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Texas’ Wind Power Generation Cut In Half Due To Winter Storm
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2021 Feb 15, 2:10pm 6,874 views 98 comments
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68
Eric Holder
2021 Feb 18, 5:50pm
Eric Holder
2021 Feb 18, 5:50pm
Rb6d says
Here was Texas' electricity makeup in kilowatt-hours on Sunday:
Natural Gas: 43,798
Coal: 10,828
Wind: 8,087
Nuclear: 5,140
And Monday 8pm, at the height of the storm:
Natural Gas: 30,917
Coal: 8,023
Wind: 649
Nuclear: 3,785
https://thefederalist.com/2021/02/18/basic-math-shows-wind-energy-failures-contributed-to-texas-deadly-power-loss/
HunterTits saysThe left is saying that the gas lines are freezing up too and that is the real reason why Texans don't have heat.
Some power generating capability was lost because 1. wind turbines iced over, and 2. too low temperature froze residual water in gas lines so some capacity went offline. The question is, what was percentage of renewable vs non renewable sources failed. From data I saw yesterday, 40% of renewable power failed vs about 20% of fossil fuel.
Here was Texas' electricity makeup in kilowatt-hours on Sunday:
Natural Gas: 43,798
Coal: 10,828
Wind: 8,087
Nuclear: 5,140
And Monday 8pm, at the height of the storm:
Natural Gas: 30,917
Coal: 8,023
Wind: 649
Nuclear: 3,785
https://thefederalist.com/2021/02/18/basic-math-shows-wind-energy-failures-contributed-to-texas-deadly-power-loss/
70
EBGuy
2021 Feb 18, 6:13pm
Still waiting for Tres Amigas to come online...
Or, atlernatively, a Nationwide HVDC grid. See Interconnections Seam Study (which, evidently, was suppressed, by the previous administration -- because MOAR coal).
Or, atlernatively, a Nationwide HVDC grid. See Interconnections Seam Study (which, evidently, was suppressed, by the previous administration -- because MOAR coal).
72
WookieMan
2021 Feb 21, 9:31am
WookieMan
2021 Feb 21, 9:31am
Rb6d says
How do gas lines freeze up though? There's not enough water in even a 1/2" line to freeze. This seems like pure BS. It's literally been ~18*F or below for all of February here in my part of IL. Much of that below 0*F during darkness. Natural gas lines don't freeze here, ever. Shit, I don't even winterize my pool lines every year (I should). Why would it be any different in TX for a few day cold snap?
I'm probably going crazy, but I feel like everything is propaganda at this point. The weather happened down there for sure, but how it's being portrayed with little to no ability to verify that what is being said is even true. All the footage from local affiliates here in IL are all using stock footage from somewhere in Europe and not TX. Maybe propaganda or maybe laziness grabbing a clip to fill the time.
Either way, what should have been a trivial events has turned into some big story. I just question why now. Especially when it doesn't sense.
HunterTits saysThe left is saying that the gas lines are freezing up too and that is the real reason why Texans don't have heat.
Some power generating capability was lost because 1. wind turbines iced over, and 2. too low temperature froze residual water in gas lines so some capacity went offline. The question is, what was percentage of renewable vs non renewable sources failed. From data I saw yesterday, 40% of renewable power failed vs about 20% of fossil fuel.
How do gas lines freeze up though? There's not enough water in even a 1/2" line to freeze. This seems like pure BS. It's literally been ~18*F or below for all of February here in my part of IL. Much of that below 0*F during darkness. Natural gas lines don't freeze here, ever. Shit, I don't even winterize my pool lines every year (I should). Why would it be any different in TX for a few day cold snap?
I'm probably going crazy, but I feel like everything is propaganda at this point. The weather happened down there for sure, but how it's being portrayed with little to no ability to verify that what is being said is even true. All the footage from local affiliates here in IL are all using stock footage from somewhere in Europe and not TX. Maybe propaganda or maybe laziness grabbing a clip to fill the time.
Either way, what should have been a trivial events has turned into some big story. I just question why now. Especially when it doesn't sense.
73
Maga_Chaos_Monkey
2021 Feb 21, 12:42pm
Maga_Chaos_Monkey
2021 Feb 21, 12:42pm
Rb6d says
I bought some of his shirts as Christmas gag gifts.
The only good news story about this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UyEWREHxjJQ
I bought some of his shirts as Christmas gag gifts.
74
NDrLoR
2021 Feb 21, 1:41pm
NDrLoR
2021 Feb 21, 1:41pm
WookieMan says
How do gas lines freeze up though?We never had these outages during the ice storms of the 70's--we also didn't have wind farms in the 70's.
75
Bd6r
2021 Feb 21, 3:15pm
Bd6r
2021 Feb 21, 3:15pm
WookieMan says
Redneck oil field friends of mine say that they have "water plugs" in gas pipelines, which froze and stopped gas flow.
How do gas lines freeze up though?
Redneck oil field friends of mine say that they have "water plugs" in gas pipelines, which froze and stopped gas flow.
76
WookieMan
2021 Feb 21, 6:22pm
WookieMan
2021 Feb 21, 6:22pm
Rb6d says
They probably know better than I do, but I've never heard of that. Are you talking individual houses or the suppliers lines freezing? I've never heard of either, just interested more than anything.
WookieMan saysHow do gas lines freeze up though?
Redneck oil field friends of mine say that they have "water plugs" in gas pipelines, which froze and stopped gas flow.
They probably know better than I do, but I've never heard of that. Are you talking individual houses or the suppliers lines freezing? I've never heard of either, just interested more than anything.
77
HeadSet
2021 Feb 21, 6:23pm
HeadSet
2021 Feb 21, 6:23pm
Rb6d says
Sounds like they need to stop pissing in the manifolds...
WookieMan saysHow do gas lines freeze up though?
Redneck oil field friends of mine say that they have "water plugs" in gas pipelines, which froze and stopped gas flow.
Sounds like they need to stop pissing in the manifolds...
78
PeopleUnited
2021 Feb 21, 7:50pm
PeopleUnited
2021 Feb 21, 7:50pm
Refined natural gas won’t freeze, but the unrefined stuff is prone to freezing. The pipes that feed their power plants must be carrying unrefined natural gas. Seems if this is true it was bound to happen sooner or later.
79
WookieMan
2021 Feb 22, 4:27am
WookieMan
2021 Feb 22, 4:27am
PeopleUnited says
We've got two pipelines near me. Those fuckers are huge. 36" roughly. All buried deep. There was one in our backyard. Every Tuesday an inspector plane would fly over to make sure no one was digging.
I guess maybe in TX they don't bury them as deep to save money? It wasn't that cold either and if it's moving, it's hard to comprehend it freezing. Could be part of the cause I guess, just doesn't compute for me with it freezing ass here now and in the past, and we've got quite a few nat. gas plants. We do have the most nuke capacity though too, so maybe that's a factor of not experiencing outages? I think we also have some of the largest wind farms too. I'm somewhat near one.
Refined natural gas won’t freeze, but the unrefined stuff is prone to freezing. The pipes that feed their power plants must be carrying unrefined natural gas. Seems if this is true it was bound to happen sooner or later.
We've got two pipelines near me. Those fuckers are huge. 36" roughly. All buried deep. There was one in our backyard. Every Tuesday an inspector plane would fly over to make sure no one was digging.
I guess maybe in TX they don't bury them as deep to save money? It wasn't that cold either and if it's moving, it's hard to comprehend it freezing. Could be part of the cause I guess, just doesn't compute for me with it freezing ass here now and in the past, and we've got quite a few nat. gas plants. We do have the most nuke capacity though too, so maybe that's a factor of not experiencing outages? I think we also have some of the largest wind farms too. I'm somewhat near one.
80
zzyzzx
2021 Feb 22, 5:39am
zzyzzx
2021 Feb 22, 5:39am
PeopleUnited says
I was thinking that it was moisture in the lines that was freezing and clogging the line.
Refined natural gas won’t freeze, but the unrefined stuff is prone to freezing. The pipes that feed their power plants must be carrying unrefined natural gas. Seems if this is true it was bound to happen sooner or later.
I was thinking that it was moisture in the lines that was freezing and clogging the line.
81
WookieMan
2021 Feb 22, 7:55am
WookieMan
2021 Feb 22, 7:55am
zzyzzx says
I'm not some engineer, but I'm still lost on how a gas line can freeze. I mean the upper part of the country and Canada would be fucked. That's a huge source of heating and electric supply. Unrefined is usually in large diameter gas lines. That would be a fuck ton of water in the line.
Again, not saying it's not possible, just seems improbable. It also wasn't that cold either in Texas compared to much of the country. Really seems like a case of utilities and government fucking things up as usual and making excuses.
PeopleUnited saysRefined natural gas won’t freeze, but the unrefined stuff is prone to freezing. The pipes that feed their power plants must be carrying unrefined natural gas. Seems if this is true it was bound to happen sooner or later.
I was thinking that it was moisture in the lines that was freezing and clogging the line.
I'm not some engineer, but I'm still lost on how a gas line can freeze. I mean the upper part of the country and Canada would be fucked. That's a huge source of heating and electric supply. Unrefined is usually in large diameter gas lines. That would be a fuck ton of water in the line.
Again, not saying it's not possible, just seems improbable. It also wasn't that cold either in Texas compared to much of the country. Really seems like a case of utilities and government fucking things up as usual and making excuses.
82
zzyzzx
2021 Feb 22, 8:15am
zzyzzx
2021 Feb 22, 8:15am
WookieMan says
I'm still wondering about this as well. Pure speculation:
Maybe they don't bury stuff below the frost like because they aren't used to doing it or otherwise don't believe it applies to them?
Maybe their maintenance sucks and they do have enough water in their lines to freeze?
Don't winterize because "global warming"?
I'm not some engineer, but I'm still lost on how a gas line can freeze.
I'm still wondering about this as well. Pure speculation:
Maybe they don't bury stuff below the frost like because they aren't used to doing it or otherwise don't believe it applies to them?
Maybe their maintenance sucks and they do have enough water in their lines to freeze?
Don't winterize because "global warming"?
83
Bd6r
2021 Feb 22, 2:10pm
Bd6r
2021 Feb 22, 2:10pm
zzyzzx says
Don't winterize because T gets cold in S. Texas once every 35 years
Don't winterize because "global warming"?
Don't winterize because T gets cold in S. Texas once every 35 years
84
PeopleUnited
2021 Feb 23, 5:09am
PeopleUnited
2021 Feb 23, 5:09am
zzyzzx says
Yes water is often in he lines that come from natural gas fields.
From a career gas industry expert: “Before it’s processed, natural gas lines can freeze, mostly due to the formation of natural gas hydrate, which forms at conditions of high pressure and low temperature in the presence of water.
During the production process, pressure is dropped at the wellhead. Gas expansion = thermodynamic cooling, often causing water to condense. Dense hydrate plugs can form. Usually the freezing is combatted with methanol.
Gas pipelines have quality standards for gas they will accept on their lines, as too many liquids will collect in low points and cause pipeline operation problems. Operators may have to dehydrate the gas prior to sales and process the gas at a gas plant to remove natural gas liquids.
The distribution utilities work hard to keep gas and only gas in their distribution lines”
But it appears in Texas they did not work hard enough to make that happen.
I was thinking that it was moisture in the lines that was freezing and clogging the line
Yes water is often in he lines that come from natural gas fields.
From a career gas industry expert: “Before it’s processed, natural gas lines can freeze, mostly due to the formation of natural gas hydrate, which forms at conditions of high pressure and low temperature in the presence of water.
During the production process, pressure is dropped at the wellhead. Gas expansion = thermodynamic cooling, often causing water to condense. Dense hydrate plugs can form. Usually the freezing is combatted with methanol.
Gas pipelines have quality standards for gas they will accept on their lines, as too many liquids will collect in low points and cause pipeline operation problems. Operators may have to dehydrate the gas prior to sales and process the gas at a gas plant to remove natural gas liquids.
The distribution utilities work hard to keep gas and only gas in their distribution lines”
But it appears in Texas they did not work hard enough to make that happen.
85
WookieMan
2021 Feb 23, 6:56am
WookieMan
2021 Feb 23, 6:56am
PeopleUnited says
Isn't it still moving though? I've kept pipes from freezing dozens of time from just having a moderate drip going. It obviously happened and it's not 100% water, but just seems strange to me. It's very hard to freeze buried lines and it wasn't that cold and it seems like it would take quite a bit of water in the mix.
Maybe because of the low likelihood of freezing they cutback on prevention? That still doesn't make sense with relatively accurate 10 day forecasts temperature wise. Some engineer should have thought of that or whoever is running that shit. I mean that's like the equivalent of bagging bread first and throwing a gallon of milk on top of it. Most thinking people know that's wrong to do. If I'm in charge of pipe I'm making sure it doesn't leak or freeze. No different than landing a plane, can't do it without the gear down.
I don't know. I don't trust anything anymore. Seems fishy. We're finally thawing out here a touch, but most of Feb has been 15*f or lower for highs. Hard ass freeze for 2 weeks plus. Never have had natural gas freeze up. Ever. Texas has been cold before too. My wife did a half marathon in Biloxi, MS during a snow storm with a layover in Houston where it was snowing. Gas didn't freeze up then? Not saying you're wrong, just doesn't make sense.
During the production process, pressure is dropped at the wellhead.
Isn't it still moving though? I've kept pipes from freezing dozens of time from just having a moderate drip going. It obviously happened and it's not 100% water, but just seems strange to me. It's very hard to freeze buried lines and it wasn't that cold and it seems like it would take quite a bit of water in the mix.
Maybe because of the low likelihood of freezing they cutback on prevention? That still doesn't make sense with relatively accurate 10 day forecasts temperature wise. Some engineer should have thought of that or whoever is running that shit. I mean that's like the equivalent of bagging bread first and throwing a gallon of milk on top of it. Most thinking people know that's wrong to do. If I'm in charge of pipe I'm making sure it doesn't leak or freeze. No different than landing a plane, can't do it without the gear down.
I don't know. I don't trust anything anymore. Seems fishy. We're finally thawing out here a touch, but most of Feb has been 15*f or lower for highs. Hard ass freeze for 2 weeks plus. Never have had natural gas freeze up. Ever. Texas has been cold before too. My wife did a half marathon in Biloxi, MS during a snow storm with a layover in Houston where it was snowing. Gas didn't freeze up then? Not saying you're wrong, just doesn't make sense.
86
zzyzzx
2021 Feb 23, 9:41am
zzyzzx
2021 Feb 23, 9:41am
WookieMan says
This is my best guess.
Maybe because of the low likelihood of freezing they cutback on prevention?
This is my best guess.
87
RWSGFY
2021 Feb 24, 9:45am
RWSGFY
2021 Feb 24, 9:45am
Donald says
It's basically a stationary aircraft: these work in Antarctica too when properly equipped.
So I learned an interesting fact over the last week: They have wind turbines in Antartica. And they work in cold weather.
It's basically a stationary aircraft: these work in Antarctica too when properly equipped.
88
zzyzzx
2021 Feb 25, 11:07am
zzyzzx
2021 Feb 25, 11:07am
Look at all the videos of people filming themselves crying while their homes flood from a burst pipe.. was their 1st priority to capture themselves crying so they could share it online? Why not prioritize finding a way to shut off the water?
90
Ceffer
2021 Feb 26, 8:15am
Ceffer
2021 Feb 26, 8:15am
I thought the wind turbines in Texas were to suck up the cow pies and launch them at New Mexico.
91
HeadSet
2021 Feb 27, 8:16am
HeadSet
2021 Feb 27, 8:16am
Ceffer says
Is that the origin of "When The Shit Hits the Fan?"
I thought the wind turbines in Texas were to suck up the cow pies and launch them at New Mexico.
Is that the origin of "When The Shit Hits the Fan?"
92
zzyzzx
2021 Mar 3, 11:38am
zzyzzx
2021 Mar 3, 11:38am
Real Plumber Reacts to THE BIGGEST PLUMBING FREEZE BREAKS on TikTok
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FuL5Db-bfTs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FuL5Db-bfTs
93
SunnyvaleCA
2021 Mar 3, 11:49am
Fortwaynemobile says
Eric Holder saysSame answer as California's not-very-fast train to nowhere boondoggle. Politicians can't resist starting a project based on federal government money. California will probably try putting the windmills on the tops of the train cars so that the thing can run itself.Fortwaynemobile saysWhy did red Texas do this retard shit?
Their energy sector is deregulated and therefore is max efficient. Which means almost no redundancy. Which is good when everything goes right and very bad when something goes wrong.
Yeah but why they did wind shit that literally everyone knows has limitations. That is some dumb shit there.
94
Eric Holder
2021 Mar 3, 12:27pm
Eric Holder
2021 Mar 3, 12:27pm
SunnyvaleCA says
You think you're joking, but you're not: there is actually two or three diesel ferries with wind generators on top of them running around SF Bay. This is fucking nuts.
Proof:
California will probably try putting the windmills on the tops of the train cars so that the thing can run itself.
You think you're joking, but you're not: there is actually two or three diesel ferries with wind generators on top of them running around SF Bay. This is fucking nuts.
Proof:
96
HeadSet
2023 Mar 6, 5:34pm
HeadSet
2023 Mar 6, 5:34pm
cisTits says
I was wondering when sailing ships would be back. Those clipper ships of old were fast even by today's standards.
Swedes might build a wind sail cargo ship that can transport 7,000 cars across the ocean in 12 days vs 8 days a normal cargo ship would take.
I was wondering when sailing ships would be back. Those clipper ships of old were fast even by today's standards.
97
AD
2024 Jan 15, 6:36pm
AD
2024 Jan 15, 6:36pm
.
Wind power is holding up tonight ... no brown outs so far in Texas ..
.
https://www.ercot.com/gridmktinfo/dashboards
.
.
Wind power is holding up tonight ... no brown outs so far in Texas ..
.
https://www.ercot.com/gridmktinfo/dashboards
.
.
98
Eric Holder
2024 Jan 16, 12:50pm
Eric Holder
2024 Jan 16, 12:50pm
HeadSet says
Fast, but EXTREMELY labor-intensive.
cisTits says
Swedes might build a wind sail cargo ship that can transport 7,000 cars across the ocean in 12 days vs 8 days a normal cargo ship would take.
I was wondering when sailing ships would be back. Those clipper ships of old were fast even by today's standards.
Fast, but EXTREMELY labor-intensive.
« First « Previous Comments 68 - 98 of 98 Search these comments
The Austin American-Statesman reported, “Wind farms across the state generate up to a combined 25,100 megawatts of energy. But unusually moist winter conditions in West Texas brought on by the weekend’s freezing rain and historically low temperatures have iced many of those wind turbines to a halt,” they added. “As of Sunday morning, those iced turbines comprise 12,000 megawatts of Texas’ installed wind generation capacity, although those West Texas turbines don’t typically spin to their full generation capacity this time of year.”
A photo began circulating on Twitter which shows a helicopter is using fossil fuel-derived chemicals to defrost a wind turbine, showing that only relying on renewable energy leads to many unforeseen complications.
“Wind power has been the fastest-growing source of energy in Texas’ power grid. In 2015 winder power generation supplied 11% of Texas’ energy grid. Last year it supplied 23% and overtook coal as the system’s second-largest source of energy after natural gas,” the Austin American-Statesman added. “The frozen turbines come as low temperatures strain the state’s power grid and force operators to call for immediate statewide conservation efforts, like unplugging non-essential appliances, turning down residential heaters and minimize use of electric lighting.”
https://thescoop.us/texas-wind-power-generation-cut-in-half-due-to-winter-storm/