patrick.net

Look at the bottom of the Monday, August 16th articles - says he will be on vacation for a few days.

Nomograph says

A key benefit of not owning a overpriced, underwater home is that you can afford to take vacations.

True dat.

Nomograph says

nehope says

he will be on vacation for a few days.

A key benefit of not owning a overpriced, underwater home is that you can afford to take vacations.

I know a few owners of places like that; they are taking vacations. They aren't paying their mortgage though o_O

Nomograph says

nehope says

he will be on vacation for a few days.

A key benefit of not owning a overpriced, underwater home is that you can afford to take vacations.

Hehe.

Why do you think the retail sales stats were as nice as they were? When you're not paying the biggest monthly outlay, suddenly there's LOTS of free spending money lying around!

"A key benefit of not owning a overpriced, underwater home is that you can afford to take vacations."

Guess I did not get the memo. I own a house and took a mini vacation last month to DC. I also have a ton of FF miles. I will go somepleace nice with them just as soon as I figure out where. I'm trying to decide between Italy, France, and England.

HousingWatcher says

Guess I did not get the memo. I own a house and took a mini vacation last month to DC. I also have a ton of FF miles. I will go somepleace nice with them just as soon as I figure out where. I’m trying to decide between Italy, France, and England.

Housing Watcher, I have to agree with you....... we missed the memo as well. Life is good and we have several properties. I'm 50 and retired so every day is vacation for me. My partner still works because he likes it, not because he has to, but he loves his job and enjoys going in and gets lots of time off. We have an upcoming SF and North Bay trip planned then we're headed up to the north state mountains for fly fishing. We're booked on an up coming holiday cruise for a week, and planning out another vacation to Asia. We own property and I think it's great because it has given us lots of security and freedom. Real estate is a good investment over time if you buy location, location, location. No flipping or using them as an ATM and pay them off quickly so there is no mortgage. I would recommend property to anyone that wants to buy right and hold on to it for years. Property holdings are just one assest that should be held in my opinion as part of a diversified portfolio (condo's, single family residences, bonds, cash, stocks, mutual funds). I.e; don't buy 2 condos in the same complex, spread your property to different nearby cities, etc.

I'm sure there are a lot of folks hurting out there with job loss depending on the type of business, but we're not participating in this recession and I don't think we're the exception, but rather the rule. In fact, I would say that most of our friends aren't participating in this recession. Just anecdotal evidence here in our little part of the world, but the restaurants are packed with waiting required at the better restaurants here in Pasadena every day. The plays that we went to in L.A. and North Hollywood last week were also full so it looks to me like folks are spending lots of money. I think there are a lot of people doing much better than the news would lead people to believe. We had lunch with friends today in the San Fernando Valley and a couple that are friends of our friends said they have been out bid on 13 houses the past several months even though they have a pre-approval letter and more than required down payment for homes in the Valley, plus they have been adding 10-20% above the asking price. They are being beaten out by cash buyers so there is activity going on out there.

Sure Rob, you're the rule not the exception! Most people are retired at 50 and own several properties and work only if they want to. Of course.

Reality check: The vast majority of people need their jobs and a lot more are hoarding what little cash they can, anticipating the next round of layoffs, than are living the high life as you purport to be - if you're living off an inheritance or other windfall and have a diversified portfolio of properties, cash, stocks, mutual funds, etc., then bully for you, but this is certainly not the picture for 99% of Americans, and if you think it is, please call me, I have a bridge to sell you.

JimAtLaw says

if you’re living off an inheritance or other windfall and have a diversified portfolio of properties, cash, stocks, mutual funds, etc., then bully for you, but this is certainly not the picture for 99% of Americans, and if you think it is, please call me, I have a bridge to sell you.

Inheritance....LOL. Oh how I wish. I grew up poor in San Pablo and Richmond so my family didn't have any money. I worked an 8 hour a day job and made wise decisions buying property and spending less than I made. I even had to pay 100% for my own education because my folks couldn't afford to help. I know it's old fashion thinking, but it really does work. I was on the Dave Ramsey plan before Dave ever had a plan since we're the same age. Live on less than you make, don't pay credit card interest, pay off your mortgages as quickly as you can, pay cash for cars, blah, blah, blah. I haven't paid interest on a credit card since I was about 22 or 23 years old, which is about 27 years ago. I would have to look and see what my credit card interest rates are because I don't pay interest so I really don't care what Chase or Amex is charging. After writing this I had to go look at my statement out of curiosity and it's 10.99 and the other is 9.99, but when I pay it off every month instead of paying it to bankers, I don't care. It comes down to a mind set.........spend less than the pay checks coming in. I hate sending bankers money. Like I said in another post last week when someone mentioned getting or keeping a mortgage so as to write off the interest is just not a very fincancially smart thing to do. Pay them off as quick as possible with extra principle payments to get rid of them, then once it's paid off send the same amount to a favorite charity and get the same deduction instead of lining the pockets of bankers. If someone is in a 28% tax bracket why would they want to spend 1.00 to save 28 cents to send the bankers kid to college. This mind set is very prevelant out in the world. The World Wildlife fund or other charities need the money more than bankers. I still think most people are doing ok unless they were in an industry that was hard hit. Someone once said on this site that they use it as a contrarian indicator because it's always doom and gloom and I am beginning to think they were right. The official number of CA unemployment is somewhere around 12.% (I know some willl argue this but you need some official number) then there are still 88 people out of a 100 working so I guess they are the ones filling up the restaurants here and when I took my nieces to Disneyland a few weeks ago it was elbow to elbow in all the restaurants and rides. A few months ago we drove down to the San Pedro pier for a 7 day Mexican cruise and the ship was fully booked. I don't know where you live, but like I said in my post, I can only speak to my little part of the world here in the San Gabriel Valley of Pasadena, Arcadia, Bradbury, Sierra Madre, South Pasadena, San Marino, etc. and the San Fernando Valley. I'm sure the good folks of Las Vegas are hurting because they have since taken the number one spot for unemployment over Michigan.......but then again, we went to Vegas a week before Memorial weekend. The I-15 from L.A. was packed all the way to Vegas and once there we had to wait to check in because of the crowds and the restaurants were busy. Over the 4th of July weekend we went to San Diego and the same thing there......couldn't even upgrade to a suite at the Wesin in the Gas Lamp Distict/waterfront because they were all booked up.

The official number of CA unemployment is somewhere around 12.% (I know some willl argue this but you need some official number) then there are still 88 people out of a 100 working so I guess they are the ones filling up the restaurants here

Do any measures of unemployment allow for accounting of pretty much every last dollar of housing money that fueled the economy for the better part of the last decade? Realtors, and anyone in the construction industry? My understanding is if you're not paying UEI taxes then you can't be counted as unemployed, even once you've lost your stream of income/employment

i think it's the 10 out of 100 people that are privy to all the political privilege that got bailed out that have kept the wheels turning for the last three years. that and unemployment being extended out to two years

There is always a rob918 in every finance discussion on every website. It's always the same line "I've made a lot of smart decisions and I'm quite comfortable, thank you very much".
I have also done well, I live in the same city you do and all I can say is you need to get outside your little cruise ship/disneyland world (or even just talk to the people you meet while there). I know plenty of people who spend every available cent on the same things you do and they are hurtling towards their own private financial hell. Crowds don't equal dollars either - ask any bartender who has worked at the same place for years.

m1ckey6 says

I have also done well, I live in the same city you do and all I can say is you need to get outside your little cruise ship/disneyland world (or even just talk to the people you meet while there). I know plenty of people who spend every available cent on the same things you do and they are hurtling towards their own private financial hell. Crowds don’t equal dollars either - ask any bartender who has worked at the same place for years.

I disagree that crowds don't equal dollars unless it's a free event. That's just plain silly. Hotel rooms in SD aren't free, Disneyland is $100.00 for a park hopper alone, even a cheapy inside cruise cabin for a week would guess somewhere around $500.00 each. To use your analogy folks are doing all these things for free. Let's just say that If what you say is true, I would say that those folks shouldn't be out spending money on cruises, Disneyland and trips then and to paraphrase you, folks are 'spending every available cent on the same thing and are hurtling toward their own private financial hell.' They should be buckling down more. That means that they are living beyond their means and spending more than they make which I think is foolish in good or bad times.

Unlike you though, I give most Americans more credit than that and think that they are doing OK and can afford to do those things. I talk to lots of people that aren't as sour on things as you are so I guess we just talk to different people :-)

I'm back. It's nice to be missed.

We drove up to Lassen volcanic park in northern CA and camped for most of the week. It's very beautiful, with great views, big trees, and little lakes. The best part was a place called Bumpass Hell. I'd never seen any real volcanic activity before, so it was a trip to see boiling mud, sulfer, and hear the roar of hot gasses escaping the earth.

I’m back. It’s nice to be missed.
We drove up to Lassen volcanic park in northern CA and camped for most of the week. It’s very beautiful, with great views, big trees, and little lakes. The best part was a place called Bumpass Hell. I’d never seen any real volcanic activity before, so it was a trip to see boiling mud, sulfer, and hear the roar of hot gasses escaping the earth.

Bumpass Hell is awesome, but man you have got to go to Yellowstone. it is Bumpass Hell times a thousand with amazing wildlife and the Grand Canyon of the Yellowstone. The most amazing place on the face of the earth IMHO. Was the road open through the park?

OK, I'll add Yellowstone to my must-see list.

The road was open, but there was still snow around, which was pretty weird because it was about 90 degrees. I put snow in my hat just to cool off.

You seriously don't see how crowds can exist and spending be down at the same time rob918?! You are simply too dumb to have done well unless you are pulling down a pension from some scam government job. Did you work for the city of Bell by any chance?

Even the LA Times gets it:
http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-0821-restaurants-closing-20100821,0,584097.story

Being slower than the LA Times take some effort.

Great To Have you BACK PATRICK, Glad you had a great time, and when we pause to see the world for what it is, a living breathing planet it is astounding, and awe-inspiring (sp)

m1ckey6 says

You seriously don’t see how crowds can exist and spending be down at the same time rob918?! You are simply too dumb to have done well unless you are pulling down a pension from some scam government job. Did you work for the city of Bell by any chance?

Sure, ok, whatever you say, you're always right. Thank you for the kind and polite words :-)

I'm in Danville, Ca, near Walnut Creek in the East Bay. I feel as if I'm living in the Matrix. Restaurants are full, shopping centers crowded, spas booked, many home pending signs.

WEIRD.

i rarely drive past the mall, and never on a sunday afternoon, but i did today and i've never seen it so crowded. i guess that doesn't mean much especially since i don't have other (data) to compare it to, but it surely does feel wierd when in my mind the whole world economy has supposedly gone to hell in a handbasket.,,,,,,,,hopefully only in my mind

or maybe it's just that back to school shopping that has everyone out spending

me thinks that credit/(or debt 'money') is a drug stronger then nicotine or heroine, and everyone is hooked. by hook or crook, they're going to get their next fix, and they are addicts, so they are not thinking rationally, and even though buying a house in the American Dream, and that means a 30 yr mortgage to consume about a 1/3 of your income for the majority of your working life, most people are still stuck on keeping up with the joneses and looking pretty and getting that new cell phone that for a mere 100$ per month can let you call people better (then a 1960's rotary), so if there's a way, there's a will, and the same people that leveraged our collective lives to hell with credit and absurd consumer expenditures aren't going to quit cold turkey,,,,,,,,,

I’m back. It’s nice to be missed.
We drove up to Lassen volcanic park in northern CA and camped for most of the week. It’s very beautiful, with great views, big trees, and little lakes. The best part was a place called Bumpass Hell. I’d never seen any real volcanic activity before, so it was a trip to see boiling mud, sulfer, and hear the roar of hot gasses escaping the earth.

Congrats Patrick... time well spent.

m1ckey6 says

You seriously don’t see how crowds can exist and spending be down at the same time rob918?! You are simply too dumb to have done well unless you are pulling down a pension from some scam government job. Did you work for the city of Bell by any chance?

Malls have become a form of entertainment. They dont spend they go there for the walk around.

thomas.wong1986 says

m1ckey6 says

You seriously don’t see how crowds can exist and spending be down at the same time rob918?! You are simply too dumb to have done well unless you are pulling down a pension from some scam government job. Did you work for the city of Bell by any chance?

Malls have become a form of entertainment. They dont spend they go there for the walk around.

It is pretty hot out there. Save on electricity on the weekend just relax at a Mall. :)

robertoaribas says

pulling in nearly $50K a year on California unemployment…

???? Oh dear lord. Can I move there after I lose my job?

I'm pretty sure it's not $50K/year. I was unemployed in California and the max was $450/week, which is $23,400/year.

Re: Unemployment, I can attest to that MAX is 450 a week, and after 18 years of being on the same JOB I had to use the benefit for 8 weeks. I felt horrible, and while I thanked god for the income, I felt so so well underfunded and at fault!

rob918 says

I disagree that crowds don’t equal dollars unless it’s a free event. That’s just plain silly. Hotel rooms in SD aren’t free

Bars: there will always be lots of patrons--they just tip less during a recession (ask any bartender--I've known many as a travelling alcoholic)

Malls: I'm a buyer for a large retailer and can tell you that traffic in malls means not very much. Right now, there's still plenty of traffic, but sales are down YoY for the last two months, and YoY for the overall year. People go to the malls to look and not buy. Just like drunks at a bar will still drink but not tip much. Back to school means nothing anymore if you are selling discretionary (i.e., high margin) merchandise.

Restaurants: Folks will always eat. Like in the malls, they will browse but not buy, but they will always stop at the food court because you have to eat (but you don't have to have another pair of stripper shoes); cooking at home is not any cheaper than going out, either, unless you are feeding a family of 5. People just order cheaper entress, skip the dessert, and don't order a bottle of wine unless 6 people are at the table. Again, spending shrinks but crowds do not.

People do not want to be sequestered in their homes by the recession. They will go out until they literally cannot afford gas to drive.

dadab says

It is pretty hot out there. Save on electricity on the weekend just relax at a Mall

YEP1

thomas.wong1986 says

YEP1

Incidentally, this was taped during the early '90s recession. . . .

Philistine says

thomas.wong1986 says

YEP1

Incidentally, this was taped during the early ’90s recession. . . .

Hehe