patrick.net

Doesn't it really depend upon the amount of the penalty?

I mean clearly health insurance rates are going to rise dramatically due to all the extra stuff they now have to cover, but if the penalty is low enough, them people will just pay it.

See health care calculator here:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/special/politics/what-health-bill-means-for-you/#

Hypothetically - per the calculator, if you are over 26, without insurance, for a ONE person household making $40K a year and are unmarried/single - the annual premium on your health coverage (with FEDERAL ASSISTANCE) is NO MORE THAN $3800. If you do not get the coverage, then the penalty you pay (all criteria remaining the same) is $744.00. This lower penalty however will only occur for the first few years, at which point the penalty will start to approximate the cost of the health insurance premium... (Thanks for the TAX INCREASE, Obama)

If all the above stated criteria remain the same, but instead you make $45K a year there is NO FEDERAL ASSITANCE to keep your health care within affordable limits and your annual penalty increases to $869.00 (again for the first few years, and again, thanks for the TAX INCREASE)...

Oh, and then there is the 30% deductible if you need to actually USE the insurance....

Given this cost-structure, at what point will employers have an incentive to cut their costs and not offer health plans as part of compensation all together?? And what will this do for the self-employed / entreprenuers trying to start businesses now that their TAXES just went up massively, will it help or hinder the development of these business??

And what will this do to those unemployed for more than a year, which is quite normal in this Obama economy??

Just some questions, I'm trying to figure this thing out... Perhaps it would be a good idea to get into the health insurance industry if this thing stands and does not get repealed. A captive market would ensure customers....

The middle class goes with out, while paying handsomely to subsidize the lazy and those that refuse to work.

scratch that we're all fucked...

here's what a family of 4 making only 30K a year will have to pay...
Which is less than 24000 a year after taxes. Which is less than 2K a month which is about 500 a week.

Starting in 2014:You will have the option of buying a health plan through your state's exchange with federal assistance. Based on your income, your annual premiums for that plan would be no more than $900 to $1,200. Your maximum out-of-pocket costs for deductibles and co-payments would be capped at 6 percent of the total cost.

This on top of out of control commodity gouging and price fixing on energy and food. Everyone will be working for Wallstreet with out a damn thing to show for it at the end of the year.

My numbers come out to over 9K a year btw. That's more than my house principal.

Small businesses which didn't have a health insurance for their employees would have to pay a penalty tax and since it is a cost to them they would pass that cost to their customers.
Small businesses which used to have a health insurance for their employees might make a decision to eliminate them if the cost is higher (which is going to be for sure) than the cost of penalty tax. However it is really difficult just to dump your cost. They probably say they would give their employees small raise in exchange of dumping the insurance. So their overall cost would go down a little bit.

Travis Bickle says

And what will this do to those unemployed for more than a year, which is quite normal in this Obama economy??

As far as I can tell they will be enrolled in Medicare (or Medicaid, whichever).

zzyzzx says

I mean clearly health insurance rates are going to rise dramatically due to all the extra stuff they now have to cover

Nope.

Insurance rates have been going up year after year for quite a while before the PPACA was ever passed or even brought up. That is why Clinton attempted to do healthcare reform years ago.

The cost of insurance and healthcare in the US has less to do with the price of doing business and more with profit for a few at the top.

The big problem with the PPACA is that it doesn't really do all that much to limit how much insurance costs can rise while also giving the insurance companies lots of cash on the tax payers' dime.

Forcing people to buy healthcare coverage while doing little or nothing to restrict price and profit increases for insurance companies and healthcare providers is a fucking joke.

My wife and I gross about 155K a year, there is no subsidy, or pity for EVIL people like us who went to school and work hard for a living. If we were to be dumped into this system, we would have to go to an exchange and pay up to 8% of our income a year on healthcare, or face a $1380 "Tax" from the IRS. So pay $12,400 a year in premiums or pay a fine, excuse me, "Tax" of $1,380 a year and get no services from it. This is bullshit, you know the exchange will run the premium up to the max for your income, this is a huge giveaway to the insurance companies and a huge transfer of wealth from the middle class to the lower class. If my employer quits offering healthcare as a benefit, and why wouldn't he, I'm taking a hit for over $1,000 a month for Obamacare premiums.
Most companies will quit offering health insurance as a benefit I predict, it will just be too tempting for the greedy bastards to pawn you off to the exchange. Without a raise in your pay to reflect their savings of course! They will simply put the money in their pocket. This will have many, many unintended consequences for healthy, middle class families and be a boon to poor and unhealthy people. If you and your wife each make $8 and hour and have a child, you will now have to come up with $215 a month to make the 8% premium, good luck, you'd be better off on welfare by the time it was all said and done. The middle aged woman who can't get insurance for her pre-existing conditions will now have to get insurance for her preexisting conditions, hope she can foot the bill or she'll have to opt out and pay a fine, sorry, "Tax".

So I predict only the poorest, most unhealthy people will be happy with this.

I'm too lazy to do the research. Will the supplemental ins. that 65yr.olds carry be effected.