patrick.net

FAB, thanks.

So you are a sailor. Me, too, but not a pro one like you. Not yet.

Sir Rick of Bulldust said:

governer conan- been reading War and Peace, huh? too bad most of the people were the peon infantry. the enemy officers would often meet before battle and have a few drinks before they played thier little game of chess. btw- why would you have to make money to marry up, isnt that the whole point of marrying up? the whole thing is ridiculous anyway… i find our new ‘upper class’ are a bunch of fucking heathens.

1. Never read W&P. I stopped on the first page. Too many long names.

2. Officers having tea before (and during) the battles. There are some anecdotes. But not as pervasive as you suggested.

3. I saw a video snipet from a series on "Class in America." I believe it was made by PBS. In it, a guy from "down the hill" finally made enough money to marry a girl from "up the hill." She could not hide her disdain for his inferior background during the interview. They were just married.

4. Moneyed people married their daughters into the military caste precisely because the latter was where the power of the old society rested. It was a clear case of money marrying up power and status.

My question is, why isn’t the price dropping YET? I did see a lot more for sale signs up, I did see less and less people go to open houses. But the asking price of houses are still up there, what gives?

Sellers are probably still confused and are in denial. Many people are waiting for prices to fall, so if prices do go down, there will be some support. It is going to take some time and more frustration.

Remember, timing a purchase may save you money or it may not.

Red Whine Says:

"...I think we won’t see the last Boomers leave the workforce for another three decades. Sweet Jeebus."

God almighty! I hope you're wrong man, I hope you are wrong.

>>The youngest Boomers are about 50

According to the current working definition, the youngest are 42.

“…I think we won’t see the last Boomers leave the workforce for another three decades. Sweet Jeebus.”

Either that or they will just vote more income-tax for the working generation and more benefits for the retired generation. Which one is more likely? I wonder.

Red Whine,

A lot of Boomers will be forcibly retired as soon as enough Gen X-ers make their way into the boardroom. I know that in my profession, the senior partners used to become "of counsel" to the firm. They were given a retirement dinner with many speeches and accolades. They'd also be given a small office at the firm, just to make them feel like they were still a valued member of the profession. They no longer drew a full salary, and they no longer did any actual work, but the appearances were maintained. It was a classy way to let someone retire. A doddering old man could drop by the office for an hour once every other week to reminisce, chat with the other lawyers, and feel as if he were still at the height of his powers.

Naturally, the Boomers changed all that. They took the of counsels' offices away. Now when the older lawyers retire, their offices are given to the junior associates. Their names are pried off the door and removed from the letterhead. They are no longer considered members of the firm; they are just retired.

Something tells me that Gen-X'ers will take this one step farther. The Boomers won't just lose their offices -- security will escort them from their desks.

Once we are finally in charge, our duty will be to treat the next generation well. If we do, perhaps they won't treat us badly.

Once we are finally in charge, our duty will be to treat the next generation well. If we do, perhaps they won’t treat us badly.

And the prior generation badly, very badly. I say cane them. "oh did you say caine? I love caine"

Something tells me that Gen-X’ers will take this one step farther. The Boomers won’t just lose their offices — security will escort them from their desks.

Why stop there? Why not "escort" them to the welcoming firing squa-- er, "retirement party"?

Once we are finally in charge, our duty will be to treat the next generation well. If we do, perhaps they won’t treat us badly.

I afraid that power may skip a generation, from one boomer (baby) to another (echo). From father to son.

I wonder how many sellers are like this?

Too many. We will just have to wait for fear to reign. They are still greedy.

i think we should consider lethal injection.

Your hatred is misguided. Find peace and be happy.

Thanks for the correction — I’ve had a hard time getting consensus on what the exact cutoffs are. I would NEVER have guessed that a 42 year old qualifies.

42 - 46ish are cusp boomers. They are definitely more like boomers than Xers, but they also missed out on many of the "peak boomer timing" exploits.

Cusp Xers are probably in the 38-42 group (in which I admittedly fall). The inverse is true of cusp Xers: they tended to get a bit more good timing than the rest of X, but definitely still far worse than the average boomer.

(Just my opinion...no data to back any of this up)

Either that or they will just vote more income-tax for the working generation and more benefits for the retired generation. Which one is more likely? I wonder.

I afraid that power may skip a generation, from one boomer (baby) to another (echo). From father to son.

As cynical as I've become towards my generation's retirement and career prospects, I somehow doubt that Gen-Xers will put up with 70% income tax, permanent abject poverty, no retirement and zero advancement prospects, while we passively watch BBs & Gen-Yers consume everything we produce and live in luxury. Revolutions and civil wars have started over much less, though I doubt either is likely.

If something approaching this Gen-X perma-slavery scenario actually comes to pass, many of us "Slackers" will simply opt to drop-out of the system altogether (e.g., work under the table, leave the country, turn to crime, etc.). At that point, ceteris paribus, our gracious Boomer Overlords will have to come to the political compromise table or face some harsh choices themselves.

i think we should consider lethal injection.

Your hatred is misguided. Find peace and be happy.

Your hatred gives you focus... I can FEEL your anger... Give yourself to the Dark Side :twisted:

Your hatred is misguided. Find peace and be happy.

Peter P, I thought you were a foodie, turns out you're a hippie/foodie.

many of us “Slackers” will simply opt to drop-out of the system altogether

Fuck yeah, Class B RV and off to Mexico I go.

As cynical as I’ve become towards my generation’s retirement and career prospects, I somehow doubt that Gen-Xers will put up with 70% income tax, permanent abject poverty, no retirement and zero advancement prospects, while we passively watch BBs & Gen-Yers consume everything we produce and live in luxury.

Well I guess Gen-Xers will have marginally more power than illegal aliens.

I am Gen X myself.

I somehow doubt that Gen-Xers will put up with 70% income tax...

Tax increases are coming, no doubt. I found this article very interesting:

http://finance.yahoo.com/columnist/article/moneymatters/5160

Thus, in 2010, you get another shot to convert your IRAs to ROTHs. Do it and take the hit now rather than taking it at a higher tax rate later. Interestingly, this will require some disposable income or savings to pull off to handle the tax bill, thus FBs need not apply.

Peter P, I thought you were a foodie, turns out you’re a hippie/foodie.

Perhaps a New Age foodie. Hippie? Perhaps not.

peter, im not so sure peace and contentment are on the bill. people my age are being raped. we have no future. i would rather be living in a thrid world country( where things are reportadly so terrible ). At least in third world countries I dont have to spend %60 of my waking ours in a cubicle writing computer code and getting no where.

Rick, have you seen an astrologer lately? If not, go do it. Seriously.

FRIFY,

That Roth IRA conversion looks tempting for 2010 -thanks for the info. Right now, though, being a JBR (and no kids) I am relying on my conventional tax-deferred IRA to reduce my annual tax tab. This looks like an attractive opportunity for when I become a homedebtor and/or parent.

I wonder if the IRA-to-Roth also applies to noncontributory/rollover IRAs. People who have rolled old 401ks into noncontributory/rollover IRAs could make out like bandits if that’s the case.

I'm sure that's the case as I've heard that rollovers are legally the same as normal IRAs.

ROTH IRAs are obviously the bomb from a personal standpoint, but their effect on the national budget is not so nice. There will be nice windfall tax payments coming from people taking advantage of this conversion in 2010, but the long term consequences is that the future governments can't tax these dollars. Rich boomers can quit their jobs (or go part time) and qualify by the income standards that's obstensibly meant to prevent the program from being a sop to the rich.

Anyway, set your clocks...

I am relying on my conventional tax-deferred IRA to reduce my annual tax tab.

Unless you don't qualify because of your beaucoup de hahas, you've got to go ROTH over conventional IRA. It's a slam dunk. Taxes are crazy low right now, so pay the taxes now and get your dollars out of the clutches of the tax man.

ROTH IRAs also allow you to withdraw your original contribution (not the earnings) amount with NO PENALTY! Thus, if you're squeezing for that downpayment or find yourself in a nasty pinch, you can pull that out without the 10% + income tax penalty of a conventional IRA.

Hmmm... I wonder if that rule will apply to rollover amount after 2010?

Randy H Says:

"Cusp Xers are probably in the 38-42 group (in which I admittedly fall). The inverse is true of cusp Xers: they tended to get a bit more good timing than the rest of X, but definitely still far worse than the average boomer."

____

Randy, at age 39, I'm a "cusp" X'er. I have NOT had ANY good timing.

I've done nothing but play by the rules like they told me. I graduated high school. I joined the military and served my country. I joined the reserves when I got off active duty. I got a bachelors degree. I got an MBA.

for all of this work I have been nothing but RAPED by this fricken' economy. I don't own shit but school debt.

I just had TWO interviews with the same fortune 500 company in Tempe, AZ, last week, for TWO different positions. I worked there diligently for over seven months on a contract basis, have great references for my work, and I'm still not sure if I'll get hired.

I threw everything but the kitchen sink at them during the interview. I didn't bust out the knee pads, but it looked like thay might have been expecting it, since the four panelists that interviewed me (half women half men) were CLEARLY Boomers.

If anyone should be hired it's me. It should be a slam dunk, but knowing my luck I'm going to take it, sans lube, once again. I think they could sniff me out as a cusp X'er and will probably give the job to some fat, greedy Boomer from the East Coast that just rolled into town from NY.

I can't take this sh-t anymore. I'm serious!

can you recommend a good astrologer?

A good astrologer is someone who clicks with you and someone who is willing to help you learn. It is quite personal. Every person has different needs.

A good start is to download some free astrology software (e.g. Astro 123) and play around with it. A good astrologer is your guide in understanding all the symbolism, not a fortune teller.

A good start is to download some free astrology software (e.g. Astro 123) and play around with it. A good astrologer is your guide in understanding all the symbolism, not a fortune teller.

I recommend a good Ouija board. I have one from c. 1975 I might be willing to part with for the right offer. Both stand an equally good chance of accurately predicting the future, whereas my method is significantly cheaper. :mrgreen:

One of the interesting things about the Boomer/Gen X dichotomy is that the Boomers aren't paying us enough to buy their houses.

I actually think this will affect housing prices. When the guy in the next office wants to retire and tries to sell his house to me for $1.5mm -- I won't be able to afford to buy it!

I promised a serious analysis of this issue; with the threadmaster's permission, I will try to put it up on Friday. right now it is a series of emails that need to be assembled into a coherent whole.

I threw everything but the kitchen sink at them during the interview. I didn’t bust out the knee pads, but it looked like thay might have been expecting it, since the four panelists that interviewed me (half women half men) were CLEARLY Boomers.

Mike, Mike, Mike, the key to sucking off boomers is to not forget the finger in the bunghole.

SQT-

No, it's that we don't see a future. I don't mind working hard to succeed. I put myself through college. Tonight I will probably pull an all-nighter at work, and then argue two different motions in the morning.

It's that I don't see any way to make this hard work pay off. What am I supposed to do, ask my boss to triple my salaray in recognition of my hard work? Fat chance of that.

Or am I supposed to start my own firm, with gross annual revenues of $1,000,000 per year, just to buy a single family tract home?

It's not a question of not wanting to work hard. It's about working hard and getting nothing. It's about not seeing any way to succeed absent a gigantic market crash.

SQT, I'm your Father, your anger shows much promise. Come to the Dark Side, HARM and I await you. ;)

:twisted: Good, SQT... GOOOOD. I can feel you anger... it gives you focus. It makes you stronger. :twisted:

-you
+your

SQT,

You are my hero(in). I also find the undertone of misogyny here a bit much at times. I really strains me that at least once on every thread someone makes a blanket statement that essentially declares that my wife is a [fill in your vitriol here].

I seriously don't understand why anyone would presuppose that they know what is best for all others. It is an arrogant, ironically "liberal" position to assume that you know how others should best live their lives.

Just keep in mind that the woman bashers are, with 100% positive correlation, the very men that are unsure of their own masculinity. If I weren't already married to a strong, intelligent, kickass woman, I'd be surely smitten by SQT.

Michael Holiday,

at age 39, I’m a “cusp” X’er. I have NOT had ANY good timing.

I’ve done nothing but play by the rules like they told me. I graduated high school. I joined the military and served my country. I joined the reserves when I got off active duty. I got a bachelors degree. I got an MBA.

I hear you. I'm making a generalization, of course. I'm 38, and I have hit some pretty rough spots in the past 5 years myself; which is why I went back for my MBA also. My point was that it only gets worse as you progress further into GenX. The younger GenX'ers didn't even have the hope for that which pisses you and I off for not getting.

Surfer-X: I won't even comment on X's last comment to my post, but he might be on to something. Boomers want the whole hog, if you know what I mean.

Randy: Yeah, I know where you're coming from. If I get hired by Honeywell, I might see if they would kick in a few bucks so I could get another masters degree in International Management from Thunderbird grad school. It's ranked #1 in International Business but would set me back over 60K. It's only worth it if they'll comp me some $$ towards tuition or forget it. It's just a vanity degree anyway.

Thunderbird grad school?

And I thought they were only purveyors of fine bum wine, did not know they had a "grad school" division. Must have something to do with the large bum wine profit margin.

.

surfer-x Says:

Thunderbird grad school?

'...did not know they had a “grad school” division. Must have something to do with the large bum wine profit margin.'

Ha, ha! Thunderbird wine is so bad, I tried it in the Army, it's so friggen' bad I had to hold my nose when I gulped, it then almost threw up. I couldn't drink that sh-t.

Thunderbird International Business school is a few blocks from my house in a suburb of Phoenix called Glendale, AZ. The school is, and has been, rated #1 in International Business. It's reputation is global, but it's price tag is stellarly-high.

Wouldn't mind going there, but it's very pricey. Nice diploma, though. It could open some doors in Silicon Valley. I might even be able to afford a condo after I paid off the tuition.

I swear, I'm a hair's breadth away from Bay Area law enforcement. I'm sure, with overtime, I could crack $100K. And even have half a pension in ten years. I could make 20 years worth of Arizona pension in ten, then come back here pimped out and maybe sell a few houses on the side for $$.

@Surfer-X & Michael Holliday,

I recommend spending some time reading up at: http://www.bumwine.com/

Red Whine should appreciate it too... not that he'd be caught dead actually drinking anything like that, of course.

Soo bad or so bad?

Soooooooooo bad...