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One should only get a loan on their first car, when just starting out. All subsequent cars should be brought cash.
I was talking with a couple of Toyota dealers since I am in the market to buy a Toyota Camry.
One should only get a loan on their first car, when just starting out. All subsequent cars should be brought cash.
China and the media is laughing at us.
I like to look at vehicles (online) and wouldn't buy a Toyota right now based on the crappy availability.
zzyzzx says
automatic climate control, and that's a deal breaker.
What's automatic climate control?
Something that automakers put in most cars to confuse owners as to if their vehicle's HVAC is working. Instead of a simple button to press for hot or cold and a hot/cold dial, automatic climate control is like having a thermostat (like what you have in your house) except for your vehicle. It adds extra parts which reduces reliability, and you are never sure if your A/C compressor is supposed to be on or off.
Toyota needs to bring back the L trim levels if they want me to even consider buying one.
zzyzzx says
Something that automakers put in most cars to confuse owners as to if their vehicle's HVAC is working. Instead of a simple button to press for hot or cold and a hot/cold dial, automatic climate control is like having a thermostat (like what you have in your house) except for your vehicle. It adds extra parts which reduces reliability, and you are never sure if your A/C compressor is supposed to be on or off.
Sounds like a nonsense feature to me. The auto off/on at traffic signal stops seems like a bullshit feature to me.
China and the media is laughing at us. The media keeps talking about Chinas small $2,000 pick up trucks that Americans can't have.
One should only get a loan on their first car, when just starting out. All subsequent cars should be brought cash.
I have a teenager who is learning car driving. I am thinking about buying a car through my llc and let the teenager drive this car. Will this protect my personal assets from potential accident related lawsuits since the car will be titled under the name of the llc?
zzyzzx says
Toyota needs to bring back the L trim levels if they want me to even consider buying one.
L trim level doesn't have automatic climate control?
Yep, ASS in most implementations Sucks. A feature that annoys most drivers more than it saves on fuel. Luckily many cars offer a way to turn it off, although you have to purposefully do it each time you start them.
My current car is my newest, '98 Civic. Bought it about three years ago. Needed rear brakes, and head gasket replacement, that's it so far. Also the most money I've spent on a car, $3,000. I've never taken a car loan, ever.
https://www.consumerfinance.gov/about-us/newsroom/cfpb-orders-toyota-motor-credit-to-pay-60-million-for-illegal-lending-and-credit-reporting-misconduct/
The CFPB is ordering Toyota Motor Credit to stop its unlawful practices, pay $48 million to harmed consumers, and pay a $12 million penalty into the CFPB’s victims relief fund.
"Toyota's lending arm illegally withheld refunds, made borrowers run through obstacle courses to cancel unwanted services, and tarnished their credit reports," said CFPB Director Rohit Chopra. "Given the growing burdens of auto loan payments on Americans, we will continue to pursue large auto lenders that cheat their customers."
Toyota Motor Credit Corporation is the United States-based auto-financing arm of the Toyota Motor Corporation, and is headquartered in Plano, Texas. It is one of the largest indirect auto lenders in the United States, with nearly five million customer accounts and more than $135 billion in assets as of October 2022.
Toyota Motor Credit provides financing for consumers buying cars through Toyota dealerships, and also offers optional products and services sold with the vehicles. Dealerships often sell the products and services as a bundled package to consumers and then add them onto car loan contracts. Bundled products include Guaranteed Asset Protection (GAP), which covers the difference (or gap) between the amount a consumer owes on an auto loan and what their insurance pays if the vehicle is stolen, damaged, or totaled. Toyota Motor Credit also offers Credit Life and Accidental Health (CLAH) coverage, which covers the remaining balance if a borrower dies or becomes disabled, and vehicle service agreements, which reimburse borrowers for parts and service beyond what is covered by the manufacturer warranty.
The cost of the bundled products, financed by Toyota Motor Credit, averaged between $700 and $2,500 per loan. Including these products in a vehicle sale or lease can significantly increase the loan amount, monthly payment, and finance charge. Toyota Motor Credit profits from the sale of these products by collecting more finance charges on the increased loan amount.
Thousands of consumers complained to Toyota Motor Credit that dealers had lied about whether these products were mandatory, included them on contracts without the borrowers’ knowledge, or rushed through paperwork to hide buried terms. Nevertheless, Toyota Motor Credit devised a scheme to retain the revenue from these products by making it extremely cumbersome to cancel, and then failed to provide proper refunds for consumers who succeeded in cancelling. The company also falsely told consumer reporting companies that borrowers had missed payments, and it failed to correct consumer reporting errors it knew were wrong.
Also, here is another case from https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/news/press-releases/2022/04/ftc-takes-action-against-multistate-auto-dealer-napleton-sneaking-illegal-junk-fees-bills
The complaint against North American Automotive Services, Inc. (also known as Ed Napleton Automotive Group) alleges that eight of its dealerships and the general manager of two Illinois dealerships illegally tacked on junk fees for unwanted “add-on” products such as payment insurance and paint protection. The illegal junk fees cost consumers hundreds or even thousands of dollars.
According to the complaint, the dealerships would often wait until the end of the hours-long negotiation process to sneak junk fees for add-on products and services into consumers’ purchase contracts, which often run as long as 60 pages. These junk fees were often added despite consumers specifically declining the add-ons or having confirmed prices that did not include the add-ons. In other cases, the consumers were falsely told the add-ons were free or were a requirement to purchase or finance their vehicle.
A survey cited in the complaint showed that 83 percent of buyers from the dealerships were charged junk fees for add-ons without authorization or as a result of deception. One consumer cited in the complaint reported that the dealership located in Arlington Heights, Ill., charged him for nearly $4,000 in add-on fees after he’d paid a similar amount in down payment.
The complaint also alleges that the Napleton dealerships discriminated against Black consumers in connection with financing vehicle purchases. Napleton employees had wide latitude to increase the cost of a consumer’s loan by increasing the amount paid in interest or adding add-ons to the final contract.
According to the complaint, Black customers at the dealerships were charged approximately $190 more in interest and paid $99 more for similar add-ons than similarly situated non-Latino White customers.
Under the terms of the proposed settlement with the FTC and the State of Illinois, $9.95 million of the $10 million judgment will be used to provide monetary relief to consumers, and $50,000 will be paid to the Illinois Attorney General Court Ordered and Voluntary Compliance Payment Projects Fund.