patrick.net

I'm actually eyeing crypto at this point. May start buying month-to-month. Or not. No hurry, historically crypto dips lasted a while after bottoming out.

https://finance.yahoo.com/m/d846ed84-ecd2-3f25-8167-23943ae06c73/bitcoin-drops-to-20-000-as.html

Bitcoin Drops to $20,000 as Crypto Crash Continues

zzyzzx says

Bitcoin Drops to $20,000 as Crypto Crash Continues

A BUYING OPPORTUNITY!!!

RC2006 says

Shouldn't bitcoin be taking off if it is gold 2.0? Seems to be linked more to FOMO, bitcoin whales, and disposable cash.

Good point - where's all the buttcoin pimps? STORE OF VALUE!!!

Onvacation says

Somebody has to pay for all of these computers and the power to run them. When it is no longer profitable the miners will quit and sell their custom hardware to some company using blockchain for some better purpose than a Ponzi scheme.

There is no doubt that crypto has added to the state of the art in math, software, and hardware.

The only way to get your money out is to find someone to buy your "coin". The only way to make money is to find someone to pay you more than you paid for it. Everything else went to hardware and power costs.

It's like real gold only better because you don't have to carry it around.

Onvacation says

Somebody has to pay for all of these computers and the power to run them. When it is no longer profitable the miners will quit and sell their custom hardware to some company using blockchain for some better purpose than a Ponzi scheme.

I'd just like to buy an upgraded graphics card for under $1000, preferably under $300. How low does BTC have to go to achieve that - $50? Cool!

@Onvacation,
you are mean here!!!
Onvacation says

It's like real gold only better because you don't have to carry it around.

stereotomy says

Onvacation says

Somebody has to pay for all of these computers and the power to run them. When it is no longer profitable the miners will quit and sell their custom hardware to some company using blockchain for some better purpose than a Ponzi scheme.

I'd just like to buy an upgraded graphics card for under $1000, preferably under $300. How low does BTC have to go to achieve that - $50? Cool!

I need a new vid card to. If bitcoin tanks market will be flooded with cheap high end cards.

RC2006 says

Shouldn't bitcoin be taking off if it is gold 2.0? Seems to be linked more to FOMO, bitcoin whales, and disposable cash.

In all fairness, gold 1.0 is not taking off either. Not tanking like crypto, but not really taking off, and hasn't been in last years. Despite the inflation.

zzyzzx says

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/celsius-halt-crypto-withdrawals-washington-140101369.html

Celsius' move to halt crypto withdrawals catches Washington's eye

HODLers be like: "there is no need to withdraw EVER anyway".

mostly reader says

RC2006 says

Shouldn't bitcoin be taking off if it is gold 2.0? Seems to be linked more to FOMO, bitcoin whales, and disposable cash.

In all fairness, gold 1.0 is not taking off either. Not tanking like crypto, but not really taking off, and hasn't been in last years. Despite the inflation.

I really don't understand why gold hasn't taken off.

Is it because of Bitcoin?

RedStar says

Is it because of Bitcoin?

I understand that today total worth of all the gold in the world is about 10X of all the worth of all the crypto in the world at today's prices. (~10T/~1T USD) Not negligible, but still somewhat insignificant. Besides, if there were dependency on crypto then I'd think that drop in crypto prices would've cause the opposite effect. So, no, I don't think that it has anything to do with crypto.

RedStar says

I really don't understand why gold hasn't taken off.

I'm also confused about this. Could be market rigging, in which case one should buy gold in preparation for reality to break through. Or it could just be that gold is overpriced according to some fundamental metric, like the cost of getting the next bit out of the ground.

Sometimes I wonder if the market for gold has been quietly cornered like DeBeers did with diamonds. Maybe there are huge gold nodules on the sea floor like the manganese nodules, and someone has scooped them up and is slowly selling.

Gold did have a massive run-up in recent memory:

Patrick says

RedStar says

I really don't understand why gold hasn't taken off.

I'm also confused about this. Could be market rigging, in which case one should buy gold in preparation for reality to break through. Or it could just be that gold is overpriced according to some fundamental metric, like the cost of getting the next bit out of the ground.

Sometimes I wonder if the market for gold has been quietly cornered like DeBeers did with diamonds. Maybe there are huge gold nodules on the sea floor like the manganese nodules, and someone has scooped them up and is slowly selling.

Gold did have a massive run-up in recent memory:

Warren Buffett on gold

Buffett calls gold an “unproductive” asset, which, as defined in his 2011 letter to shareholders, means “assets that will never produce anything, but that are purchased in the buyer's hope that someone else — who also knows that these assets will be forever unproductive — will pay more for them in the future.”

True, but gold has a damn long history of being consistently valuable.

Patrick says

I'm also confused about this.

everything collapses into a deflationary spiral, even gold. look at 2008 in your gold chart.

you want cash for now.

id gladly transition all cash into gold soon though

CBOEtrader says

Patrick says

I'm also confused about this.

everything collapses into a deflationary spiral, even gold. look at 2008 in your gold chart.

you want cash for now.

id gladly transition all cash into gold soon though

Gold will remain fairly stable. Those that have actually purchased the metal know that premiums on the metals just increase, as the official value of the metal goes down. I saw silver at below $10 not too long ago, think 3 years ago? You couldn't buy silver for less than $18 at that time.

People think that "Well, just buy it on a commodity exchange and take delivery, that's what COMEX is for!" - no it's not. Unless you're a billionaire, you cannot delivery from COMEX and even then, I doubt it.

Find the cheapest actual physical metal you can - that's the actual price. COMEX is a manipulation scheme, to manipulate public perception.

RC2006 says

I need a new vid card to. If bitcoin tanks market will be flooded with cheap high end cards.

Bitcoin broke below 19k. Buy the dip? Or wait?

HODL HODL HODL!!! Storehouse of value! Collapsing in the face of mass inflation is just a blip on the radar screen!

Bitcoin in my opinion has peak due to the facts the war in Ukraine didn't create a new high nor did Coinbase's Super Bowl ad on the most watch televised event in the world. Unless you can find someone who wants to pay more for your bitcoin, don't. We are out of people who want to pay more for your bitcoin...we are out of people who want to pay for it I believe. There is no larger market for bitcoin or any crypto unless a country is formed. Bitcoin's floor is pretty steep IMHO, the masses love it but I don't know where it stops. Maybe $15k, maybe $10 or maybe $5k.

So, I'm not buying bitcoin. Will you?

@Patrick
True, but gold has a damn long history of being consistently valuable.
Real estate, some stocks, bonds and various services have a longer history of being more valuable in the long run, rather than consistently valuable.

This is what playing chicken in a market with leverage at 100% looks like. TILT!!!
No worries once the blood letting is done which is certainly not, although it won't be
BTC I'll will be prying the best of the utility tokens out of bony fingers of the dead never
to return want-a-be crypto players!!! I'll disclose when I am buying back in again probably
in the BTC12,000 +/-... USD is still the top of the fiats even though it's the white spot found
on top of chicken shit it is still top dog. Not much of anything is going to bottom until the USD flips
not crypto, equities, oil or even gold until then... Watching epic crashes although can be enjoyable
on 1 side reality is lots of regular people your friends and family are getting crushed in all markets
and it's by far only going to get worse anyone thinking any of this goes back where it was has a bad
case of normalcy bias, good luck just the same.

Well, we are at at $17,962.70 per a bitcoin. Financial markets are closed on Tuesday.

I'm thinking of selling NVDA and AMD giving how close they are tied to crypto mining.

AmericanKulak says

HODL HODL HODL!!! Storehouse of value! Collapsing in the face of mass inflation is just a blip on the radar screen!

Tis only a flesh wound!

1337irr says

Buffett calls gold an “unproductive” asset

You are correct, and Buffet is correct. But notice, Buffet did not say "don't buy any gold". He said gold is a non-productive asset. He is saying he can find better assets than gold to generate a return. Buffet ALSO doesn't have to worry about liquidity. He literally owns food plants. If he needs food, he doesn't need to liquify assets to buy food. He can literally go down to his food plant or farmland and get some food. Also he's 90+, and the whole thing isn't going to explode before he dies.

For those of us with LESS than a billion dollars and our own food plants, and a life expectancy longer than 10 years, having a small % of our assets in non-productive, but STABLE and liquid asset is simply an insurance policy. Also, note that gold/silver MINERS are productive assets.

But you should take Buffet's advice to heart. Don't load up on gold or silver with 25+% of your portfolio. But don't buy a lot of speculative assets. Buy a few solid earners at a good price that are expected to be around for a good 50 or 100 years. Let them pay you good dividends.

Bitcoin is pump and dump of course but it will continue due to the money laundering that can done on it without any trace - so government can not seize money…

That’s why they hate bitcoin and that’s why it has risen I value so much.

richwicks says

People think that "Well, just buy it on a commodity exchange and take delivery, that's what COMEX is for!" - no it's not. Unless you're a billionaire, you cannot delivery from COMEX and even then, I doubt it.

exactly. remember when oil futures went negative in 2020? that was because all the corporations who were allowed to take delivery were "full". the system breaks down exactly when we need it the most, and some asshole made a fortune.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/crypto-investors-scramble-173004105.html

Robber Baron Elite Scum says

without any trace

LOL

Robber Baron Elite Scum says

Bitcoin is pump and dump of course but it will continue due to the money laundering that can done on it without any trace

It's a myth that bitcoin can't be traced.

It's a database that keeps every transaction ever made with the token available. That's why it's so fucking agonizingly slow and why it's basically an unworkable currency.

The IDEA is you just have an anonymous wallet, and if you just use the wallet, it can't be traced, UNTIL you try to turn it into cash. Use your wallet to ONCE turn it into cash, you're traceable, and if you move it to another wallet, people looking at the blockchain and see meta data, and notice you only send bitcoin to that wallet cash out.

Dont know if anyone posted this but:

it’s now becoming increasingly evident that Bitcoin may be a creation of the NSA and was rolled out as a “normalization” experiment to get the public familiar with digital currency. Once this is established, the world’s fiat currencies will be obliterated in an engineered debt collapse (see below for the sequence of events), then replaced with a government approved cryptocurrency with tracking of all transactions and digital wallets by the world’s western governments.

Then there’s this 1997 NSA Document: How To Make A Mint The Cryptography Of Anonymous Electronic Cash

https://web.archive.org/web/20210818185225/https://twitter.com/RudyHavenstein/status/941542996457041920

Food of thought for bitcoin enthusiasts. It is just for efficient tracking of what you do.

Insert here obligatory picture about decentraluzed fungable and private bitcoin

Cash is King.

Please get into the habit of using cash, at least for small purchases, folks.

Bitcoin peaked at $19,650 back in December 2017, then it crashed.

It is now at $19,231.

If it drops 10% below $19,650 then there is a lot of downside potential for it to drop another 20%.

.

ad says

It is now at $19,231

Back over $20k.
HODLER's be buying the dip.

Onvacation says

Back over $20k.
HODLER's be buying the dip.

Some are probably but its a bull trap imo big money (miners) spending a little money to draw the sucker crowd in to sell to.... Not enough blood in the streets for me to be buying much of anything on the other side of the $USD: crypto, equities or metals not even to $-cost average.

142,000 Bitcoin Could Be Dumped As Creditors Eye Mt. Gox Repayment
The Mt. Gox rehabilitation trustee asked creditors to choose between bitcoin, cash or Bitcoin Cash to receive repayment, risking pressuring the market further.

https://www.nasdaq.com/articles/142000-bitcoin-could-be-dumped-as-creditors-eye-mt.-gox-repayment

AmericanKulak says

Cash is King.

Please get into the habit of using cash, at least for small purchases, folks.

So "small business" folks can do what us, paycheck-earning stiffs, can't - avoid taxes? If I pey cash I expect a discount so tax savings are shared with me.

Voyager went belly up. When they went online earlier this year they were giving out $100 to anyone who would open an account and deposit $100. Doubled my $100 "investmnet" and GTFO the very next day.