patrick.net

Patrick says

Robber Baron Elite Scum says

Free Car listing site for owners and dealers.

I wish you well, but including dealers seems like a bad idea to me. The name says "by owners" and not "by dealers". When people find out that the name of the site is not entirely true, that lowers your credibility right away.

Thanks for the response and thanks for not closing this thread under spam.

I am genuinely seeking advice on the name and the business model.

I will not allow dealers on the website as a golden rule per your suggestion.

Thanks for wishing me well also Patrick!

GNL says

Big_Johnson says

GNL says

As far as your original question goes, yes, I think it is a great name. Surprised it was available.

Reading….it wasn’t, he paid 5k to get the domain.

Surprised it was available for only 5K

That is why I bought it right away because it was a bargain in my humble opinion.

It was first listed for $50k and the seller slowly dropped the price.

Also carsbyowner.net redirects to Chinese porn lol 😂

Robber Baron Elite Scum says

I can hire a developer to improve it by buying the open source of the software to host myself?

I have experience with this. Yes, hire a developer on a per project basis.

1. Have a clear overall idea of what your website needs to do/say/offer.
2. Break the development of the website into small projects so you can
analyse if it was really what you need before going to the next project.
3. BE FOCUSED.
4. Be extremely clear on the details of the project. EXTREMELY CLEAR.
5. DO NOT pay a developer until they have finished the project.
6. Be fair. It isn't fair to the developer to expect them to do a
project for the agreed upon price if you keep making changes.
I will bet Patrick and others here on the site will attest to the
fact that the details matter A LOT. Once a developer starts,
even a little change can throw off what they've already
started/completed.
7. Ask the developer's advice.

This is just my .02. I'm sure Patrick has even better advice.

I'm obviously not much of an artist, so I can't really help there.

I agree with all of @GNL's advice above. Developer will probably want at least some earnest money in advance though.

If "carsbyowner" is not trademarked yet, get the trademark on that pronto. Then the name is even more valuable.

Robber Baron Elite Scum says

If they accept and sell to Peddle.com, than peddle.com will give me 20% of the profit the car makes once it makes a profit.

Seems like there is some danger of the "rolling break even" there. Movie producers used to promise a percentage of the profits to actors, and then make sure there was never a profit though creative accounting. Actors have caught on to that particular scam.

Solid advice GNL.

Much respect to you.

They sell the open source of their software for $350 dollars.

I will buy it and host it on my own servers and hire a developer to make improvements.

Patrick says

Developer will probably want at least some earnest money in advance though.

I've never had to do this. We started with small easy things and worked up to an almost full time position with our developer. What keeps our relationship honest is 1. Being fair with each other. I won't win everything and neither will he. 2. The promise of more work and the fact I don't need an enemy to my business helps keep the gears greased as well. At the end of the day, all relationships should benefit both parties.

Ceffer says

Remember, you will have to fire bomb the offices of the local Craigslist to get a leg up. You have to remember how you and the family hate competition.

C-list now charges $5 to
list a car

Robber Baron Elite Scum says

I currently work for a dodge ram Chrysler Jeep dealership.

washing cars?

Robber Baron Elite Scum says

Solid advice GNL.

Much respect to you.

They sell the open source of their software for $350 dollars.

I will buy it and host it on my own servers and hire a developer to make improvements.

I was in talks with a commenter here on patrick.net. I can't remember who it was but could search past emails. He is a developer and was looking for a side hustle. Patrick actually knows him also.

It would be nice to see a website that only lists vehicles for sale by owner. I think that you can filter out dealers one one of the major sites, but the number of vehicles listed by owner is slim.

Does anyone see a flaw in the following idea? If it is workable, @Robber Baron Elite Scum could create a national financing network that makes it possible for buyers and sellers to work together without a dealership.

MY IDEA....

Years ago I had the idea to create what I called a mobile car dealership. For the most part, people cannot purchase cars from individuals if the price is over say a few thousand dollars. Why? Because most people don't have that much in their bank accounts.

My idea was to purchase a large van or even a fancy box truck and be the finance person. When 2 people decide on the price of a car, they call me and I show up with a mobile office with all the industry gear I need to work out the financing between the buyer and a bank. I'd be able to cut a check, from the bank, right there on-site to the seller. I'd take my commission on the spot also.

Is this possible?

GNL says

Is this possible?

Sure but it sounds like it doesn't scale. Unless YOU aren't actually in the van and you hire people. Otherwise it sounds like a mobile pet groomer.

just_passing_through says

GNL says

Is this possible?

Sure but it sounds like it doesn't scale. Unless YOU aren't actually in the van and you hire people. Otherwise it sounds like a mobile pet groomer.

I agree, in order to scale, I think you'd want to create a franchise for it. But let's be honest, the finance guy at a dealership makes, or can make, very good money so, comparing to a pet groomer I think is not comparable. Is a one person franchise that can create a $150k income desireable? How many people would like to make this working for themselves?

The dealships have it pretty good imo. Most people trade in their cars if the car isn't a POS. They do it because it is so hard to sell privately. So, now the "deal" at the dealership is convoluted with too many moving parts...dickering over the price of 2 cars instead of 1 plus most people (I'm just guessing) go through the dealer for their financing. Once private sellers realize they have another choice to sell their used car before they go to the dealer (a private buyer will pay more for a used car than the dealer will) the word would spread VERY quickly and a franchise is born.

Booger says

It would be nice to see a website that only lists vehicles for sale by owner. I think that you can filter out dealers one one of the major sites, but the number of vehicles listed by owner is slim.

I will hire people off Patrick.net when CarsByOwner.com takes off.

Patrick will be one of the first persons to be hired.

GNL will be hired too.

Booger will also be hired too. just passing through will also be hired.

GNL says

They do it because it is so hard to sell privately. So, now the "deal" at the dealership is convoluted with too many moving parts...dickering over the price of 2 cars instead of 1 plus most people (I'm just guessing) go through the dealer for their financing.

I agree if it's not paid off. If it's paid off, you get a check and you give them the title signed off. It's not overly complicated at least here in IL. Like you say most people go to the dealer to unload their existing car and not mess around with selling it. Hence why there's little market for this business and it's already super competitive when you factor in the likes of Carmax.

I don't know, I don't think the margins are there to corner 2-5% of the car buying market, IF it's even that much and you dominate it. Money can be made I suppose, but I wouldn't get my hopes up over having gotten a domain name when 99% of domain names have little or nothing to do with the business they're in. Besides them being legacy companies and you know of them, does Allstate or Statefarm make you think insurance when you hear their names? Nope. The name doesn't matter or the website. It's branding, marketing and selling.

I wish RBES success, but I'm not seeing it. Maybe I'll be motivation and he will get it which I wish for. Just not seeing it. Humans are lazy and will just drive to a dealership, sell the beater and get a newer car in 3 hours. It's why FSBO has never worked with real estate. It's actual work, so you hire a broker. 99% of people have never sold a home on their own. It's work whether you like brokers or not. Same with cars. Have fun dealing with a bunch of tire kickers...

cars by owner lacks bullshit euphemism. how about “rediscoveredcars”. suddenly old broken shit with maintenance nightmare and no parts sounds like a romantic adventure into the past when everything was better.

i understand cars and sales well, this is just my 2 cents.

Big_Johnson says

Hey Robber Baron
You mentioned you work at a jeep dealership.
What do you think about the 4Xe Rubicon?
(Recalls aside). Looking for your honest opinion.

The build quality and durability is great. They make them bullet proof.

The braking could use some improvements however.

But other than that, they are a work horse.

@wookieman

Plenty of people sell their cars privately to get the most money out of it and then they go to the dealership to get a new one.

Real estate does not work for sale by owner - I agree.

Cars are a different animal. Lots of people sell Ferraris and Lamborghinis privately.

The dealers barely provide you with much for your trade and they flip the trade for a lot of money.

You can use escrow.com with my platform and I will soon have a financing network for the used cars to be bought.

Dealers scam you on the trade and people know this very well but I agree they are lazy, that’s why I have an instant offer button for peddle.com to buy it instantly.

In case they can not sell it fast enough.

My idea will work. You are just jealous and a hater.

The name “Cars By Owner” is perfect

just_passing_through says

Bd6r says

FuckYouPeasants

I think we have a winner!

Lol 😂 I think we defiantly have a winner!

FuckYouPeasants will be my slogan

Robber Baron Elite Scum says

My idea will work. You are just jealous and a hater.

Could be true.

Robber Baron Elite Scum says

Plenty of people sell their cars privately to get the most money out of it

The thing is, when I filter for cars being sold by owner on any of the major car sites, it's a very high proportion of dealers, even on Facebook Marketplace.

zzyzzx says

Robber Baron Elite Scum says

Plenty of people sell their cars privately to get the most money out of it

The thing is, when I filter for cars being sold by owner on any of the major car sites, it's a very high proportion of dealers, even on Facebook Marketplace.

Sounds like an opportunity for someone to do it correctly then.

zzyzzx says

Robber Baron Elite Scum says

Plenty of people sell their cars privately to get the most money out of it

The thing is, when I filter for cars being sold by owner on any of the major car sites, it's a very high proportion of dealers, even on Facebook Marketplace.

I will ban dealers from my website. I will listen to Patrick. No new cars just used, so no dealers allowed.

GNL says

Sounds like an opportunity for someone to do it correctly then.

Yes an opportunity to milk peasants the right way.

FuckYou Peasants is a great brand name.

GNL says

Could be true.

Yes indeed.

Robber Baron Elite Scum says

My idea will work. You are just jealous and a hater.

The name “Cars By Owner” is perfect

I'm neither. I wish you luck. I think you're focusing too much on a name though. That's where I think you're failing out of the gate. YOU make the name, the name doesn't make YOU. I could drop $10B on Zillow.com or whatever it would cost, but if I don't know how to run it and create sales and revenue, it means nothing. You need to be focusing 100% on the service you'd provide. Name/domain means dick to be honest. And that's what this post is about. You asked for feedback and you got it.

The name doesn't matter. Thousands of people do this annually trying to sell used cars. I wouldn't get too worried about the name is all I'm saying. Prove me wrong. I don't care. Just giving feedback like you asked....

WookieMan says

The name doesn't matter.

I think you shouldn't give advice about this. You really do not know what you're talking about. Companies spend ungodly amounts of money to come up with names. Startups spend ungodly amounts of time to come up with a memorable name that isn't already taken as a domain. If you have to purchase a name/domain from a 3rd party and you're a startup, that alone could cause you to have to find a different domain. This is where you get out over your skis. Especially now that domains are mostly all taken it is even more difficult. And I don't think anyone thinks that a name is all you need. Is a name important? Come on dude, of course it is.

GNL says

WookieMan says

The name doesn't matter.

I think you shouldn't give advice about this. You really do not know what you're talking about. Companies spend ungodly amounts of money to come up with names. This is where you get out over your skis. Especially now that domains are mostly all taken it is even more difficult. And I don't think anyone thinks that a name is all you need.

Enjoy: https://www.zyxware.com/articles/4344/list-of-fortune-500-companies-and-their-websites

90% plus have nothing to do with the product they're selling. It's family names and made up company names. I guess the top 500 companies in the world basically don't know what they're doing? There's a multinational company called 3M for fucks sake? They provide and make products/services that sell. A domain name doesn't sell for you. You're not getting the point at all. The OP is hung up on whether the name is good or not. IS THE FUCKING PRODUCT/SERVICE GOOD OR NOT!

I don't understand what is difficult to comprehend here. Nothing has been laid out about how this would be different than the thousands of other companies doing the exact same things, just he thinks the name is good. That doesn't make a business. And I'm not out over my skis. I ran a business for over 15 years top to bottom. If the first thing you question is the name, you're likely doomed. It means you cannot make a decision. If he succeeds I'll give him a digital high five, I don't want people to fail. I'm going to give real, constructive criticism when it's due.

Another thing is don't come to a public forum if you don't want to hear honest answers from people that have done it. Sometimes the truth hurts.

You are not a smart person. You've never started a company. Of course the product matters. Duh. No one said it didn't. You are projecting. No one here EVER said the name is the only thing that matters. If you don't think companies give a shit about the name of their company you are delusional. For fucks sake, they spend tons of money on logos and even spend ungodly amounts of time, research and $$ on just the colors they use in adverts. Good grief.

Robber Baron Elite Scum says

What you think about my business name ?

GNL says

No one here EVER said the name is the only thing that matters.

The first quote is one of two questions in the OP. Then....Robber Baron Elite Scum says

What do you think ?

No discussion of what the business is going to be and how to make money. It's about a domain name. It's a flawed approach. I don't care what companies spend on names and logos, that's all useless if you don't have a product or service to sell. Point in case: https://www.temu.com/

This is a company selling pure shit with a domain that makes no sense to any American, yet millions of people are buying from them. The business owner makes the name. These companies you keep mentioning didn't put money into logos/domain names until the had actual revenue in the millions. This is one of the easiest cases of a big company with a shit name and logo selling and making a ton of money.

You're missing the point dude. He has NO service to speak of besides one that has been replicated thousands of times that probably has a higher failure rate than restaurants. The name/domain name doesn't generate sales. Is it a good or bad name, who knows? If the service is shit, it's a bad name. Can you at least understand that? I feel like I'm talking to a wall.

All of this advice from someone who ran a daycare for adults for 15 years. You said it yourself, the RE industry is full of nothing but idiots. You're missing the point. It was a simple question by the OP and you turned it into a lecture about how it's shit because YOU think it can't be done. I pity your children.

Robber Baron Elite Scum says

FuckYou Peasants is a great brand name.

For the parent company...

GNL says

You're missing the point. It was a simple question by the OP and you turned it into a lecture about how it's shit because YOU think it can't be done. I pity your children.

Lol, I'm not at all. I suppose you like your pronouns as well? The fucking name doesn't matter. There's no clear business plan besides buying a domain name. You're better off doing keyword search targeting with a domain as dumb as something like mycarisgay.com. Unless you have 7+ figures for marketing out the gate, your domain name makes ZERO difference.

And yes, if I can run an adult daycare filled with idiots, I'd say I have way more experience than most in the realm of business. You deal with dozens of high school drop outs that took 3 tries to pass their real estate exam. That's real fucking work. Thanks for proving my point for me.

I own a company. Any company is work. Any company can earn high dollars. Try it sometime.

Wookie bought a car and he's now an expert on the industry. He's never started a company but he's an expert. He's never flown a plane but he's an expert. He's never been a politician but he's an expert. He's never bought a domain but he's an expert. Are you catching on to the pattern yet?

Just now, he says he's closing on some land that he's going to build his dream home of 2,200 square feet and now he's an expert on being a builder. I pity the builder you hire (if you aren't the poser I've accused you of being). Interesting that after our dustup all of a sudden you're starting to get your act together on your dream home. Maybe you realized that someone wasn't buying your BS?

www.truplace.com

Oops, I mean https://btwimages.com/

Schokolade says

Is it a secret

Why don't you give me your home address or an address of one of your rentals?

Maybe it's this one...

https://www.homevisit.com/

Maybe I'm just a lowly photographer on this site...

https://homejab.com/

GNL says

Wookie bought a car and he's now an expert on the industry.

I've bought about a dozen. Have a good friend that works for Toyota and know a prominent Ford dealer in my area. I know more than most.

GNL says

He's never started a company but he's an expert.

Started 2 myself and ran another top to bottom for 15+ years. I know more than most.

GNL says

He's never flown a plane but he's an expert.

I've flown a plane AND have a current FAA license. I know more than most.

GNL says

He's never been a politician but he's an expert.

I'm an elected official. I've been on a ballot and have been elected. My father has ran for circuit court judge. I understand politics more than most.

GNL says

He's never bought a domain but he's an expert.

I own over a dozen domain names currently. Future ideas. If I piss it away, I don't care. It's just a name. Again, I know more than most.

Enjoy attacking me. You literally were wrong on every single thing you pointed out.

GNL says

Just now, he says he's closing on some land that he's going to build his dream home of 2,200 square feet and now he's an expert on being a builder. I pity the builder you hire (if you aren't the poser I've accused you of being). Interesting that after our dustup all of a sudden you're starting to get your act together on your dream home. Maybe you realized that someone wasn't buying your BS?

And on this topic, I've mentioned over and over and over again, we're not in a rush. The sale of my current house is a non-issue. I have time. What's the point in rushing it? I'm not some peasant that has to sell my house to build a new one. Not everyone lives like that and that's by choice on my end. I've been a part of 3-4 builds. I've rehabbed my entire current home from plumbing, electric, fixtures, kitchen, etc. I've been in well over 1k homes in and during construction. The builder will love me because I know the process.

You've been in a negative box lately. I'd suggest getting out of it. I have no reason to lie here. I can do anything I want and know more than most. Sorry that's upsetting I guess. I've had a fortunate life and at times unfortunate. I'm not certain why you care so much unless things aren't going well in yours. Maybe take a step back and realize other people are not you.

A jack of all trades is a master of none.