patrick.net

One sure sign of a scam: Something is making a shitton of money, but everybody is spreading the word about it.

If you had a surefire way to make big bucks, why would you tell strangers on the internet about it?

All right guys what’s a good mining software for this? Can anyone advise? I get how it works, want to try to cash in on transactions here just to mess around.

It’s supremely cost prohibitive to buy the hardware necessary for a mining machine that would hash at an effective rate, not to mention the ongoing cost of kWh/BTC at least if mined in peoples Democracy of Kalifornistan.

Mining was good for those that got in in the first 25% or so of BTC, and were able to cash out some coins as they went to upgrade and add hardware as necessary.

There is now more power being spent mining Bitcoin than the whole country of Argentina uses to light their houses, etc. Or so I read recently.

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-56012952

It does not seem to be a good thing ecologically.

Patrick says

It does not seem to be a good thing ecologically.

Not sure if you'd seen that picture from space of Texas at night. Looked like a big smiley face throughout S. Texas from flaring gas. Now a lot of that is being used to mine crypto. That's the sort of electricity being used - cheap stuff that was not being used in the first place.

Think of all of the energy used to power the lights etc., in banks and to mine gold. That is way more.

“Mining” a fantasy fake virtual currency is a perfect addition to the Twilight Zone unreality we are living in today.

Bitcoin is total complete bullshit.

Fake media, fake pandemic, fake Russia hoax, fake global warming hoax, fake election, fake experts like Fauci, fake everything.

End of coffee rant.

Yeah, I was just commenting about the energy part. :)

clambo says

Bitcoin is total complete bullshit.

Why is Tesla holding 1.3B USD in Bitcoin then? Do you know more than Tesla?

Fortwaynemobile says

All right guys what’s a good mining software for this?

I wouldnt mine....you cant compete against mining pools. If you want to profit from crypto, buy BTC and ETH. That's your safest bet....we are already deep in the bull run. If you have play money then gamble with some shitcoins to pull a higher ROI. Since prices have appreciated already a lot, I would only put money into the top 10 coins by market cap at this stage of the cycle.....MINUS Dogecoin. While i think Doge can reach a $1, i think this one is pure gambling considering the 6,000% price increase this year.

70% of mining in China should be a pretty big red flag no pun intended.

It's wealth transfer ponzi.

RC2006 says

It's wealth transfer ponzi.

So all BTC holders are at the top of the ponzi? Who is being scammed? Me, who bought last year? (i paid 15k for a BTC. Now one BTC is worth 55k). Doesnt feel like a scam....feels like best thing since sliced bread.

reminder: bitcoin is a wealth transfer to the chinese coal industry!

Tesla is almost as absurd as Bitcoin, but at least the stock represents a share of equity.

I do know more than Tesla in one respect; my little business made a profit without government intervention to help me. Wait, that’s 2 things, Tesla doesn’t profit does it?

Edit/addendum

Before someone says that dollars are worse than bitcoin; I don’t have them either, except in small amounts needed to pay for things that I want or need.

Yeah, take all the worst things about the tech bubble and housing bubble inflated assets. They are both still better than bitcoin, in that they represented an actual asset that at least had the hope of generating revenue. The only thing that truly created misery in those situations was the leverage/debt people went into to participate. To the extent that people are leveraging into bitcoin, I truly see pain and misery coming.

clambo says

Tesla doesn’t profit does it?

Tesla has a non-negative (albeit very high) P/E, so it does profit.

@clambo .. dollars are NOT worse than bitcoin. They are two entirely different things.
A) bitcoin is not currency.
- a system of money in general use in a particular country.
- the fact or quality of being generally accepted or in use

I can't go down to mcdonalds in any country that I know of and buy a burger using bitcoin.

bitcoin wants to be a currency

I get what you are saying that the inflation in dollars is bad. But lack of inflation does not make something a valuable asset. For instance, gold has a very limited supply. There are other precious metals, but you cant substitute copper for gold. Bitcoin has a limited supply, but you can easily substitute etherium for bitcoin. Similarly, my poop has limited supply. But it's not valuable. It can easily be substituted with your poop.

So dollars DON'T have a limited supply.. but they do have a lack of substitution. You can't just pay your taxes in pesos instead of dollars. In the US, debt must be settled in dollars. If you earn your salary in pesos or bitcoin or gold, it doesn't matter.. you still have to pay your taxes in dollars. Unless and until that changes, bitcoin will be substitutable and as far as I can tell, has no intrinsic value, despite having a currently market driven price.

On the flip side, I am NOT saying the dollar situation is good.. and pretty soon you might be able to get lots and lots of dollars in exchange for very little things that are not substitutable (food, tools, energy).
With bitcoin mining, the situation is: buy energy, buy compute power, generate bitcoin, sell bitcoin for dollars, use dollars to buy energy and have dollars left over.

When that happens, and you can get lots of dollars for energy, why would you want to spend your energy mining bitcoin to trade for dollars, if you can just get lots of dollars for your energy directly? (This just means inflation will happen and bitcoin transaction costs will rise astronomically)

Zak says

Similarly, my poop has limited supply. But it's not valuable. It can easily be substituted with your poop.

This original or copied?? I about pooped my pants laughing. lo fucking l.

I learned the word "fungible" recently.

Poop is fungible.

being something (such as money or a commodity) of such a nature that one part or quantity may be replaced by another equal part or quantity in paying a debt or settling an account Oil, wheat, and lumber are fungible commodities.

BitCoin:
Before I Start... I've started following this in 2012... and mined in 2014... been in I.T. for 30 years... ok... done

A Peer 2 peer network of Decentralized people... no one single owner.
It's a Global programming environment for the secure exchange / transfer of information .
It's not a piece of digital currency... it's a tiny part of it.
It's a protocol for information synchronization. It can precicely and chronologically Time order any data ( Blockchain) and have a built in check for Validity without any central authority.
This Blockchain is the database that is a giant Accounting Ledger, that stores the transmission and receiving of financial information.
This is a public record of Ownership, with ownership rights secured by Cryptography.

The blockchain is combined with encryption functons and database rules to provide people with ownership rights to a certain balance of numbers... DUBBED ... COINS

... One of the challenges..... when someone invents a whole new technology... is to describe it... in old Technology terms... so ... i't s really just data... Data that is tied to a certain identity.

the database rules includes a condition where multiple private encryption keys must be used to send this Data (Coins) to another user

So if your dealing with a party on the BITCOIN Network, you will know that person is trusted without the need for a Central 3rd party.

Bitcoin is a Secure Record Keeping environment

The Architechure, can replace the Stock Market, financial institutions, foreign Exchanges, Credit Card/Debit Card Processing,.. and this is ever evolving.

So...why do you put money in the Bank?
fundamentally for 2 reasons...
Inflation, since banks at one time gave you interest for them to hold your Money. and
It might get stolen if you keep it in your home.

In Bitcoin you really can't have your "Coins" stolen. you can get your Bitcoin stolen if you lost your encrypted wallet... but a physical wallet is also prone to your case being stolen if not protected.

Finally.. Mining is global... not just China... so the China arguement does not hold major water with me... I mined with Solar with a tiny miner, and dropped it to use utility elec... but that was years ago.. now its back to small scale, and watching/playing the upticks/Downticks.
ok... I'm done..

seesaw says

BitCoin:
Before I Start... I've started following this in 2012... and mined in 2014... been in I.T. for 30 years... ok... done

Awesome post....i copied it for the future. People are slow to learn....especially when it comes to new tech.

I wish people would understand more about IT/software engineering. Most BTC haters are hillbillies or people who are just not smart enough to buy crypto and hold it on a digital wallet. Wallet to them means dirty cash and silver coins.

WookieMan says

Zak says

Similarly, my poop has limited supply. But it's not valuable.

Thats exactly the difference between your poop and Bitcoin. Nobody wants your poop but a single Bitcoin is trading at 58k at the moment (even though people who think they are smart predicted a price of 1.2k for Bitcoin).

Even Tesla bought Bitcoin. Currently they are holding 1.3B worth of Bitcoin on their books :)

Thanks Tesla!

seesaw says

BitCoin:
Before I Start... I've started following this in 2012... and mined in 2014... been in I.T. for 30 years... ok... done

A Peer 2 peer network of Decentralized people... no one single owner.
It's a Global programming environment for the secure exchange / transfer of information .
It's not a piece of digital currency... it's a tiny part of it.
It's a protocol for information synchronization. It can precicely and chronologically Time order any data ( Blockchain) and have a built in check for Validity without any central authority.
This Blockchain is the database that is a giant Accounting Ledger, that stores the transmission and receiving of financial information.
This is a public record of Ownership, with ownership rights secured by Cryptography.

The blockchain is combined with encryption functons and database rules to provide people with ownership rights to a certain balance of numbers... DUBBED ... COINS

... One of the challenges......

@Zak

if your poop can do any of these things that Bitcoin can do....maybe your poop will be worth something one day. Highly doubt it though....hopefully, thats not a personal attack ROFL.

seesaw says

In Bitcoin you really can't have your "Coins" stolen.

But if you want to sell your "coins" you need to find a bigger fool than the one that bought your coins.

Tell me if I am wrong?

Onvacation says

seesaw says

In Bitcoin you really can't have your "Coins" stolen.

But if you want to sell your "coins" you need to find a bigger fool than the one that bought your coins.

Tell me if I am wrong?

yeah, you are wrong. Bitcoin buyers are smart. Bitcoin sellers are fools. Why hold cash during inflation? I rather hold Bitcoin and get wealthier.
You just got it mixed up. :) From my own experience: I bought 1.9BTC at 15k each. Now each of them is worth 58k! Thank god i didnt hold cash instead!!!!!!

Onvacation says

But if you want to sell your "coins" you need to find a bigger fool than the one that bought your coins.

Sounds like the current state of housing market in SFBA

B.A.C.A.H. says

Onvacation says

But if you want to sell your "coins" you need to find a bigger fool than the one that bought your coins.

Sounds like the current state of housing market in SFBA

Whenever you sell an asset you can say a greater fool bought it. That works until that greater fool makes money off of it. Than you say, the buyer the greater fool sold to becomes the greater fool and the previous greater fool is suddenly a smart investor? Onvacation is full of s***. He doesnt even know when the last Bitcoin will be mined. He seems to have no clue about Bitcoin and just trolls us. Typical behavior for people who missed out and are sour grapes.

Bitcoin says

That works until that greater fool makes money off of it.

Thing is, with Bitcoin, the greater fool makes money only by finding a yet greater fool, no?

With stock, on the other hand, you actually own shares in a real company that should be producing profits. You can lose there too, but at least there is a real business behind each share of stock.

Patrick says

but at least there is a real business behind each share of stock.

that's right. Behind Bitcoin is a much greater value than just a company. The entire gold market is for grabs. Dont believe me.....just wait :)

seesaw says

It's a protocol for information synchronization. It can precicely and chronologically Time order any data ( Blockchain) and have a built in check for Validity without any central authority.

Winner.. This is the "fundamental value" of bitcoin.. but what is that value "worth". Do any governments recognize this bitcoin register as they do for instance a county recorder's office? No. Is a document legally binding in any way because it is authenticated in bitcoin? No more than a simple notary public down the street that doesn't require a globally connected network "mining" energy inefficient blockchain keys. The scope of bitcoin's use is SO narrowly limited and unable to fulfill most legal functions that it is nearly useless. The first blockchain to come along supported by a governmental legal framework will devalue this weak substitute for actual legal protection almost immediately. Already blockchains with lower energy consumption per transaction are eating into this limited value effectiveness of bitcoin. And as far as "scarcity", bitcoin does not have a suitable lack of substitutability that anything we would want to behave as a "currency" should have. You can simply start another blockchain network. There is a value in the network effect of bitcoin in particular, but i would imagine the "next Satoshi" is actively thinking about how to break the network effect as a requirement. BTW, if someone figures this out, facebook , twitter, and linked in will quickly fall as well.

seesaw says

Finally.. Mining is global... not just China... so the China arguement does not hold major water with me...

Sounds like something an ostrich would say. "Here is a big glaring issue, a majority of mining is going to China, and powered by coal, but i did something different one time, and i heard some other stuff, so i'll bury my head in the sand and pretend that huge issue doesn't exist.."

And that's the responsible "investment analysis" you think people should hang their security on?

Zak says

seesaw says

Finally.. Mining is global... not just China... so the China arguement does not hold major water with me...

After Musks recent tweet I have the following theory:

Musk is an entrepreneur....what do they do? They solve problems.
He just bought 1.5B USD worth of Bitcoin and now tweets that the energy consumption is a problem? Who is he kidding....of course he knew this when he bought....So what is he up to?
Tesla miner coming soon.....what better company to manufacture Bitcoin miner devices and take over the mining business? They already are invested in Bitcoin and have the perfect set up for mining the green way. Let's just not mention that EV's use electricity too.....

Is it time to ping this thread again? What would bitcoin do? Elon Musk says sell... it's bad for the environment! LOL!

Bitcoin says

He just bought 1.5B USD worth of Bitcoin and now tweets that the energy consumption is a problem? Who is he kidding....of course he knew this when he bought....So what is he up to?

We've told you. It was a pump and dump by Musk. Pretty much indisputable at this point.

The guy wants to literally live on Mars. It's not a dream. It's not a joke. To get there he needs $$$$$. Who knows the entry/selling points, but he's likely walking with $500M+ in USD of OPM, which is what will help get him where he wants to go. Mars. Mark Cuban is fucking around in the game as well, because he knows the game.

Meet some legit multimillionaires. You don't know the game you're playing. You're in a boxing ring with a 23 year old Mike Tyson. You will get knocked out. Until you can throw $5-10M+ at an investment and lose it all, you can't beat the other players. At some point you run out of money after they took all yours.

I guess some people who bought bitcoin for $64,863 are a little upset today ($43,705).
48.4% down isn’t too bad, is it?
Maybe not? Some will hold it through thick and thin.

People, just buy WFC, it’s a good deal, you can’t lose (after it hits $54, I’m OUT)

WookieMan says

Until you can throw $5-10M+ at an investment and lose it all, you can't beat the other players. At some point you run out of money after they took all yours.

When I was a wee gambler, I wondered why there were upper limits on some casino games, like roulette. Wouldn't the house always want you to bet as much as you can?

The answer is that with sufficient money, and without an upper limit, you could just keep doubling your bet on red or black on the roulette wheel every time you lost, and soon you'd recover what you lost. But if they cap your bet, then when you lose at that level, you have to win twice in a row to get back to where you were.

So I'm agreeing with the premise: people with more money to bet have a big advantage in the game. They will survive the random fluctuations better than someone without as much money.

Who is more likely to win a coin flip?

1. A baby
2. An M.I.T. Phd. in statistics
3. A rich gazillionaire

Any of the above.

WookieMan says

Bitcoin says

He just bought 1.5B USD worth of Bitcoin and now tweets that the energy consumption is a problem? Who is he kidding....of course he knew this when he bought....So what is he up to?

We've told you.

"We"
You told us Musk sold.....According to Tesla's financials in Q1 they have the vast majority of BTC on their books.

He did troll however with his dogecoin shit. Typical musk. You never know with this guy. Bitcoin doesnt need him....he provided a nice pump to BTC which he is now reversing. Doesnt mean BTC wont go to 100k this year....

whenever BTC dips the haters come out and cheer. Just until it recovers and reaches new all time highs. Every. time. the. same. spiel.

I think 48% is not a “dip” but something else.

I don’t care, Apple just gave me 11 more free shares of a real company, real equity.

I’m not a hater, but it’s ridiculous to brag about owning something which “dips” 48% at any time.