patrick.net

You can’t punish someone who is 60 today and started smoking 40 years ago, even if they’re a boomer.

Sure you can. The Surgeon General's warning went out over 60 years ago:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tobacco_packaging_warning_signs

-over 60 years ago
+over 40 years ago

The point still stands, though.

RE: cigarette use and warnings, the interesting and sad thing I found out when I was rotating through a VA hospital as a student was that during WWII, the military would hand out cigarette cartons to the GI's in appreciation for their service. I've met many a Vet who ended up addicted to tobacco as a result.

@SF Woman and others,

Yes, in general, Europeans are slightly shorter than Americans. Scandinavia is an exception, and the Netherlands too. In fact, the Dutch are on average the tallest people on the planet. Just look at all those lanky speed skaters during the Olympics, or look at someone like Rik Smits. Interestingly, this is a relatively recent (20th Century) phenomenon. The reasons for this are unknown.

Skibum, unfortunate things happen and unfortunate decisions are made. Hopefully knowledge will steer people towards the right behavior.

Back to housing, though. I wonder if many obese Americans would be able to even live comfortably in the smaller homes built during previous generations. Maybe that's why McMansions *need* to be built!

@SFGuy,
They could *possibly* be using certain vegetable oils which has no trans-fats and little or no cholesterol. However, I sorta doubt that. The biscuits would taste awful.

Other than a perfectly round tummy, I look normal.

HARM,

Could you erase some of my comments from the bottom of "Has Hell Finally Frozen Over?". Thanks!

Hope they pass Prop 86. I wish they would have jacked the cost of a pack of cig to like 10 bucks or something. Hate when ppl smoke and come back inside the office without washing up.

Wait a minute, thanks to section8 and/or illegal creative lending, I guess it is the same for housing too

What are you talking about? People who buy have to settle for crappy 1950 2/1 bungalows. People who use section8 and/or illegal creative lending get to have brand new homes.

We may be approaching a point where FDA regulations of drugs are a hinderence to society.

We are past that point.

We also need easier access to human testing.

I am a fan of hybrid exotic loan products that give me more power to choose my payment and be a stronger buyer in the marketplace

They only give other buyers strength over you in the marketplace.

I think Doctors in America do the worst diagnosis. Either they are afraid to do a proper diagnosis or they are afraid that they will loose their favor with Insurance companies or they are not competitive enough. I hate having to go to hospitals and ER rooms and having to wait for an hour to be seen by a doctor and feel that you are hurried out. They dont have time to listen to you. Unless it is some simple disease, it is hard to get anything out of doctors. They just dont know what to say.
I guess it is better to just stay healthy and try and never go into a hospital if you have a choice.

I guess it is better to just stay healthy and try and never go into a hospital if you have a choice.

Or just be rich and pay them triple in cash.

I usually just see a herbalist. I do not usually see a doctor unless the herbalist tells me to do so.

Skibum is going to hate me now.

I wish they had Homoepathic and Ayurvedic treatments here. I can live with that. They work for me.

Does your herbalist have an MD? Just asking. If an RW can have an MD, why not a herbalist?

No. Not that I know of.

Of course, if I break a leg I would go to a doctor.

HARM,

Love the debt/diet analogy! In the end, it's all about our consumption habits and immediate gratification. I'm making a genuine effort to educate myself about new methods to deal with debt.

Even with an "ideal entry point" it just doesn't make any sense for anyone here over say 30 to take the plunge without a plan as to how we're going to pay the damn thing off. We've all looked at bi-weekly payments and it's certainly a step in the right direction but that typically only knocks off about 8 years on a 30 yr. FRM. Some of the more "untraditional" programs I've looked at are about the inverse where depending on the amount borrowed it's possible to have your home paid off in 8-10 years.

In keeping w/your analogy, if it means "tightening your belt" then I'll learn to live with it.

I support making Cupertino to Condotino…

I wish they have high-rise (40+ stories) condos here. :(

Thats nice SFWoman..
I would like to get a contact info if you dont mind.

Peter P,

If that herbalist is a Chinese educated traditional medicinist, he or she should definitely have a "medical" degree from a Chinese institution of at least B.S. or above.

Ditto acupuncturists. They're all considered equivalent to doctors and some go through very rigorous training.

I'm not a fan of traditional or modern medicine. I believe in induced fevers and really hot showers. They probably kill a lot of brain cells and they might one day lead to my early death, but they do wonders at fixing me up quick without obvious after effects.

disclaimer: not medical advice.

If that herbalist is a Chinese educated traditional medicinist, he or she should definitely have a “medical” degree from a Chinese institution of at least B.S. or above.

I think they do.

I love my dentist and my optometrist though.

I believe in induced fevers and really hot showers.

Huh? I believe in mind over body though.

They probably kill a lot of brain cells and they might one day lead to my early death, but they do wonders at fixing me up quick without obvious after effects.

Perhaps I will try.

I love my dentist and my optometrist though.

You love them?

Very platonically. As much as a patient can love doctors who she sees twice a year and still not think about them once she leaves their office.

New thread: Soft-landing 2.0

When a person can get more for not working, the system is severely out of whack.

I think California needs to augment the proposition 13.
The healthcare cost to homeowners older 60 to increase by no more than 1% per anum.
They deserve to be protected because they're homeowners right?

Peter P Says:

Skibum is going to hate me now.

No, I don't hate you. I just hope you have the common sense to see an MD when warranted.

@Phil,
It's sad but true. US healthcare has a lot of problems. If your main interface with the system is through an ER, the problems are greatly magnified. ER's are the worst part of the heathcare system, as they shoulder an inordinate burden of uninsured. Especially those who think their primary care doctor is "Dr. ER."

SFWoman Says:

> I have had two friends call me from Disney World
> because they were astounded at all of the gigantically
> obese families walking around with their obese
> children carrying 32 ounce sodas and eating ice creams.

Why don’t thin people go to Theme Parks or Wal Mart? It seems like almost every man, woman and child (over 10 years old) at a Theme Park or Wal Mart looks like they weigh more that I do (a tall 40 something guy)…

The Jon Said:

> A lot of people think that if they exercise a little they
> can eat like crazy but that’s really the wrong way to
> think about it. For better or worse, the human body
> is pretty efficient. A 10k race (not jog) will burn
> around 850 - 1000 calories.

I have friends who tell me that they “work out” and are putting on weight and it turns out that they only work out for a couple hours a MONTH! I have never met a fat person that works out for an honest five hours a week.

Then HARM Says:

> Exactly. For most people (SQT and professional marathon
> runners excluded), it’s almost impossible to lose weight
> through exercise alone, unless you also combine it with a
> healthier diet & fewer calories. The amount of exercise it
> would take to burn off all the empty calories from a typical
> obsese person’s diet is staggering –and for most people,
> unrealistic.

I agree that “most people” will not loose much weight with exercise, but as I mentioned above it has more to do with the fact that “most people” don’t (and won’t ever) really do much exercise. Once someone is in decent shape they can run 20K or ride 40K in a little over an hour. If they swim a couple miles and/or spend a little over an hour in the weight room on days they are not running or riding they can pretty much eat anything they want.

I think that the reason people are so much fatter today is that people start getting fat earlier. I have posted this before, that I can’t think of the last time I saw a kid walking or riding a bike around the city. As a kid I remember racing Big Wheels (little plastic trikes with plastic wheels for those who don’t remember) down Laguna toward Green Street when visiting a friend in the city and riding my BMX bike over Highway 92 to Half Moon Bay (about 40 miles round trip) multiple times each summer (and every year for the Pumpkin Festival when the bikes were actually faster than driving) with friends when we were as young as 12. I bet SF Woman’s friends would cringe in horror of the thought of letting their kids today walk more than a block by themselves and would call child protective services if they heard a parent was letting a 12 year old (with no helmet) ride a single speed bike (with no reflectors) on a highway (with no real bike lane)…

I fear child preadators more. I live right next to a park, and unfortunately that’s a favorite hangout for people whom you do not want around your kids. I do a Megan’s Law search fairly regularly to see who lives around here with a record.

Perhaps child predators should be required to wear a transponder. Parents can have a device that beeps if they even come nearby.

Thailand and India have gone into state of the art world class health care specifically to serve the needs of those of us in the first world. Most everything else is being outsourced. A health care exodus is growing. Mexico, Brazil and many other 2nd and 3rd tier economies are trending toward following Thailand. Need a triple by-pass? How about 10-15k $USD in India as opposed to $150-200k stateside, followed shortly thereafter by bankruptcy? Go East old men, go East.

Mike,

I agree with most of your points re: corruption and why "pure" socialized medicine would fail in the US, with a few exceptions/caveats:

The doctor’s for instance are grossly overpaid. I recently had to visit an emergency room. Cost for the doctor was $465.00.

Before declaring doctors here "overpaid", you should consider that: a) malpractice insurance and legal fees will consume a huge portion of that doctor's lifetime earnings, and b) s/he probably took on a quarter-million dollars in student loans just to get that MD (more for specialists), which s/he will spend the next 10-20 years paying off.

Well, for starters, the politicians decided the National Health Service Fund was a good source to “raid” if money was needed elsewhere so even though it’s a National Health Service Fund, the politicians steal from the fund to pay for other things.

If this is going on routinely in Britain, how can you unequivocally state that "America is one of the most corrupt countries in the world"? Our government's corrupt to the core --not debating that-- but if you're going to state that we're more corrupt than every other nation, better have some facts to back it up. Just sayin'....

According to Transparency International's 2005 corruption perceptions index (a different "CPI" than we're used to tallking about), the USA is the 17th least corrupt among the 159 nations surveyed. The UK was 11th, and Canada ranked 14th.

I would also point out one elephant in the room you failed to mention: illegal aliens and free-ridership. This alone is bankrupting emergency rooms and trauma centers along border states right now. There is no way we can simply absorb the hundreds of billions in costs from the tens of millions of uninsured non-taxpaying illegals if 100% socialized medicine were mandated overnight.

MD's in England make about the same per week as they do here. This factors in the 12-14 weeks of vacation they now take in England. With massive illegal immigration and abuse, the NHS will collapse soon anyway. It is all the talk in the UK. I talk to doctors who have trained and practiced everywhere. none would deny that the highest medical standards are in the US. You dont want medical care when you are 80? Great. The govt will eventually deprive you of that option anyway. The # of grotesquely obese folk at the theme parks is startling. But stand outside any supermarket for 10 minutes. You may never eat again. If our sports icons were Lance Armstrong, Beckham,Gretzky, Federer, and Jungberg instead of fatsos in the NFL, NBA, MLB, NASCAR, and PGA, we would have slimmer waistlines I assure you.

Height of a population is probably indicative of its health. As a nation, the US is actually getting shorter not taller. This is independent of the Mexican and asian influx. Probably correlates with our poor nutrition. The Dutch are purported to have had the greatest increase in height. The height studies generated by a former U. of Chicago Sociologist received some US media coverage and then was quickly banished. We dont like bad news here......

I would never let my family receive any advanced medical care in europe. Much less the Far east. It is interesting that the top soccer players in europe, sponsored by multi-billionaire owners, come to the US for any orthopedic issue. They have access to the best of Europe yet come to the states.

Though arguably, the twin pillor of malpractice insurance malfeasance lies in lack of AMA regulation (by not kicking out bad doctors) and ... crazy southern small town juries.