patrick.net

I respect their desire to serve. However they clearly are in denial about government welfare. None of them get rich by it to be sure, but they are the recipients of a wide variety of services not available to civilians for "free".

True, not to mention they will get VA healthcare for the rest of their life. So if they ever shoudl get something serious, they don't have to worry about going bankrupt paying medical bills.

I also like this sign from a hospital employee:

I wonder what percentage of their hospital's revenue comes from Medicare and Medicaid.

Who are the 53% crowd? Well, we know for a fact that at least one of them is FAKE. The guy lives in Spain. Apparently the teabaggers are good at Photoshop. Although if they were really good, they would not have gotten caught.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/10/15/1026620/-We-Are-the-53-is-Using-Fake-Images?via=siderec

Doing well in life in spite of having grown up in an abusive home does not absolve the abusers' abuse. Likewise, just because one does well in this economy, their doing well doesn't absolve the incredibly corrupt actions of bankers and politicians.

Like I said, we need a more regressive tax system to encourage people to earn more money.

Oh, now I get it. Silly me! Again, weird that so many of them have military experience.

The most damning evidence against that guy, is that he spells his Erik with a k. Might as well just kill hisself

Essentially what they are saying is, "I had to needlessly suffer as a working slave earning low wages and working ungodly amounts of hours. Therefore, everyone else should have to needlessly suffer too (except for the corporations that robbed us)." These people feel the need to punish others because they themselves have been punished. They are delusional to the economic realities of the US in which capital has evaporated from the the system while lots of it have become a lot more concentrated in fewer hands. There's just a lot less money and fewer jobs to go around because of the greedy capitalists. Instead of trying to punish the abusers, these 53%ers seem to derive perverse pleasure from punishing the abused.

The poor economy will ensure that many people will be left behind. There's no way around that unless the gov't steps in an finds ways to end corporate corruption and find ways to allow more people to earn more money. Instead, many people are intent on blaming people for being lazy and grand standing their achievements while proclaiming if they can do it, so can everyone else. Pointing fingers at the masses of the down and out solves nothing and legitimizes corporate corruption at the expense of the people.

So far in the USA the OWS answer is to shame wall street.

This is not an emotion they feel.

They just laugh at this.

They laugh in style.

HousingWatcher says

Now, according to him, he joined the military, then got a degree. NEWSLFASH: That degree was paid for by the govt. under the GI Bill. He went to school for 100% free courtesy of Big Government.

Also, the gummint subsidized his home loan (especially if it was a VA loan).

Love the guy who filed Chapter 13 -- what an idiot. He just pushed his costs onto the rest of us.

These people are mostly not introspective and aren't realizing that the banksters have been playing them and still are. The reality is that Teabaggers (47% of whom don't pay federal income tax) and Occupy Wall Street have way too much in common to be sniping at each other so much.

Okay, I am a military vet and what to say here.....

I understand that the military people (me) take pride in what they have accomplished but it was at the expense of the US government. It looks like they fail to realize that.

HousingWatcher says

True, not to mention they will get VA healthcare for the rest of their life.

Innacurate statement. You are only covered for things that happened to you while in service. If you do 20 years or more then yes, it is a damn good price of 460 dollars to cover your family for full medical care. Paid for by the US taxpayer and I thank you all for supporting us there. The military retirement benifits is a prime driver for people to stay in past 10 years of service. Otherwise, the sacrifices for your country become a burden to big to carry for the .1 percent of the population.

Mr 53% ignores the fact that the poor pay sales tax, social security tax of 10.4%, and various fees and tolls that are not significant to richer people.

Since the poor spend all their money, that sales tax is a big chunk every year, especially in places like California where it's over 8%.

The rich escape social security because their social security tax rate is ZERO PERCENT on all income above $106,000.

So the poor pay 10.4 + 8 + fees which is GREATER than the 15% that the ultra rich pay because the ultra rich have nearly all their income as capital gains and dividends.

Mr 53% is an ignorant easily manipulated bitter moran. I wish he were on here so I could challenge him.

Mr 53% ignores the fact that the poor pay sales tax, social security tax of 10.4%, and various fees and tolls that are not significant to richer people.

Well, also, most people don't realize WHY someone could pay 0% federal income tax:

1) they're a student and are exempt or get a tax credit
2) they make below the threshold (e.g. standard exemption + standard deduction)
3) EITC
4) deductions for being a senior or being blind
The list goes on. It doesn't always have to be about being a deadbeat.

Basically any tax exemption, tax credit, or tax deduction can put you into the 0% in a given year. I was at 0% when I was a student and also for my first tax return after graduation because I got a massive tax credit for paying tuition the prior year. Now I pay more than the median household income per year. Things change.

This is Mr. 53%:

His 3 jobs are bloggng at Red State, hosting a radio show, and appearing on CNN. All back breaking jobs that require lots of sweat...

Erick Erickson, Founder Of ‘We Are The 53%’ Site, Whines About His Brand New House And Well Paid CNN Gig

http://thinkprogress.org/special/2011/10/11/304642/erickson-whines-53-percent/

terriDeaner says

Oh, now I get it. Silly me! Again, weird that so many of them have military experience.

From the second image of Housing Watcher's post:

This guy probably got an ROTC scholarship, so his bachelor degree was at least partially subsidized by the taxpayer, plus a job guarantee on graduation. Any debts remaining were likely paid off with help from the government through the GI loan repayment program.

As a soldier, he also got much of his room, board, and medical care paid for for most of his adult life - the biggest costs to a household. He would have received additional stipends for supporting a family, if he started one while in the service. On-base housing, shopping at the tax-free, shopping at the PX, etc.

He retired after 21 years, that means at the age of 42/43 he got a pension for the rest of his life which I think is 1/3 to 1/2 of his average salary (forget whether that is the average of the last few years or the average over time). For an officer or Senior NCO (after 20 years in the military, he'd have to be at least an O-5 or E-7) that's pretty good money.

If he brought a home, he did so with little or no money down and the great terms available through the VA loan program, which are vastly superior to most of the commercial products accessible to the general public.

As for his Master's, I believe the military has programs that loan money for education to retired personnel at much better terms than what most civilians can get. For example, they have the troops to teachers program today, and have had similar programs in the past.

The combination of a taxpayer-paid lifetime pension in his early 40s and lifetime Tricare gave him the flexibility to open a business without putting his family's finances/health at much risk.

Nomograph says

These people are something else. What an embarrassment.

"I started my own business in 1997 at the age of 27, by the time we sold we employed over 25 people."

* I joined a (dot.com) startup and was given stock options. I had nothing to do with actually starting the company.
* I was given LLC or S Corp shares in my family's business.

thunderlips11 says

As for his Master's, I believe the military has programs that loan money for education to retired personnel at much better terms than what most civilians can get.

Actually, over the past 10 years it has been really good for Military people to get an education. He would have had his masters and PHD paid for in full if he was taking classes while in the military.

If it was the Clinton years he could have only needed to pay 25 percent of his tuition costs. The military would have picked up the other 75 percent. Or, it could have been paid in full if he went to a military career school.

thunderlips11 says

The combination of a taxpayer-paid lifetime pension in his early 40s and lifetime Tricare gave him the flexibility to open a business without putting his family's finances/health at much risk.

Actually, I don't begrudge prior service members for their benefits. Broadly I'd say they deserve at least what they get if not more. Politics of the military-industrial complex aside, many of them do extremely dangerous (and often essential) jobs that other folks in our society choose not to, and end up with lifelong, debilitating physical and mental issues following their active duty careers. And the ones that get out before retirement (including combat vets) get far less in terms of lifetime benefits.

That said, the jokers above should at least acknowledge that they understand WHERE the money for their training, subsidized benefits, etc. came from. You know... TAX DOLLARS.

terriDeaner says

That said, the jokers above should at least acknowledge that they understand WHERE the money for their training, subsidized benefits, etc. came from. You know... TAX DOLLARS.

Most acknowledge the money that funded their training, income, etc., came from "TAX DOLLARS." But more specifically, most understand that it came from tax dollars from people and businesses who pay INCOME TAXES.

Patrick's straw man about social security taxes, sales taxes, and various tolls and fees is irrelevant, unless this "99%" movement is looking to expand progressive taxation into everything, i.e., a "rich" person pays 2x the price to go through a bridge toll, a "rich" person should pay a higher % of sales tax within a state on each person, etc. And the argument with social security is an interesting one. Some argue on the one hand that it is not an "entitlement," it is a form of "insurance" that is "earned," but on the other hand demand that the cap on income from which the "rich" get to "escape" be lifted, without lifting the maximum benefit of course, in order to have the "rich" subsidize what people say they "earned."

As far as Vicente's equating military pay and benefits with "welfare" .... Vicente, perhaps you should enlist in one of the services, and take a lot of the Occupy protesters with you, since you've clearly identified the easy way out of their issues... A job, help for education and its costs, health care, and housing. And it's all for "free!"

Paralithodes says

Most acknowledge the money that funded their training, income, etc., came from "TAX DOLLARS." But more specifically, most understand that it came from tax dollars from people and businesses who pay INCOME TAXES.

I'm specifically referring to the sign-holders above, not military folks in general.

My father used to say: "The only thing certain in life is that the underclass will pay taxes and die." I wish more of the underclass would be proud of their pathetic, impoverished lives like the minions pictured above. Look how subservient and happy they are. Nothing like menial work to temper the foolish desires of the poorly bred.

These 53% people are the best underlings. They will eat a shit sandwich for your entertainment and then apologize for having foul breath. Incidentally, this is part of the application process for my man-servants.

The Nigerian dude living in Spain isn't the only fake on that site. Some of the others have photo data showing really old file origination dates. Like from 8 years ago! So many entries with just text, which suggest they were all written by the same person.

Since they were called out for faking photos, what few new ones appear often have the photo data stripped out entirely.

This Daily Kos thread suggests (if you dig into comments) more than a dozen of them were proven fakes.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/10/15/1026620/-We-Are-the-53-is-Using-Fake-Images

Due to a favorable stock market, I'll be just over the threshold to quality as "the 1%" this year. I can't honestly write anything for the 99% blog, but maybe I can write something clever for the 53% blog. Maybe something like this:

"I'm a college (and highschool, for that matter) drop out.
My job is pretty easy, not stressful, and has amazing benefits.
I don't really have much to complain about.
I'll pay about $65k in federal income taxes alone this year, which seems reasonable to me.
I am the 53%. Also, the 1%, and next year I'll probably be the 99% again."

terriDeaner says

Actually, I don't begrudge prior service members for their benefits.

I'm with you - I don't begrudge their benefits, but they should acknowledge their impact.

There are so many fake 53% stories on that blog. A 20-year old kid who claims his credit score is "just south" of 800. Impossible, since a credit score that high needs a long history that a person that age couldn't possibly have.

"

Another fun one.

"Unregistered, uninsured car and no health insurance so we didn't wreck or car and get sick."

Of course! Getting into an accident, breaking a leg, getting ill, etc. is a choice. I woke up this morning and said, "Self, we're not getting sick today or involved in a fender bender." And isn't having an unregistered, unlicensed car illegal in just about every state except maybe New Hampshire?

Also, how does a restaurant get taxed into oblivion? Taxes are only paid on profits.

Some of these have to be fakes or hoaxes.

Hey there pal, these weren't meant to stand up to SCRUTINY!

Just like all those "runaway acceleration" incidents, where when you look into them an awful lot of them turn out to be fishy. YOU are supposed to remember only the BAD BAD initial accusation part.

Do your part, take your Soma.

Vicente says

Hey there pal, these weren't meant to stand up to SCRUTINY!

Amen Brother. Just one more for now:

"I started working at 10"

In the coal mines, because I'm 100 years old, born before child labor laws...

"I'm now 50"
Whoops.

"I got a salary job when I was 16."

Doogie Howser?

"Went to collage ..."

This One?

Never took a dime? Perhaps this person eschewed public roads, public schools, etc. all their life and just didn't think to mention it.

I think you missed the part about STUDENT LOANS. This person does not meet the bootstrappy standards, they should have been "pay as you go" even if it meant working 2 night jobs. It gets worse when they let offspring pay "some of" their education. "Yeah I'll buy the textbooks, sure...." Didn't even ask them to pay back-rent and upbringing? They can't do self-supported and with loans like their old man? This person is a socialist sympathizer/infiltrator trying to make the 53% look bad.

I was mowing lawns at 9 years old. I win!

Mr 53% ignores the fact that the poor pay sales tax, social security tax of 10.4%, and various fees and tolls that are not significant to richer people.

Since the poor spend all their money, that sales tax is a big chunk every year, especially in places like California where it's over 8%.

The rich escape social security because their social security tax rate is ZERO PERCENT on all income above $106,000.

So the poor pay 10.4 + 8 + fees which is GREATER than the 15% that the ultra rich pay because the ultra rich have nearly all their income as capital gains and dividends.

Mr 53% is an ignorant easily manipulated bitter moran. I wish he were on here so I could challenge him.

But sales taxes can be avoided by paying online. Yes Amazon is not as large as walmart...so far. But the size of online shopping keeps growing. You don't need a credit/debit card to shop online because gift cards are sold in many stores..coin star also gives credit with change to have a gift card as well.

Also not all states have sales taxes on the same items. Not all tax food or clothing.

Of course there is always the underground economy where goods and services are also traded. And there are retailers that do give discounts for working for them which further lowers the price of goods. I've been at some that have had employee discounts of 10%, 20% and even as high as 40%.

Percentage of income spent on food in the USA is much lower than that of other countries (I'm not saying it is high quality..just cheaper).

If you want to jump on something try Louisiana as they just made any cash transaction of a used item illegal
http://ackelandassociates.com/cash-transactions-banned-by-louisiana/

So you now need a money order, credit card or debit card to shop at yard sales, flea markets, good will stores and the salvation army!

Vicente says

I think you missed the part about STUDENT LOANS.

What? Student Loans backed by government guarantees?

Vicente says

I was mowing lawns at 9 years old. I win!

hahaha!

"I walked uphill to school, both ways, in the snow, with only pocket lint for lunch!"

thunderlips11 says

Some of these have to be fakes or hoaxes.

That jackass quit college to be in a band and lived in HUD housing while in that band? He does realize that HUD is a federal agency, right? And that he was directly mooching off the 53% while he was in that band?

Also, that guy is also telling Occupy Wall Street to protest the bailouts, which OW is doing. He's a dumbass.

thunderlips11 says

"Went to collage ..."

This One?

Also, government-sponsored home loan + government-subsidized student loan, most likely.

A lot of these people are full of shite and have probably taken more money from the government than many of the protesters have.

corntrollio says

A lot of these people are full of shite and have probably taken more money from the government than many of the protesters have.

Yep. For as many ignorant, inconsistent sign-waving fucktards as have shown up in this 53% pseudo-movement, one might think they were a straw-man hoax. If one were inclined to conspiracy theories, that is...

terriDeaner says

For as many ignorant, inconsistent sign-waving fucktards as have shown up in this 53% pseudo-movement, one might think they were a straw-man hoax. If one were inclined to conspiracy theories, that is...

Yes, but that said, I saw "get your government hands off my Medicare" signs during Teabagger protests in the Bay Area. Sometimes it comes with the turf...

Sorry, but if you live in poverty, then you do not make enough to pay income taxes. You are NOT part of the 53%:

But don't worry, Michelle Bachmann says you should pay taxes. So we will tax you on your minimum wage job. I am sure you don't mind...

Here is another one:

"I have ZERO sympathy for people who prioritized poorly (don’t spend $100,000 on school if you’re not medically insured) and made crappy financial decisions (don’t spend $100,000 on a Gender Studies degree at all, whether you’re medically insured or not). You really want to be out of debt? Stop being a wimp and join the Army. But nobody forced you to go into debt in the first place, so I’m not entirely sure why I’m supposed to feel sorry that you suck at making life choices. Grow up."

TRANSLATION: Go get a government job and stop whining!

"I am 21 years old.

My parents worked tirelessly to send my 3 brothers and I through private schooling while grossing under 100k annually, combined.

I got good grades in high school and attend NoName U as a history education major.

I chose to take out student loans knowing I’d face high interest rates from private loan companies.

I have a 3.89 GPA as a senior and receive zero government aid while others at this institution are barely passing with the help of a government handout.

None of that matters though, because I chose the condition I’m in.

I don’t want a handout because what’s the fun in having something given to you? I thrive for the challenge of making something of myself. Many a “big businessman” started as the little guy.

When I graduate I’ll face nearly $60,000 in student loans and a dismal job market for education majors.

IF I get employed I’ll be underpaid and underappreciated, but I don’t care.

I revel in the success I earn for myself.

These are the decisions I’ve made and I’ll stand by them and pay my debts.

Because at the end of the day I’ll be happy with who I’ve become through hard work and perseverance.

I have two loving parents who support me and 3 older brothers who encourage me to achieve my dreams.

I am thankful for everything I have.

I AM THE 53%!"

-------------------

Sorry, but if your unemployed and do not pay income tax, you are NOT part of the 53%. With the dismal job prospects for teachers, it might be a very long time until you become part of the 53%. But you should still pay tax. So we will add a 9% sales tax onto your tuition. I am sure you do not mind, right?

HousingWatcher says

(don’t spend $100,000 on school if you’re not medically insured)

Except that if you go to most universities, you would get healthcare along with your tuition -- often mandatory for students to have some form of healthcare. If your parents have it, you can waive out of the school's plan.

And yeah, as HousingWatcher also said -- people in poverty don't pay income tax, and students generally don't pay income tax either.

Plenty of people are dumb. Some people are too dumb to realize that they're dumb.

A paerson living in "extreme poverty" likely gets money back from the federal govt... a negative income tax so to speak.