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Texas’ Wind Power Generation Cut In Half Due To Winter Storm
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2021 Feb 15, 2:10pm 6,956 views 98 comments
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33
NDrLoR
2021 Feb 16, 5:31pm
NDrLoR
2021 Feb 16, 5:31pm
Everything still on in Waco--I have a year old gas furnace that is keeping the house at a constant 73 deg, running 24/7. I usually shut it off overnight, but not this time. I just hope if we have freezing rain tomorrow it won't bring down power lines.
34
Booger
2021 Feb 16, 5:42pm
Booger
2021 Feb 16, 5:42pm
NDrLoR says
Yeah, I run my furnace more if I think that there might be a strong induced electricity outage.
I have a year old gas furnace that is keeping the house at a constant 73 deg, running 24/7. I usually shut it off overnight, but not this time. I just hope if we have freezing rain tomorrow it won't bring down power lines.
Yeah, I run my furnace more if I think that there might be a strong induced electricity outage.
36
RC2006
2021 Feb 16, 7:10pm
RC2006
2021 Feb 16, 7:10pm
Friends in Texas have water and power out they are burning firewood and running oven to keep house in 50s.
37
Eric Holder
2021 Feb 16, 8:19pm
Eric Holder
2021 Feb 16, 8:19pm
"We can live with some intermittency and rationing—at least until batteries and other forms of energy storage are up and running everywhere....we don’t need the entire residential third of U.S. electricity consumption to run off lithium or to operate seamlessly. We don’t need Nest or permanent telecommuting. For a while, let’s eat a cold dinner here and there. Continuity costs too much."
https://patrick.net/post/1335554/2020-10-12-to-save-the-climate-give-up-the-demand-for-constant-electricity
https://patrick.net/post/1335554/2020-10-12-to-save-the-climate-give-up-the-demand-for-constant-electricity
38
Maga_Chaos_Monkey
2021 Feb 16, 9:26pm
Maga_Chaos_Monkey
2021 Feb 16, 9:26pm
Yeah, fuck off and wear a sweater eh asshat (@bostonreview)?
39
Ceffer
2021 Feb 16, 10:22pm
Ceffer
2021 Feb 16, 10:22pm
Does this mean everybody in Texas is going to move to California now?
40
Eric Holder
2021 Feb 17, 10:41am
Eric Holder
2021 Feb 17, 10:41am
Ceffer says
Some CA transplants sure will.
Does this mean everybody in Texas is going to move to California now?
Some CA transplants sure will.
42
Eric Holder
2021 Feb 17, 11:04am
Eric Holder
2021 Feb 17, 11:04am
Fortwaynemobile says
Their energy sector is deregulated and therefore is max efficient. Which means almost no redundancy. Which is good when everything goes right and very bad when something goes wrong.
Why did red Texas do this retard shit?
Their energy sector is deregulated and therefore is max efficient. Which means almost no redundancy. Which is good when everything goes right and very bad when something goes wrong.
43
zzyzzx
2021 Feb 17, 11:29am
zzyzzx
2021 Feb 17, 11:29am
Eric Holder says
This!!! Electric generation deregulation means little or no spare capacity since it's not profitable to build a power plant that's almost never used. That and I bet if there is an old oil fired plant that's rarely ever used in Texas the oil is too coagulated to pump at the moment. That and supposedly there is a natural gas shortage there right now, so instead of using the NG to generate electricity, it's used for home heating.
Their energy sector is deregulated and therefore is max efficient. Which means almost no redundancy. Which is good when everything goes right and very bad when something goes wrong.
This!!! Electric generation deregulation means little or no spare capacity since it's not profitable to build a power plant that's almost never used. That and I bet if there is an old oil fired plant that's rarely ever used in Texas the oil is too coagulated to pump at the moment. That and supposedly there is a natural gas shortage there right now, so instead of using the NG to generate electricity, it's used for home heating.
44
thenuttyneutron
2021 Feb 17, 12:07pm
thenuttyneutron
2021 Feb 17, 12:07pm
MAGA says
https://atomicinsights.com/south-texas-project-unit-1-tripped-at-0537-on-feb-15-2021/
This unit should not have tripped. It was entirely preventable with a little bit of heat trace or insulation on the sensing line. Nuke plants are awesome in cold weather because they are usually unaffected by the cold and they are more efficient in cold weather. These plants run 18 to 24 months between refuelings and can maintain full power through most of the time between refueling outages. The plants sometimes have to coast down at the end because they have run out of excess reactivity to keep the plant at 100%.
Even with a deep coast down, these plants provide a lot of clean reliable power.
I'm glad that San Antonio invested (40%) in nuclear power. I hope they build South-Texas-3 and South-Texas-4 as well.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Texas_Nuclear_Generating_Station
https://atomicinsights.com/south-texas-project-unit-1-tripped-at-0537-on-feb-15-2021/
This unit should not have tripped. It was entirely preventable with a little bit of heat trace or insulation on the sensing line. Nuke plants are awesome in cold weather because they are usually unaffected by the cold and they are more efficient in cold weather. These plants run 18 to 24 months between refuelings and can maintain full power through most of the time between refueling outages. The plants sometimes have to coast down at the end because they have run out of excess reactivity to keep the plant at 100%.
Even with a deep coast down, these plants provide a lot of clean reliable power.
45
RWSGFY
2021 Feb 17, 12:49pm
RWSGFY
2021 Feb 17, 12:49pm
thenuttyneutron says
"Some people have wondered how “pressure sensing lines” for a feed water pump could have been affected by cold outside air temperatures. There are no turbine halls at STP, both of steam turbines are out in the open air. I’m sure there is a design reason for this choice, but it isn’t apparent."
First time I hear about turbines being out in the open. This is weird AF.
This unit should not have tripped. It was entirely preventable with a little bit of heat trace or insulation on the sensing line.
"Some people have wondered how “pressure sensing lines” for a feed water pump could have been affected by cold outside air temperatures. There are no turbine halls at STP, both of steam turbines are out in the open air. I’m sure there is a design reason for this choice, but it isn’t apparent."
First time I hear about turbines being out in the open. This is weird AF.
47
Patrick
2021 Feb 17, 8:06pm
Patrick
2021 Feb 17, 8:06pm
My wife was saying that Texas somehow entirely prohibits buying power from other states.
Maybe it's because California got so completely screwed by the Enron guys 20 years ago or so.
Maybe it's because California got so completely screwed by the Enron guys 20 years ago or so.
48
ForcedTQ
2021 Feb 17, 10:53pm
Patrick says
ERCOT is a physical island without interconnection between the west and east grids.
My wife was saying that Texas somehow entirely prohibits buying power from other states.
Maybe it's because California got so completely screwed by the Enron guys 20 years ago or so.
ERCOT is a physical island without interconnection between the west and east grids.
49
Maga_Chaos_Monkey
2021 Feb 17, 11:47pm
Maga_Chaos_Monkey
2021 Feb 17, 11:47pm
Woo hoo! Finally got power late at night 3 days later! Warming up... Still no water pressure so no shower, no clean cloths...
Get this: My rent houses are pretty new. Recently gas water heaters turned over to piezo electric starters instead of the old light-a-match method. This is so when not heating the gas can be cut entirely and when needed it's started electronically. Sort of like shitty cars these days.
Well one of my renters got his power back yesterday and couldn't turn the heater back on. It's close by and I was just looking at ice melt so I went over to try to help. It has a button on it to initiate a spark much like a BBQ grill.
Fucker doesn't work. He's fucked.
Anyone who's started a gas appliance can tell you even with a cigarette lighter they can be finicky. You have to warm them up with the damn lighter when they are cold to get the gas flowing.
What a fucking moronic idea!
Get this: My rent houses are pretty new. Recently gas water heaters turned over to piezo electric starters instead of the old light-a-match method. This is so when not heating the gas can be cut entirely and when needed it's started electronically. Sort of like shitty cars these days.
Well one of my renters got his power back yesterday and couldn't turn the heater back on. It's close by and I was just looking at ice melt so I went over to try to help. It has a button on it to initiate a spark much like a BBQ grill.
Fucker doesn't work. He's fucked.
Anyone who's started a gas appliance can tell you even with a cigarette lighter they can be finicky. You have to warm them up with the damn lighter when they are cold to get the gas flowing.
What a fucking moronic idea!
53
Ceffer
2021 Feb 18, 9:24am
Ceffer
2021 Feb 18, 9:24am
All those snot nosed LibbyFuck weasel Californians are going to come running back weeping. Where is California going to spread its cancer now?
54
Automan Empire
2021 Feb 18, 9:38am
Automan Empire
2021 Feb 18, 9:38am
Patrick says
This decision was made in the 1930s when the Federal government set rules for interstate electricity exchanges. Texas opted out of "Federal interference." There may exist good reasons for this, but it was sure painful for them when their generating capacity was widely impacted.
My wife was saying that Texas somehow entirely prohibits buying power from other states.
Maybe it's because California got so completely screwed by the Enron guys 20 years ago or so.
This decision was made in the 1930s when the Federal government set rules for interstate electricity exchanges. Texas opted out of "Federal interference." There may exist good reasons for this, but it was sure painful for them when their generating capacity was widely impacted.
55
Automan Empire
2021 Feb 18, 9:42am
Automan Empire
2021 Feb 18, 9:42am
Eric Holder says
This is why you make purchases like this in the off season when you don't NEED them at the same time as millions of your fellow Americans. Factory refurbished is the way to go. The Generac factory store on Ebay had a few batches of refurb units at a VERY good price last spring that I regretted not jumping on. Cheap generators are loud (and inefficient) as fuck and belong on construction sites, not neighborhoods and campgrounds.
It's like shopping for a generator during CA fire season - good luck with that.
This is why you make purchases like this in the off season when you don't NEED them at the same time as millions of your fellow Americans. Factory refurbished is the way to go. The Generac factory store on Ebay had a few batches of refurb units at a VERY good price last spring that I regretted not jumping on. Cheap generators are loud (and inefficient) as fuck and belong on construction sites, not neighborhoods and campgrounds.
56
Eric Holder
2021 Feb 18, 11:32am
Eric Holder
2021 Feb 18, 11:32am
Automan Empire says
A bit late for that, don't you think?
Eric Holder saysIt's like shopping for a generator during CA fire season - good luck with that.
This is why you make purchases like this in the off season when you don't NEED them
A bit late for that, don't you think?
57
Ceffer
2021 Feb 18, 11:34am
Ceffer
2021 Feb 18, 11:34am
Biden approves 100 million dollar package to teach illegal immigrants how to snow ski in Texas.
This supersedes Biden's previous 100 million dollar package to teach illegal immigrants how to line dance.
This supersedes Biden's previous 100 million dollar package to teach illegal immigrants how to line dance.
58
FortwayeAsFuckJoeBiden
2021 Feb 18, 11:39am
Eric Holder says
Yeah but why they did wind shit that literally everyone knows has limitations. That is some dumb shit there.
Fortwaynemobile saysWhy did red Texas do this retard shit?
Their energy sector is deregulated and therefore is max efficient. Which means almost no redundancy. Which is good when everything goes right and very bad when something goes wrong.
Yeah but why they did wind shit that literally everyone knows has limitations. That is some dumb shit there.
59
Eric Holder
2021 Feb 18, 11:44am
Eric Holder
2021 Feb 18, 11:44am
Fortwaynemobile says
Maybe there were some kind of federal subsidies involved?
UPD. Found the answer:
"In 2005, then-Governor Rick Perry — who most would agree is a “champion” of the fossil fuel industry — signed into law a mandate requiring Texas to increase its wind power electricity. Why? Rick Perry is not an electrical engineer, and I’m not saying he is to blame for what happened. But even fossil fuel advocate Rick Perry, may have the teensiest notion in his head that fossil fuels are “bad,” insufficient, and therefore, we “need” wind."
So it's not federal-mandated or encouraged and was completely self-inflicted.
Yeah but why they did wind shit that literally everyone knows has limitations. That is some dumb shit there.
Maybe there were some kind of federal subsidies involved?
UPD. Found the answer:
"In 2005, then-Governor Rick Perry — who most would agree is a “champion” of the fossil fuel industry — signed into law a mandate requiring Texas to increase its wind power electricity. Why? Rick Perry is not an electrical engineer, and I’m not saying he is to blame for what happened. But even fossil fuel advocate Rick Perry, may have the teensiest notion in his head that fossil fuels are “bad,” insufficient, and therefore, we “need” wind."
So it's not federal-mandated or encouraged and was completely self-inflicted.
60
joshuatrio
2021 Feb 18, 12:16pm
joshuatrio
2021 Feb 18, 12:16pm
Get ready for gas to go up even more. I'm predicting another $4-5/gallon run during the Biden administration.
61
fdhfoiehfeoi
2021 Feb 18, 12:21pm
fdhfoiehfeoi
2021 Feb 18, 12:21pm
What was that thing we used to burn to keep warm..? Oh yeah, coal!
63
Maga_Chaos_Monkey
2021 Feb 18, 1:02pm
Maga_Chaos_Monkey
2021 Feb 18, 1:02pm
Ceffer says
Texans don't line dance. They 2-step. They laugh at line dancers.
Biden approves 100 million dollar package to teach illegal immigrants how to snow ski in Texas.
This supersedes Biden's previous 100 million dollar package to teach illegal immigrants how to line dance.
Texans don't line dance. They 2-step. They laugh at line dancers.
64
Automan Empire
2021 Feb 18, 4:42pm
Automan Empire
2021 Feb 18, 4:42pm
HunterTits says
You... might want to spend a few minutes looking into a topic before dropping some sanctimonious partisan talking point mocking "other political sportsball team" but making it obvious you actually know nothing about the topic at hand.
The left is saying that the gas lines are freezing up too and that is the real reason why Texans don't have heat.
You... might want to spend a few minutes looking into a topic before dropping some sanctimonious partisan talking point mocking "other political sportsball team" but making it obvious you actually know nothing about the topic at hand.
65
Automan Empire
2021 Feb 18, 4:45pm
Automan Empire
2021 Feb 18, 4:45pm
What dataset does that map depict? Does the talking point still stand when you include Alaska and Canada in the map?
Booger says
Booger says
66
Booger
2021 Feb 18, 4:56pm
Booger
2021 Feb 18, 4:56pm
Automan Empire says
Satire.
What dataset does that map depict? Does the talking point still stand when you include Alaska and Canada in the map?
Booger says
Satire.
67
Bd6r
2021 Feb 18, 5:45pm
Bd6r
2021 Feb 18, 5:45pm
HunterTits says
Some power generating capability was lost because 1. wind turbines iced over, and 2. too low temperature froze residual water in gas lines so some capacity went offline. The question is, what was percentage of renewable vs non renewable sources failed. From data I saw yesterday, 40% of renewable power failed vs about 20% of fossil fuel.
The left is saying that the gas lines are freezing up too and that is the real reason why Texans don't have heat.
Some power generating capability was lost because 1. wind turbines iced over, and 2. too low temperature froze residual water in gas lines so some capacity went offline. The question is, what was percentage of renewable vs non renewable sources failed. From data I saw yesterday, 40% of renewable power failed vs about 20% of fossil fuel.
68
Eric Holder
2021 Feb 18, 5:50pm
Eric Holder
2021 Feb 18, 5:50pm
Rb6d says
Here was Texas' electricity makeup in kilowatt-hours on Sunday:
Natural Gas: 43,798
Coal: 10,828
Wind: 8,087
Nuclear: 5,140
And Monday 8pm, at the height of the storm:
Natural Gas: 30,917
Coal: 8,023
Wind: 649
Nuclear: 3,785
https://thefederalist.com/2021/02/18/basic-math-shows-wind-energy-failures-contributed-to-texas-deadly-power-loss/
HunterTits saysThe left is saying that the gas lines are freezing up too and that is the real reason why Texans don't have heat.
Some power generating capability was lost because 1. wind turbines iced over, and 2. too low temperature froze residual water in gas lines so some capacity went offline. The question is, what was percentage of renewable vs non renewable sources failed. From data I saw yesterday, 40% of renewable power failed vs about 20% of fossil fuel.
Here was Texas' electricity makeup in kilowatt-hours on Sunday:
Natural Gas: 43,798
Coal: 10,828
Wind: 8,087
Nuclear: 5,140
And Monday 8pm, at the height of the storm:
Natural Gas: 30,917
Coal: 8,023
Wind: 649
Nuclear: 3,785
https://thefederalist.com/2021/02/18/basic-math-shows-wind-energy-failures-contributed-to-texas-deadly-power-loss/
70
EBGuy
2021 Feb 18, 6:13pm
Still waiting for Tres Amigas to come online...
Or, atlernatively, a Nationwide HVDC grid. See Interconnections Seam Study (which, evidently, was suppressed, by the previous administration -- because MOAR coal).
Or, atlernatively, a Nationwide HVDC grid. See Interconnections Seam Study (which, evidently, was suppressed, by the previous administration -- because MOAR coal).
72
WookieMan
2021 Feb 21, 9:31am
WookieMan
2021 Feb 21, 9:31am
Rb6d says
How do gas lines freeze up though? There's not enough water in even a 1/2" line to freeze. This seems like pure BS. It's literally been ~18*F or below for all of February here in my part of IL. Much of that below 0*F during darkness. Natural gas lines don't freeze here, ever. Shit, I don't even winterize my pool lines every year (I should). Why would it be any different in TX for a few day cold snap?
I'm probably going crazy, but I feel like everything is propaganda at this point. The weather happened down there for sure, but how it's being portrayed with little to no ability to verify that what is being said is even true. All the footage from local affiliates here in IL are all using stock footage from somewhere in Europe and not TX. Maybe propaganda or maybe laziness grabbing a clip to fill the time.
Either way, what should have been a trivial events has turned into some big story. I just question why now. Especially when it doesn't sense.
HunterTits saysThe left is saying that the gas lines are freezing up too and that is the real reason why Texans don't have heat.
Some power generating capability was lost because 1. wind turbines iced over, and 2. too low temperature froze residual water in gas lines so some capacity went offline. The question is, what was percentage of renewable vs non renewable sources failed. From data I saw yesterday, 40% of renewable power failed vs about 20% of fossil fuel.
How do gas lines freeze up though? There's not enough water in even a 1/2" line to freeze. This seems like pure BS. It's literally been ~18*F or below for all of February here in my part of IL. Much of that below 0*F during darkness. Natural gas lines don't freeze here, ever. Shit, I don't even winterize my pool lines every year (I should). Why would it be any different in TX for a few day cold snap?
I'm probably going crazy, but I feel like everything is propaganda at this point. The weather happened down there for sure, but how it's being portrayed with little to no ability to verify that what is being said is even true. All the footage from local affiliates here in IL are all using stock footage from somewhere in Europe and not TX. Maybe propaganda or maybe laziness grabbing a clip to fill the time.
Either way, what should have been a trivial events has turned into some big story. I just question why now. Especially when it doesn't sense.
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The Austin American-Statesman reported, “Wind farms across the state generate up to a combined 25,100 megawatts of energy. But unusually moist winter conditions in West Texas brought on by the weekend’s freezing rain and historically low temperatures have iced many of those wind turbines to a halt,” they added. “As of Sunday morning, those iced turbines comprise 12,000 megawatts of Texas’ installed wind generation capacity, although those West Texas turbines don’t typically spin to their full generation capacity this time of year.”
A photo began circulating on Twitter which shows a helicopter is using fossil fuel-derived chemicals to defrost a wind turbine, showing that only relying on renewable energy leads to many unforeseen complications.
“Wind power has been the fastest-growing source of energy in Texas’ power grid. In 2015 winder power generation supplied 11% of Texas’ energy grid. Last year it supplied 23% and overtook coal as the system’s second-largest source of energy after natural gas,” the Austin American-Statesman added. “The frozen turbines come as low temperatures strain the state’s power grid and force operators to call for immediate statewide conservation efforts, like unplugging non-essential appliances, turning down residential heaters and minimize use of electric lighting.”
https://thescoop.us/texas-wind-power-generation-cut-in-half-due-to-winter-storm/