patrick.net

Dan8267 says

rando says

Dan8267 says

this very problem was created by you and your ancestors.

Absolutely not.

I did nothing whatsoever to create any black racism against whites, nor did any of my ancestors.

That is not at all what I'm saying. Like you I don't have ancestors who were American slavers. I was talking about Fort Wayne. You can tell from his attitude that he is descended from slavers. Their descendants are the only ones who whitewash American history.

Now, I'd be all for forgiving the American South once it repents from its ways. The sins of the father are only passed on to the son if the son reenacts those sins in one form or another or condones them. Unfortunately, that is exactly what the American South continues to do to this day. It's not white Americ...

You got caught Dan, at least own up to your mistaken and misplaced hatred for us white folk.

You aren't going to have many friends with that attitude of yours.

MMR says

They have voter ID in India and about 88.2% of the population (or higher) have it. Also, the rate of participation in elections is much higher than it is here in the US

Their voter ID laws aren't designed solely for the purpose of voter suppression.

Voter ID laws target African Americans with almost surgical precision

In the North Carolina case, the 4th Circuit panel agreed with allegations that North Carolina’s omnibus bill selectively chose voter-ID requirements, reduced the number of early-voting days and changed registration procedures in ways meant to harm blacks, who overwhelmingly vote for the Democratic Party.

“The new provisions target African Americans with almost surgical precision” and “impose cures for problems that did not exist,” Judge Diana Gribbon Motz wrote for the panel. “Thus the asserted justifications cannot and do not conceal the State’s true motivation.”

It's been proven in court. 'Nuff said.

Booger says

How did people living in Poland and Hungary create this problem?

They didn't. The damn American Southerners created the problem.

FortWayne says

You got caught Dan, at least own up to your mistaken and misplaced hatred for us white folk.

Bullshit lie. My position has always been consistent and exactly what I described above. Why don't you show on single post I've made on PatNet in which I demonstrate hatred for white folks in general, you lying sack of shit.

FortWayne says

You aren't going to have many friends with that attitude of yours.

What you call "attitude" is what everyone else calls honesty. I guess it must be an alien concept to you.

The truth is that you, Fort Wayne, and your ancestors are responsible for creating all those problems you bitch and moan about. So I asked you again, was slavery worth it? Do you have the balls to admit your ancestors committed evil and vile acts and that they made the country a worse place for subsequent centuries by practicing slavery?

And quite frankly, I'm sick of inbred whites like you making the rest of us whites look bad. Most of us whites created the greatest things in the word: democracy, the scientific method, the printing press, the transistor, the Internet. And then there is white trash like Fort Wayne who gives our culture and our history a bad rap. If it wasn't for white trash like him, the rest of the world wouldn't look down on us. And it's all because you can't get over the fact that you lost the Civil War, you traitors. You are just harming America.

zzyzzx says

You'd be surprised. Just today, I talked to some great, very strong students, one part asian mixed, one latino, one black, that are accustomed to living in a diverse urban community, and they visited some east coast universities over spring break and were very uncomfortable with some of the ones that were overly homogeneous.

And I can can related to this too, when I visit a brother in a place that's 100% white, after living so many years in LA and Chicago in diverse communities, it's got a very weird feeling to it. Don't get me worng. A ot of friendly people. But it takes some adjusting to, and I don't know if I like it. But then, I haven't been there long enough to adjust.

Now that isn't white racism per se, but it's the kind of place that white racists are going to choose to live. (please - I'm not saying that everyone that chooses and all white community is a racist anymore than I would say that all republicans are racist. ).

marcus says

Now that isn't white racism per se, but it's the kind of place that white racists are going to choose to live.

That is true, but! The kind of racists you'll find in mostly white private universities are the limousine liberal types who vote Democrat. They are intolerant of those who are different, but the kind of difference they can't abide is ideological. Think of it as a cult of white people all programmed to think the same way and harass those who express differing opinions.

The redneck racists these days mostly live next door to black and Latino families, and count many as friends. They hold unpopular beliefs that are different from the cult of Democrat white people, and are intolerant in much the same way as that type. It's an intolerance of ideas. Racism enters into it where certain races have systemic cultural issues that cause them to offend society much more often than other people. Here's where you see the difference. Limo Leftists will avert their gaze and insist that it's the white mans fault somehow. Rednecks will just call a spade a spade.
Who's more racist?

I do think I get it about the whole feeling uncomfortable around people who even well meaning, are entirely of another race or culture. There are plenty of places where I can be and encounter this phenomenon in Southern California. Just the other day I was in the little Saigon area getting some bahn mi and was so out of place that little kids were staring at me. Maybe it's like that.

Quigley says

The kind of racists you'll find in mostly white private universities are the limousine liberal types who vote Democrat. They are intolerant of those who are different, but the kind of difference they can't abide is ideological. Think of it as a cult of white people all programmed to think the same way and harass those who express differing opinions.

The redneck racists these days mostly live next door to black and Latino families, and count many as friends. They hold unpopular beliefs that are different from the cult of Democrat white people, and are intolerant in much the same way as that type. It's an intolerance of ideas. Racism enters into it where certain races have systemic cultural issues that cause them to offend society much more often than other people. Here's where you see the difference. Limo Leftists will avert their gaze and insist that it's the white mans fault somehow. Rednecks will just call a spade a spade.

Who's more racist?

I get your point, but I don't believe that it holds up. A huge part of the Trump voting block are actually republicans that couldn't pull the trigger for Hillary.

Sure some of the red necks that voted for TRump have friends that are latino or black, but it's not a generalization that holds up. The generalization that a lot of the white Hillary voters are naive and don't have experience with diversity is more true, but still isn't a generalization that makes sense to me.

As things get more diverse everywhere, I believe that the TRump effect diminishes, but it might get worse before it gets better.

I predicted this white fear many years ago, but didn't realize it would be as big a political force as it is, probably becasue I did not predict some of the forces that are exacerbating the white fear.

I knew this would happen when the Cubans took over...
marcus says

It's 10:00pm in Floriada

marcus says

some of the forces that are exacerbating the white fear.

Nobody likes to be actively discriminated against. Not even white people. That's where this push back is coming from. If you want to move forward to equality and an egalitarian society, you have to give up the regressive Left's idea of anti-white racism being necessary to correct historical wrongs and systemic cultural issues in minority communities.
Nothing less will suffice.

Lefts view of equality is putting white folk into slavery and discriminating against us because they feel entitled to it. It's when left starts believing their own bullshit, case point Dan who outright hates whites calling us "slavers".

I feel discriminated all the time, especially with how government treats people.

Quigley says

you have to give up the regressive Left's idea of anti-white racism being necessary to correct historical wrongs and systemic cultural issues in minority communities.

Nothing less will suffice.

I think it's a cop out. The regressive left you speak of is not that big a force, but they will continue, to an extent, because the minority individuals buy their message, and that's a growing demographic.

I don't have a problem ignoring overstated beliefs of "white privilege."

The real and only reason Trump was able to win was that the left didn't have a better candidate, combined with a huge and effective propaganda campaign against Hillary that goes all the way back to the 90s. I recall a palpable hate that my conservative older brother had for her, when she had the gall to be working on policy back in 1992.

I don't know about Bernie. I like him but am not one of those with any confidence he could have won the main election. But there are many people such as E. Warren that would have easily beaten him.

Best comment on racism ever.

rando says

Best comment on racism ever.

Agreed. Freeman is right on the money.

Giving a shit about race at all is racism. The amount of melanin is a person's skin is completely irrelevant and unimportant to anything except sunburn protection. The people who truly live in a post-racial mindset are the ones who just don't care or even think about race unless discussing the failings of society to get past racism.

Intel did a study and could not find any wage gap when considering similar jobs and years of experience:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/on-leadership/wp/2016/02/03/intel-says-there-is-no-pay-gap-between-men-and-women-at-the-chipmaker/

Dan8267 says

Agreed. Freeman is right on the money.

Giving a shit about race at all is racism. The amount of melanin is a person's skin is completely irrelevant and unimportant to anything except sunburn protection. The people who truly live in a post-racial mindset are the ones who just don't care or even think about race unless discussing the failings of society to get past racism.

Hence you are by your own definition racist, because you refer to all "white" people as slavers. Of course you sucked it up when Patrick called you out on it. But that's just you realizing you went out of line.

FortWayne says

Hence you are by your own definition racist, because you refer to all "white" people as slavers.

Now that's a bold face lie told by a coward. Quote me saying that all white people are slavers. Quote me saying anything that remotely could be interpreted by any reasonable person as meaning that.

Only a coward makes up lies about what his opponent said, and a stupid one at that as everything on PatNet is public, so it's damn easy to refute your lies.

I'm pretty damn sure though that your ancestors were slavers and that you miss those good old days.

anonymous says

Pretty stupid Cartoon considering it's underlying basis is that blacks were deprived homes due to inability to obtain mortgages, which didn't even come along until 1934 and then were 50% down and 3-5 year terms.

I don't know that I'd trust something that so blatantly lays out a false premise.

Fucking White Male says

How does the fact that George Soros finances BLM play into all this?

It brainwashes people into thinking that voter ID= voter suppression

Registering to vote is a lot like registering for Medicaid. Lot of people won't do it simply because it is 'too much work'.

People will get their welfare either way and people will get medical care through ER regardless

Fucking White Male says

Pretty stupid Cartoon considering it's underlying basis is that blacks were deprived homes due to inability to obtain mortgages

Also consider that there is no one who cares less about your race than a lender.

All they want is to be sure of getting their money back with interest. They are completely blind to all other considerations.

MMR says

It brainwashes people into thinking that voter ID= voter suppression

The ‘smoking gun’ proving North Carolina Republicans tried to disenfranchise black voters

The federal court in Richmond found that the primary purpose of North Carolina's wasn't to stop voter fraud, but rather to disenfranchise minority voters. The judges found that the provisions "target African Americans with almost surgical precision."

In particular, the court found that North Carolina lawmakers requested data on racial differences in voting behaviors in the state. "This data showed that African Americans disproportionately lacked the most common kind of photo ID, those issued by the Department of Motor Vehicles (DMV)," the judges wrote.

So the legislators made it so that the only acceptable forms of voter identification were the ones disproportionately used by white people. "With race data in hand, the legislature amended the bill to exclude many of the alternative photo IDs used by African Americans," the judges wrote. "The bill retained only the kinds of IDs that white North Carolinians were more likely to possess."

The data also showed that black voters were more likely to make use of early voting — particularly the first seven days out of North Carolina's 17-day voting period. So lawmakers eliminated these seven days of voting. "After receipt of this racial data, the General Assembly amended the bill to eliminate the first week of early voting, shortening the total early voting period from seventeen to ten days," the court found.

Most strikingly, the judges point to a "smoking gun" in North Carolina's justification for the law, proving discriminatory intent. The state argued in court that "counties with Sunday voting in 2014 were disproportionately black" and "disproportionately Democratic," and said it did away with Sunday voting as a result.

"Thus, in what comes as close to a smoking gun as we are likely to see in modern times, the State’s very justification for a challenged statute hinges explicitly on race — specifically its concern that African Americans, who had overwhelmingly voted for Democrats, had too much access to the franchise," the judges write in their decision.

This is about as clear-cut an indictment of the discriminatory underpinnings of voter-ID laws as you'll find anywhere. Studies have already shown a significant link between support for voter ID and racial discrimination, among both lawmakers and white voters in general.

"Faced with this record," the federal court concludes, "we can only conclude that the North Carolina General Assembly enacted the challenged provisions of the law with discriminatory intent."

To argue that voter ID laws are intended to fight voter fraud is an utter lie. Every voter ID law every proposed by Republicans have been designed solely for the purpose of rigging elections by preventing legal voters from voting. That is the entire intention, and it's painfully obvious. To say otherwise is a lie.

I had a dream I was being defiled by a black Democrat President while a bunch of White Liberals yelled "Go! Go! Go!"

They touched me there...

So I called the Trumpolice.

Shouldn't have fucked with the Constituents you retards. That's going to be bad taste for YEARS and DECADES to come.

That first Black President should have brought the country together.
The Liberals used him to scratch every itch they've had for decades.
Obama as just a Shit doo doo rag the Liberals used to smear shit all over this once great nation of ours.

Trump is here it's OK Ya'll!

Dan8267 says

On a serious note, the exact quote from MLK is

"I look to a day when people will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."

He did not limit that to people of any particular color.

anonymous says

Why do lenders consistently charge minorities higher interest rates

They charge higher rates not based on race, they charge higher rates where risk is higher. In fact lending applications frequently don't even ask for race, they only ask for your debt to income ratio. You left wingers have a pathetic understanding of lending and business, probably why you always vote for more taxes.

anonymous says

Realtors are more prone to show "people" to the "right" neighborhood than anyone else I know.

Actually, realtors on the south side of Chicago deliberately moved in blacks so that they could then go to the whites and encourage them to sell quickly while they still could.

Summary: realtors have zero ethics and will do anything to get a commission. It's insulting to innocent pond scum to compare realtors to scum.

anonymous says

Why do lenders consistently charge minorities higher interest rates (i.e. autos etc.) whey they can get away with it. The poor and minorities who often are one in the same have a harder time to repay anything and get the highest interest rates. I know - it's the risk, right ?

Lenders will charge the interest rate that offsets the risk of default enough for them to make a profit.

Simply charging people interest rates according to their probability of repayment is of course likely to cause people in poor financial shape to have to pay more.

Or are you saying that banks should simply give away money?

anonymous says

Why do lenders consistently charge minorities higher interest rates

Realtors must be Asian-lovers, as Asians get lower mortgage rates than other races.

http://www.financialsamurai.com/mortgage-interest-rates-by-race/

It seems that this "discrimination" based on race BS falls apart when one looks at Asians. If there is discrimination in this country, it is based on your income, and not race.

anonymous says

Asian's may have better credit scores and larger down payments in addition to having the funds to buy down the rate even more.

Yes, and lower income of African Americans compared to whites is likely the reason for higher mortgage rates. Not race. Alternatively, we have to agree that realtors discriminate against whites to benefit Asians.

FortWayne says

In fact lending applications frequently don't even ask for race

A law called the Equal Credit Opportunity Act (ECOA) enacted in 1974 makes it illegal for lenders to discriminate based on race, national origin, gender, age, marital status, or because one receives public assistance.

Another law called the Home Mortgage Disclosure Act (HMDA) enacted in 1975 requires lenders to collect, report, and disclose a long list of data about mortgages they originate, including each borrower’s race, ethnicity, gender, and age.

anonymous says

too bad we don't really enforce most of them or do so on a select basis.

Regulatory enforcement of equal opportunity laws can make a huge difference. Government and NAACP should regularly have applicants of different colors apply for loans and compare rates, to ensure the lenders are complying with the law. Even a credible threat of prosecution can bring lenders into compliance on a prospective basis, without litigating past actions.

anonymous says

The poor and minorities who often are one in the same have a harder time to repay anything and get the highest interest rates. I know - it's the risk, right ?

No, it's what the market will bear. If lenders know that a prospective borrower is likely to be overcharged everywhere, they don't need to offer a lower rate based on risk. If lenders know they can get away with charging more, then many are likely to do so. It doesn't require conspiracy or even animus: it's not personal, merely business. Imagine you are working in a big bank, paid on commission, and the choice comes down to more $ for your kids vs more $ for strangers. Maintaining a level playing field requires enforcement, so the bank representatives face a substantial probability of getting caught quickly and maybe fired or fined before Christmas. Routine regularatory testing can work better than sporadic litigation.

curious2 says

Dan8267 says

On a serious note, the exact quote from MLK is

"I look to a day when people will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."

He did not limit that to people of any particular color.

Of course, that is my entire point!

anonymous says

drBu Asian's may have better credit scores and larger down payments in addition to having the funds to buy down the rate even more.

Of course, again.

I'd be shocked if that were not the case.

But by SWJ logic, we should accuse banks of racism for allowing Asians to get better interest rates.

I'll make you a deal, you stop calling everyone around you racist and at least try to see it from the other side and I'll cut all those words out... except Jesus.
Jesus is holy, non-negotiable.

anonymous says

@FortWayne - it would be refreshing if one day - just one - you could write a reply that did not include the word(s) Jesus, Gay or Homo and Liberal or Dem and for the record you have no idea who or what I voted for over the years, let alone what I really support or do not support.

For all you know I could be taking alternate stances on most things just because. In most areas I am financially very conservative and in social matters fairly the opposite since I don't really care to know what other people are doing or who or what they are doing it with let alone who or what they pray to or don't pray to.

Dan8267 says

The wage gap is clearly a myth. If there were any actual evidence to support it, that evidence would have come out by now.

The wage gap is not a myth. There is all kinds of data that supports the claim that women are paid less for the same job title but what the data cannot answer is why. If we try to politicize this issue then we end up with two far too simplistic answers: women are discriminated against or women are inferior in their performance.

Of course, both of those reasons are true sometimes but not enough to even be significant. I tend to side with this very moderate analysis: http://freakonomics.com/podcast/the-true-story-of-the-gender-pay-gap-a-new-freakonomics-radio-podcast/

The biggest takeaway is if you were to monetize flexibility, the gap between men and women at the same professional level would likely disappear. If you seek to shrink the wage gap, you would need to reduce the need for flexibility for women and/or increase the desire for flexibility for men. You would reward productivity over hours at the office or offer alternative schedules and workplaces.

Luckily, this describes the millennials exactly. On the macro level, you could probably do nothing and see improvement. However, I see no reason not to define success, track progress and course correct as necessary; in other words, calling it myth, even if you don't believe it requires policy changes, isn't appropriate.

jessica says

There is all kinds of data that supports the claim that women are paid less for the same job title

Job titles are meaningless, but show the data anyway. I've search long and hard for the actual data, and it's nowhere to be found. And no, a report with zero actual figures written by some anonymous bureaucrat does not constitute evidence or data.

Show me the actual salary and benefit data in CSV format with each column described in a text file, and I can data-mine the shit out of that. Not only would I be able to tell you exactly what, if any, wage gap exists, but also which individual companies are responsible and how to fix it. But if you have no data, you have no case. Hearsay means nothing. Data is everything in this matter.

In any case, equal pay for equal works requires, by definition, abandoning capitalism. Capitalism is allowing owners of the means of production to determine the distribution of revenue from that production. If you mandate equal pay for equal work, you are by definition no allowing the owners to determine distribution of revenue. So pick what you want, equal pay or capitalism. I'd go with the former myself.

jessica says

The biggest takeaway is if you were to monetize flexibility, the gap between men and women at the same professional level would likely disappear.

I've heard that men are more likely to haggle for a higher starting salary, and may be more likely to change jobs for a higher salary, while women may be more likely to accept the first offer and stay put.

Also, I wonder if women are more likely to choose jobs that divert more of their salary into "benefits," e.g. mandatory insurance programs. WSJ reported that the then-mandatory WI teachers' union contract diverted around half of total payments to mandatory "benefits", including $24k/yr medical insurance per teacher. Unfortunately, women do seem more likely to sign up for unnecessary and injurious tests, e.g. excessive diagnostic radiation, so policies that cover "free" diagnostic tests can cost a lot.

anonymous says

Growing up in supposedly the predominant race as well as the race/gender combination I realized as a child the degrees of discrimination that existed just within that little realm.

You are projecting your childhood experience as that race/discrimination perception onto everyone. Now do you really think that's smart to say if a few people feel certain way, therefore everyone else does? You are not the only person who has ever been discriminated against, I have been discriminated against plenty whenever it was beneficial to the other side. But I don't assume every little "unequal outcome" is discrimination like you do.

The difference here is if one does not get a loan because he/she can't pay their bills, you see that as discrimination, I see it as common sense. That is because you are very much on the left and see everything as discrimination and matter of equal outcomes for everyone. That's a general problem with the left, the mindset.

Then again - if you were a white and best of all a male, chances are low any of this would have affected you or at least very much.

-----------

White Guys: "There is no racism or discrimination. Us White Guys are the least racist of all, ever! Bigly!!"

Dan8267 says

argue that voter ID laws are intended to fight voter fraud is an utter lie. Every voter ID law every proposed by Republicans have been designed solely for the purpose of rigging elections by preventing legal voters from voting. That is the entire intention, and it's painfully obvious. To say otherwise is a lie.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/blogpost/post/voter-id-proponents-point-to-laws-in-other-countries/2012/07/12/gJQAVlGCfW_blog.html?utm_term=.f1f77f5f2da4#comments

Same for leftists who say it's discriminatory..in your world, leftist = republican = conservative, but whatever

One commenter, who is prob more sensible states:

"the authors ...

"...also pointed out that in many other countries, it’s much easier to obtain identification than it is in the United States because ID cards are issued to all citizens automatically:

“Countries such as Spain, Greece, France, Malta, Belgium, and Italy provide national identity documents to their citizens to use for many purposes, including travel, banking, and healthcare access as well as voting.”

That says it all doesn't it?

The obvious solution is a national ID system, applicable to all citizens, for a whole host of purposes, including voting, banking and healthcare.

But who are those who always obstruct and delay and drag their feet on a sensible national ID system?

A few libertarians on the right (mostly anti-tax zealots) plus the usual crowd of "advocates" on the left for various minorities and immigrants on the left who want to crash the gates to get government benefits.