patrick.net

I know I know, it seems crazy.

But you guys are smart guys. It's not the dilapidated wooden box that you are paying for. Someone got a lot of land in one of the most desirable locations of the East Bay, for a price that you'd expect to pay for such a thing.

Don't get too fixated on the state of the box you see in the pic.

Oh and just for reference:

I'm looking at the houses surrounding that one... between $1.275 and $1.7M from what I can see on redfin... $750K for that lot looks more than fair if you want to pursue Rockridge.

Ironman says

Strategist says

How much would that dump cost in New Jersey?

In it's current condition, barely $100K (mostly in the property value).

In higher cost area of NJ, maybe up to 250k

BayArea says

Oh and just for reference:

I'm looking at the houses surrounding that one... between $1.275 and $1.7M from what I can see on redfin... $750K for that lot looks more than fair if you want to pursue Rockridge.

Some nice areas of Oakland for sure, but the price surge in recent years absolutely due to people being priced out of SF and overall, having lived in Bay Area and visiting there few times in past years, I hardly see any new home construction, at least when compared to places like Atlanta, Phoenix, Las Vegas and even New Jersey

BayArea says

I know I know, it seems crazy.

But you guys are smart guys. It's not the dilapidated wooden box that you are paying for. Someone got a lot of land in one of the most desirable locations of the East Bay, for a price that you'd expect to pay for such a thing.

Don't get too fixated on the state of the box you see in the pic.

Clearly a tear down, but how was rockridge priced 10-15 years ago?

BayArea says

I lived in rockridge for 7yrs. Beautiful and extremely desirable part of the East Bay.

It sold for $250,000 over asking because $495,000 wasn't a real price.

The online real estate estimators have that property at around $950,000.

That location right off College Ave is beyond desirable. That's the heart of Rockridge.

Well it is one of the few majority white neighborhoods, yet Oakland tech is still only 17% non Hispanic whites

Surely that is worth 600-700/sf

So the Russian propaganda site zerohedge says it wasn't the Russians.
No, it was a Russian spy but acting from the inside.
That's really great info.

MMR says

I hardly see any new home construction,

There is a lot, but mostly (from what I've seen) apartment buildings, townhouses, and detached with microscopic lots.

FP says

MMR says

I hardly see any new home construction,

There is a lot, but mostly (from what I've seen) apartment buildings, townhouses, and detached with microscopic lots.

Tons of new construction in East Dublin and Southern Pleasanton. Both apartments and SFHs.

HEY YOU says

Strategist says

Special Snowflakes feel they're entitled to 2500 sq ft McMansions.

Damn elitist bastards. They should all live in 800 square feet like Republicans.

All of Trumps residences do not exceed 800 square feet.

And if they still can't afford a 800 sq ft home, they should move to a 400 sq ft home.

YesYNot says

Easier said than done. That was one goal of Obamacare.

Obamacare didn't even try to reduce healthcare costs!!!
No lifetime maximum limit should have tipped you off on that already!!!

Strategist says

How much would that dump cost in New Jersey?

In Baltimore City less than $10000, possibly a LOT less.

Ironman says

The seller of the Rockridge home originally purchased the home in the 1970s

Would have been better if article posted this 1970's buying price.

Insurance isn't health care. They make money on health care denial.

Lashkar_i_Trumpi says

Insurance isn't health care. They make money on health care denial.

And the cost of insurance is a very small part of our overall healthcare bill. Before Obamacare distorted the market, most large healthcare firms only make about 3-7% profit.

Does anyone think the US government bureaucracy can manage healthcare claims and payments for less than 5 cents on the dollar?

MMR says

BayArea says

I know I know, it seems crazy.

But you guys are smart guys. It's not the dilapidated wooden box that you are paying for. Someone got a lot of land in one of the most desirable locations of the East Bay, for a price that you'd expect to pay for such a thing.

Don't get too fixated on the state of the box you see in the pic.

Clearly a tear down, but how was rockridge priced 10-15 years ago?

In 2007? Housing market was on fire just before the subprime housing meltdown. Rockridge real estate was scorching hot in 2007.

socal2 says

Does anyone think the US government bureaucracy can manage healthcare claims and payments for less than 5 cents on the dollar?

Yes. It doesn't have shareholders expecting dividends and stock growth.

Price controls, esp. on ER, absolutely necessary. Should be kept in line with inflation. There is no international shortage of cotton, alcohol wipes, etc. and healthcare provider wage pressure is in line with general wage-earners (that is, not increasing rapidly at all).

There is a reason Health Care costs are exploding annually and it isn't aging population, see Japan (and the current elderly in Japan smoke or smoked like Chimneys)

socal2, you seem to equate/confuse profit with expenses

FP says

socal2, you seem to equate/confuse profit with expenses

Profits as a percent of revenue.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/theapothecary/2014/06/27/profits-in-health-insurance-under-obamacare/#3c3a24df3c3a

Lashkar_i_Trumpi says

Yes. It doesn't have shareholders expecting dividends and stock growth.

Unionized government bureacrauts don't have any accountability or incentive to save money and ferret out fraud.

Private Insurer Profits? $13 Billion. Medicare Fraud? $48 Billion
https://www.forbes.com/sites/aroy/2011/03/04/private-insurer-profits-13-billion-medicare-fraud-48-billion-health-reform-priceless/#2f5a3cb42f5a

Lashkar_i_Trumpi says

Price controls, esp. on ER, absolutely necessary. Should be kept in line with inflation. There is no international shortage of cotton, alcohol wipes, etc. and healthcare provider wage pressure is in line with general wage-earners (that is, not increasing rapidly at all).

There is a reason Health Care costs are exploding annually and it isn't aging population, see Japan

If the economic structures we used weren't so fucked up, health care like any technology would asymptotically decrease in cost to some fixed, low level.

jazz music says

It is urgent that we all fight for Medicare for all, to FIX OBAMACARE...

You don't seem to realize those are opposite goals, and the latter is the slogan of "The Resistance", an Orwellian subversion along the lines of Animal Farm.

Quigley says

One is assistance for paying for medical school for kids of not-wealthy families.

Mexico has a better solution: free medical/dental/vision school for interested students who show ability and potential and agree to work for a year for the government in an underserved area. It creates a plentiful supply of highly capable medical professionals, and thus low prices for excellent quality. It's the best place in North America to go for those services.

Means testing is a bad idea that keeps coming back, in Rin's comments also. Why should you care whether your doctor was born in a log cabin he built himself? "Oh, sorry he misdiagnosed your kid and blinded her for the rest of her life, but he had come from a dirt poor family so we gave him a scholarship, while dissuading better qualified candidates with $60k/year tuition." The idea comes back because it expands the market for expensive tuition: find a way to enable people who can't afford it. It's a lot like Obamneycare in that way: expand Medicaid so that hospital executives can monetize even indigent vagrants at $500k/year each. The idea comes back because marketing can easily distort the inherent sacrifices to look "fair" when in fact it's about maximizing their own power at the expense of everyone else.

The better solution is to reduce the cost. The Mexican system works because they produce so many talented graduates that even the professors can be hired at reasonable salaries. If we had NAFTA for medical/dental/vision, the price would equalize.

Also repeal the Rx requirement, because too many people are scheduling Dr visits for permission to buy junk they saw on TV. Let Darwin Awards take their course. If some schmuck wants to buy the toxic placebo he saw on TV, and wash it down with a can of Pepsi to deter police violence, so be it. You can't save people from themselves, so let people make their own decisions and the smart ones will check expert systems (e.g. RightDiagnosis.com, FKA WrongDiagnosis.com) that cost nothing.

Also, as noted above, emergency services need price controls. That should also be on a fee-for-diagnosis basis, not fee-for-service, which creates terribly perverse incentives. Ideally, emergency medical should be paid by government like Fire&Police, because there is no time for "market" comparisons.

American overpricing relative to other countries, and excess spending especially after age 65, practically began with Medicare's fee-for-service model driving over-utilization. Dan and others have posted a chart showing how American spending leaps above all others starting around Medicare age. Some have noticed the increase becomes most noticeable around age 60, and so they don't blame Medicare, which starts generally at age 65. They don't realize Medicare eligibility extends already to some people under age 65, and the pool expands enough by age 60 to affect the charts. Expanding current Medicare to all, while maintaining current supply restrictions and perverse incentives that increase demand, would increase spending even faster. Here is a chart comparing American medical costs to other countries; notice what happens when Americans become eligible for Medicare, whether due to age or disability (which correlates with age after around 60):

Ironman says

Strategist says

And if they still can't afford a 800 sq ft home, they should move to a 400 sq ft home.

Or a single wide.

Noooooooo. We deserve nice big houses in good neighborhoods. We need good quality cars with all the bells and whistles, and a sports car on the driveway. We need to be able to shop at nice department stores, go to good restaurants. And we need to have several vacations a year.
It's our right. So what if i'm not working.

3 of my siblings live with my mother in NJ. Ages 28 to 40.

GuiltyBattle says

3 of my siblings live with my mother in NJ. Ages 28 to 40.

I'm willing to bet those 3 losers voted for Obama.

Consider it selection of those unfit to breed in this competitive exonomy.

Ironman says

The Number 1 living arrangement today for Americans in the 18-to-34 age bracket, according to the Census Bureau, is to reside without a spouse in their parents’ home.

Great job, boomers!
Thank you so much.

I don't mind if my kids stay with the wife and I into thier 30s or more as long as they are productive. Everything is just a cycle and maybe its just going back to the way it use to be. Maybe this struggle will bring families closer which is has been on a decline for for a long time in the US.

We could have a two tier system, one for those that work and one for those that don't. Insurance companies need to go but we also need to talk about at what point do we not keep people alive without getting emotional about it. People should be able to die gracefully and not kept on life support or long term critical care after a certain age.

curious2 says

Mexico has a better solution: free medical/dental/vision school for interested students who show ability and potential and agree to work for a year for the government in an underserved area. It creates a plentiful supply of highly capable medical professionals, and thus low prices for excellent quality. It's the best place in North America to go for those services.

This is an excellent idea.

curious2 says

Means testing is a bad idea that keeps coming back, in Rin's comments also. Why should you care whether your doctor was born in a log cabin he built himself? "Oh, sorry he misdiagnosed your kid and blinded her for the rest of her life, but he had come from a dirt poor family so we gave him a scholarship, while dissuading better qualified candidates with $60k/year tuition."

Agreed. Talent, not poverty, should be the basis for such scholarships.

MMR says

Standard of living has gone down for long time

In Nixons America one breadwinner could support whole family, small house 2 cars maybe a boat.

Very few people can do that now.

Before boomers,
vs
After boomers.

It should be pointed out that during the last 40yrs, there's been migration into big cities. That partly explains the trend.

What do you mean "now"? Less than half a year after losing both Congress and WH to GOP? You absolutely sure this is a good time to push for lefty ideas?

Ironman says

Sounds like your parents didn't kick your ass and make you personally responsible for your actions.

You admit boomers didn't do a good parenting job, in addition to destroying the economy?

What the hell are they doing, waiting for Obama handouts?

What does it have to do with me? Who says I'm a millennial?
I'm just observing the facts laid in front of us: Boomers did a terrible parenting job in addition to destroying the economy.

Ironman says

rpanic01 says

I don't mind if my kids stay with the wife and I into thier 30s or more as long as they are productive.

Why would you want that? How can the kids learn, grow, mature and handle life's issues if they're living under your wing?

rpanic01 says

Everything is just a cycle and maybe its just going back to the way it use to be.

Kids use to live at home into their 30's in the past??? When was that?

Unless I move out of or my kids move out of California they might not have much of a choice, and as I said they would have to be productive no deadbeats.

Is it really that bad of a thing I had my dad live with me up until it became to difficult from his illness but my kids will always cherish the time with there grandfather that they would have not had otherwise. My one grandmother lived with my aunt and uncle, my great grandparents lived above my grandparents. Honestly I think something has really gone wrong with our society. A lot of older houses were built for multigenerational familys and have been turned into apartments or split up into separate housing.
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/19/us/19family.html

socal2 says

Unionized government bureacrauts don't have any accountability or incentive to save money and ferret out fraud.

That's why you privatize enforcement. Hey, privatization is always the answer. Let Private Firms pursue Medicare fraud and keep 25% of the haul. Lawyers' profit is a great motivator - and fear of it.

You know how many law firms would love to sue over $20 sprays of Lysol?

I believe the top 5 health insurance companies brought up $30B of their own stock in just two years, hardly suffering.

Whatever we're doing now doesn't work beyond any reasonable doubt, since our costs are astronomical but results mediocre.

Everybody, left and right agrees - only the stupid center of technocrats refuses to see the system they run and benefit from sucks and needed replacement two decades ago.
http://www.weeklystandard.com/insurers-profits-have-nearly-doubled-since-obama-was-elected/article/2005073
http://www.salon.com/2016/10/28/making-a-killing-under-obamacare-the-aca-gets-the-blame-for-rising-premiums-while-insurance-companies-are-reaping-massive-profits/

Whatever the solution, cost controls, at least for ER services, is a big starting point.

"Cost Controls don't work". Funny, works great in Japan. ~1% cost increases on medical care annually, while dealing with an incredibly aged population consisting of many lifelong smokers, and a smaller demographic behind it that has even fewer kids.

Ironman says

rpanic01 says

I don't mind if my kids stay with the wife and I into thier 30s or more as long as they are productive.

Why would you want that? How can the kids learn, grow, mature and handle life's issues if they're living under your wing?

Well, if they are productive, responsible and saving money it should be OK to live at home for some time. They will be able to save up for a down payment, and basically get an early boost towards financial prosperity.
But wait a minute......they are millennial. How can they be responsible?

Epitome of diplomacy right there. I always thought AF would be the finest ambassador America can produce.