patrick.net

Patrick

Why do you stay in California? I assume you are not stuck there with no means of leaving.

WineHorror1 says

Patrick

Why do you stay in California? I assume you are not stuck there with no means of leaving.

Yes and we know Patrick is not tied down to home ownership there. Easier from him to move to Idaho.

There are many much better states to live in.

I’m telling you, sanctiary policies will only change if illegals start murdering wealthy liberal elite. No one in power gives a shit about peasants dying.

FortWayneIndiana says

I’m telling you, sanctiary policies will only change if illegals start murdering wealthy liberal elite. No one in power gives a shit about peasants dying.

Exactly right.

The singular of data is not anecdote.
Studies, not Fox New bullshit headlines, have shown that illegal and legal immigrants have far lower rates of criminality than home-grown white thugs.
Pure bullshit, xenophobia and racism. Frankly, America would be a better place if you swapped every Trump supporter over the border for a desperate immigrant trying to escape some American-made shit hole in Latin America.

The studies are far from conclusive either way. As noted, most studies combine legal and illegal immigrants into one group. Legal immigrants are indeed far more law abiding than native - because any illegal activity and they can have their immigration status revoked. So, obviously, if I am a legal immigrant into a country I am going to be far more law abiding. I went through the LEGAL process - I want to be here. And I don't think anyone is questioning legal immigration - it doesn't apply to sanctuary cities which is all about protecting the criminally illegal.

And if you look at financial costs, almost all studies seem to conclude that there is a cost to having a high ILLEGAL population. Debate continues on how much that cost actually is....

And, btw, most of the studies that are reliable have been done by the Cato institute which is a right wing, libertarian think tank. And their general view is also that criminal activity is less than native but for a variety of reasons. Their site has numerous reports, etc...

HOWEVER, that is not the issue here. If people enforced the laws and we did not provide criminal sanctuary for illegals then we would not have these murders. That is the point. You and I as citizens are subject to detainer. I don't really care for the argument "oh, it is ok because, really, if you look at all crime, these folks are less likely in the aggregate to commit a crime". Not the point.

This did get me thinking about party affiliation as well for crime. I have no idea of the research quality since I was just browsing, but most sites I check showed violent crime is more affiliated with democrats than republicans. Probably not a surprise I suppose and variation wasn't too extreme. But, I don't think swapping Trump supports to the South will help with crime... Although, as I have said, Trump is not a Republican - he is really despised within the party but they need him (for now). Trump is the ultimate populist, similar to Jackson...
Ex:
http://www.roperld.com/personal/politics/ViolentCrime.htm

Expat01 says

The singular of data is not anecdote.
Studies, not Fox New bullshit headlines, have shown that illegal and legal immigrants have far lower rates of criminality than home-grown white thugs.
Pure bullshit, xenophobia and racism. Frankly, America would be a better place if you swapped every Trump supporter over the border for a desperate immigrant trying to escape some American-made shit hole in Latin America.

Your argument is wrong and probably racist (you have to say home grown WHITE!THUGS! in order to show how bad and evil those fucking white people are)
The incarceration rate for illegals is about 44% of domestic rate (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2018/06/19/two-charts-demolish-the-notion-that-immigrants-here-illegally-commit-more-crime/?noredirect=on).
Incarceration rate for US total is about 900/100 000 inhabitants (https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2018/05/02/americas-incarceration-rate-is-at-a-two-decade-low/)
This means illegals are incarcerated at a rate of about 400/100 000.
White incarceration rate is 380/100 000 (https://www.prisonpolicy.org/graphs/raceinc.html). This is lower than incarceration rate for illegals.
Furthermore, if the particular illegal in story would have been deported from US - country where he is illegally - the woman in question would still be alive. Non-enforcement of immigration laws has caused this woman's death. Idiots who do not enforce these laws are indirectly responsible for her death.

d6rB says

The incarceration rate

And the incarceration rate is usually lower than the perp rate. And since there are sanctuary cities and many localities don't aggressively pursue illegals with petty and often fairly serious crimes (DUI, Burglary), the rate is much lower than it oughta be.

In many states, they don't even bother with illegals over moving violations, knowing they won't pay and unlike native Americans, are harder to track with SSNs and addresses from marriage licenses, birth certificates, utility bills, etc.

Expat01 says

The singular of data is not anecdote.
Studies, not Fox New bullshit headlines, have shown that illegal and legal immigrants have far lower rates of criminality than home-grown white thugs.
Pure bullshit, xenophobia and racism. Frankly, America would be a better place if you swapped every Trump supporter over the border for a desperate immigrant trying to escape some American-made shit hole in Latin America.

Funny. And in 25 years the white xenaphobes would have created shangri la and what is now America would look like a shithole. Too funny.

Expat01 says

Studies ... have shown that illegal ... immigrants have far lower rates of criminality than

If there were no illegal immigrants the overall criminality would be even lower and this is what should be the ultimate goal. Let's kick them the fuck out, it's not legal for them to be here anyway.

Expat01 says

New bullshit headlines, have shown that illegal and legal immigrants have far lower rates of criminality than home-grown white thugs.

Don't 100% of illegal immigrants commit crimes?

WineHorror1 says

Patrick

Why do you stay in California? I assume you are not stuck there with no means of leaving.

@WineHorror1 The answer is mostly that I finally once again found a job I really love. My last such job was 1999 to 2004. I really can't think of any good reason to complain about my current job. I'm not on pager duty, the pay is fine, the insurance coverage is amazing, the work is interesting, the location is good, the people are great overall. Maybe I won't get rich at it, but that's OK.

Also, I've been in the Bay Area so long (22 years now) that most of my friends are here, and even a few relatives I didn't know about when I first arrived. It would be pretty hard to leave all that.

So there are always tradeoffs. I don't like the housing prices, the shit on the sidewalks, or the 98% of tech workers who are violently intolerant towards even mild and well-reasoned questioning of The Narrative. But if I leave, I lose a lot of good things along with the bad.

Patrick says

WineHorror1 says

Patrick

Why do you stay in California? I assume you are not stuck there with no means of leaving.

@WineHorror1 The answer is mostly that I finally once again found a job I really love. My last such job was 1999 to 2004. I really can't think of any good reason to complain about my current job. I'm not on pager duty, the pay is fine, the insurance coverage is amazing, the work is interesting, the location is good, the people are great overall. Maybe I won't get rich at it, but that's OK.

Also, I've been in the Bay Area so long (22 years now) that most of my friends are here, and even a few relatives I didn't know about when I first arrived. It would be pretty hard to leave all that.

So there are always tradeoffs. I don't like the housing prices, the shit on the sidewalks, or the 98% of tech workers who are vio...

I apologize for putting you on the spot. I get it. Roots can be difficult to pick up. Glad to hear you like your job. That's certainly a big deal. I abhor mine. If you don't mind me asking...what does your current job duties entail?

I'm working on a React Native app in a team at the moment. I love Javascript, but I think React Native is a horror show of complexity and dependency, and most sites should use Progressive Web Apps to get almost the same functionality with one tenth the effort.

But if you really want a native app, then React Native does at least spare you the pain of developing two separate codebases to deal with the Goople duopoly. You can have just one codebase. Though of course then you have a big dependency on Facebook, which is no more trustworthy than Google or Apple.

It's mostly my company and the people there that I really like.

FortWayneIndiana says

No one in power gives a shit about peasants dying.

What I don't get is why anybody votes for these morons. I mean who runs on a platform of give illegals the right to vote, let them all of them in, so they can take your jobs and you know what else, what candidate runs on higher taxes and abolishing ICE, who wants to take your guns and kill your babies as a kind of retroactive abortion, how does someone run on that shit and get elected?

I'll tell you how: Trump derangement syndrome and ballot harvesting, which is legalized election stealing in the state of California.

WineHorror1 says

The answer is mostly that I finally once again found a job I really love

You don't have to explain yourself to an arrogant bully, if I'm reading WineHorror 1's comments correctly, it was like he was saying, 'so if you don't like it here, why don't you leave?' Something an arrogant bully would say.

I'm glad to hear you are happy overall with your job and doing so well. It gladdens my heart to know happiness rules, while politics can make you angry and you're always dealing with shit heads in politics. Well, I shouldn't say always, but there are a lot of uncompromising assholes in politics. When dealing with politics I find it is mostly a dirty business, full of corruption and power hungry mad people with big egos.

Now Trump, he has a big ego. You have to have a HUGE ego do what he does. No wimp is going to accomplish what he has in life. But, I truly believe he has a big heart and he has true love for his country, and that's mixed in there with all the other shit unfortunately, but he's the genuine article. What you see, is what you get. I think he's great, and that's why the Dems hate him so much, cause he isn't a total lying sack of shit like Snake Schumer and Nancy Pelosi. Trump's a real leader, unlike those cowards in the Democratic party, who hide behind a mask of virtue, and call Trump a "racist" because they have run out of good arguments and have no sound policy platform.

WillPowers says

WineHorror1 says

The answer is mostly that I finally once again found a job I really love

You don't have to explain yourself to an arrogant bully, if I'm reading WineHorror 1's comments correctly, it was like he was saying, 'so if you don't like it here, why don't you leave?' Something an arrogant bully would say.

I'm glad to hear you are happy overall with your job and doing so well. It gladdens my heart to know happiness rules, while politics can make you angry and you're always dealing with shit heads in politics. Well, I shouldn't say always, but there are a lot of uncompromising assholes in politics. When dealing with politics I find it is mostly a dirty business, full of corruption a...

Calm down, you're looking for oppression anywhere you can find it.

Patrick says

I'm working on a React Native app in a team at the moment. I love Javascript, but I think React is a horror show of complexity and dependency, and most sites should use Progressive Web Apps to get almost the same functionality with one tenth the effort.

But if you really want a native app, then React Native does at least spare you the pain of developing two separate codebases to deal with the Goople duopoly. You can have just one codebase. Though of course then you have a big dependency on Facebook, which is no more trustworthy than Google or Apple.

It's mostly my company and the people there that I really like.

Thanks for taking the time to answer my questions.

d6rB says

Non-enforcement of immigration laws has caused this woman's death.

IF all Irish immigrants had been denied entry because of a few murderous Irish that had come earlier, then neither Patrick nor I would be here.

These things are not as simple as you want to make them.

d6rB says

Idiots who do not enforce these laws are indirectly responsible for her death.

Which laws ? The ones that say all illegals need to be deported ? The ones that say hiring illegals is a serious crime ?

marcus says

Which laws ? The ones that say all illegals need to be deported ?

It likely has to do with the environment of enforcing the immigration laws. A lax environment will create a greater risk that this type of murder by the illegal immigrant will occur.

Besides that, the enforcement is ineffective if nearly everyone crossing the border is considered an asylum seeker and allowed to stay within the USA awaiting their asylum hearing.

marcus says

IF all Irish immigrants had been denied entry because of a few murderous Irish that had come earlier, then neither Patrick nor I would be here.

Irish came legally, without breaking laws during entry. You are again confusing legal vs. illegal immigration.

marcus says

Which laws ? The ones that say all illegals need to be deported ? The ones that say hiring illegals is a serious crime ?

Both. Lock up those who do not enforce deportation of illegals, and those who hire them (such as chairmen of food packaging companies and builders). Fine those who hire illegals at $100 K per each illegal employed. Make CEO's personally criminally responsible for hiring illegals.

WineHorror1 says

Calm down

Sorry, I'm a very excitable person, although I can look at myself objectively and see my faults. I don't always have human interactions in perspective, so I take it you were just asking him and not provoking him.

Again my apologies. I was out of line.

Hacer que América vuelva a ser grande

marcus says

IF all Irish immigrants had been denied entry because of a few murderous Irish that had come earlier, then neither Patrick nor I would be here.

The Irish also came at a time when there was no welfare state of any kind.

The Irish weren't murdering anybody in the US blindly. There were a few incidents, and even some WW1 sabotage, but most of those were reported by other Irishmen. Same with Italian Anarchists and Jewish Communists (the Rosenbergs were turned in by a cousin and hounded by the legendary McCarthy Staffer Roy Cohn, a mentor of Donald Trump)

The attitude was to become an American.

My Great Grandfather WAS an illegal, a Cooper who jumped ship in the 1890s, because he found out that Americans made a shitton more than he made working for the Hannover Lines ship he was employed on. BUT, he paid a fine of several months wages to become legal, and became as militant an American as he was an super-Anticlerical Protestant. Not a Muslim from Pakistan who believed in Sharia, encouraged to stay 'authentic' by society at large like today.

I don't remember all the details but I believe he had to pay Federal AND NYC fines, one because his kids were enrolled in public school and he was required to pay NYC back. Imagine NYC doing that today.

marcus says

IF all Irish immigrants had been denied entry because of a few murderous Irish that had come earlier, then neither Patrick nor I would be here.

That's fine then compromise and throw those out that commit a crime - instantly. Lengthy criminal record - nuff said. For each two kicked out they can let one so-far peaceful aspiring new immigrant in.

Marcus doesn't know how to respond to MisterLearnCodes last comment :-)

d6rB says

You are again confusing legal vs. illegal immigration

I wasn't confusing it.

The point still holds, even if you can't see it.

Let me try to help. Would an argument of stopping legal Irish immigration becasue of past Irish immigrant murderers ever been made ? I know, it probably was. But I don't think it holds much water.

marcus says

The point still holds, even if you can't see it.

Certainly seems like your points confused legal vs illegal. If you didn't then your logic is weak af

Try this, either directly respond to a point or make a point of your own w/o the purposeful ambiguity

Cboe, dont count on Marcus doing that. He is a master of not only TDS but also deception.

AD says

Cboe, dont count on Marcus doing that. He is a master of not only TDS but also deception.

Let's be honest. Replace the word "master" above with the word victim and then the statement is accurate. People with TDS suffer from deception of self, reinforced by MSM and the narrative.

marcus says

Would an argument of stopping legal Irish immigration becasue of past Irish immigrant murderers ever been made ?

This argument had never been made for any group. You fake news assumptions seem to be at the core of why you arent on the same page as others in this forum.

Trump has been very clear his policy is to increase legal immigration based on the candidates value to our country.

@Marcus is either lying or allowing himself to believe a lie which is repeating. Unclear

marcus says

Let me try to help. Would an argument of stopping legal Irish immigration becasue of past Irish immigrant murderers ever been made ? I know, it probably was. But I don't think it holds much water.

You are moving goal posts.
Irish came legally. Some of them were murderers, most not. Legal immigrants who commit crimes should be incarcerated and then deported. According to this reasonable standard, Patrick would still be here.
Illegals are here illegally. Some of them are murderers, most not. All of them are breaking laws by their presence here and should be deported. This has no bearing on legal immigration.

6rdB says

You are moving goal posts.
Irish came legally. Some of them were murderers, most not. Legal immigrants who commit crimes should be incarcerated and then deported. According to this reasonable standard, Patrick would still be here.
Illegals are here illegally. Some of them are murderers, most not. All of them are breaking laws by their presence here and should be deported. This has no bearing on legal immigration.

Yep, there was no welfare during the classic immigration period. You worked or you starved the moment you got off the boat.

Anyway, all my ancestors came here legally and assimilated quickly.

That's all I would ask of immigrants today.

1. Don't break the law getting here.
2. Put America above all other loyalties.

I am opposed to dual citizenship as well. Either US or nothing else - give up US citizenship if you want to get UK, etc.... Dual citizenship just allows gaming of the system for the well off.

Agreed.