patrick.net

and the only way to fix this is with a gay wedding cake with solar panel icing served in an elementary school transgener bathroom by professional sensitivity trained personal.

Or perhaps a carbon tax.

But thank you for demonstrating why conservatives are dumb fucks. Managing the world's environment wisely is an engineering issue, not a cowboy vs. hippie culture war. The fact that conservatives make it into a culture war is why they should have no input on the matter.

Dan8267 says

The fact that conservatives make it into a culture war is why they should have no input on the matter.

If I have to bake the cake, you will get my input.

Call it Crazy says

1. That chart shows a downward trend.
2. Volume, not thickness, is a better measurement of arctic ice as thickness varies greatly.
3. Piomas shows the arctic ice volume is at its lowest level in recorded history
4. Piomas data shows the arctic is rapidly losing ice.

https://www.GetB-xs9D_A

5. American Geophysical Union (AGU) confirms this.

https://www.EkXXPKnlmlg

Call it Crazy says

Dan8267 says

Volume, not thickness, is a better measurement of arctic ice

Notice the current chart of "Volume"? Which direction is it going the last three years?

*

You are kidding right? Do the words trend line mean anything at all to you?

if i have to buy health insurance, you will get my input

CaptainShuddup says

Dan8267 says

The fact that conservatives make it into a culture war is why they should have no input on the matter.

If I have to bake the cake, you will get my input.

if i have to travel the world telling everyone how guilty america is while watching iran construct an extinction level event you will get my input.

not if you're a day trader...

bob2356 says

You are kidding right? Do the words trend line mean anything at all to you?

https://www.C8w5_t7r6lw

Moronic climate change deniers are giving us white men a bad name.

When it comes to climate change denial, not all human beings are created equal. As a recent study shows, conservative white males are less likely to believe in climate change.

To understand why there is a trend amongst conservative white males, the Gallup data was cross-examined with research about the "white male effect" -- the idea that white males were either more accepting of risk or less risk averse than the rest of the public.

The white male effect could stem from the notion that, historically, white males have faced fewer obstacles in life, said McCright. But another school of thought sees the adoption of risk tied to personal values. "It has to do with their identity as an in-group," he said. "Something that would challenge the status quo is something [conservative white males] want to shun."

McCright says, up to 40 percent of all white males in the study sample believe in hierarchy, are more trusting of authority and are more conservative. Conservative white males' motivation to ignore a certain risk -- the risk of climate change in this case -- therefore, has to do with defending the status of their identity tied to the white male establishment.

When you base your acceptance of scientific fact on your gender and ethnic group, you're a freaking moron. So stop making white men look like idiots, conservatives. Denying man-made climate change today is as stupid as claiming the Earth is flat. You really look that dumb to the other 90% of the world.

Kill the people! Kill them ALL!

Or perhaps a carbon tax

----------------

Its bad ideas such as this, that prohibit problems from being solved.

And it's always the same. Ignore the root cause, attack a symptom, usaully with a tax. Then wonder why there isn't widespread support

Problem - Income/wealth inequality

Solution - higher taxes on income

Problem - pollution adversely affecting our environment/planet

Solution - carbon tax

Problem- Standard American Diet based on usfedgov bad information (the food pyramid), results in malnutrition and obesity, along with the majority of reasons why people are perpetually sick and wasting away the majority of our health care resources, and ever increasing costs with no end in sight.

Solution - force people to pay a tax to private health insurance corporations, or a fine to the IRS

There's a theme here, and if dem voters were so much smarter than repubtards, theyd have a better track record. Instead, they rally behind these non-solutions to problems, and what we get in return is another layer of complexity, compounding the problem they claim to want to solve

errc says

And it's always the same. Ignore the root cause, attack a symptom, usaully with a tax. Then wonder why there isn't widespread support

Problem - Income/wealth inequality

Solution - higher taxes on income

While I agree that free trade deals have been horribly damaging to the US economy, I think it's inevitable that we must come up with some sort of redistributive method. Even without foreign competition, machines will eventually displace labor, driving labor costs down and increasing inequality. Capital returns will be high while return on labor will be low. Progressive taxation is a valid method, though far from the only method. What would you call the root cause and how would you address that cause?

Call it Crazy says

Dan8267 says

which clearly shown a very strong downward trend.

right until it doesn't.... like it did in the early 80's...

No, you mathematically illiterate dumbass, even the 1980s fits in the overall downward trend. You just can't read a graph, which is not surprising given how Fox News deliberately fucks up graphs.

https://www.OlZx_whzem0

https://www.w7EvBxRYNME

Yeah, if you narrow the range enough, say to two data points, you can force an upward trend, but that just makes you look like a cherry-picking idiot.

Once again, CIC demonstrates both the stupidity and dishonesty of conservatives. Again, conservative white males need to shut the fuck up because their making all white males look like idiots and we're not.

errc says

Ignore the root cause, attack a symptom, usaully with a tax.

Carbon dioxide and other greenhouse pollutants are the root cause. Climate change is the symptom. So it makes sense to have pollution taxes, including carbon taxes and to use the revenue from those taxes to clean up the pollution. The amount of the tax should be whatever it takes to clean the pollution.

That's a free market solution. The market, not the players, is free to react and efficiently allocate resources. If the tax makes coal too expensive, then coal has always been too expensive, and only through the form of theft called "cost shifting" has a distorted market been able to run coal power plants. An efficient, non-distorted market would determine that coal is not worth burning because the real total cost is greater than the benefits.

Now, if you want to argue there is a more fundamental cause of climate change than pollution, feel free to do so. Pollution is the result of bad economics, but as far as the environmental degradation is concerned, it is the primary cause. Ultimately, if you wanted to, you could trace every problem back to the Big Bang. No Big Bang, no Earth, no humans, no problems. I think that's going a bit too far though.

errc says

Problem - Income/wealth inequality

Solution - higher taxes on income

On that I agree. The real problem is the owner class exploiting and overtaxing the worker / wealth-producing class. The real solution is a different economic model that rewards productivity rather than bargaining power.

Dan8267 says

The real solution is a different economic model that rewards productivity rather than bargaining power.

yeay, we agree all around.

Georgists did not propose income taxes, they proposed title taxes. You want title to "your" land, pay the people you're dispossessing thereby.

You extract resource wealth out of the land, pay the severance taxes of that taking.

if we did just these two things, we'd have a much more balanced economy, more 'makers' and fewer 'takers'.

In number the rent-seeking uberwealthy are of course a tiny minority, but their bootprint on the paycheck economy is immense, since housing, healthcare, and energy are dominant life expenses everyone faces if they desire to have a standard of living above that of our cavemen ancestors.

It's these multi-trillion rent flows out of the paycheck -- 'maker' -- economy that is causing most of the economic woe.

The trade deficit is substantial -- $500B/yr -- but only a fraction (1/4) of the parasitical "1%" take.

Our nation's $2T in annual corporate profits looks to be another pole in the imbalance tent forming.

http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/graph/?g=1bb4

shows how corporate profits used to be $2000 per capita in the 80s and 90s, now they're pushing $7000.

This is largely due to 'globalism' and the cost-savings and expanded markets corporate america is deriving thereby.

Corporate america is tapping global wealth flows, but this isn't trickling down to the workers, and when it does it just boosts housing costs dollar for dollar anyway since housing is so scarce in so many areas now.

Bellingham Bill says

Georgists did not propose income taxes, they proposed title taxes. You want title to "your" land, pay the people you're dispossessing thereby.

You extract resource wealth out of the land, pay the severance taxes of that taking.

Exactly. And it would be a far more efficient use of resources. Strange that all the so-called free market supporters aren't Georgists.

Bellingham Bill says

In number the rent-seeking uberwealthy are of course a tiny minority, but their bootprint on the paycheck economy is immense

Precisely because of their prior rent-seeking and locking everyone else out of the landlord business.

Call it Crazy says

And when you start your ice graph at 1979, what's that say about a narrow range? Did the polar ice caps only come into existence in 1979?

Man, you are grasping for straws. The polar caps have been stable for thousands of years until the 20th century when we started emitted enough pollution to have an effect on them. The graphs start at 1979 because that's when the specific data started, dummy. Before the melting became obvious, no one bothered to measure the year-over-year cap sizes.

However, glacier melting data goes back over a hundred years and confirms man made warming and melting.

Call it Crazy says

Any idea why CO2 is called a greenhouse gas?

Because it traps infrared radiation.

Call it Crazy says

You do know that CO2 has been injected into greenhouses to stimulate plant growth, right?

Everyone is well aware that plants breath in CO2 and produce O2. Dumb asses like you don't realize that we're releasing CO2 far quicker than plants can covert this CO2 back into oxygen. And no, we won't get lush forests by pumping more CO2 in the atmosphere. We'll get lush forests by banning logging and converting forests into farms.

Call it Crazy says

Did you know the optimum range in the greenhouse is 1200 - 1500 ppm?

Do you realize that every lie you tell, repeating what Fox News says, has been thoroughly debunked? Using high levels of CO2 inside a close environment like a greenhouse helps plants. Putting that much CO2 move than 30 feet about ground does nothing to help plants and would cause New York City to be underwater. Are you going to compensate everyone for trillions of dollars of lost real estate?

Call it Crazy says

Looks like we have quite a way to go before it becomes a "pollutant"!

Hardly. All of human civilization was made possible by having a very nice and comfortable environment. If we allow CO2 levels to rise to the levels you want, the U.S. economy alone would lose trillions of dollars per year. It's way more expensive to deal with the lost productivity of climate change than it is to simply stop polluting.

And pollution itself is a market distortion that goes against free market principles. It's shifting the cost of production from those buying the product to those not and therefore is a perverse subsidy. In fact, allowing society to bear the costs of pollution instead of the individual corporations is, by definition, SOCIALISM. It's just a bad form of socialism that no one wants except the parasites forcing it on society and the brain dead morons supporting them. So let's end socialism in the form of society spending ecological wealth to support the private profits of lazy, uninnovative corporations.

Dan8267 says

Yeah, if you narrow the range enough, say to two data points, you can force an upward trend, but that just makes you look like a cherry-picking idiot.

Once again, CIC demonstrates both the stupidity and dishonesty of conservatives. Again, conservative white males need to shut the fuck up because their making all white males look like idiots and we're not.

I watched those videos, well most of them anyway. I had to stop halfway into the second one as I was getting so annoyed. I found them almost as annoying as the rare occasions I have stumbled on a FOX editorial.

Dan there is nothing wrong with zooming in on the region of interest on a chart. As Mr. Pacman pointed out FOX clearly labeled the percentages and the axes so anyone with a sliver of a brain can correctly interpret the data if presented in a neutral manner. Now when those graphs were presented the presenter may have lead the audience to gloss over the data and focus on the relative magnitudes of the points and that is wrong; however Mr. Pacman did not show that happening.

Call it Crazy says

Dan8267 says

Putting that much CO2 move than 30 feet about ground does nothing to help plants

Sure it won't...

Again, you are not even applying common sense when reading graphs. Plants physically cannot absorb CO2 that's 10 miles above them. You have gross misunderstandings about how the world works.

Furthermore, having plant growth isn't going to help NYC when it's drowning.

Call it Crazy says

It's absolutely amazing how many people die of CO2 poisoning each year inside meeting rooms, schools and houses..

Straw Man argument. No one ever said that people were going to be poisoned by CO2. A pollution does not have to be toxic to be a pollution.

However, people along coastal cities will become refuges as the sea-level rises and people will die of Malaria as the mosquito line rises. But, I guess you don't give a shit about that.

Call it Crazy says

*

Do you realize that every lie you tell, repeating what Mother Jones says, has been thoroughly debunked?

Posting unsourced images is not debunking.

Dan8267 says

Putting that much CO2 move than 30 feet about ground does nothing to help plants and would cause New York City to be underwater. Are you going to compensate everyone for trillions of dollars of lost real estate?

https://www.K8E_zMLCRNg