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Union thugs force more jobs out of CA
2014 Oct 23, 11:52pm 3,397 views 23 comments
by zzyzzx follow (9)
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tatupu70
2014 Oct 23, 11:56pm
Or more appropriately titled, "Management greed forces jobs to more desperate areas"
zzyzzx
2014 Oct 23, 11:59pm
Or more appropriately titled, "Management greed forces jobs to more desperate areas"
The people on their AZ plant seem to find the wages and benefits acceptable.
tatupu70
2014 Oct 24, 12:05am
The people on their AZ plant seem to find the wages and benefits acceptable
Did you ask them?
Like I said--more desperate areas are happy to have any job. We're at a point where people are working for free just to get experience in the hope that it will help sometime in the future. The value of labor is trending to zero.
And you think that is a good thing.
zzyzzx
2014 Oct 24, 12:14am
Did you ask them?
Did you ask job seekers in CA near this plant if the wages and benefits being offered are acceptable? I didn't think so. Union didn't either. They only care about getting their cut.
tatupu70
2014 Oct 24, 12:29am
Did you ask job seekers in CA near this plant if the wages and benefits being offered are acceptable? I didn't think so.
That's the point. With the current economy--capital and business has the upper hand so of course people will take whatever scraps that business gives them. The value of labor is going to zero.
As a society, I wouldn't think that's something we should be promoting.
Union didn't either. They only care about getting their cut.
There are some unions that are better than others, just like businesses. But, in general, unions care about getting their members better wages and benefits. Because we all know that, left on their own, owners would give workers as little as possible....
Because we all know that, left on their own, owners would give workers as little as possible....
This is why I have changed my mind about raising minimum wage. Unions are too driven by their own greedy ways, so let's solve the issue you mention by raising minimum wage instead for workers 18 years or older.
Strategist
2014 Oct 24, 12:56am
Or more appropriately titled, "Management greed forces jobs to more desperate areas"
The subject heading as it stands now is perfect.
"Union thugs force more jobs out of CA"
The people on their AZ plant seem to find the wages and benefits acceptable
Did you ask them?
Like I said--more desperate areas are happy to have any job. We're at a point where people are working for free just to get experience in the hope that it will help sometime in the future. The value of labor is trending to zero.
And you think that is a good thing.
For the 300 people who could be working, wages certainly went to Zero. The Mafia Extortionists must get their pond of flesh.
There are some unions that are better than others, just like businesses. But, in general, unions care about getting their members better wages and benefits. Because we all know that, left on their own, owners would give workers as little as possible....
Is that a crime? When you buy a car don't you want to pay as little as possible? When you fill up with gas don't you want to pay as little as possible? It's called "market price"
tatupu70
2014 Oct 24, 1:05am
Is that a crime? When you buy a car don't you want to pay as little as possible? When you fill up with gas don't you want to pay as little as possible? It's called "market price"
Well, no, it's not currently against the law as long as you meet the minimum wage. Don't you see how this ends, however? When the value of labor is zero??
Are you really so shortsighted?
tatupu70
2014 Oct 24, 1:06am
The Mafia Extortionists must get their pond of flesh.
Just curious. A corporation that pays a non-livable wage with next to no benefits is fine. But a union that fights to get workers more money is an extortionist?
indigenous
2014 Oct 24, 1:11am
Brilliant...
Union organizers are awful close in color to community organizers, really just subversives looking to line their pockets.
Strategist
2014 Oct 24, 1:19am
The Mafia Extortionists must get their pond of flesh.
Just curious. A corporation that pays a non-livable wage with next to no benefits is fine. But a union that fights to get workers more money is an extortionist?
It certainly is extortion. The union thugs are only interested in their cut. They could give a damn for others. They just brought the value of 300 jobs to Zero.
And who are the union thugs that make $500,000, to tell others what living wages are?
How many more "Twinkies" are these useless thugs gonna create?
Strategist
2014 Oct 24, 1:22am
Brilliant...
Union organizers are awful close in color to community organizers, really just subversives looking to line their pockets.
And a lot more lazy. They have nothing to do but snore at their desk, while workers slog it out in the mud.
tatupu70
2014 Oct 24, 1:28am
It certainly is extortion. The union thugs are only interested in their cut. They could give a damn for others. They just brought the value of 300 jobs to Zero.
And who are the union thugs that make $500,000, to tell others what living wages are?
How many more "Twinkies" are these useless thugs gonna create?
lol--wow, you really are sucking down the propaganda aren't you?
The fact that you quote the Hostess case as support for a theory that unions are to blame just shows your lack of understanding.
Shaman
2014 Oct 24, 1:28am
Usually I'm defending the union, but this action is unsupportable. Bringing bullshit environmental suits to slow or halt job creating activities is just low, and a disservice to the community. California environmental lawyers do not need any more bribe money.
It sounds like the company wanted a chance to do right by its workers from the start, but the union officers were more interested in getting new dues-paying members. Maybe the workers would have voted to organize anyway, as is their right. But holding construction hostage to the evil Enviro lobby is just obscene.
tatupu70
2014 Oct 24, 1:32am
Usually I'm defending the union, but this action is unsupportable
I actually tend to agree with you, the only caveat being that we're getting only the Fox news side of the story.
Strategist
2014 Oct 24, 1:32am
It certainly is extortion. The union thugs are only interested in their cut. They could give a damn for others. They just brought the value of 300 jobs to Zero.
And who are the union thugs that make $500,000, to tell others what living wages are?
How many more "Twinkies" are these useless thugs gonna create?
lol--wow, you really are sucking down the propaganda aren't you?
The fact that you quote the Hostess case as support for a theory that unions are to blame just shows your lack of understanding.
Who said it's a theory?
Strategist
2014 Oct 24, 1:33am
Usually I'm defending the union, but this action is unsupportable
I actually tend to agree with you, the only caveat being that we're getting only the Fox news side of the story.
I'm glad you guys are finally seeing the light.
zzyzzx
2014 Oct 24, 1:36am
But a union that fights to get workers more money is an extortionist?
This situation is different in that there are no actual employees at the plant to potentially unionize. The decision to unionize or not needs to be made by the plant employees first. Liberals don't seem to believe in things like personal choices.
tatupu70
2014 Oct 24, 1:41am
Who said it's a theory?
You're right. I should have said-"your incorrect assumption."
SEIU also tried to barge into local Senior Homes run by the nations larger firms.
First try to get this public private sector pensions paid down. The same extortion allowed Pensions to be over the heads of all Californians, making us pause to buy new homes.
We need Manufacturing Jobs in CA. Manufacturing jobs that created wealth and tax revenues allows the Unions to thrive. Now that collectively jobs are outsourced, not only is the job loss the primary cause of the GINI Spread, but Huge Private/Public pension debt makes everyone in the high Greed Ponze even greedier.
Verily, Democrats are more Myopic even that the leaders in the last days of Rome!
But a union that fights to get workers more money is an extortionist?
This situation is different in that there are no actual employees at the plant to potentially unionize. The decision to unionize or not needs to be made by the plant employees first. Liberals don't seem to believe in things like personal choices.
Sir, Good Point.
Because of the large liabilities of Pensions, the Unions must do this prior to employees, even risking chasing off firms willing to invest.
Reason is, if you allow employees to be enslaved to have to pay back the current debt obligation of the Pensions, no person would want to be on the hook to work to pay this down.
As I stated, while the Democrats have been mano-a-mano with the Unions in a re-elections certainty fest over the past 2-3 decades, they true are more out of touch of reality than the leaders of Rome at the time of that empires decline.
Liberals don't seem to believe in things like personal choices.
Unfair - they certainly believe in choice. Just as long as you're choice matches theirs - then it's all good. Now wasn't that simple.
indigenous
2014 Oct 24, 4:00am
Liberals don't seem to believe in things like personal choices.
Unfair - they certainly believe in choice. Just as long as you're choice matches theirs - then it's all good. Now wasn't that simple.
Nicely said!
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/10/23/union-demands-send-japanese-firm-jobs-packing-from-california-town/
The California city of Palmdale was ready to roll out the red carpet this summer when a Japanese company agreed to build a $60 million factory on a city-owned, vacant parcel on the southwest side of town -- but now the company is taking its project out of state and critics say union greed is to blame.
As many as 300 people were slated to work at the 400,000-square-foot plant, painting and wiring light rail cars under a huge contract with the Los Angeles Metropolitan Transportation Authority. It was a coup for Palmdale Mayor Jim Ledford, and a plan that seemed to suit Kinkisharyo International, which last year moved its U.S. headquarters from Boston to El Segundo, Calif.
"I believe this is just the beginning of a manufacturing renaissance here in the Antelope Valley,” crowed Ledford in June.
“We've been waiting for this day for a long time,” added Palmdale Economic Development Director Dave Walter. “So many people and organizations played huge roles in making this a reality."
But a newly formed environmental group -- which critics say is a front for a local union -- had other ideas.
The "Antelope Valley Residents for Responsible Development," a group backed by the International Brotherhood Workers Union Local 11, produced a 588-page appeal claiming that construction of the proposed factory would violate state environmental laws, by, among other things, kicking up spores. What the union really wanted, according to Kinkisharyo officials, was clearance to organize the plant without any interference from the company. When Kinkisharyo officials balked, the project suddenly became a potential environmental hazard.
“They are using California's environmental laws as a pretense to put leverage on the company to get what they want,” Kinkisharyo spokesman Coby King told FoxNews.com. “It's unfortunate when groups that don't care about the well-being of the environment use the laws to delay, and even kill, good business development.”
Kinkisharyo, the El Segundo-based U.S. subsidiary of Kinki Sharyo Co., is currently assembling 78 light rail cars for Metro, with delivery of the first car expected this month. The company has exercised an option to build an additional 97 cars under a 10-year, $891 million contract with the MTA. For now, the company is doing the work from a hangar in Palmdale. But after delays the company has said have cost it $2 million, Kinkisharyo is looking out of state for a site to build its plant.
“The company is disappointed," King said. "They would have liked to stay in Palmdale.”
The standoff began shortly after the June announcement, when Local 11 officials sought a so-called card check agreement, where a company accepts the union if a majority of workers sign authorization cards. Absent such an agreement, the National Labor Relations Board would authorize a secret ballot during an organizing campaign the company would be free to oppose. The company said no thanks.
"We offer good salaries and good benefits, and we've never had a labor issue," Donald Boss, Kinkisharyo's general manager of program management, told The Los Angeles Times. "If our employees want to organize, they can. But we aren't going to organize for them."
Kinkisharyo officials say that's when the environmental issues suddenly arose. The complaint alleged Kinkisharyo did not secure proper water rights and that the project could spread spores that carry valley fever.
"The union claims are not truly about the environment, they are about trying to force union representation on the plant," said Gary Toebben, president and CEO of the Los Angeles Area Chamber of Commerce.
A union spokeswoman denied that the environmental concerns were motivated by the company's opposition to its efforts to organize workers..
“That's absolutely not the case,” said Elizabeth Brennen, of IBEW Local 11 said to FoxNews.com. “Obviously union support is important, but so are the environmental concerns.
“Water rights are a serious issue that needs to be addressed,” she said.
Ledford feels the union's efforts are letting a rare opportunity to create jobs and increase tax revenues slip away in a depressed area that still faces double-digit unemployment.
“We've played by the rules," Ledford told FoxNew.som. "It's just not right. Their game is to delay to get their way.
“I just want to get my people back to work,” he said. “We should be working together to retain, instead of bleeding, jobs.”
In what may have been a last-ditch effort to stay in Palmdale, Kinkisharyo proposed renovating the hangar it is currently using, Ledford said. But the union-backed environmental group again challenged the plan and the company has already begun an out-of-state search, saying an appeal of the union-backed complaint would be too costly.
"We are looking at some out of state options," King told FoxNews.com. "West of the Mississippi."
#environment