patrick.net

Fort Wayne, always on the bleeding edge of current events. There's been a refugee crisis of epic proportions going on in Europe for a while now. Look how many current articles the word "refugees" brings up in the Guardian. http://www.theguardian.com/world/refugees

People are migrating out of Hungary to places like Germany which has a record number of new immigrants from all over. The 150K in your quote into Hungary a country of less than 10 million would be like us taking in 3 million (in one year).

I reckon Germany is the new moral leader in the world. Remember when that used to be us ? OR at least we thought it was ?

http://www.bloombergview.com/articles/2015-09-09/why-germany-welcomes-refugees

The phrase "German moral leadership" may sound strange to many ears, what with the role the country played in two world wars and more recent indignation over the tough stance it took towards Greece's debt woes. Yet anyone witnessing how the nation has responded to this summer's flood of refugees would have to acknowledge that leadership as a fact.

Why such a transformation has taken place is a tough question to answer, not least because as recently as the 1990s, Germany responded in a far less heroic way to the wave of refugees who fled the war in former Yugoslavia.

The political polarization in our country is the reason we can't be in that role anymore. It's probably the fault of the democrats right ? Because their incessant push for communism and an authoritarian state, forced the republicans to start blocking ALL liberal initiatives. Even if liberals embraced a policy previously embraced by conservatives, republicans have to reject it simply on the grounds that it might add to Obama's legacy or historically look like an accomplishment by democrats. And that would be terrible, because it could lead to democrats getting more power, turning us in to the Orwellian nightmare that the republicans are thankfully saving us from, by simultaneously increasing the power of money in politics while increasing the wealth of our plutocrats. God bless the republicans.

Thank goodness for republicans, saving us from the authoritarian hell that the democrats would bring us, if they were given half a chance.

Yet still another example of how Eastern Europeans are smarter then Western Europeans.

Look at the comments in the Guardian, probably the biggest left-wing paper in Britain, maybe the World, with an ancient history.

There's a few trolls, but by and large it's a Labour to Socialist commentariat. The majority is not in favor of more immigrants or refugees. They point out the refugees from Syria are:

A) Being created by US bomb strikes
B) Most had fled Turkey where they were safe from fighting and have been there for months, even a year (like the Drowned Kid's Family)
C) Are moving to Europe for Economic Reasons.

You'll also notice the Multi Kult wing has their usual "Haha, White Majoriry Soon!" sneer, showing they are just really anti-stale pale white male racists or rubes who think importing large numbers of Creationist Sunni Arabs is going to help them boost their currently 6-member Trotskyte / Maoist party's rolls.

But they're totally outnumbered by those opposed to more immigration. The leftists in Britain "Get It", by and large. They know importing immigrants is a plot to drive down wages, increase rents where there is already a housing shortage, and most importantly - Overwhelm the Welfare State to the Breaking Point and provide an excuse to kill it off.

marcus says

The political polarization in our country is the reason we can't be in that role anymore. It's probably the fault of the democrats right ? Because their incessant push for communism and an authoritarian state, forced the republicans to start blocking ALL liberal initiatives.

There is something I think we both agree on, unless you were being sarcastic. I do think it's the fault of Democratic leadership who brought us to this polarization, they were leaders and yet instead of leading they turned everything into partisan issue.

thunderlips11 says

The leftists in Britain "Get It", by and large. They know importing immigrants is a plot to drive down wages, increase rents where there is already a housing shortage, and most importantly - Overwhelm the Welfare State to the Breaking Point and provide an excuse to kill it off.

Same problems we have here. Democrats will want to ignore that, because those people are usually voting for D's. The moment immigrants vote for R's, both parties will switch their stances to their own benefit. Makes one wish that parties cared more for America instead of their own party's power preservation. But I reckon that ain't gonna happen any time soon.

It's the same crap the Neoliberal-captured Labour was all about. Claw back benefits of those laid off in the Financial Crisis they helped create by supporting Financial Deregulation, but extend them openly to brand-new, fresh-off-the-boat Immigrants warmly, easily, and generously.

Meanwhile privatize the Rails, bring in expensive contractors to "consult" with NHS and declare stretchers in Hospital Hallways to be "Beds", arrange minimum wage people to visit patient rooms and say "Hello" which qualifies as a "Service Visit every hour" by "Hospital Staff."

I saw a great quick three question interview with a 12 year old Syrian kid on the street. He basically said, stop the war in Syria, and the problem ends. Syrians want to stay in Syria. People are fleeing for their lives.

You think people willingly uproot their whole life, expose themselves to abuse, and risk the lives of themselves and family members, for a few extra dollars? These aren't "migrant" workers, or "illegals", these are refugees, in every sense of the word.

Anyone calling them migrants is wrong, and is doing so because they know calling them refugee would immediately force the extension of agreed upon international rights.

They are not entering Hungry illegally. They are displaced and seeking refuge. Europe better figure this out, as a group of countries, just like Angela Merkel has been saying. (I wish she could run for US president)

The decisions nations make with regards to this issue may haunt them for a long time to come. I'm looking at you too USA.

The main cause of the Syrian Refugee Crisis is the absurd bombing of Assad (and the Kurds by Turkey) under the guise of bombing ISIS and supporting the 5 members of the Democracy Groups that are genuine and not dissemblers to get training and weapons from the US and then defect to ISIS (remember the Sunni volunteers for the "Iraqi Army" that absconded on graduation day with pay and weeks of free US led combat training? Or the Sunni "Iraqi Army" units that spent most of their time harassing Shi'a civilians, many of whom drove over to ISIS in their US provided equipment? #BringBackOurHumvees)

However, most of them have been living in Turkey for months; The boy who drowned, his family had lived in safety in Turkey for a year. They had clothes and were fed, had cell phones.

This wave is economic migrant; a refugee is fleeing violence with no safe place to go. A refugee who finds a safe place in a neighboring country that welcomes him, but then leaves for Europe is an economic migrant.

In Germany, lone male migrants (the vast majority) are being met at the train and bus stations by Salafi/Wahabi groups, offering them help, shelter, and friendship.

FortWayne says

Makes one wish that parties cared more for America instead of their own party's power preservation. But I reckon that ain't gonna happen any time soon.

Actually if you are much older than 50, then you should remember a time when politicians did care more about America than their party's power.

But the thing is, democrats getting substantial power back, would mean an end to the lower tax policies (on high increments income and unearned income) that the wealthy have enjoyed for these same decades that polarization has been so high. Republicans had to in bring a lot of groups in order to win elections enough to keep these policies going. And to increase radically the influence of money in politics. And now they would have the gullible types (no offense) think that republicans keeping power is all about other reasons such as family values, and freedom from the authoritarian state (seat belts, bicycle helmets, allowing gay marriage, obamacare, - and all those other ways that democrats want to control us).

It's scary to think the lengths republicans will go to to retain power. Redistricting, blocking voting with voter IDs, and blocking everything an otherwise successful President does are only a few recent examples.

Oh, and yeah. I was being sarcastic.

thunderlips11 says

The leftists in Britain "Get It", by and large. They know importing immigrants is a plot to drive down wages, increase rents where there is already a housing shortage, and most importantly - Overwhelm the Welfare State to the Breaking Point and provide an excuse to kill it off.

It's a little bit more complicated than that. Native Europeans have a birth rate around 1.4 per woman. This would mean a dropping population and a problem of taxing the middle class enough to maintain even the current welfare state. Europe has an aging population for which healthcare and pensions have to be provided. Luckily for them they don't have the absurd military requirements that we do, but still if anything they benefit (maybe not immediately) from the population injection.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ageing_of_Europe

marcus says

It's a little bit more complicated than that. Native Europeans have a birth rate around 1.4 per woman

Good. The world needs less people. Europe is densely populated. This means declining rents, less unemployment, and more pay (remember how the Black Death increased the standard of living greatly for those who survived?)

marcus says

. This would mean a dropping population and a problem of taxing the middle class enough to maintain even the current welfare state.

Again, fewer people = cheaper rents, higher employment, more pay. Europe (esp. the UK) has the same problem the US does - corporations hiding money in Trusts and Bankster Special Jurisdictions, which can be eliminated with a stroke of a pen.

Europe has a high rate of able bodied Jobless. Many more Eastern Europeans would move West if they could. Declining Populations help destroy the Reserve Army of Labor the Wealthy depend on for "Labor Discipline" and to keep wages, unions, and housing supply low.

Finally, automation. I've everything is getting automated, we don't need more migrants. I won't even mention the Environmental Benefits, that will be lost if you replace a naturally dwindling population with new migrants with no knowledge of conservation, running their ACs and driving cars.

There is nothing wrong with a declining population, Europe is one of the most densely populated places on Earth, Several European countries are denser than Japan.

All population control groups are in favor of no immigration to Europe.

thunderlips11 says

There is nothing wrong with a declining population

Except that in modern times we've never had it. All modern capitalist economies are predicated on growth. Growing GDP, growing populations, growing tax revenues for governments.

thunderlips11 says

Again, fewer people = cheaper rents, higher employment, more pay

But before that, an extremely painful transition, for everyone, including the plutocrats that own all the corporations whose profits are based on an ever increasing number of consumers.

It's not that you're wrong. There will be a time when growth stops in the first world, or even populations decline. But now, with the baby boomers entering retirement would be a particularly bad time for it for everyone, not just the owners. And especially in some of the socialist countries of Europe that have to pay a lot of benefits to those seniors.

Stupid Europe,going along with the American warmongers starting shit in other countries without a Declaration of War.
EU! Suck It & Swallow! after your warmongers give you a bloody anal. That's what Americans are doing.

You might pay for your intrusions in foreign countries with attacks from terrorist hidden in the mass of immigrants.

marcus says

All modern capitalist economies are predicated on growth.

Hehehehe...

Your way of saying, "excellent point ?"

marcus says

Your way of saying, "excellent point ?"

You might say that. Let's say I'm highlighting what I think the key part of your point is.