patrick.net

indigenous says

Strategist says

There was no need to publicize intricate details of his affair with "that woman"

So the country needs less accountability?

We need common sense accountability from all politicians, both sides of the aisle.

indigenous says

If he is willing to cheat on his wife what is he willing to do to the country?

Not true. Politicians are aggressive type A personalities. They will have affairs, they will do bad things in their personal lives. If you want a "perfect" President, we will never have a President. Lets get a President who can do the job we elected him to do.

indigenous says

That being said he is still preferable to what we have now...

I would agree.

I did not say anything about the presidency.

What I like (from Wikipedia):

Palin cut property taxes by 75% and eliminated personal property and business inventory taxes.

Using municipal bonds, she made improvements to the roads and sewers

Palin eliminated the position of museum director[48] and asked for updated resumes and resignation letters from "city department heads who had been loyal to Stein,

reduced her own $68,000 salary by 10%

What I don't like is:

he city's long-term debt grew from about $1 million to $25 million due to $15 million for the sports complex

I do like:

By November 2003 she was filing non-public ethics complaints with the state attorney general and the governor against a fellow commission member, Randy Ruedrich, a former petroleum engineer and at the time the chair of the state Republican Party.[63] He was forced to resign in November 2003.

She also joined with Democratic legislator Eric Croft[68] in complaining that Gregg Renkes, then the attorney general of Alaska,[69] had a financial conflict of interest in negotiating a coal exporting trade agreement.[70][71] Renkes also resigned his post

In her State of the State address on January 17, 2008, Palin declared that the people of Alaska "can and must continue to develop our economy, because we cannot and must not rely so heavily on federal government [funding]."[102] Alaska's federal congressional representatives cut back on pork-barrel project requests during Palin's time as governor

Palin dismissed Public Safety Commissioner Walt Monegan on July 11, 2008, citing performance-related issues, such as not being "a team player on budgeting issues"[123] and "egregious rogue behavior."

Strategist says

Not true. Politicians are aggressive type A personalities. They will have affairs, they will do bad things in their personal lives. If you want a "perfect" President, we will never have a President. Lets get a President who can do the job we elected him to do.

The point is that what a person does in every aspect of his life affects every other aspect of their life. You seem to think he can be a man whore in one aspect of his life and have complete integrity in another. Bull Shit, that is a contradiction in logic.

I like tpb's manipulation of statistics (half of all 'mericans love palin).

Here are a few more stats you'll enjoy:

Half of all doctors graduated in the lower 50% of their class
According to a 2014 study, 1 in 10 Americans think HTML is a sexually-transmitted disease.

sbh says

I couldn't agree more. The entertainment factor:

Didn't Obama Entertain you? That's how he got elected. He didn't give presidential speeches, he gave Def Jam Comedy tours, complete with pyrotechnics exploding on stage as he made his entrance fist bumping and hand slapping his whole way to the Def Mic.

elliemae says

I like tpb's manipulation of statistics (half of all 'mericans love palin).

Ellie the article said ONLY a paltry 54% of Americans have heard enough of Sarah Plain. And with a 10% margin of error in any pol, that means, there could actually be 49%, which would mean that there are 51% who hasn't heard enough. And wises she would keep talking until all of the Liberals hang them selves to escape their fake rage crisis they get every time she speaks.
She's doing America a public service and 51% of Americans realize it.
And wishes every Liberal in America would suddenly develop a chronic case of Laryngitis.

turtledove says

"I did not have sexual relations with that woman."

And that was a true statement. "Sexual relations" is a euphemism for sexual intercourse, not a catch-all for any kind of sexual activity. Hell, what constitutes sexual activity is inherently vague. Does kissing constitute sexual activity? Depends on who you ask and when. But the term sexual relations means intercourse specifically.

Bill Clinton answered the question that was asked, not the question the republicans meant to ask. That was all he was legally obligated to answer. You can make the case that Clinton was deceptive in that he didn't volunteer information he know was relevant, but you cannot make the case that he lied or committed perjury.

Has Bill Clinton ever lied? Of course, all human beings have. But he did not lie about that question. He outsmarted the republicans.

You know you did commit perjury? James Clapper, Director of Intelligence

This asshole committed perjury.

And Clapper lied about something that material affects the freedom, security, liberty, and life of every single American: the NSA's illegal domestic spying program that undermines the First and Fourth Amendments.

Now that's the guy who needs to be prosecuted. The fact that he hasn't been is further proof that the right's outrage against Clinton's testimony is fake, not that it wasn't obvious already.

I just love all of the Liberal defensive posturing here.

But not one Liberal can list ONE single positive damn thing the Liberals have done since Kennedy.

They are dreaming that Obama's election campaign propaganda bullshit still has enough inertia to carry their tired asses anywhere in the next two elections.

Dan8267 says

Now that's the guy who needs to be prosecuted.

Why? yea it is less than ideal but what does it really hurt? There is a shit load of stuff i care about more.

OTOH Clinton was the fucking President. I put this in the same category as a priest sodomizing a child.

indigenous says

How many presidents were impeached?

Irrelevant. What matters is convictions not accusations.

Nixon was granted a pardon by corrupt Gerald Ford. If republicans had any integrity, they would have let the Nixon answer to the law.

indigenous says

He was cheating on his wife and acting as the president in the White House, but that is just a minor faux paw?

Compared to behavior of Republicans, yes. Newt Gingrich cheated on his wife while she was in the hospital with cancer. That's despicable.

If we want to compare sex scandals, the Republicans have more to be ashamed of then the Democrats.

But ultimately, the sexual lives of politicians should be irrelevant unless those politicians are running based on "family values" or some bullshit like that. Hypocrisy matters to the public. Whether or not a person is a good, faithful husband is irrelevant to whether or not he is a good president. For the later, only his policies matter.

If we're judging presidents based on their personal lives, I submit that any president who believes in an imaginary sky-daddy is a bad president. At least that's material to the job.

By the way, if you don't want politicians who have extramarital affairs, either vote only for single people or women.

indigenous says

I read it was not enough evidence to convict, yet his successor as governor did do time related to the same scandal. I guess they don't call him slick willy for nothing?

No, what you are proposing is called guilt by association. It's like executing Saddam's limo driver.

But hey, if you want to play that game, I guess we'll have to hold Chris Christie accountable for Bridghazi. Still want to play that game?

Strategist says

if "oral sex" is not sex, why does it have the word "sex" in it?

Sex is the quality of maleness of femaleness as determined by the relative sizes of gametes in a two-sexed species.

Canonically, the act of sex is not sex. The correct terms are sexual intercourse, fellatio, cunnilingus, analingus, and anal penetration.

When you use the word "sex" to describe any of those things, or a multitude of other acts, you are using a colloquialism and as such you should expect to be misinterpreted unless you precisely define what you mean as colloquialism are used very inconsistently.

Bill Clinton was not asked if he had performed or received a "sexual act" on or from Lewinsky. He was asked specifically if he had "sexual relations" and that is the term he used in his reply. The term "sexual relations" is not synonymous with the term "sexual act". The former is a euphemism for vaginal intercourse specifically. The later is a vague term that may or may not include hundreds of things such as kissing, french kissing, necking, nipple licking, cupping a feel on a breast whether above or below the bra, ... well I could go on for hours listing things that may or may not count as "sexual acts" depending on who you ask.

The bottom line is whether or not you consider oral sex to be sex is an entirely different question as to whether oral sex means the same thing as sexual relations.

In other words, ...
if "oral sex" is not sex, why does it have the word "sex" in it?
because that's not how colloquialisms work. Their meanings are not reflected by the terms that compose them.

indigenous says

Palin is quite impressive. She is definitely a quality person, who has done some things that showed integrity and went against the status quo.

You know when you are watching a porno at a stag party with your bros... There's two hot lesbians going at it and then a naked man walks onscreen, and all of your buddies burst out laughing and saying things like "that's the smallest penis I've ever seen" and "how the hell does a guy with such a small dick get into a porno".

When that happens, you don't want to be the guy who say, "What are you talking about? I wish I had a dick that big!".

Well, indigenous, you are that guy.

indigenous says

white trash like Clinton disrespecting this country like that is funny.

A president getting a blow job in the privacy of the Oval Office is not disrespecting the country.

Lying to Congress and the American people about the NSA violating the 4th Amendment is disrespecting the country.

Lying about Iraq being connected to 9/11 is disrespecting the country.

Lying about Iraq having weapons of mass destruction is disrespecting the country.

Blocking a bill to pay for 9/11 responders' medical treatment thus causing those heroes to die is disrespecting the country.

Causing a government shutdown in order to make a tenth attempt to repeal the Affordable Care Act is disrespecting the country.

Blocking a single payer system that would create standard and transparent medical pricing is disrespecting the country.

Sending our children into combat without proper body armor is disrespecting the country.

Spying on our phone calls, Internet activity, and the contents of our mobile phones and computers is disrespecting the country.

Installing spyware including some capable of remotely and covertly activating the cameras on our phones is disrespecting the country.

Arresting adults for the responsible consumption of marijuana and taking away their right to vote is disrespecting the country.

Passing voter ID laws who sole intent and effect is to prevent legitimate voters from voting is disrespecting the country.

Spreading massive lies about everything on a propaganda network masquerading as a news network is disrespecting the country.

Polluting our once great natural resources is disrespecting the country.

turtledove says

Clearly, a person can have sex with almost anything.

I disagree. Sex with a BMW isn't sex. It's just masturbating on something. Sex is way more than simple ejaculation. If ejaculation of sperm was the defining characteristic of sex, then only men would be having sex when a man and woman have intercourse. This, in my opinion, is a misleading use of the term.

Dan8267 says

Nixon was granted a pardon by corrupt Gerald Ford. If republicans had any integrity, they would have let the Nixon answer to the law.

Nixon has caused as much damage to this country as LBJ or Obama or FDR

Dan8267 says

Compared to behavior of Republicans, yes. Newt Gingrich cheated on his wife while she was in the hospital with cancer. That's despicable.

Yea I think McCain did that as well, but they were not the President.

Dan8267 says

If we want to compare sex scandals, the Republicans have more to be ashamed of then the Democrats.

Objection that is conjecture, Sustained.

Dan8267 says

Hypocrisy matters to the public. Whether or not a person is a good, faithful husband is irrelevant to whether or not he is a good president.

Bullshit, you cannot separate one aspect of a persons life from the rest.

Dan8267 says

When that happens, you don't want to be the guy who say, "What are you talking about? I wish I had a dick that big!".

Is that the way it works in your gay porn as well?

elliemae says

According to a 2014 study, 1 in 10 Americans think HTML is a sexually-transmitted disease.

ROFLMA!

Dan8267 says

A president getting a blow job in the privacy of the Oval Office is not disrespecting the country.

I know it is hard for you libs to wrap your wits around this idea of integrity, but it IS disrespecting the country.

Dan8267 says

Lying to Congress and the American people about the NSA violating the 4th Amendment is disrespecting the country.

At the end of the day it is not all that important

Dan8267 says

Lying about Iraq being connected to 9/11 is disrespecting the country.

Agreed

Dan8267 says

Blocking a bill to pay for 9/11 responders' medical treatment thus causing those heroes to die is disrespecting the country.

Cite the references.

Dan8267 says

Sending our children into combat without proper body armor is disrespecting the country.

They are sending children to war? How bout not going to war in the first place?

Dan8267 says

Arresting adults for the responsible consumption of marijuana and taking away their right to vote is disrespecting the country.

Agreed

Dan8267 says

Passing voter ID laws who sole intent and effect is to prevent legitimate voters from voting is disrespecting the country.

Bull Shit prove it.Dan8267 says

Spreading massive lies about everything on a propaganda network masquerading as a news network is disrespecting the country.

So you mean ABC, NBC, CBS, NPR, MSNBC, Public television?

Dan8267 says

Polluting our once great natural resources is disrespecting the country.

Ambiguous, many instances of this, generally it gets cleaned up.

CaptainShuddup says

But not one Liberal can list ONE single positive damn thing the Liberals have done since Kennedy.

The Office of Congressional Ethics
The Internet and Net Neutrality
Product Labeling/Truth in Advertising Laws
Consumer Product Safety Commission
Public Broadcasting/Educational Television
Americans With Disabilities Act
Family and Medical Leave Act
Clean Air Act and ammendments
Clean Water Act
Fair Credit Billing Act
Anti-Torture backlash
Civil Rights Act of 1968
Marriage Equality
Matthew Shepard Hate Crimes Prevention Act
Consumer Protection Agency Has Done for You
Mortgage lenders can no longer push you into a high-priced loan when you qualify for a lower-cost one
Preventing the state from vaginally raping women who want abortions

Just to name a few things.

Just because you're a republican doesn't mean you have to believe everything Rush tells you. Palin is a sideshow and a disgrace, she abolutely needs to shut the fuck up... like yesterday. All publicity is good publicity does not apply to politics.

indigenous says

Dan8267 says

Now that's the guy who needs to be prosecuted.

Why? yea it is less than ideal but what does it really hurt? There is a shit load of stuff i care about more.

It undermines liberty and the republic. The people must know what their government is doing or their government is not one of the people, by the people, for the people.

It is an utterly ridiculous statement to make that a president getting a blow job has more impact on your life than a rogue government agency spying on your every move.

The later prevents free discussion of how to improve government and reform corrupt agencies.

And quite frankly, given your fucked up values, I don't care what you care about. Your priorities don't reflect what's important in the real world.

indigenous says

Nixon has caused as much damage to this country as LBJ or Obama or FDR

FDR did not damage this country. LBJ escalated the Vietnam War, and that was bad, but he wasn't a war criminal or a common criminal like Nixon. Obama has done more evil than Nixon, but Obama is no liberal. It's debatable whether or not LBJ was a liberal.

In any case, your backhanded attempt to appear to be criticizing Nixon while really criticizing Democratic presidents has failed.

indigenous says

Yea I think McCain did that as well, but they were not the President.

That has nothing to do with Clinton's affair being illegal or unethical. Nothing Clinton did was illegal and he did not perjure. Everything the republican politicians did were far more unethical and morally despicable than what Clinton did.

And as for presidents, the atrocities committed by the Bush administration were many orders of magnitude more grotesque and offensive than anything Clinton ever did.

No, attacks on Clinton for getting a blow job is simply conservative hypocrisy. Getting a blow job isn't even in the same ballpark as blowing up the body of a living 4-year-old girl. It doesn't even come remotely close.

Dan8267 says

The Office of Congressional Ethics

Funny Stuff, an oxymoron, name one person they did anything more than slap their wrists?

Dan8267 says

The Internet and Net Neutrality

Will take care of itself no government necessary.

Dan8267 says

Product Labeling/Truth in Advertising Laws

Ok

Dan8267 says

Consumer Product Safety Commission

So we can spend endless amounts of taxpayer money listening to redundant superfluous expensive ads. What have they actually stopped?

Dan8267 says

Americans With Disabilities Act

Which costs easily 10x more than it should

Dan8267 says

Clean Air Act and ammendments

And the last remaining jobs get offshored

Dan8267 says

Consumer Protection Agency Has Done for You

Fuck this shit, completely redundant that will be paid for by the consumer, Another Sarbanes Oxley that costs through the roof and do nothing

Dan8267 says

Mortgage lenders can no longer push you into a high-priced loan when you qualify for a lower-cost one

Yea like we need big brother to tell us how to wipe our nose. Yes lets make people complexly obsequious so the government can further enslave them.

Dan8267 says

Preventing the state from vaginally raping women who want abortions

So this was a big problem? states raping women? Is rape by sodomy ok then?

indigenous says

Bullshit, you cannot separate one aspect of a persons life from the rest.

Not only can we, but the law demands it. If a business fires a person for having an extramarital affair, that business is liable for discrimination.

Work and personal life are separate and should be that way.

And if you want to talk about morality, starting the Iraq War and using our military for political gain is way the fuck more immoral than cheating on your wife.

Killing 9/11 responders by filibustering a bill needed to save their lives is way the fuck more immoral than getting a blow job from a woman who's not your wife while you are married. It's not even the same ballpark.

Dan8267 says

It undermines liberty and the republic. The people must know what their government is doing or their government is not one of the people, by the people, for the people.

Bullshit you are making a mountain out of a mole hill...

indigenous says

Dan8267 says

When that happens, you don't want to be the guy who say, "What are you talking about? I wish I had a dick that big!".

Is that the way it works in your gay porn as well?

Exactly what is "my gay porn"? Are you trying to imply that I've been in gay porn? Sadly, they don't make a wide-angle lense that can capture my full penis.

Plus, I'm completely straight.

Not that I find your fourth grade attempt to call me gay offensive -- well, I find having someone as stupid as you being a member of my species offensive, but that's another issue -- after all, there is nothing morally or ethically wrong with being homosexual or bisexual.

I just happen not to be either. Of course, I understand why a small-minded person like you would think that I'm gay. After all, I promote the human rights of gays, and small minded conservatives just can't understand the concept of supporting the rights of persons in groups to which you do not belong. Conservatives only care about themselves and thus cannot grasp the concept of empathy and why a human being would be motivated to help out "an outsider" who belongs to a different tribe, religion, race, class, sexual orientation, or nation.

The thing is, I can't explain this behavior to you because you simply lack the compassion to understand it. You'll just have to chuck it up as a liberal thing.

Dan8267 says

FDR did not damage this country.

Sure he did the amount of hubris filled legislature that kept this country down for 10 years when it did not need to be is without compare.

Dan8267 says

LBJ escalated the Vietnam War, and that was bad,

LBJ's war spending is what pushed Nixon into taking us off of the gold standard. The other big thing he did that damaged the country was passing medicare.

Dan8267 says

Obama has done more evil than Nixon

No because taking us off of the gold standard will probably end this country.

Why don't you think O is a liberal? (modern definition)

Dan8267 says

In any case, your backhanded attempt to appear to be criticizing Nixon while really criticizing Democratic presidents has failed.

Says who?

You are extremely economically illiterate.

Dan8267 says

indigenous says

Yea I think McCain did that as well, but they were not the President.

That has nothing to do with Clinton's affair being illegal or unethical. Nothing Clinton did was illegal and he did not perjure.

Again - did you read my response to you on this specific point earlier? How do you conclude that he "did not perjure"?

Dan8267 says

Everything the republican politicians did were far more unethical and morally despicable than what Clinton did.

Name them

Dan8267 says

And as for presidents, the atrocities committed by the Bush administration were many orders of magnitude more grotesque and offensive than anything Clinton ever did.

Agreed

CDon says

Personally, I think they should have pushed the executive privilege aspect of this case so as to exclude the testimony from congressional review

Personally, I think Clinton should have used the military to execute all the Republicans trying to topple our republic. Had the Republicans not diverted time and resources away from Clinton's Middle East policy, Al Qaeda could have been weakened and 9/11 would have never had happened.

The bottom line is that these Republicans attacking Clinton on bullshit charges for their own personal political gain, alter the course of history that ultimately led to 9/11. So, it's far more reasonable to impeach those Republicans.

Dan8267 says

After all, I promote the human rights of gays, and small minded conservatives just can't understand the concept of supporting the rights of persons in groups to which you do not belong. Conservatives only care about themselves and thus cannot grasp the concept of empathy and why a human being would be motivated to help out "an outsider" who belongs to a different tribe, religion, race, class, sexual orientation, or nation.

Yet it is ok for you to say: ?

Dan8267 says

When that happens, you don't want to be the guy who say, "What are you talking about? I wish I had a dick that big!".

Well, indigenous, you are that guy.

indigenous says

I know it is hard for you libs to wrap your wits around this idea of integrity, but it IS disrespecting the country.

The lack of integrity is exactly what the Republicans demonstrated by using Congressional hearings for backhanded political manipulation and for attempting to create a sex scandal while hypocritically practicing far worse sexual acts and affairs.

Also, lying about WMDs and connections between Iraq and 9/11 shows a complete lack of integrity.

Also, undermining the Constitution for security theater shows a complete lack of integrity.

Also, polluting the Earth to increase quarterly profits shows a complete lack of integrity.

Also, shutting down the government because you didn't get your way on a health care bill shows a complete lack of integrity.

Also, sabotaging the recovery to make the president look bad shows a complete lack of integrity.

Also, trying to insult a man by calling him gay shows a complete lack of integrity.

Dan8267 says

There is nothing in that record that gives a specific definition of sexual relations or shows any kind of meeting of the minds. The record does not even use the terms "oral sex" or "fellatio", so how can the record define sexual relations to be those things?

Again, from the specific definition I sent you earlier:

"Definition of Sexual Relations" to the court: For the purposes of this deposition, a person engages in "sexual relations" when the person knowingly engages in or causes -
(1) contact with the genitalia, anus, groin, breast, inner thigh, or buttocks of any person with an intent to arouse or gratify the sexual desire of any person;
(2) contact between any part of the person's body or an object and the genitals or anus of another person; or
(3) contact between the genitals or anus of the person and any part of another person's body. "Contact" means intentional touching, either directly or through clothing."

Bob Bennett and the President specifically stipulated to this in prior interrogatories - the court took judicial notice of the same.

Dan8267 says

Not only can we, but the law demands it. If a business fires a person for having an extramarital affair, that business is liable for discrimination.

Real life doesn't work that way.

Dan8267 says

Killing 9/11 responders by filibustering a bill needed to save their lives is way the fuck more immoral than getting a blow job from a woman who's not your wife while you are married. It's not even the same ballpark.

What is the rest of the story?

indigenous says

Dan8267 says

Lying to Congress and the American people about the NSA violating the 4th Amendment is disrespecting the country.

At the end of the day it is not all that important

Wow, that shows a complete lack of integrity and is disrespectful to the country.

indigenous says

Dan8267 says

Blocking a bill to pay for 9/11 responders' medical treatment thus causing those heroes to die is disrespecting the country.

Cite the references.

http://thedailyshow.cc.com/videos/i58xmo/worst-responders

http://thedailyshow.cc.com/videos/nuwe6u/9-11-first-responders-react-to-the-senate-filibuster

And if you don't have the balls to watch these two videos, you're a scumbag. The second one interviews actual 9/11 responders who were affected by the filibuster, the real heroes.

indigenous says

Dan8267 says

Passing voter ID laws who sole intent and effect is to prevent legitimate voters from voting is disrespecting the country.

Bull Shit prove it.

I've done this many times on this site. Here's one of a hundred videos showing the truth.

http://www.youtube.com/embed/o32tF-S6K60

Dan8267 says

The lack of integrity is exactly what the Republicans demonstrated by using Congressional hearings for backhanded political manipulation and for attempting to create a sex scandal while hypocritically practicing far worse sexual acts and affairs.

So it would be better not have any rules or laws? Especially for the leader of the US?

Dan8267 says

Also, lying about WMDs and connections between Iraq and 9/11 shows a complete lack of integrity.

Getting good information in war is notoriously hard and inaccurate. Not that I'm defending more lack of integrity.

Dan8267 says

Also, undermining the Constitution for security theater shows a complete lack of integrity.

SOP in times of war

Dan8267 says

Also, polluting the Earth to increase quarterly profits shows a complete lack of integrity.

Cut the conjecture examples.

Dan8267 says

Also, shutting down the government because you didn't get your way on a health care bill shows a complete lack of integrity.

What because they didn't vote on the sequester fast enough for you, fuck off.

Dan8267 says

Also, sabotaging the recovery to make the president look bad shows a complete lack of integrity.

More conjecture examples

Dan8267 says

Also, trying to insult a man by calling him gay shows a complete lack of integrity.

That is a two street.

Gawd you are a mouth piece for the democrats. Talking to you is a Waste of time. You are completly economically illiterate, glib, and close minded. It does not matter because this country is not long for this world.

indigenous says

Dan8267 says

Spreading massive lies about everything on a propaganda network masquerading as a news network is disrespecting the country.

So you mean ABC, NBC, CBS, NPR, MSNBC, Public television?

No, I mean Fox News. None of the sources you state lie. Fox News lies every day and is caught every day lying.

Just because you don't like Sesame Street doesn't make Kermit the Frog a liar.

indigenous says

Dan8267 says

Polluting our once great natural resources is disrespecting the country.

Ambiguous, many instances of this, generally it gets cleaned up.

Another example of an actual lie told by someone who lacks integrity and that harms and disrespects our country. Oh, the hypocrisy of the political right.