patrick.net

Thomas, well stated - and true in my experience. I grew up in a 100% Dumocrat family. I was the first to come to my senses (in my mid twenties) when I realized Dem's = Force, not Freedom. It took my parents a much longer time but they changed from the dark side too.

Our whole family went from 100% Dems - to 100% Peace and Freedom (Ron Paul).

Freedom is soooooo refreshing, you others should try it for a change.

Love, Abe

Honest Abe says

Freedom is soooooo refreshing, you others should try it for a change.

The only people who have "freedom" are in the top 0.1% who own everyone else's labor. The rest of us have to work 40 hours (or more) per week to survive.

Didn't the robber barons use things like race and ethnic divisions to cause the underclass to fight among themselves, rather than unite for their common economic interests?

Seems that strategery still works very well today, as evidenced by this thread...

wthrfrk80 says

Didn't the robber barons use things like race and ethnic divisions to cause the underclass to fight among themselves, rather than unite for their common economic interests?

These arguments seem familiar...

wthrfrk80 says

. The rest of us have to work 40 hours (or more) per week to survive

Come work in Silicon Valley.. you will be working 50-60 hours!
and that is not uncommon for any past decade.. 80s 90s and today.

Freedom.. pull yourself by the bootstrap, its worked for many today.

Mick, the correct name is not androids, but sociopaths. But thanks for stating the obvious!

Honest Abe says

I grew up in a 100% Dumocrat family

Let me guess. In the south ?

Marcus, this thread isn't about me, or where I grew up. Where are you from, the elitist North East or perhaps the screwball state of California?

State sponsored, forced discrimination is just as wrong as any other type of discrimination. Or are you of the camp "Murder is evil - unless the government does it, or counterfeiting is wrong, unless the government does it, or discrimination is bad, unless the government does it, or theft should be illegal, unless the government does it.

Geezzzz - how can your brain mentally justify that???

Honest Abe says

Where are you from, the elitist North East or perhaps the screwball state of California?

Yes. He obviously grew up in the South.

thomas.wong1986 says

LOL! kids vote Demo... until they get more mature, and switch to GOP. God Family and Country gene kicks in. And like many othe children of immigrants they vote GOP.

I believe that demographics show that all ethnic minorities have been voting for Democrats for several election cycles (except for Arab-Americans, who trend conservative, and that was prior to 9/11 and the right's Muslim assault).

Further, Demographics don't trend well for the Right. They've long lost the Jewish vote, the Black vote, will almost permanently lose the Hispanic vote.

The Asian vote has switches sides as well. I think even the anti-communist Cuban community has switched or is on the precipice of switching.

What's left of the GOP? Angry old white people.

CL says

What's left of the GOP? Angry old white people.

That and corporate money.

wthrfrk80 says

CL says

What's left of the GOP? Angry old white people.

That and corporate money.

You are correct, with a few exceptions. It's not like that in Texas but they'll go Republican anyway. 2012 isn't 1960 or 1964. That Democratic party disappeared around 1980. That was also when Rick Perry, Phil Gramm, Dick Armey and quite a few others jumped ship and became Republicans. Dick Shelby bailed soon afterward.

If Howell Heflin were alive and serving in the Senate today, I'm fairly sure he would be a Republican as well. If not, he'd be a DINO like Mark Warner.

Problem is...those angry white people are very much in the drivers seat in swing states like Ohio, Pennsylvania and Florida. The vote in VERY significant numbers and they will determine who becomes President. They always do.

rootvg says

Problem is...those angry white people are very much in the drivers seat in swing states like Ohio, Pennsylvania and Florida.

True that.

I think, demographically, we're in for a big shakeup vis a vis the two major parties.

Obviously the angry old white people will begin to die off. Replacing them is lots of new immigrants from south of the border. Poor, but socially conservative.

So the Republicans may have to get more "liberal" on economic issues to woo them. And the Democrats may have to get more "conservative" on social issues like abortion and gay marriage.

I think all of that would be a good thing.

wthrfrk80 says

rootvg says

Problem is...those angry white people are very much in the drivers seat in swing states like Ohio, Pennsylvania and Florida.

True that.

I think, demographically, we're in for a big shakeup vis a vis the two major parties.

Obviously the angry old white people will begin to die off. Replacing them is lots of new immigrants from south of the border. Poor, but socially conservative.

So the Republicans may have to get more "liberal" on economic issues to woo them. And the Democrats may have to get more "conservative" on social issues like abortion and gay marriage.

I think all of that would be a good thing.

Agreed, but that's gonna be awhile. Quite awhile.

CL says

Further, Demographics don't trend well for the Right. They've long lost the Jewish vote, the Black vote, will almost permanently lose the Hispanic vote.
The Asian vote has switches sides as well. I think even the anti-communist Cuban community has switched or is on the precipice of switching.

FWIW, asian and latino (Californians) arent all immigrants or poor working class like the media and left-wing would like to portray.. they have been here for multiple generations now.. and many are successfull business people in many different fields with their own right and belief in tradional values of hard work and free enterprise.

Over the past 10 years now, here comes the east coast liberals, because they discovered Silicon Valley, and want to dictate their nonsense social policies trying to rewrite our successfully experiences for "Californians". Like so many, they are all to greedy to "write their own name" into our (Californian) history books.

Its just laughable!

CL says

What's left of the GOP? Angry old white people.

And angry Hispanic, Asian, and other groups who share the same political philosophies.

There's a big difference between the brand of Hispanic that goes to Texas and the brand that goes to California.

I've seen them and they ARE different.

rootvg says

the brand of Hispanic that goes to

I know nothing of "that goes to" but I know of many "Californians" who have been here and have Mexican ancestry, as i have known many of Italian, German, Japanese, Russian, Korean and other ancestry. I known them since they lived on the same block, gone to the same church, same schools, made friendships through out our lives. We are not the liberals some on the left and media paint us as being.

thomas.wong1986 says

rootvg says

the brand of Hispanic that goes to

I know nothing of "that goes to" but I know of many "Californians" with Mexican ancestry, as i have known many of Italian, German, Japanese, Russian, Korean and other ancestry. I known them since they lived on the same block, gone to the same church, same schools, made friendships through out our lives. We are not the liberals some on the left paint us as being.

I used that phrase because it came from a Hispanic guy who was working two and three jobs to put his academically talented kid through Jesuit Academy, which is probably the best Catholic HS in that area.

That isn't a politically correct area down there and I'm not a politically correct person...not gonna be, either.

rootvg says

That isn't a politically correct area down there and I'm not a politically correct person...not gonna be, either.

"politically correct" a foreign concept imported from the East Coast... puke!

Thomas, just because you keep giving stupid answers doesn't mean you're winning this thread.

Scagnetti, I think you could probably do with having a bit more white guy guilt.

This was a troll post.

This instructive cartoon, called a "silent agitator' when first distributed exactly a century ago, is part of a large collection of such educational documents created by the I.W.W. in it's campaign to organize workers into a single union.

http://www.iww.org

They were effective enough in their goals, which included open opposition to the first World War, that they provoked a violent suppression action, supported by both parties, called the Palmer Raids, which resulted in government incited arson and demolition of union halls, and executions of IWW leaders. This was Hoover's first big project. Clearly as a corporate stooge his future was very bright.

Were he still alive, Palmer would surely be filled with envy at the powers available to the government for suppression of dissent in the U.S. today. He had no idea that if you propagandize a lie often enough, people throughout the country will happily parrot the lie, even if it means their own destruction.

kentm says

Thomas, just because you keep giving stupid answers doesn't mean you're winning this thread.

We (Californians) dont need your liberal agenda nonsense. We were doing just fine before you came here.

Thank you for visiting our state and have a safe ride back home.

State sponsored racism is still racism. Double standards, alive and well in the liberal "brain".

University of California, Berkley Cookie Sale:
Cookies $1.50
If you're American Indian $1.25
If you're Mexican American $1.00
If you're African American 50 cents
If you're an illegal alien, we pay you $1.19 for each cookie you can eat.

Liberal thinking, dumb and dummerer.

"The productive class resigns itself to being tethered to a permenant milestone of egregious taxation and inflation in support of the consumption class of bureaucrats and the entitled,

OR

There is a financial civil war and revolt by the productive class, and economic default on the obligation to support the non-productive classes (politicians and those infected by the entitlement disease)".

Daxton Brown: Preparing for Economic, Social, and Political Collapse

It is impossible to overcome the growing size of entitlements, except through default by the productive class. Liberalism is the cause of the disease.

The leviathan State is demanding more and more tax revenue from a smaller and smaller group of producers. It cannot continue on this way. Collapse is imminent, the real question is when.

wthrfrk80 says

rootvg says

Problem is...those angry white people are very much in the drivers seat in swing states like Ohio, Pennsylvania and Florida.

True that.

I think, demographically, we're in for a big shakeup vis a vis the two major parties.

Obviously the angry old white people will begin to die off. Replacing them is lots of new immigrants from south of the border. Poor, but socially conservative.

So the Republicans may have to get more "liberal" on economic issues to woo them. And the Democrats may have to get more "conservative" on social issues like abortion and gay marriage.

I think all of that would be a good thing.

Oh yeah, big government with conservative social policy. We get to be just like China!

Honest Abe says

It is impossible to overcome the growing size of entitlements, except through default by the productive class. Liberalism is the cause of the disease.

As if you know anything about the "productive class".

Honest Abe says

The leviathan State is demanding more and more tax revenue from a smaller and smaller group of producers. It cannot continue on this way. Collapse is imminent, the real question is when.

Ah, yes, the "leviathan State" is clearly demanding more and more tax revenue. Why, the federal government has increased taxes by an average of negative 12% over the last 15 years!

Honest Abe says

people who are mad as hell and are not going to remain silent any longer.

When were you silent?

I was silent when both the repub's and demo crats were busy destroying America's freedoms.

Nomo, you are obviously radically unaware of whats going on in America. Hope you get better soon. Try reading some good books, a mind is a terrible thing to waste.

Todays book recommendation: Capitalism & Freedom, by Milton Friedman.

PS I know you're a hater of Capitalism (well, at least your comments indicate you hate freedom) so just think of "Free Enterprise" when you see the word capitalism. It might help make your mind right. You don't hate Free Enterprise, do you?

Honest Abe says

Nomo, you are obviously radically unaware of whats going on in America. Hope you get better soon. Try reading some good books, a mind is a terrible thing to waste.

Todays book recommendation: Capitalism & Freedom, by Milton Friedman.

PS I know you're a hater of Capitalism (well, at least your comments indicate you hate freedom) so just think of "Free Enterprise" when you see the word capitalism. It might help make your mind right. You don't hate Free Enterprise, do you?

Abe, at the end of the day there are far more of us than there are of him. This is why his type uses emotion and the heat of the moment as leverage to get what they want done.

As evidenced by the number of years Republicans v. Democrats have served in the White House since World War II, sometimes they get a few things they want. Most of the time, they do not. Most of the time we shove our foot up their ass and end up laughing about how screwy and unfocused they are, over a few beers.

http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxtopics/2010_budget_high-income.cfm

Kevin, why not try a little common sense...like cause and effect. Government raises budget BY $3.5 TRILLION DOLLARS, again -(cause) - tax increases to follow (effect). Well duhhhhaaa. My guess is that you are either unaware of the negative consequences of bad political decisions - or - you support them. Which do you think it is??

And why would you ASS ume that I know nothing about the productive class.

After all the ONLY people who care about government waste, fraud, mismanagement, corruption, trampling the constitution, over-reaching laws, constraint of the people, over-regulation and trying to micromanage every aspect of our business and personal life are the people in the productive class, who pay federal income tax - people like me - people who are mad as hell and are not going to remain silent any longer.

@root

Don't know if you saw the latest poll results in the swing states. It appears that there aren't as many of "you" as you thought...

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/obama-pulls-front-romney-santorum-key-states-quinnipiac-105729939.html

Tapout 70,

Rootvg was referring to the NUMBER of indibiduals who are NOT liberals, not the delegate count or the latest poll results.

Screwy liberals make up less than 30% of the America population (thank god), according to Aurthur Brooks, author of todays book recommendation: THE BATTLE, How the Fight Between FREE ENTERPRISE and BIG GOVERNMENT Will Shape America's Future.

tatupu70 says

@root

Don't know if you saw the latest poll results in the swing states. It appears that there aren't as many of "you" as you thought...

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/obama-pulls-front-romney-santorum-key-states-quinnipiac-105729939.html

Right...it looks like the healthcare bill is going down, Republicans may gain as many as ten seats in the Senate and hold their current position in the House.

But Obama is going to win again? That doesn't make sense.

We're going back to normalcy. All the signs are there.

rootvg says

Right...it looks like the healthcare bill is going down, Republicans may gain as many as ten seats in the Senate and hold their current position in the House.

It actually doesn't look anything like that...

tatupu70 says

rootvg says

Right...it looks like the healthcare bill is going down, Republicans may gain as many as ten seats in the Senate and hold their current position in the House.

It actually doesn't look anything like that...

You're not gonna mindfuck me. I've told you that over and over. I'm stronger than that and I don't care about "feelings".

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/news/jeffrey-toobin-health-care

We don't live in the United States of California and Massachusetts.

rootvg says

You're not gonna mindfuck me. I've told you that over and over. I'm stronger than that and I don't care about "feelings".

Don't worry--I have no desire to sexually assault your brain. Just wanted to show you that you are very wrong. And that the swing states are NOT leaning towards Romney.

tatupu70 says

rootvg says

You're not gonna mindfuck me. I've told you that over and over. I'm stronger than that and I don't care about "feelings".

Don't worry--I have no desire to sexually assault your brain. Just wanted to show you that you are very wrong. And that the swing states are NOT leaning towards Romney.

Do you truly believe Obama can win Ohio and Florida?

Do you honestly believe the election will come down to anything other than the unpopularity of Obamacare, unemployment and gas prices?

Are you serious?

rootvg says

Do you truly believe Obama can win Ohio and Florida?
Do you honestly believe the election will come down to anything other than the unpopularity of Obamacare, unemployment and gas prices?
Are you serious?

Did you see the poll results?

Have you seen the favorable/unfavorable splits on Romney lately?

You do realize that Obama won't be running against an "anonymous" Republican, right?

tatupu70 says

rootvg says

Do you truly believe Obama can win Ohio and Florida?

Do you honestly believe the election will come down to anything other than the unpopularity of Obamacare, unemployment and gas prices?

Are you serious?

Did you see the poll results?

Have you seen the favorable/unfavorable splits on Romney lately?

You do realize that Obama won't be running against an "anonymous" Republican, right?

I don't know what you do for a living but you don't know shit about American politics.

I suspect the real issue is that you don't know what normalcy looks like.

What we have right now sure as hell isn't normal and I worry about what the next recession will look like (gonna happen, everyone's talking about it) but after that, we'll start getting back there again. We'll NEVER get there under this guy because there are too many people who don't want his vision and the vision of people allied with him to become the standard. Over and over again, I keep telling you this isn't the United States of Europe.

rootvg says

I don't know what you do for a living but you don't know shit about American politics.
I suspect the real issue is that you don't know what normalcy looks like.
What we have right now sure as hell isn't normal and I worry about what the next recession will look like (gonna happen, everyone's talking about it) but after that, we'll start getting back there again. We'll NEVER get there under this guy because there are too many people who don't want his vision and the vision of people allied with him to become the standard. Over and over again, I keep telling you this isn't the United States of Europe.

See--there's your problem. You see things a certain way and assume everyone else must agree. You don't like Obama. Fine--that's certainly your right. Don't vote for him next election.

What I'm doing is showing you that the majority of people in the swing states feel differently than you. Therefore Obama is going to win.

Deal with it.