not a Liberal because you want the power of the State to ban private religious belief and have basically said Republicans should be locked up because they don't believe in the same policies as you.

You want to infringe on the rights of others.........like all Commie Totalitarians have done in the past.

Anyhoo - have you managed to identify a "Liberal" in American political life that meets your definition? Certainly there has to be someone.

Dan8267 says

A liberal, by definition, believes

1. All people are equal under law. We are a nation of rights, not privileges, and everyone has the same right.

2. People should be allowed to do what they want as long as they aren't infringing upon the rights of others. There should be no victimless crimes.

3. Government should be transparent and accountable for its actions.

The people you call "leftist liberals" do not meet this definition and therefore are not liberals. Since they disbelieve in the above principles, they are, by definition, conservatives. The entire liberal vs conservative fight has always been about these three principles, not about arbitrary cultural preferences like do you listen to Garth Brookes or Adele.

These three principles are the core issues in every debate on U.S. policy from climate change to warfare to legalize pot to same sex marriages to Wikileaks to gerrymandering to the war on drugs to voting rights and voter ID laws to the draft to t...

Okay, so who are actual liberals? Name some people.

Dan8267 says

Oh, by the way, Fort Wayne, it looks like your team is still doing that whole lynch the black guy thing. At least Kathy Gifford, comedian, was making a bad joke. Your team is serious on the whole lynching thing, and they've done it many times in the past.

One difference between the ones you show and the ones Twoscoops showed is that the Trump ones are Media productions not some random idiot like with the Obama ones. There are always going to be nuts on both sides nothing is ever going to stop that, but on the left it is sanctioned and produced by the media.

It wasn't right wing, it was everyone telling liberals "wtf is wrong with you people".

Clearly you still have no idea why your team has issues.

jazz music says

#epically_triggered.

Ring wing reacts in hysteria, demands safe space.

Dan8267 says

A liberal, by definition, believes

1. All people are equal under law. We are a nation of rights, not privileges, and everyone has the same right.

2. People should be allowed to do what they want as long as they aren't infringing upon the rights of others. There should be no victimless crimes.

3. Government should be transparent and accountable for its actions.

socal2 says

Therefore you are not a Liberal because you want the power of the State to ban private religious belief and have basically said Republicans should be locked up because they don't believe in the same policies as you.

Not even remotely close. Christians violate the rights of others all the fucking time. It's a rare exception that Christians aren't violating basic rights. From slavery to gay marriage bans, throughout the entire scope of history, including American history specifically, Christianity has been used to severely violate the rights of others. Since I'm forced to choose between basic human rights like free speech and marriage and the right to practice delusional rituals, I'll gladly choose the former over the later.

Besides, America has never had freedom of religion. Want to make human sacrifices? Illegal. Want to dance naked in the forest? Illegal. Want to take spiritual drugs? Illegal. Refuse to join the military when drafted? Illegal. Refuse to contribute to war in any matter at all? Illegal. Refuse to pay taxes for wars? Illegal. You cannot even follow the commandment "thou shalt not kill" in America. Indirectly through taxation, you are forced to murder people including children. So don't give this bullshit that giving special privileges to Christianity is somehow freedom of religion. That's complete hypocritical bullshit.

Want to try again about how I don't follow those principles? Go on. You get three lives in this game.

socal2 says

Anyhoo - have you managed to identify a "Liberal" in American political life that meets your definition? Certainly there has to be someone.

Goran_K says

Okay, so who are actual liberals? Name some people.

There are many, most of which are not famous. However, even if there were zero liberals including myself, my statements would still be true. The merits of a political philosophy is not determined by popularity. If it were, than Nazism would have had great merits.

In any case, the poster boy for liberalism is Noam Chomsky, and he has written and spoken extensively on politics and policy. So if you are going to attempt to poison the well, he's your target. However, a liberal being a bad person does not invalidate the philosophy. You'd have to show that the philosophy itself is bad, and you fuckers can't do that. I can point out shitloads of bad Christians. Hitler comes to mind. Does Hitler by himself invalidate all of Christianity?

The difference between fools and wise men is that fools look for examples of people who are in a group to show that the platform of the group is wrong, and this is logically invalid. The wise man attacks the platform itself. I can name shitloads of bad things about Christianity itself without mentioning a single Christian. You cannot do the same regarding liberalism.

But hey, prove me wrong. Show how the three principles of liberalism are bad things and why we should reject them. Go on, grow a pair of balls and do that.

rpanic01 says

One difference between the ones you show and the ones Twoscoops showed is that the Trump ones are Media productions not some random idiot like with the Obama ones. There are always going to be nuts on both sides nothing is ever going to stop that, but on the left it is sanctioned and produced by the media.

You've missed the real point. The left and the right are the same side. As much as they hate each other, they are one the side of irrationality, tribalism, and state enforced culture. We liberals are on the side of rationality, freedom, and cultural agnosticism. That's the real war being fault. It's always been that war and not about which bathroom people can use.

Learn to see the forest from the trees.

jazz music says

Originally Quakers dominated and discriminated against Catholics and Jews.

Until Wiccans can dance naked in the streets, parks, and woodlands, there is no freedom of religion in America.

Until I don't have to pay a single cent for our immoral military, there is no freedom of religion in America.

Until pot heads can take whatever mind-altering drugs they want to have spiritual experiences, there is no freedom of religion in America.

If we can outlaw all those religious practices, we should treat all religions equally by outlawing them all.

Gloria, Gloria, I think Griffin's got your daughter's number...

Holds head of President. Family complains - but she's the one being bullied. Oy Vey.

... oh man, the Left must be groaning about this. Will they defend her?

TwoScoopsMcGee says

Gloria, Gloria, I think Griffin's got your daughter's number...

I think she's found the alias you've been living under, oh Gloria.

I miss Laura Branigan. She was great.

Goran_K says

errc says

I cashed out, bigly. Free money

Sure you did.

Perssonally, I like when my friends win money. I figure that they'll buy the beer.

Dan8267 says

In any case, the poster boy for liberalism is Noam Chomsky

Chomsky is one of the biggest supporters of statism on the entire planet. He's a huge supporter of the welfare state, and gun control. I thought liberals had to think "we are a nation of rights not privileges" and "People should be allowed to do what they want as long as they aren't infringing upon the rights of others"? Doesn't seem to pass your own sniff test.

I've actually seen Chomsky speak and debate live, his views are convoluted. He supports libertarian, marxist, and anarchist positions depending on the subject.

I'd say using your own criteria, Dave Rubin is a true modern liberal.

Goran_K says

Kathy Griffin on the other hand was employed by CNN

The debate question leaking network.

Whether or not you like Chomsky's economic beliefs, he's clearly not represented by the conservative left. Chomsky does not hang or decapitate effigies. He does not shout down free speech. He does not support antifa. He did not support Hillary. His exact words were "hold your nose and vote for her" because Trump is worse. That's not support. It's capitulation to choosing the lesser of two evils.

Chomsky frequently criticized Obama, and made far more compelling arguments against that president than Fox News ever could.

So my point is proven. The left is as conservative as the right.

You pick....

From all Dan's promotion hard to tell isn't it....

Sure, I'll pick. Clearly the shit advocated by Graybox and the shit advocated by Trigglypuff are basically the same, whereas liberalism is entirely different from both of those things.

Again, Graybox lacks the intellectual fortitude to present a single reason why any of the following principles are bad.
1. All people are equal under law. We are a nation of rights, not privileges, and everyone has the same right.
2. People should be allowed to do what they want as long as they aren't infringing upon the rights of others. There should be no victimless crimes.
3. Government should be transparent and accountable for its actions.

And that says everything you need to know.

#lawyered

It's all wrong people! When you can no longer hold a civil debates without calling for violence against the people who disagree, free speech is threatened, not to mention reasoning, intelligence. I'm starting to think ApocalypseFuck isn't kidding about cannibal anarchy.

jazz music says

Oh bull fucking shit!

That's the only retort a baseless assertion merits.

jazz music says

Oh bull fucking shit!

LOL LOL LOL

Which part? Chomsky's having anarchist/socialist views depending on the topic or me seeing him live? Kind of confused.

Yeah... Lead by example and un-ban all those fine people instead of building an arena where you try to shove it down every ones throat....
And that says everything you need to know.

You and I are debating right now -- and I use that term loosely because once more instead of talking about the issues, you are acting like a child.

jazz music says

LOL at least you took out that part about Chomsky's libertarian views LOL!

I wouldn't call Chomsky a libertarian, and I don't think he would call himself one either. He's the quintessential liberal.

Goran_K says

Which part? Chomsky's having anarchist/socialist views depending on the topic or me seeing him live? Kind of confused.

I love Chomsky's views shilling for Pol Pot and denying the Cambodian genocide.

socal2 says

I love Chomsky's views shilling for Pol Pot and denying the Cambodian genocide.

I see the batshit crazy right is still being batshit crazy. How is there room for all those delusions in your head?

jazz music says

superior freedom of speech

Did CNN invite him to host the New Year's show? I must have missed that.

jazz music says

FUCKIN' A

NOBODY DEFENDS FREEDOM OF SPEECH?

OKAY I DO.

I DEFEND KATHY GRIFFIN'S RIGHT TO FREE SPEECH.

And we have the right to not want to hear it again. Because beheading Americans is a crime and should not be embraced. Me saying that her behavior is inappropriate is my freedom of speech. You like what she did, you are free to travel to Syria and join ISIS.

jazz music says

FUCKIN' A

NOBODY DEFENDS FREEDOM OF SPEECH?

She has a right to free speech just like you and I. But that doesn't mean there aren't consequences. For example, how she chooses to direct her free speech may be a violation of her employer's policy.

Trump didn't force CNN to fire her. Trump didn't force her comedy venues to cancel her.

She brought this upon herself but she is too blinded be leftist entitlement to accept this point.

jazz music says

He would go on to say other things too, like a joke about assassinating Harry Reid, and that Obama and Hillary Clinton “should be tried for treason & hung.”

Calling for a trial is now the same as simulating the decapitation of the President? WILD!

jazz music says

Censorship is not speech.

Go yell BOMB on the plane, or insult random people on the street, then tell us all about your "freedom" if you still alive.

jazz music says

Snarky bastards can't even express a coherent thought. You are welcome to read only Tenpoundbass.

Your problem is that your heart is filled with discord. You are upset, being a liberal Democrat does that sort of thing to human brain. Tell you what, seek Christ. That is a solution to all the problems, it'll fix your mental health and make you a better person. Love and Forgiveness are your friend.

jazz music says

Do you feel frustrated about not having authority over people?

I think you just nailed FortWayne.

www.youtube.com/embed/6iRff_gqxc0

jazz music says

And censorship is STILL not speech, damn!

The President is censoring Kathy Griffin?

Was Chik Fil'a or that Sewing Franchise censored?