patrick.net

Navy is obsolete. Too easy to sink a ship today. In a real war, all the navy on the planet would be at the bottom of the ocean in a matter of weeks.

Russia will figure this out before the United States does.

The only possible use of the Navy is submarines, and they can be trivially detected. Even deep submersibles, leave a wake which is easily detectable.

The future of warfare is exclusively air. We shouldn't even bother with infantry. Why there is a person behind a gun, STILL, and not just controlling it remotely is, is beyond me.

Another RWS - Samoom - was fucked up by USVs and towed to the base:

WWIII IN 3 .. 2.. 1 ..

stereotomy says

WWIII IN 3 .. 2.. 1 ..

ANY SECOND NOW!!!!!

This will buff right out...

stereotomy says

WWIII IN 3 .. 2.. 1 ..

Basically Elon Musk turned out to be a week-kneed gullible little cunt: he was browbeaten by the Soviet ambassador Antonov into believing that attack on the Red Fleet home base will lead to an IMMEDIATE THERMONUCLEAR WAR!!!! He wasn't homeschooled, was he?

Had Putin wanted to, Kiev would have disappeared within the first 2 weeks of the war.

Russia has conducted a very limited military exercise, while Ukrainians are being slaughtered en masse. Their own government temporarily admitted to 400,000 Ukrainian military deaths, precisely why they are capturing fighting age men from the streets, giving them a weapon, and sending them to the front lines. Russia, on the other hand, has close to 250,000 VOLUNTEERS.

There isn't a chance that Ukraine can defeat Russia. Anyone that believes that has been fooled into believing that nonsense by the Military Industrial Financial Complex.

RayAmerica says

There isn't a chance that Ukraine can defeat Russia. Anyone that believes that has been fooled into believing that nonsense by the Military Industrial Financial Complex.

There isn't a chance that Russia can defeat Ukraine either. Russia lost that chance nearly 1.5 years ago with all of their early cock-ups to topple Kiev and the central government.

At best Russia can hang onto bits of Eastern Ukraine and Crimea they currently occupy and call that a "win" while Ukraine continues to drone and hit Russian positions with artillery for the next several years.

If you are truly worried about WWIII and wanting to stop the death and destruction, the quickest way to achieve that is to Russia to stop invading their sovereign neighbor.

If you are worried about the US Industrial Complex and spending now, just wait to see what it will balloon to if Russia somehow manages to "win" in Ukraine.

socal2,

America's military industrial financial complex always needs a boogeyman in order to justify their evil deeds. In this case, it is Russia ... and you've fallen for it.

RayAmerica says

socal2,

America's military industrial financial complex always needs a boogeyman in order to justify their evil deeds. In this case, it is Russia ... and you've fallen for it.

Well - if Russia stops their failed (EVIL) invasion of Ukraine and brings troops back inside Russia's borders - that will take one big boogeyman off the table for the MIC.

Despite Russia' EVIL military being totally corrupt and incompetent - the MacGregor's of the world continue to laud them with praises and warning the US that Russia can't possibly lose to Ukraine - ensuring more MIC spending and keeping Russia as a boogeyman for decades to come.

Again, for those of you on this forum who seem most concerned about escalation to WWIII and loss of Russian/Ukrainian lives and treasure, why don't you ever advocate for the cleanest, easiest and most legitimate way to stop the conflict by getting Russia to stop their illegal and EVIL invasion? Instead, many treat Putin's massive crimes and destruction like many treated Islamists as simply unthinking and immovable objects that the West just needs to accept and adapt to live with.

Back when the Soviet Union was collapsing, President George H. W. Bush, and his Sec. of State, James Baker, both promised Mikhail Gorbachev that NATO would not expand "one inch further." Since then, NATO has expanded dramatically in an attempt to encircle Russia.

Back in 2013/14, the State Department's Victoria Nuland, and the warmonger Sen. John McCain, went to Ukraine and promised American support for a coup that would overthrow the then Ukraine Government, which just so happened to be on friendly terms with Russia. That coup succeeded. Russia said all along that Ukraine joining NATO would be completely unacceptable, because of the danger that such a membership would pose to the strategic Black Sea.

It was AMERICA that provoked this war, not Russia.

Just try to imagine a hostile membership of nations occupying the territories and borders of North and Central America. How do you think America would react? History tells us how we would; the Cuban Missile Crisis on 1962, which brought us to the brink of nuclear war.

The MIC/MIBC and the New Northern Crusade will not stop even if Russia withdrew. After the fall of Jerusalem to Saladin's army (which took place due to Knight Templar's insistence on an utterly stupid strategy to fight numerically far superior Muslim army out in the open, instead of using the hugely expensive and proven effective city walls to the Kingdom of Jerusalem's advantage; The Kingdom of Jerusalem had been in existence for nearly a century by then, the people of both Europe and the Middleast had been banking with the Knight Templars for nearly a century; i.e. the ponzi scam of banking was about to be exposed), the Northern Crusade was launched on the Old Prussians (native people before the arrival of Teutonic Knights), Poles and Lithuanians, in order to replicate the banking fraud (and financial success in the first nearly 100 years) that the Crusade to Jerusalem had been.

The current (New) Northern Crusade (aka War in Ukraine, and possibly later War in the Baltics and War in Poland) is not about converting Russia to Christianity (I mean, "Democracy" vote counting by inserting millions of fake ballots and you'd better believe the result or you are apostasy!), but about killing Ukranian, Baltic and Polish bank account holders (and of course Russian bank account holders) in major Swiss, UK and US banks. Possibly even mass-slaughtering Israeli bank account holders after giving Iranian theocrats (today's Saladin, who was Kurdish/Iranian himself) the money to build nuclear weapons and forcing Israelis to relocate to the old Pale of Settlement (located in today's Ukraine, Baltics, Belarussia and Poland) "homeland." Blackrock is front-running future Jewish refugees by buying up Ukranian land and infrastructure.

The operation is not about vanquishing/converting the heathens but about harvesting the faithful and gullible fellow-travellers and their bank accounts. The bankers are not interested in letting Ukranian, Polish or Baltic account holders cash out and spend the money that they have saved over the last 30+ years from making trinckets like automotive switchgear export to the west.

RayAmerica says

That coup succeeded. Russia said all along that Ukraine joining NATO would be completely unacceptable, because of the danger that such a membership would pose to the strategic Black Sea.

Yes, Putin was forced to act unless he wanted to see NATO naval bases at Odessa and Sevastopol.

RayAmerica says

It was AMERICA that provoked this war, not Russia.

And there it is! Always America's fault.

This insinuates that Putin and Russia are just like dumb Islamists with absolutely no agency over their actions. They are just dumb animals only responding to stimulus?

Had Russia not blundered into Ukraine last year, they would still have their army/reputation intact and less NATO members on their borders.

There is no universe where a reasonable observer can claim Russia is better off today for having launched this disastrous war against their sovereign neighbor.

socal2 says

Had Russia not blundered into Ukraine last year, they would still have their army/reputation intact and less NATO members on their borders.

Factually incorrect. Ukranian army was the 2nd or 3rd largest army under NATO command, and Turkey (the 2nd largest NATO army if we don't count UAF) has not moved. If Russia acted too passively, Turkey may well have invaded through the Caucusus under the flag of pan-Islamism/pan-turkism; as it is, Turkey is already helping Azerbaijian take parts of Armenia, both before and after the conflict in Ukraine started. UAF is much much smaller and weaker now than it was before February 2022.

There is no universe where a reasonable observer can claim Russia is better off today for having launched this disastrous war against their sovereign neighbor.

Factually incorrect. If Russia didn't move, the UAF would have invaded Don Bass and Crimea. Due to local geography, it's advantageous to Russia/Russians to have battles take place west / northwest of those locations than further east / southeast. It would be much harder to maintain the land bridge to Crimea if the UAF under NATO command had the jump/initiative in fighting.

socal2 says

And there it is! Always America's fault.

Yes, it generally is.

The point of informing people that there wasn't a weapons of mass destruction program in Iraq in 2002, and that the US government and the media completely lied about this was to prevent them from doing it again.

The point of informing people that Qaddafi wasn't about "to cause a humanitarian crisis in Libya" and that the government was AGAIN lying about this, was to prevent the government doing it again. Added spice is to point out that Libya is in civil war to this day, and has slavery markets as a result of US intervention, a real humanitarian crisis. The hope is people who were fooled for a SECOND time will realize they were fooled, and it won't happen again.

The reason to point out that Assad WASN'T gassing his own people, is actually elected, that ISIS was being funded by the United States, that the "white helmets" don't actually exist and are actually terrorists, there's no such thing as a "moderate rebel", and that the civil war in Syria is funded DIRECTLY by the United States right to giving them everything from US weaponry to US trucks, is to prevent them from doing it again.

The reason to point out that the US overthrew Ukraine in 2014, and this led to a civil war immediately, which the US encouraged, that the Minsk Accords were signed as a delay tactic (Angela Merkel admitted that), and the US has been doing everything and anything to provoke Russia into a war, the reason to point out that the US blew up the Nordstream, has been trying to prevent Russia from exporting energy, and has been sabotaging their economy for TWO DECADES is to prevent them from doing it again.

And here are you: "WHUT? Ya think this is American's fault?"

FOR FUCKS SAKE, OBVIOUSLY IT'S AMERICA'S FAULT. THEY'VE BEEN DOING THIS FOR 20 YEARS, AND YOU STILL CAN'T SEE THE PATTERN?

The reason that WWIII is on the horizon isn't the fault of people like me, it's the fault of people like you and I'm fed up with it.

You COWER in calling out corruption. You're afraid to do it, so we have a bunch of bloodthirsty assholes running our nation, right into the ground. There's been absolutely no benefit to letting them do this, but don't "blame America". Who am I supposed to blame? Whose fault is it? The liars, or the people that tell you the truth?

socal2 says

And there it is! Always America's fault.

It't not 'always America's fault,' but if you know anything about history, we sure have been involved in fomenting revolutions, staging coups, and starting, or, participating in wars for no apparent reason. And for the most part, the American people have been duped into providing their support.

Just one example; World War I. Americans were told that we needed to fight in that European conflict in order to "make the world safe for Democracy." There was only one problem with that oft repeated phrase; there wasn't a single Democracy in all of Europe at that time!

RayAmerica says

It't not 'always America's fault,' but if you know anything about history, we sure have been involved in fomenting revolutions, staging coups, and starting, or, participating in wars for no apparent reason. And for the most part, the American people have been duped into providing their support.

My reading of history shows that most of the "meddling" by the US since WWII was in REACTION to Marxist and Islamist revolutions fomented by the USSR, Russia and China in Europe, Asia, Africa and South/Central America.

Are we still going to pretend at this late date that Marxism and Islamism were not destructive cancers on human civilization?

People act like the USSR, China and Russia after WWII were merely bystanders and not involved in carving up Europe and spreading their ruinous ideology around the planet stunting generations into their retarded Communist/Authoritarian ideology. Ditto for Islamist countries.

Russia has no legal or moral claims to invade and occupy their former Commie-slave colony in Ukraine.

The sooner Putin and Russia stop their failed invasion, the sooner the killings and needless destruction stops.

"Spasibo for F-35. We hacked code back in 2014 when Lockheed had 1000s of people all over your nyation trying to make work. Yankee BlueJeans long in development, much time for espionage. Was snyap to snyatch flash drive with important pieces. You keep Orion, is junk, we pay CCP for Dragon when Biden make Elon hire CCP nyationals for SpaceX or be racist. Will make up for Fleet, nyet?"

socal2 says

Are we still going to pretend at this late date that Marxism and Islamism were not destructive cancers on human civilization?

People act like the USSR, China and Russia after WWII were merely bystanders and not involved in carving up Europe and spreading their ruinous ideology around the planet stunting generations into their retarded Communist/Authoritarian ideology. Ditto for Islamist countries.

Have you considered the possibility that those ruinous ideologies and political movements were fomented by the banksters trying to kill their account holders? The most important Soviet military leader, who was instrumental in the REDS winning over WHITEs (royalists) in the Russian Civil War, Trotsky, was shipped from NYC to Russia in 1917; While living in NYC, he had no employment or visible income but lived a lavish life; upon his arrival in Russia in 1917, he was immediately made a member of the top Socialist/Communist leadership largely thanks to the banks funding he brought. China's Mao was recruited by the Skull-and-Bones, and Chinese anti-communist forces' defeat on the mainland was again largely due to a cut-off of ammo supplies by a US administration that was later found to be heavily infiltrated by communists. Iran's Khomeini (the principle leader of modern Ismanic revivalism, as before him the Arab/Muslim world was primarily enamored with Baathist Party, a secular party that carried out strict enforcement against religious zealots) was a political refugee in Paris before he was suddenly given tons of money to foment Islamic revolution in Iran. Have you ever wondered how the US lost the war in Vietnam when every fight saw 10:1 to 100:1 kill ratio? Have you ever considered the possibility that the anti-communist forces were never meant to win? They were only a device for laundering money, and then have them killed so the banks could keep their account balances . . . just like all those Afghanis falling from the sky/plane and/or "accidentally" having smart bombs dropping on their entire family!

Putin was probably a bankster agent to begin with, as he too was an alum of Klaus Schwab's school of young global leadership. He and his army are being used to harvest East European bank account holders.

Reality says

Have you ever wondered how the US lost the war in Vietnam when every fight saw 10:1 to 100:1 kill ratio?

The kill ratio was a lie. They counted a severed finger or a blood trail as a KIA. The Artillery, Infantry, and Air Support each counted the same count for their own records, as the Pentagon was putting the screws to officers to have big bodycounts or be mustered out.

So after a fire fight with called in Arty and Air, and the found a severed finger, a trail of blood, and an actual dead VC, it counted as 9 enemy KIAs.

socal2 says

My reading of history shows that most of the "meddling" by the US since WWII was in REACTION to Marxist and Islamist revolutions fomented by the USSR, Russia and China in Europe, Asia, Africa and South/Central America.

This isn't the same world as it was in 1960.

NOTHING the United States is doing today is in reaction to marxist or islamist revolutions today.

In fact, if you've not noticed, the US tries to destroy secular governments in the Middle East. Lebanon is one, Syria is another, Iraq WAS another.

There's really no rhyme or reason to what the US does today in terms of foreign policy. They just make up bullshit to start a war, because war makes a lot of money for Offense Contractors. They don't care if the war is won, there's NO ideology in the war, there's no goals for the war, it's just start a war, and prolong it as long as humanly possible.

What was the goal in Afghanistan?

It's pretty obvious that Ukraine isn't going to win this war against Russia, but nobody in our government will allow it to stop.

The kill ratio during the Vientnam War was likely legit or close to reality: the communist guerilla organization in South Vietnam had suffered such a high casualty count that it ceased to exist after their Tet Offensive in January 1968; North Vientnam had to use its regular army after that; Vietnamese male-to-female ratio became very lopsided after the war.

i’m noticing a pattern in america. government creates a war, tells everyone to support it, people support it and cheer for it. NEW ENEMY!!! Few years after war ends everyone knows it was genocide and mistake, but everyone moves on because it’s far away and there’s new exciting thing on tv… oh well.

Reality says

The kill ratio during the Vientnam War was likely legit or close to reality: the communist guerilla organization in South Vietnam had suffered such a high casualty count that it ceased to exist after their Thet Offensive; North Vientnam had to use its regular army after that; Vietnamese male-to-female ratio became very lopsided after the war.

Opposite. MACV grossly undercounted Viet Cong support by ignoring "Part Timers". Just like many in Afghanistan drove taxis or repaired shoes and only became terrorists/guerillas occasionally on Friday nights. That's why Tet was such a shock.

And the KIA lists were baloney, so they had at least 1/3 the kills they thought they had.

To win wars, prohibit officers from getting MBAs and force them to get degrees in Classical Philosophy and Literature.

The Vietnamese were so lacking in manpower a few years after we left they fought off a CCP invasion and invaded Cambodia.

"Just remember, I don't get my $Billions, you don't get your 10%."



Reality check for the comedian Zelensky. Do you want to see an end to this war? Here's the answer: no money, no more war.

Senior House GOP Lawmaker: Not Enough Votes in House Republican Conference for Ukraine Aid

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2023/09/18/senior-house-gop-lawmaker-not-enough-votes-house-republican-conference-ukraine-aid/

RayAmerica says

Senior House GOP Lawmaker: Not Enough Votes in House Republican Conference for Ukraine Aid

It will just be used in someway to provide enough kickbacks to the abstainers before they vote in the positive. The Ukrainian war has at least 1 more year to go. It won't end until a new one is created to replace it. I think possibly Iran, maybe even somewhere in South America.

RayAmerica says

"Just remember, I don't get my $Billions, you don't get your 10%."



Reality check for the comedian Zelensky. Do you want to see an end to this war? Here's the answer: no money, no more war.

Senior House GOP Lawmaker: Not Enough Votes in House Republican Conference for Ukraine Aid

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2023/09/18/senior-house-gop-lawmaker-not-enough-votes-house-republican-conference-ukraine-aid/

Except European aid is already 2x of what the US provides. It should be enough to finish the Red Fleet in the Black Sea for good, rendering Crimea useless for its intended purpose and not worth holding onto. Then Europeans pocket all the $350-600B of Soviet money and assets stuck abroad to compensate them for the trouble and the US will be left looking like a bunch of cucks who folded in front of a hollowed-out fake empire.

richwicks says

socal2 says

And there it is! Always America's fault.

Yes, it generally is.

If America is primarily (solely?) responsible for all the bad outcomes (wars) around the world and our arch geopolitical rivals like the USSR, Russia, China and Islamists were mere victims or bystanders - does that mean America (or the Globohomo banksters?) gets all the credit for all the massive worldwide improvements in the past 80 years in terms of reduction of poverty, war, famine, genocide and overall improvement in literacy, health, lifespan, economic/social freedom?

Or are all these massive world improvements in spite of US being the world's superpower since WWII? The Commies, Islamists and 3rd world despots would have gotten there eventually - right?

RWSGFY says

Except European aid is already 2x of what the US provides.

As of end of February, the apologetic was that while the EU sent half what the US did, it was a higher share of the typical EU country's GDP.

https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/articles/2023-02-24/these-countries-have-sent-the-most-aid-to-ukraine

Of course "Typical" includes Malta, Lativa, Andorra, Estonia, etc. and I'm sure doesn't apply to G7 heavyweights and the writers knew that when they wrote the dodging propaganda piece.

If the IMPORTANT European countries were donating this much, and knowing the EU is richer than the US in GDP, the Europeans would have to be contributing more in raw dollar equivalents.

Another misleading half-truth "Ukraine's neighbors", which doesn't include the other G7s like France, Germany, Italy, etc.

Here's what Ukraine Aid should look like if the EU and US were EQUALLY committed.



Frankly, the EU should be paying 80%.

Another dodge is counting 4 and 5 year commitments as "Aid" comparable to US Aid promised within the year.

So Norway promises 7B over 5 years counts as "7B" equal to a 3rd Quarter US Package of $20B that will be 100% delivered mostly in weeks or months.

See the Trickery here:
https://www.ifw-kiel.de/topics/war-against-ukraine/ukraine-support-tracker/

"Look at how many sacks of potatoes and hemp rope and amber chunks Lithuania gave!!!"

The only country on this list that is an internationally noted economic bigwig is Netherlands.

Jakob Fugger rubbing hands with glee when the US pays the installment payments on EuroBank Fuggers Loans on behalf of Ukraine. Because you know that's going to happen at some point, win or loss.

All the "financial aid" money EU is lending to Ukraine is in bonds and loands, and the US will end up paying off, just you watch.

socal2 says

If America is primarily (solely?) responsible for all the bad outcomes (wars) around the world and our arch geopolitical rivals like the USSR, Russia, China and Islamists were mere victims or bystanders

No - did I say that? Did I even imply it? Then why are you asking?

The United States is responsible for the disasters in Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Syria, Afghanistan, Yemen, Somalia, IRAN (the US overthrew it), Nicaragua, Haiti, and currently Ukraine. SOME countries have managed to recover, but not most.

If the US would just GET THE FUCK OUT and stop making the same "mistakes" over and over again, MAYBE, they could concentrate on improving US infrastructure rather than wasting 10's of trillions of dollars on fucking wars that do NOTHING for this nation.

The Federal Government is nothing but a parasite on US citizens, and a fucking group of criminal syndicates and goons abroad.

People are treating the Ukrainian war like a fucking football game cheering on "their side". Well, there's going to be 100's of thousands of dead by the end of it. None of this would have happened if the CIA twats didn't fucking overthrow the government. If they want to CHANGE the government, fine, they can nudge them, suggest to them, give them incentives - but no, they just overthrew it and it's only going to cost a trillion dollars in the end, ruin European energy stability, and destroy a country.

Of course the Ukraine is going to lose - when do they EVER fucking win? It's just one fuckup after another "but this time.." - no, 7 wars, it's predictable. The best the US has accomplished in my FUCKING LIFETIME is a stalemate unless you're talking about the Geneva War.

We have the same shitty infrastructure we did when I was born, nothing has been done. Flint Michigan is still poisoned, Palestine Ohio is forgotten about, Maui citizens were obviously murdered.

I don't give a shit about foreign nations. Win or lose the stupid war, it won't matter to 330 million Americans. What does it take for you to recognize that it's just a criminal syndicate that has been openly running the nation into the ground for decades? Do they have to say it to your face?


original link

Because they already have.

People are fucking sick of this, and I'm sick of people being oblivious to it.

The issue the US has with Russia is that Russia started dealing with organized crime in Russia starting in 2000, before that the Jewish mafia was raping it.
Remember those "oligarchs" they were arresting and putting in cages and on trial? They're raping Ukraine right now, and the people at the top of our government are taking a percentage to help them. That's our "special relationship with Israel". Nothing more.

socal2 says

Or are all these massive world improvements in spite of US being the world's superpower since WWII? The Commies, Islamists and 3rd world despots would have gotten there eventually - right?

YES, they would.

Stop PRETENDING our nation does anything for the betterment of the world. Right now, our largest trading partner is CHINA, you know the communist nation. Are you pretending to be naive, or are you this naive? WHY are we trading with CHINA, a communist nation?

I bet the chair you're in right now is from China, and so is the device you're reading this on.

The USSR collapsed under its own weight. China would have too, except we decided to turn communist slaves into producers in order to enslave our own nation. We FREELY sold products to Russia, but we bought nothing from them. What's China doing to us?

They are collapsing us. We are already in collapse. Without a common set of beliefs, which has been maintained through a mass media for the last 150 years, a nation can't exist. Well, our media was turned into total fucking propaganda 20 years ago. Colin Powell's son, Michael, was put into charge the FCC under William Clinton. In just a few years, all our media was consolidated and now, it's all bullshit.

socal2 says

If America is primarily (solely?) responsible for all the bad outcomes (wars) around the world and our arch geopolitical rivals like the USSR, Russia, China and Islamists were mere victims or bystanders - does that mean America (or the Globohomo banksters?) gets all the credit for all the massive worldwide improvements in the past 80 years in terms of reduction of poverty, war, famine, genocide and overall improvement in literacy, health, lifespan, economic/social freedom?

Or are all these massive world improvements in spite of US being the world's superpower since WWII? The Commies, Islamists and 3rd world despots would have gotten there eventually - right?

The argument and logic you present here in this quoted comment is exactly what communist parties in countries like China, Cuba and North Korea make: taking credit for all the improvements in the last half century+ due to technological improvements and despite those criminal regimes. Notice, global living standards were already experiencing industrial take-off (exponential growth) before WWI (never mind WWII). The arrival of WWI and WWII only slowed down the improvement, in some cases like in Russia going backwards, thanks to banksters' scheme to harvest the bank balances of the Czar and Russian upper and middle classes, basically anyone who had bank balance or wealth that could be turned into gold bricks and exported by the communist regime. Then it was the Germans' and Jews' turn to be harvested by the banksters during WWII; when the Holocaust took place, the biggest beneficiaries were not the criminal thieves digging gold tooth fillings but the banks and life insurance (as a form of savings) companies where the victims had accounts but could no longer claim when entire families were slaughtered without a death certificate. After that, the Chinese (civil war and communist take-over to killing tens of millions, especially the relatively well off), the Indians (communal violence by splitting that sub-continent and deliberately causing mass relocation), even creating the Apartheid South Africa in 1948 a few years after the supposedly anti-racist WWII in order to attract racist whites to South Africa to soak privileged benefits for a few decades then to be harvested and slaughtered through genocidal reverse-racism as we have been witnessing the last couple decades. The Ukraine project is along the same line: both Ukrainians and Russians living in Ukraine had always given an undeserved credit of cultural superiority to Western Ukraine, e.g. one of the top landmarks in Kharkov/Karkhiv would have a chocolate shop called "Lviv Chocolatier" in the prime retail space, as shown by one of Gonzalo Lira's videos in the early days of the conflict; obviouly, Lviv is not nearly warm enough to grow cocoa tree to produce cacao oil for making chocolate, so whatever chocolate from Lviv would have to be imported (likely from Latin America), so the name was reflecting nothing less than cultural admiration for Lviv. Yet, to parlay that mild sense of cultural admiration/superiority into racist hatred of Russian-speaking Eastern Ukrainians had to be one of those mass delusion formation events along the same line as Covid hysteria, pogroms, giving lard and tallow soaked cartridges to Sepoy soldiers in order to foment a mass slaughter of British colonial families (including thousands of women and children) who had put their money in the banks.

You know what else, repressive regimes like those of Communist China (and imperial China before it) and the USSR could not and can not survive without external trade. The US military superiority protecting the global sea-borne trade was enabling those trade. If not for US military might (paid for by American tax payers) protecting investors investing into the territories of those regimes that enjoy "repressive regime low labor cost advantage," the factory owners in the US would not even have dared to move their factories there.

AmericanKulak says

Jakob Fugger rubbing hands with glee when the US pays the installment payments on EuroBank Fuggers Loans on behalf of Ukraine. Because you know that's going to happen at some point, win or loss.

I visited Fugger's retirement complex in Augsburg during the year I studied in Munich:

https://www.fugger.de/en/fuggerei

Hadn't heard of him before then, but I think he was the richest man in the world, and needed some good PR. It was a good deed for sure.