patrick.net

Millionaire ain't rich.

"What they said was important"????
"poor people responses"???

It's called Self-serving bias .

Blurtman, whatever do you mean?

Honest Abe says

Blurtman, whatever do you mean?

He means if all you have is a million, you can maybe afford a small 2br apartment in Palo Alto.

And then, you'd better work hard to pay the taxes, go along well with your wife - and a strong faith in afterlife will help too.

I recall seeing a similar bullshit post like this a few weeks ago. A bunch of total generic generalities, because I can just about disprove every single one of those "reasons". Likewise the comments about "poor" people were equally ignorant.
Like I said yesterday. Stop wasting electricity creating pointless and meaningless posts.

Honest Abe says

Blurtman, whatever do you mean?

Yes, indeed, as has been suggested above. Being a millionaire isn't that much these days. Ask yourself how much you need to live in each year, and assume you may live to 80.

Honest Abe says

Strong spiritual faith

This is proof the rich people are full of shit.

Agree now having 100 million in gold bullion and cash and no debt and home owned free and clear and good health is wealth

Oops, I left one thing off by mistake.

The overwhelming majority of rich people have goals...in writing. Poor people don't.

Dan8267 says

This is proof the rich people are full of shit

There are those pesky rich people again.

Honest Abe says

Strong spiritual faith

Creflo Dollar agrees. So does Jimmy Swaggart, Rick Warren, Joel Osteen, and all of the other televangelist/megachurch slime-balls.

Do you really expect rich people to admit they got their wealth by screwing others over, being greedy and selfish, and skirting the law?

Honest Abe says

Well disciplined
Used their business to create wealth
Strong spiritual
faith
Married (28 years on average)
Lived within their means
Worked
harder than most others
Well organized
Competitive spirit

You left out the part where they START with a million or more, AND THEN do the above. Then again, how would you know?

Everybody knows that if crack babies would just apply themselves, they would easily be millionaires. Lazy fucks. ;-)

Blurtman says

Being a millionaire isn't that much these days.

Dr. Evil: I will hold the world hostage for (dramatic music): ONE MILLION DOLLARS!

No one, and I mean no one, is more entitled than rich folks. They think every penny they have is justified by every millisecond of effort they have ever exerted.

They cannot fathom that there are poor folks who have worked hard too. They cannot fathom that there are people who want to work who cannot find work.

Benmosche is a perfect example of this. Crying over bonuses paid to executives that bankrupted a company is akin to lynchings during reconstruction.

I personally know of CEO misuse of company money and a publicly traded, large US bank. I audited a budget at that bank that touched the CEO's office and found many inconsistencies. I escalated and was told, over the phone so there was no email record, to drop it.

The guy was paid 20 million a year but did not hesitate to put personal expenses "on the company" whenever he could.

As if the 20 million, car, driver, plane, personal security detail, golf membership, etc. wasn't enough. There is never enough I guess. Meanwhile the masses are forced to come out of pocket if they exceed their per diem, and told that "raises are not in the budget this year."

Its so clearly obvious why this post was made. Its more or less a means to try and somehow prove the general rhetoric that Republicans have been using since the Reagan era, which is that one tactic to try and get Americans to buy into their idea of cutting social programs is to pin the blame on the poor and create a gross generalization that ALL of them are lazy, incapable of goals, and thus undeserving of any government assistance. This is done naturally because blame can be placed on a group who generally can't defend themselves against remarks such as that.

But you want to know what's ironic about this whole thing? Guess what states are the poorest in the USA? Do a simple search and the results show that pretty much every single deep-red state is at the very bottom of that list-including the Southern state I grew up in. So with that said, then how is it that the GOP and their eager followers whom claim that all poor people are a bunch of lazy whiners make such a claim when in fact a large percentage are likely themselves poor?

And therefor this post was totally pointless. I live in one of the most liberal states in the country and guess what? It also has one of the highest incomes of any state. So again- oh the irony!

edvard2 says

This is done naturally because blame can be placed on a group who generally can't defend themselves against remarks such as that.

Yep. It's easier to pick on the weak than the strong. Just like on the playground.

edvard2 says

So with that said, then how is it that the GOP and their eager followers whom claim that all poor people are a bunch of lazy whiners make such a claim when in
fact a large percentage are likely themselves poor?

They aren't poor. They are temporarily embarrassed millionaires.

I was referring to the GOP constituency, whom the GOP of course needs to believe in them so they can proceed with their little plans.

edvard2 says

Its more or less a means to try and somehow prove the general rhetoric that
Republicans have been using since the Reagan era, which is that one tactic to
try and get Americans to buy into their idea of cutting social programs is to
pin the blame on the poor and create a gross generalization that ALL of them are
lazy, incapable of goals, and thus undeserving of any government assistance.
This is done naturally because blame can be placed on a group who generally
can't defend themselves against remarks such as that.

It mostly started with this whopper fed to the gullible mopes that already thought that, and he was the 'confirmation'.

What is most obnoxious about the Welfare Queen myth is that it is traced directly back to Ronald Reagan, who was indulging in gleeful hyperbole to outrage his Republican base. It has probably done more than any other conservative talking point in living memory to encourage Americans to be cruel to their neediest neighbors, even when some of those Americans are receiving some form of government assistance themselves. Stupid Uncle Bonzo.

What Reagan actually said, according to Wikipedia: “During his 1976 presidential campaign, Reagan would tell the story of a woman from Chicago’s South Side arrested for welfare fraud: ”She has eighty names, thirty addresses, twelve Social Security cards and is collecting veteran’s benefits on four non-existing deceased husbands. And she is collecting Social Security on her cards. She’s got Medicaid, getting food stamps, and she is collecting welfare under each of her names. Her tax-free cash income is over $150,000.”
The real life inspiration, according to Wikipedia: ”In 1976, the New York Times reported that a woman from Chicago, Linda Taylor, was charged with using four aliases and of cheating the government out of $8,000. She appeared again in the newspaper while the Illinois Attorney General continued investigating her case. The woman was ultimately found guilty of “welfare fraud and perjury” in the Circuit Court of Cook County, Illinois.”
So one woman scammed the government out of a total of eight thousand dollars and got caught and sentenced. From this one woman’s situation, Reagan creatively invented multiple imaginary dead fake veteran husbands (not true), a six-figure “annual salary” ($8,000 is four digits and not enough to live on for a year), a dozen fake Social Security cards (not correct), 80 aliases (no) and 30 fake home addresses (also no) and so on…in short, he created the Welfare Queen stereotype by wildly exaggerating information about a real person who got caught doing something wrong and who was punished for her criminal act.
Right from the beginning, when Reagan first told the infamous Welfare Queen story, there wasn’t anyone who actually got away with welfare fraud in real life! One middle-aged woman inspired Reagan’s anecdote, and she got caught! She was punished! That fairy tale The Gipper told us has led to a lot of misery, most of it directed at the weakest members of our society: those who are the least capable of defending themselves. Are we a country of unkind assholes who lack compassion for our neighbors, now?

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2012/10/14/welfare-queen-myth-must-die/

upisdown says

Are we a country of unkind assholes who lack compassion for our neighbors, now?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salem_witch_trials

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_the_United_States

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_Removal_Act_of_1830

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Crow_laws

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homestead_Strike

/?p=1230565

/?p=1230553

Don't forget people got richer, because there are so many loopholes to pay less than 15% tax while middle class pays 45% tax.

Nobody says

Don't forget people got richer, because there are so many loopholes to pay less than 15% tax while middle class pays 45% tax.

As Warren Buffett famously said, he pays a lower tax rate than his secretary.

Only Godless Communists want to correct that.

upisdown says

Are we a country of unkind assholes who lack compassion for our neighbors, now?

Yes, and gangsta rap and republican philosophy are evidence of that.

dublin hillz says

Yes, and gangsta rap and republican philosophy are evidence of that.

Republicans have no problems with welfare that goes to whites, just look at the southern red states and everywhere it is rural, but when they can hype the myth that only people of color collect welfare, it's suddenly evil.

upisdown says

Republicans have no problems with welfare that goes to whites, just look at the southern red states and everywhere it is rural, but when they can hype the myth that only people of color collect welfare, it's suddenly evil.

"Keep the Government out of My Welfare!!"

Honest Abe says

You can be a victim or you can be rich, but you can't be both.

Tell that to Mitt Romney.

Honest Abe says

If you want to be rich, you must believe you are the one causing the results you are getting.

By mathematical necessity, the vast majority of people cannot be rich. For being rich means having much more wealth than the median person so that you don't have to do mundane tasks.

As such, it is foolish to have the goal of becoming rich. Math demands failure for the vast majority of those with such a goal.

What the typical middle class person wants, is not opulence, but rather financial stability and a good quality of life. One does not have to be rich in order to be financially secure and a success in life.

The problem that most middle class people have with some of the rich, typically the most wealthy, is not that they are rich, but how they became rich. When someone becomes wealthy by exploiting others and diminishing their wealth, it is fully justifiable for the common man to despise such a person.

I have no problem with Taylor Swift being riched. She earned it and her wealth did not come at the expense of others. I do have a problem with Lloyd Blankfein being rich. He made his fortune destroying the finances of countless others while CEO of Goldman Sachs. He destroyed people's retirements and is largely responsible for the Second Great Depression and the unemployment that continues. Why shouldn't I despise him?

In contrast, Tim Berners-Lee should be the richest man in the world. He created countless trillions of dollars of wealth by inventing the World Wide Web. Why the fuck isn't he in the top 0.1%? Did he not work hard enough? Did he not accomplish enough? Did he not generate enough wealth? If he didn't, who the hell does? Berners-Lee has created more wealth for the world than anyone else in all of history. If naked capitalism worked nearly as well as its proponents claim, Berners-Lee would be the richest man in the world. So why isn't he?

Seriously, Honest Abe, I'd like to know why. It's not like Mark fucking Zuckerberg has created more wealth than Berners-Lee. Explain why one is rich and the other isn't. Because to the rest of us, it seems that Berners-Lee produced far more, but Zuckerfuck was far more conniving and manipulative, backstabbing everyone on the way to the top. I guess backstabbing is the "hard work" you keep referring to that separates us peasants from the Zuckerfucks and Blankfeins of the world.

upisdown says

Right from the beginning, when Reagan first told the infamous Welfare Queen story, there wasn’t anyone who actually got away with welfare fraud in real life! One middle-aged woman inspired Reagan’s anecdote, and she got caught! She was punished! That fairy tale The Gipper told us has led to a lot of misery, most of it directed at the weakest members of our society: those who are the least capable of defending themselves. Are we a country of unkind assholes who lack compassion for our neighbors, now?

Fairy take ? ..in the Internal/external Audit profession that would be called a good example how easy it was to override any checks and balances (if there were any) to commit clear case of fraud from the Govt. Today the Fraud is well over $100B EVERY YEAR thats ONE TRILLION IN TEN YEARS... and no plan to stop it. God forbid someone from Industry goes to work in Govt to stop these fraud...

What Reagan did was to show Govt has grown too big too out of control unable to understand its own operational processes.. Had you applied Sarbanes Oxley act to Govt.. it would fail the test..and countless people would be fired... but hey.. they are all govt Unions and unaccountable to any proper procedures and audits.

Do you see in private industry similar examples of Billions of Fraud being committed say ...employees collecting duplicate wages/salary.. Why is it Private industry has better control over their operations vs Public/Govt agencies.

Every single CPA / Accountant Govt knows about these problems...

Today, its not any single $8K case but more widespread criminal organizations who siphon BILLIONS out of the Govt and Tax payers with IRS refund claims and Medicare fraud.. and thats the tip of the iceberg.. all the while Democrats become obstructionists against any changes to STOP the widespread fraud.

Report: IRS has more work on fraud prevention system - The Hill
thehill.com/.../318863-report-irs-has-more-work-on-fraud-prevention-sy...‎
Aug 26, 2013 - The IRS's current defense against fraud, the Electronic Fraud ... agency says that some $19.2 billion worth of tax return fraud occurs each year.

Medicare Fraud: A $60 Billion Crime - CBS News
www.cbsnews.com/8301-18560_162-5414390.html‎
Sep 5, 2010 - 60 Minutes on CBS News: Medicare Fraud: A $60 Billion Crime - A.G. Holder Tells 60 Minutes More Oversight Is Needed; Scammer Explains ..

Dan8267 says

Seriously, Honest Abe, I'd like to know why. It's not like Mark fucking Zuckerberg has created more wealth than Berners-Lee. Explain why one is rich and the other isn't.

Would BL created anything had it not been for a Next.

So why didnt France become the beacon of Technology ?

The first website built was at CERN within the border of France, and was first put online on 6 August 1991.

Berners-Lee wrote his initial proposal in March 1989, and in 1990, with the help of Robert Cailliau (with whom he shared the 1995 ACM Software System Award), produced a revision which was accepted by his manager, Mike Sendall.[22] He used similar ideas to those underlying the ENQUIRE system to create the World Wide Web, for which he designed and built the first Web browser. His software also functioned as an editor (called WorldWideWeb, running on the NeXTSTEP operating system), and the first Web server, CERN HTTPd (short for Hypertext Transfer Protocol daemon).

thomaswong.1986 says

So why didnt France become the beacon of Technology ?

Why indeed? Just curious have you ever been there?

And yes as you yourself point out it does host at least half of CERN. As far as high energy physics goes France is indeed the beacon of Tech.

They also have a kickass nuclear program.

New Renter says

Why indeed? Just curious have you ever been there?

And yes as you yourself point out it does host at least half of CERN. As far as high energy physics goes France is indeed the beacon of Tech.

what is the internet but collection of Semiconductors, Storage and Software products we been doing for some years prior.. without all the tools its all trival for France ...

we certainly should be doing more with nuclear programs... but the tree huggers
have other ideas...

Rather than go by what they volunteer as reasons for their success, lets go by actual factors in their past, atleast before bashing poor people once again in full on murican mode.

Dan8267 says

By mathematical necessity, the vast majority of people cannot be rich. For being rich means having much more wealth than the median person so that you don't have to do mundane tasks.

The majority of people can be rich just not this decade.

As such, it is foolish to have the goal of becoming rich. Math demands failure for the vast majority of those with such a goal.

It's idiotic not to work at becoming rich (at which point you stop doing mundane things like working for a paycheck) and not too hard to get there.

Social security only replaces 30% of a professional's income up to the wage cap if they don't have a surviving spouse and even that can't be counted on because it's likely to become means tested.

You need 25X what you'd like to live on for a normal length retirement and 33X to survive indefinitely due to forced early retirement, longevity increases, etc.

For $100K/year that's $2.5M - $3.3M and up to $5M at the $150K/year cut-off for moderate income housing in San Mateo. Those sorts of non-housing assets and unearned income qualify as "rich" in most peoples' eyes when it's not camouflaged as a pension.

With the S&P 500 averaging 7% real returns (with dividends re-invested) over the last 50 years getting there in 40 years means saving $1000 - $2000 a month. Not buying expensive houses and new cars (where the average payment is $475/month) makes that possible. Not breeding is also a fine idea, although most people find it hard to resist the genetic imperative to reproduce.

Most people never get rich because they'd rather buy crap like shiny new cars

Last month Nakisha Bishop took out a loan to buy a $23,000 Toyota Camry and pay off several thousand dollars still owed on her old car. The key to making it work: she got more than six years—75 months in all—to pay it off.

"I had a new baby on the way, and I was trying to keep my monthly payment a little bit lower to help afford child care," Ms. Bishop, a 34-year-old sheriff's deputy in Palm Beach County, Fla., said recently. She pays $480 a month for the 2013 Camry, just $5 a month more than the note on her old car. The car won't be paid off until her 1-month-old daughter is heading to first grade.

although in that case the woman will probably have the government keep her millions for her and dish it out monthly as a public servant's pension.

"Hard work" doesn't mean anything. Illegal immigrants work far harder than most of us could ever imagine. And they barely make enough to survive.

Capitalism rewards bargaining power, it has little to do with "hard work."

The far-right narrative that "hard work guarantees success" is just a sneaky way of saying "anyone who is poor and/or isn't a millionaire is just a lazy bum." Of course some jerks (like Honest Abe) are willing to say it outright.

Honest Abe says

Is anyone surprised?

My own personal experience tells me that both can be true.

The existence of Mega-Millions confirms it.

freak80 says

The far-right narrative that "hard work guarantees success" is just a sneaky way of saying "anyone who is poor and/or isn't a millionaire is just a lazy bum." Of course some jerks (like Honest Abe) are willing to say it outright.

narrative backed up by real life success stories time and time again. this is not a far right

narrative but real stories of people who went out to strike it on their own.

from the times of early colonist to western settlers to modern day entrepreneurs.

they had enough and they packed their stuff for find a better life....

thomaswong.1986 says

New Renter says

Why indeed? Just curious have you ever been there?

And yes as you yourself point out it does host at least half of CERN. As far as high energy physics goes France is indeed the beacon of Tech.

II

what is the internet but collection of Semiconductors, Storage and Software products we been doing for some years prior.. without all the tools its all trivial for France ...

I'm not sure what you are getting at here, that without our inventing semiconductors, storage and software France would have nothing? I suppose if you take it back far enough we would have nothing had France not come to our aid in our revolution. We also would have much less had France not sold us half our country for a pittance.

we certainly should be doing more with nuclear programs... but the tree huggers
have other ideas...

Glad we agree on that point. I will also point out Marseilles has the global HQ of Eurocopter, Airbus HQ in Toulouse, Renault, PSA Peugeot, Michelin all French. Hell even the most high tech car in the world, the Bugatti Veryon is made in France.

Go there sometime, bring the family, you'll like it.

thomaswong.1986 says

freak80 says

The far-right narrative that "hard work guarantees success" is just a sneaky way of saying "anyone who is poor and/or isn't a millionaire is just a lazy bum." Of course some jerks (like Honest Abe) are willing to say it outright.

narrative backed up by real life success stories time and time again. this is not a far right

narrative but real stories of people who went out to strike it on their own.

from the times of early colonist to western settlers to modern day entrepreneurs.

they had enough and they packed their stuff for find a better life....

And died in droves. Yep, sounds like a good ol time!

New Renter says

And died in droves. Yep, sounds like a good ol time!

LOL... myth.. what are you doing in San Jose.. how did you get here.. how did others
get here... ?

New Renter says

I'm not sure what you are getting at here, that without our inventing semiconductors, storage and software France would have nothing?

you cant have the Internet with out the 3 high tech products above(Semi, storage, SW)
Cant be done without it..!

New Renter says

Glad we agree on that point. I will also point out Marsilles has the global HQ of Eurocopter, Airbus HQ in Toulouse, Renault, PSA Peugeot, Michelin all French. Hell even the most high tech car in the world, the Bugatti Veryon is made in France.

yes.. they did very well in many different industries.. its just Semi/Storage/SW wasnt their thing.
they had that Minitel .. that was an advancement for sure.. so what went wrong ?