patrick.net

sbh says

How 'bout the homeowner who's in arrears on a robosigned mortgage, got screwed by the bank and holes up in the house demanding the MERS documents? Dog comes by and they won't let him in. He breaks down the door and the family runs out the back. They're all gonna die, right? You're cool with that?

Nope. I would shoot "Dog" if he killed them.

sbh says

C'mon, Strat, do you really need over 15 minutes to put the smack down on such criminals? You ain't dissin' the Dog, are ya bro? He da man in yo worl, fer real? How 'bout da biatch dat slaps Dog when he come to serve on her welfare fraud? Gib da bitch da AK, ya know?

I was on the other thread, honest.

sbh says

C'mon, Strat, do you really need over 15 minutes to put the smack down on such criminals? You ain't dissin' the Dog, are ya bro? He da man in yo worl, fer real? How 'bout da biatch dat slaps Dog when he come to serve on her welfare fraud? Gib da bitch da AK, ya know?

I don't watch "Dog"
But let me help you.
If you have a child rapist and murderer who just snatched a 4 year old girl and was about to drive off with her, should he be shot in the back at that time?

sbh says

He breaks down the door and the family runs out the back. They're all gonna die, right?

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or

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There are rules of engagement for the police. In general, they can't shoot a fleeing person unless he poses an extreme risk to others, or he is black. Now I suppose an extreme risk could be defined to include having dangerous ideas or an anti-central government ideology.

sbh says

Strategist says

But let me help you.

You do that by not running away. People get shot for that in your world.

So should that child rapist be shot in the back? You are not answering a direct question.
How about Osama Bin Laden? He was unarmed when he was shot. Was that the right thing to do?

Blurtman says

There are rules of engagement for the police. In general, they can't shoot a fleeing person unless he poses an extreme risk to others, or he is black. Now I suppose an extreme risk could be defined to include having dangerous ideas or an anti-central government ideology.

Ha ha ha."or he is black" very funny.

sbh says

A bad lady trespasses and gets some cans from a dumpster and runs from the cops. One shot or two? I mean, if you're going to quibble about cost you have to have a definitive position on that one, right?

Zero shots. Now how about answering my questions?

Personally, flamethrowers with a hair trigger are the solutions of choice here on the compound. That and judicious use of trip wire explosives.

sbh says

Important questions and their answers require specificity. Is the rapist about to drive off with her to the police station in order to surrender? Is he about to drive off in order to return her to her home and then kill himself? Is he about to drive off to the Catholic church where he works so he can give a sermon and trade her to a Republican parishioner for a more suitable boy?

If he is driving off in order to further his crimes he poses a violent threat to another human being and he should be apprehended in an ever escalating effort by police the effort by whom is determined by the responses to it by the perpetrator.. They shouldn't immediately kill him if they have other options. I realize this is just too much nuance and judgement for you, but thankfully, you don't have a gun and a badge.

You did no give me a honest answer like I did. Just a lot of

sbh says

Strategist says

How about Osama Bin Laden? He was unarmed when he was shot. Was that the right thing to do?

Now this is an interesting question that will require of you even more nuance.

You did it again. More

Here are the answers:
The first one. Yes, he should be shot instantly. A known child molester that snatches a girl is not taking her to the Church.
On Bin Laden. No, he should not have been shot right away. I want to see him captured, questioned, tortured and fed to hungry pigs.
I would want the child molester tortured too, but the welfare of a 4 year old takes precedence.

sbh says

Try as you will to appear otherwise, you are ruled by opinion and not by principle. If you are for freedom of speech, you are for freedom of speech everywhere for everyone.

There is freedom speech, and there is freedom of speech.
You cannot yell "fire" in a crowded theater.

sbh says

If you proceed from principle the principle applies universally. You proceed from personal opinion and a weak mind ruled by emotion. This is why Dan eats your lunch, and why you hate him for it.

LOL. That is your opinion. I most certainly do not hate him. I like him. He is amusing, and kicking him around is so much fun. I like you just as much for the same reason.

sbh says

Try, though: what principle exonerates the bag lady but condemns the tagger? Can you undertake that?

I think you need help here. To you the tagger who is a child molester is no different than the bag lady who forgot to pay her electricity bill.
Big difference you know. I would shoot the tagger, and tip the bag lady.

sbh says

All that separates you from terrorists and criminals is a difference of personal opinion, and on that slim difference you are willing to base law?

Gosh. Terrorists cut off innocent peoples heads, while I got a parking ticket 7 years ago. And you say that is a slim difference.

sbh says

You claim the human rights of Americans, but not of the humans that hate Americans.

I have no intention of supporting the human rights of people who want to kill our children. Absolutely none.

The Free Speech Movement at Berkeley ran into this issue in '64.

Some proto-hippie clown from NY showed up one day at the Free Speech tables with a sign, saying one thing:

"FUCK".

Some frat bro didn't like that, and down the rabbit hole the entire Free Speech Movement went.

"Well, we meant 'free' . . . but not that free!"

What is hateful to thee, do not unto thy fellowman;
this is the whole Torah. The rest is but commentary.

Rabbi Hillel (d. 10 AD)

HydroCabron says

P N Dr Lo R says

The Muslims didn't anticipate who they'd tangled with until they met Bubba in Texas. Probably a far cry from Seattle or Portland or Boston

The cops shot these guys. Seattle, Portland and Boston all have police forces.

The morbidly obese NRA members in Texas were busy waving weapons around at Hardee's, scaring the piss out of soccer moms while gumming up their AR-15s with ranch dressing. They were unable to pry their massive bellies out of the booth in time.

Fort Hood is also in Texas, and it's an army base, but they've seen 17 dead in two separate shooting incidents since 2009. I would never recommend undertaking anything like that anywhere, but it reminds me of a guy who started shooting at SFPD: the last mistake he ever made, but at least he was the only fatality.

HydroCabron says

The cops shot these guys. Seattle, Portland and Boston all have police forces.

Yes but these police forces are out doing crosswalk stings and perhaps more like sociology majors with guns.

We have a situation where people have found a reason to murder because of where you live, your beliefs, what type of shoe you where and all the crazy hype that went on prior to the rule of law in France. The people who went thru this have more of a sense of liberty and egalitarianism.

curious2 says

Fort Hood is also in Texas, and it's an army base, but they've seen 17 dead in two separate shooting incidents since 2009

It's almost as if these generalizations of "Seattle is all liberal fruits - would try to sing Kumbaya with the terrorists" vs "Texas wouldn't stand for that shit - they'd be gunned down the second they pulled the AK out of their turban" aren't really true.

The only public incident I can think of - I'm sure there are others, but this is the only one which comes to mind - in which an armed citizen packing made a big difference, was the Gabby Giffords shooting. I don't have a problem with CCW but, as a friend who carries once said, "A gun under your jacket all day is a bulging, sweaty obstacle, and yet another thing to put on and take off."

curious2 says

Fort Hood is also in Texas, and it's an army base, but they've seen 17 dead in two separate shooting incidents since 2009.

I believe soldiers are not allowed to carry guns on base. So they were pretty much sitting ducks.

HydroCabron says

"A gun under your jacket all day is a bulging, sweaty obstacle, and yet another thing to put on and take off."

And apparently even more uncomfortable in a bra:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2015/02/18/woman-kills-self-adjusting-bra-holster/23640143/

I conceal carry a handgun everyday in a IWB holster. I barely notice it. It's part of my daily carry items; car keys, iPhone, watch, knife, wallet, and a Glock 19.