patrick.net

Zak says

death and injury rates being higher for infection than for vaccination

@Zak That is a false statement, and by a long shot. Is is blatant propaganda designed to keep the killing going so that the Pfizer can keep profiting.

https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/experimental-vaccine-death-rate-for-israels-elderly-40-times-higher-than-covid-19-deaths-researchers/?source=patrick.net

A re-analysis of published data from the Israeli Health Ministry by Dr. Hervé Seligmann, a member of the faculty of Medicine Emerging Infectious and Tropical Diseases at Aix-Marseille University, and engineer Haim Yativ reveal, in short, that the mRNA experimental vaccine from Pfizer killed “about 40 times more (elderly) people than the disease itself would have killed” during a recent five-week vaccination period. Among the younger class, these numbers are compounded to death rates at 260 times what the COVID-19 virus would have claimed in the given time frame.

http://www.nakim.org/israel-forums/viewtopic.php?t=271076&source=patrick.net

@patrick..

I thought we covered this a couple months ago.. Several hundred thousand dead in the USA of covid. Several ten thousand dead of vaccine. Order of magnitude difference..

Cherry picking data from some random study doesn't change overall order of magnitude difference. At this point I now also directly know or 1 step removed know about a dozen dead of covid. Zero from vaccine. Why isn't your data matching?

lAl_Sharpton_for_President says

If you have a healthy innate immune system, the virus will be kept in check and symptoms may not even be noticeabl

Lol.. gotta love when you say things like this..
"Oh my dick is big, so known viral infection mechanisms don't apply to me.." lol.. Right..

Remember, hypothesis must explain what we see. If the observations don't match the theory, the theory must be wrong. If your theory is that the vaccine is killing more than Covid, why do i directly know more dead of Covid than from the vaccine? Why is this consistent across the wide variety of people I talk to? What would occam's razor tell you about your theory?

Zak says

Several hundred thousand dead in the USA of covid

Several hundred clamed dead from Covid. Since the average age of these deaths is 79 in the USA, I suspect that Covid deaths counts included those who died from anything, especially old age.

Patrick says

Among the younger class, these numbers are compounded to death rates at 260 times what the COVID-19 virus would have claimed in the given time frame.

I appreciate Patrick, as I've said in the past, that you are actually fetching and digesting different data sources, and presenting them. I obviously respect this approach. I struggle to understand why systemically, these numbers don't match. If there was a 40x rate for elderly, where are the 20 million dead oldsters from the vaccine in the US???

If there were a 260x vaccine death rate for the "younger", then where are the 260k dead in the US from the vaccine, when we know about 1k kids have died from Covid? (Making Covid not very dangerous for kids).

It certainly is a study, and it has data. Why is the data so incongruent with what we see in reality?

Tenpoundbass says

The School sent home a letter yesterday along with a form to give permission for a Vax drive they are doing Jan 7th and Jan 27th.

I told the wife, not only don't send back the form, but don't send the kids to school on that day.

Maybe send the form back just in case they change the date?

Reality says

Side note: the court cases where the families fight for the use of Ivermectin were usually due to the patients being taken hostage by the hospitals. Under existing state laws, it would be a crime (comparable to being caught in illegal drug trafficking) for a family member or another doctor not affiliated with the hospital to administer Ivermectin (or any other meds) to the patient without the hospital's consent (which was being withheld, therefore the families had to go to court to obtain court-order). Those laws need to be changed. Patients should never become the hostage or the prisoner to a torture chamber calling itself "hospital" simply due to licensing.

Both of my 84 year old parents got covid. Their Doctors told us they would not survive. We took them out of the hospital and put them in a rehab center. The started to get better almost immediately. They both are survivors of covid. Each one of them has at least 3 comorbitiies.

Zak says

If you have a healthy innate immune system, the virus will be kept in check and symptoms may not even be noticeabl

Lol.. gotta love when you say things like this..

i am not talking about myself, I am describing the science of human immunology. NK cells, low affinity IgM antibodies, and additonal components of innate immunity counteract pathogens. Else, how would humanity survive when encountering new emergents?

Zak says

If your theory is that the vaccine is killing more than Covid

I have never said any such thing. Strawman arguments are the last remaining strategy of the defeated.

Zak says

Several ten thousand dead of vaccine.

And you think that is Ok?

I guess they would have died anyway.

Zak says

Why is the data so incongruent with what we see in reality?

Because data trumps anecdotal.

Al_Sharpton_for_President says

Zak says

If your theory is that the vaccine is killing more than Covid

I have never said any such thing. Strawman arguments are the last remaining strategy of the defeated.

I was referring to Patrick posting a 260x fatality rate for kids from the vaccine. I replied to both of you at once. It's not me attacking you. It's just commentary on data that I see to try to reach the best understanding of risk within my small meat computer in my skull.

Onvacation says

Because data trumps anecdotal.

This statement is like putting your head in a bucket of sand and shaking vigorously to avoid comprehending my statement. If we had a theory of gravity that said things fall toward the sky, but we see things fall to the ground, yes, it is anecdotal, but the theory doesn't match observation.

You can go back to re-read what I said if you have ANY interest in understanding a different viewpoint even without accepting it.

Zak says

You can go back to re-read what I said if you have ANY interest in understanding a different viewpoint even without accepting it.

Just to clarify, you think the Wuhan is deadly and the vax is safe and effective. Did I get that right?

Onvacation says

Just to clarify, you think the Wuhan is deadly and the vax is safe and effective. Did I get that right?

You did not. I said several hundred thousand died from Covid, and several ten thousand died from "theraputic /vaccine". I said the number of those dead from Covid is conservatively an order of magnitude greater than those dead from the vaccine. There is no value judgement other than more dead is worse to me than less dead, especially in the order of magnitude range. It's like asking if you want to jump off a 1 foot curb now, or walk along a 10 foot roof indefinitely . In both cases your chance of survival is very high. But when you have millions of people getting blown by the wind, some of them are going to die in both cases. (Even after being jabbed).

Zak says

Onvacation says

Just to clarify, you think the Wuhan is deadly and the vax is safe and effective. Did I get that right?

You did not

So you don't think the Wuhan is deadly? And you think the vax IS safe and effective even though it has killed tens of thousands and doesn't make you immune from the disease?

What part did I get wrong?

Zak says

. It's like asking if you want to jump off a 1 foot curb now, or walk along a 10 foot roof indefinitely . In both cases your chance of survival is very high

Which is unlike forcing someone to take an experimental biologic agent that has already killed tens of thousands, maimed hundreds of thousands, and has unknown long-term effects, for a virus that only kills the old and sick.

Zak says

Several hundred thousand dead in the USA of covid. Several ten thousand dead of vaccine.

Wrong.

Several tens of thousands dead of the virus.

Several hundred thousand dead in the USA from the vaxx.

Patrick says

Several tens of thousands dead of the virus.

Several hundred thousand dead in the USA from the vaxx.

Very bizzarre... It was only a few months ago that we both agreed at least a few hundred thousand were dead from the virus, before the majority of the population had been jabbed. Strange how time can warp things...

Patrick says

Zak says

Several hundred thousand dead in the USA of covid. Several ten thousand dead of vaccine.

Wrong.

Several tens of thousands dead of the virus.

Several hundred thousand dead in the USA from the vaxx.

We don't know. The statistics are intentionally bollocks up.

They conflate people who have the virus and happen to die as people dying from the virus, and they place restrictions on the cause of death from people post vax, like they have to have had it for 2 weeks.

There's no control data, so getting an objective over-view would be difficult, and considering that our government is doing everything in their power to prevent objective measurement, it's going to be extremely difficult. My confidence in the government is at an end. I'd think doctors would call them out on this bullshit, but they don't. I have no trust in traditional institutions.

https://palexander.substack.com/p/covid-19-vaccines-for-children-our?source=patrick.net

COVID-19 vaccines for children, our young children who bring statistical zero risk to the table, is all risk & no benefit, no opportunity for benefit and only opportunity for harms, thousands can die
Fauci and Walensky and Francis Collins and Pfizer CEO Bourla and CDC and NIH and public health officials and all advocating for this are criminal, any scientist or doctor, we risk killing thousands

Dr. Paul Alexander
Dec 12

INVENTOR OF THE MRNA TECHNOLOGY DR. ROBERT MALONE WARNS ABOUT THE DANGERS OF VACCINATING CHILDREN

Onvacation says

INVENTOR OF THE MRNA TECHNOLOGY DR. ROBERT MALONE WARNS ABOUT THE DANGERS OF VACCINATING CHILDREN

Why is the video cut short?

WineHorror1 says

Why is the video cut short?

Bitchute

Tenpoundbass says

The School sent home a letter yesterday along with a form to give permission for a Vax drive they are doing Jan 7th and Jan 27th.

I told the wife, not only don't send back the form, but don't send the kids to school on that day.

We did the exact same thing. Kept our child home from school during that period so there could be no chance they were "accidentally" injected.

sjmoca says

richwicks says

Several tens of thousands dead of the virus.

Several hundred thousand dead in the USA from the vaxx.

How do you support this idea? How do you explain the really low or even negative excess mortality in places like Australia or Japan which have high mrna vax rates?

https://stevekirsch.substack.com/p/latest-vaers-estimate-388000-americans?source=patrick.net

My estimate of the VAERS under-reporting factor (URF) at 41 was based on anaphylaxis rates reported in the Blumenthal paper published in JAMA.

I have argued that the anaphylaxis rate is an appropriate number to use to (under) estimate deaths because I believed that deaths would be less reported than anaphylaxis to VAERS for two reasons: 1) usually lacks the time proximity to vaccination, 2) the person seeing the death may not know the vaccination status of the victim and may not technically be required to report the death.

WineHorror1 says

sjmoca says

richwicks says

Wrong.

@WineHorror1 - You've misattributed this to me. See here:

https://www.patrick.net/post/1342946&offset=#comment-1805997

I'm generally not the type of person to ever write "Wrong." - I'm well too aware of my ability to make mistakes and even when I'm certain somebody is wrong and I'm right, I try to be good about explaining why I think I'm right - in that way, if I'm NOT right, they can explain how I'm wrong.

Positive it's an innocent mistake (or maybe a bug in this script) so no worries.

richwicks says

WineHorror1 says

sjmoca says

richwicks says

Wrong.

@WineHorror1 - You've misattributed this to me. See here:

https://www.patrick.net/post/1342946&offset=#comment-1805997

I'm generally not the type of person to ever write "Wrong." - I'm well too aware of my ability to make mistakes and even when I'm certain somebody is wrong and I'm right, I try to be good about explaining why I think I'm right - in that way, if I'm NOT right, they can explain how I'm wrong.

Positive it's an innocent mistake (or maybe a bug in this script) so no worries.

I quoted from comment #33. The quotes are getting a little long here, huh?

sjmoca says

richwicks says

Wrong.

Several tens of thousands dead of the virus.

Several hundred thousand dead in the USA from the vaxx.

How do you support this idea? How do you explain the really low or even negative excess mortality in places like Australia or Japan which have high mrna vax rates?

Japan rightfully did away with deaths "with covid" which is utter propaganda shite, so yeah they are using the real covid deaths "from" covid only. And Australia has most of their citizens imprisoned like the former Soviet union or DDR, just worse as they can't even move freely within their country. So yeah few infections obviously for the totally fucked citizenry. So these are invalid comparisons for the above reasons, next...

sjmoca says

The conclusion is that mass vaccinations made not even a blip in excess mortality. Therefore, trying to blame vaccines for the excess mortality in the US instead of covid is a huge stretch.

What are the vaccines being used in Japan, and what is the vaccination rate?

If the vaccinations are actually killing people, it's easy to see, just compare the death rate of the vaccinated against the unvaccinated within the same age group. It's not perfect, because people who "feel healthy" are less likely to get the vaccination (BTW - I wouldn't say I "feel healthy" I treat my body like a baby treats a diaper), but it's a start. We COULD be comparing mortality rates of people who have received Moderna, Pfizer, Jansen and Jansen (they changed their name because they were sued for knowingly selling baby power contaminated with asbestos), etc. This is TRIVIAL to do - but it's not done. Why?

This data isn't available. It's BASIC data to collect, but our "authorities" won't collect it. The lack of transparency is why I refuse to get vaccinated, and is probably why I will be unemployed soon enough. I'm not going to lie to get a religious exemption - I resent I have to appeal to a God to get an exemption, instead of my own reasoning - especially when my reasoning is being limited by censorship.

sjmoca says

Mass vaccinations made not even a blip in excess mortality.

There's no way to know because the data is intentionally not being collected. We can only speculate.

But we're censored and we are subject to constant propaganda. Why do you assume this is for the public good? When has censorship and propaganda EVER been used for the general good?

sjmoca says

mell says

So these are invalid comparisons for the above reasons, next...

You missed the point. The reasons for why they have low infections, in no way address the point that they're not dying in droves from the vax.

Mass vaccinations made not even a blip in excess mortality. Therefore, trying to blame vaccines for the huge excess mortality in the US instead of covid is a huge stretch.

Japan has an incredibly aging/old population. For old people the jab may help them briefly to not die right away from covid, so there is a trade off for high risk people, and excess mortality from the vax goes to zero the older the jabbed population is. If you rolled out the jab in Haiti for everyone or would be an unmitigated disaster with lots of excess mortality from the jab

sjmoca says

mell says

excess mortality from the vax goes to zero the older the jabbed population is.

On the spot speculation, which doesn't line up with other facts e.g. deaths reported in vaers are highly correlated to older age.

That's not the point. The old people die anyways within a shorter time frame, so excess mortality is moot. Also wrt myocarditis teenage boys especially and adolescents in general are far more often crippled or killed than old people. Especially compared to their near perfect general health. If you calculate by years of life added or taken away, the jab is a total genocidal disaster.

https://www.zerohedge.com/covid-19/top-cardiologist-tells-joe-rogan-intentional-plot-suppress-early-covid-treatments?source=patrick.net

sjmoca says

richwicks says

If the vaccinations are actually killing people, it's easy to see, just compare the death rate of the vaccinated against the unvaccinated within the same age group. It's not perfect, because people who "feel healthy" are less likely to get the vaccination (BTW - I wouldn't say I "feel healthy" I treat my body like a baby treats a diaper), but it's a start. We COULD be comparing mortality rates of people who have received Moderna, Pfizer, Jansen and Jansen

They have compared it. Data from the UK is showing the total mortality for the vaxed is way lower than unvaxed in the same age groups. That data is just getting denied.

Show me the source.

"News" media isn't a source today. They have been caught lying over and over and over again. They cannot be trusted at all. They are propaganda.

It's reasonable to conclude with a constant force of propaganda combined with censorship that the "authorities" can no longer be trusted. I've talked to a funeral director in the UK, his claim is that he didn't see more business during the "covid epidemic" but DID see an uptick in deaths as the vaccines were rolled in. In England, they introduced vaccines by age group, and as each age group was asked to get their "inoculation" he saw an uptick shortly afterward of those same age groups dying.

Now that's anecdotal evidence I realize, but it's a damned sight better than the assholes that pretend the Downing Street Memos don't exist.

At this point, I don't care. I'm not here to convince you. You do whatever you like, I've done my due diligence right up to telling my company to go get stuffed. They can fire me or not. I'm not taking it. I'm not trying to weasel out of it with a religious exemption or a medical exemption - I don't believe this shit, and I've been as plain as that. You have that conviction? You ever give up a job and dare your employer to get rid of you because of your convictions?

I have lost so much respect for colleagues in the last 18 months. I can't tell if they are idiots or sheep though - certain it's a combination of both.

I am amazed at either how easily propagandized people are, or how fucking weak they are. Never would have guessed 2 years ago. Never would have imagined. I not only understand the disgust that "authorities" feel over the population, I'm starting to agree with it. If they told you to smoke a crack pipe before going to work, 90% of the population would do it without question - they'd just have to introduce it in increments. Move slowly enough, and the sheep will obediently walk into a slaughterhouse.

@richwicks, that wasn't meant as a smartass comment. I didn't write "WRONG".

sjmoca says

Japan has a hundred million adults of all ages vaxed. Where's all the vax deaths?

They inspected all of the incoming vax batches and rejected the ones contaminated with metal; dodged a bullet.

sjmoca says

20 million vaxed in Australia and no excess deaths?

Do you think the vax IS safe and effective even though it has killed tens of thousands and doesn't make you immune from the disease?

WineHorror1 says

@richwicks, that wasn't meant as a smartass comment. I didn't write "WRONG".

I'm just pointing out an error that happened. I never wrote "WRONG" in this quote:

https://www.patrick.net/post/1342946?offset=0#comment-1806009

or even this quote:

https://www.patrick.net/post/1342946&offset=#comment-1805997

"Zak" wrote that:

https://www.patrick.net/post/1342946&offset=0#comment-1805764

I just don't want to have something attributed to me I didn't say - well, unless I really agree with it, and in this case I don't. It's just an error somewhere, no big deal.

https://childrenshealthdefense.org/defender/physicians-scientists-kids-should-not-get-covid-vaccine/?utm_source=patrick.net&utm_campaign=patrick.net&utm_medium=patrick.net

Before you vaccinate your child — which is irreversible and potentially permanently damaging — find out why 16,000 physicians and medical scientists around the world signed a declaration publicly declaring that healthy children should NOT be vaccinated for COVID-19.

https://nitter.net/VigilantFox/status/1469156380426842115?ref_src=patrick.net&source=patrick.net

The Vigilant Fox
@VigilantFox
Dec 10
We are witnessing one of the biggest, if not the biggest, crimes against humanity in human history

The young & healthy, with a 99.997% rate of survival, are being shamed, bullied, and coerced into taking an experimental jab that poses 50x the risk of death than the virus itself.

https://globalcovidsummit.org/news/live-stream-event-physicians-alerting-parents?source=patrick.net

Before your child is injected, watch Dr. Robert Malone’s statement on child COVID vaccinations
Before you vaccinate your child, which is irreversible and potentially permanently damaging, find out why 15,000 physicians and medical scientists around the world signed a declaration publicly declaring that healthy children should NOT be vaccinated for COVID-19. On behalf of these MDs and PhDs, Dr. Robert Malone, who has devoted his career to vaccine development, provides parents a clear statement outlining the scientific facts behind this decision.

Full Text of Malone Statement
My name is Robert Malone, and I am speaking to you as a parent, grandparent, physician and scientist. I don’t usually read from a prepared speech, but this is so important that I wanted to make sure that I get every single word and scientific fact correct.

I stand by this statement with a career dedicated to vaccine research and development. I’m vaccinated for COVID and I'm generally pro-vaccination. I have devoted my entire career to developing safe and effective ways to prevent and treat infectious diseases.

After this, I will be posting the text of this statement so you can share it with your friends and family.

Before you inject your child - a decision that is irreversible - I wanted to let you know the scientific facts about this genetic vaccine, which is based on the mRNA vaccine technology I created:

There are three issues parents need to understand:

The first is that a viral gene will be injected into your children's cells. This gene forces your child’s body to make toxic spike proteins. These proteins often cause permanent damage in children’s critical organs, including

Their brain and nervous system
Their heart and blood vessels, including blood clots
Their reproductive system, and
This vaccine can trigger fundamental changes to their immune system
The most alarming point about this is that once these damages have occurred, they are irreparable

You can’t fix the lesions within their brain
You can’t repair heart tissue scarring
You can’t repair a genetically reset immune system, and
This vaccine can cause reproductive damage that could affect future generations of your family
The second thing you need to know about is the fact that this novel technology has not been adequately tested.

We need at least 5 years of testing/research before we can really understand the risks
Harms and risks from new medicines often become revealed many years later
Ask yourself if you want your own child to be part of the most radical medical experiment in human history

One final point: the reason they’re giving you to vaccinate your child is a lie.

Your children represent no danger to their parents or grandparents
It’s actually the opposite. Their immunity, after getting COVID, is critical to save your family if not the world from this disease
In summary: there is no benefit for your children or your family to be vaccinating your children against the small risks of the virus, given the known health risks of the vaccine that as a parent, you and your children may have to live with for the rest of their lives.

The risk/benefit analysis isn’t even close.

As a parent and grandparent, my recommendation to you is to resist and fight to protect your children.