patrick.net

SP - that could be taxable? Im not sure, my knowledge on Personal Taxes is limited. But is sure smells like ordinary income (boot).

Space, it used to be rare for bidding wars to occur. Normal markets are a buyer and seller negotiating, we don't need more laws or systems to make sure that everyone. ..............

Malcolm-
Agreed, more deregulation may be the answer.

Why can't people in this country just say no? If the price makes it so the deal is not attractive don't do it. Don't go running around looking for someone to legislate or a court to force the deal to your terms.

We just did a whole thread devoted to pocket listings and feigned bidding wars so whatever "regulation" realtors fall under, it needs a serious going over.

(It does make for some lively debate though)

We are just saying NO!

Bubble blogs are a buyer's strike water cooler. Uh! Excuse me, some of us here are actually thirsty (elbows way to front)

OMG, nothing but love btw, but DINO you just sat there, and made all of these points about MLS being monopolistic because no one can comptete with it, and it does all of this and that, and then you bring up the subject of pocket listings, where the agent on his own chooses not to use the tool because of an economic benefit.

This blog is great, this is actually the first message board that I've actively posted to.

How do you tax a mini-valise containing $250K in currency notes that the buyer hands to the seller as partial, un-recorded consideration?

Don't currency notes have embedded GPS chips?

"Can you show me any other examples of *transactional* monopolies which have been (a) not regulated and (b) found legal? "

Again. The National Football League

Malcom,

As usual, you're missing the point. It's this ENTIRE CULTURE of entitlement where NAR sees the buyer as nothing more than a necessary evil. The culmination of which is the "ultimate realtwhore circle jerk-fest" where properties are flipped back and forth amongst various straw buyers (complete with appraise-whore/lender collusion) where it takes the D.A a year and a half to figure out who was s@cking who off.

Sea World

Missing the point? I don't even see a point in that last post.

This blog is great, this is actually the first message board that I’ve actively posted to.

Same here. Ben's blog is too informative. No one will talk about sushi.

Now the speculative bubble was some giant conspiracty of the realtors?

:) or cake.

You do realize entire culture of entitlement is a paradox.

Like saying they are all monopolies.

But it has to be from a JBR point of view, truly successful people can keep their silly opinions to themselves.

We like to inform, persuade, AND entertain.

Yep. We have sophistry and post-modernism. :) We also have excellent data and analysis from Randy.

Malcom,

Help Me, Help YOU! O.K?

NAR/MLS/REIC very quickly indoctrinates "rookies" into the "finer points" of being a realtwhore. USE the MLS when it suits your/our needs, circumvent (and SCREW the client) when double dipping is in order!

This infraction (if caught) carries some pretty stiff penalties, as much as five HUNDRED dollars! Pffft (I just got both ends for a total of 60k?) I think I can swing a $500 fine. Now you're trying to tell us these assclowns should be allowed to "self-regulate". That they should be trusted to run MLS in an ethical fashion? You're kidding, right?

Out of curiosity, which blog is the "ben's blog" y'all are referrin' to?

Yes, they will go out of business much qucker if you let them hang themselves. If you don't trust your realtor don't use him/her.

Out of curiosity, which blog is the “ben’s blog” y’all are referrin’ to?

That would be the mother of all bubble blogs, thehousingbubbleblog.com.

But patrick.net is a community, if not a family.

If you get full asking price why would you care if you agent got both sides? Their job is to sell your house, if he has a pocket buyer I'd rather have that 'exclusivity'.

If you get full asking price why would you care if you agent got both sides?

I agree. But I will only deal with good agents.

Your problem DINO is that you try to paint all realtors the same. They can be viewed as a commodity (contrary to many monopolies) but even that is not right because they are different in abilities, experiences, and networks. Some are good, some are disgusting, some are just new inompetent Johnny Come Lately types.

I suspect your model of how things should work basically ends up being a government HUD official lists your house in the national registry, then a buyer is approved by the national bank, and the deal is transacted at the government determined fair market price. Then no one can get hurt, and it will be much more efficient.

I have met some good agents. I even have friends who are agents. You just need to trust your instincts on whether they can help you.

Malcom,

Randy has tried to help you, I've tried to help you and you just keep flailing for some kind of loose thread to tug on. NAR is crooked, we all know it and their culture of corruption, collusion and entitlement is both legendary and well documented. There is no paradox. Not here.

And what's with the JBR/"successful" cheap shot? I've made (and lost) a lot money. I've never made anything secret about that. Anybody can act "classy" when they're winning.

He's a realtor.

Peter P, your point is ridiculous. You actually expect people to shop around for a good agent? Absolutely absurd. Wait a minute, let me get this straight, you are advocating choosing an agent based on his or her actual ability. You don't find it UNFAIR to consider someone's track record in your decision? You don't seem to realize that you are VICTIMIZING newer agents who haven't proved themselves as yet. Don't you realize that this type of EXCLUSION makes you a greedy MONOPOLIST? If not a monopolist you are a DE FACTO COLLUSIVE MONOPOLY, and enough people like you can only lead to buyer CARTELS.

"RealtWHORES?" - are BJs in the listing agreement?

"RealtWHORES?" - but they are not the ones getting f**ked! At least, not yet.

DINO, no offense but I don't need your help. I have a point of view just like yours. You sound like a bible basher with this, I am right so I am trying to help the ignorant atitude.

Actually I live quite well in a fully paid off house if you must know.

You should learn to see through a bunch of silly realtors scrambling around to try to save their livlihoods. It's quite comical when you realize no one really has any power over you.

Randy H & DinOR,

Great posts, great debate --thanks for doing the "heavy lifting" on this for all of us.

Malcolm,

I can understand that it's possible to argue against the MLS being a monopoly from a strictly legalistic POV, and I'm sure capable antitrust lawyers could argue statutes and precedents forever. But from a consumer or disinterested observer's POV, how can you not see anti-competitive or collusive behavior happening right before your eyes? Does 5-6% for basically granting access to a proprietary database seem like a reasonable premium to you, especially when the rest of the world somehow manages with 1-2%?

Forget about the local Realtor pulling down competitor's signs/flyers stuff for a minute --small potatoes. How many cases of coordinated MLS "blacklisting" or large-scale NAR's legal broadsides against competing HelpUSell or Zillow-type outfits does it take for you to see there's something very anti-competitive going on, and they're not just isolated, unrelated incidents?

The strict "no compete" clauses in MLS-Realtor agreements may turn out to be the smoking gun form a legal standpoint. However, the anti-competitive collusive behavior (blacklisting, attacking competitors, etc.) will only buttress the case.

Malcolm, you are right. I should not discriminate a person based on his abilities.

To be fair, I will choose one by throwing darts. Besides, this should outperform 75% of agent-pickers. :)

"Actually I live quite well in a fully paid off house if you must know. "

If more people made this their goal, the real estate guild would be far less an issue. People would not see the price as "other peoples money," and not be so careless with it.

HARM says
"how can you not see anti-competitive or collusive behavior happening right before your eyes? Does 5-6% for basically granting access to a proprietary database seem like a reasonable premium to you, especially when the rest of the world somehow manages with 1-2%?"

I see it all, I don't disagree with anything you are saying, but you guys keep shooting down your own point when you then bring up the new competing technologies that by themselves are unraveling it. MLS is a proprietary system, or course it is anti competitive, that is the definition of proprietary. You guys have this purist view of how business works. It is not like that. It is just like the military, your goal is to establish an unfair advantage. If that seems wrong to you then I'm afraid you have some big problems because that is the main point in most MBA programs.

Peter, that is funny, that reminded me of these human lie detectors. They boast about having a 50% accuracy rate. Excuse me? You just basically admitted that you aren't better than random chance.