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Dan8267 says

There will never be world peace as long as there is religion are human beings.

If you believe that, you are truly sad.

Decades ago, I read a seemingly simple but truly profound observation from international diplomacy. I cannot recall the exact words, so I cannot find it via search engines, so I will paraphrase: wars begin when the belligerants disagree as to which side is stronger, and end when a consensus has been reached.

As long as each side claims to have an omnipotent deity on its side, they can never reach consensus as to which side is stronger, and thus the war can never end.

If you ignore the fact people are born different, and that a certain percentage that don't have shit will always want your shit and will go to war to get it, then you are the ostrich with it's head in the sand.

Dan8267 says

If you believe that, you are truly sad.

curious2 says

wars begin when the belligerants disagree as to which side is stronger, and end when a consensus has been reached

Exactly, which is why world peace is achievable. War must not be profitable to anyone. This eliminates the rational causes of war. To eliminate the irrational causes of war, religion must be eliminated.

curious2 says

wars begin when the belligerants disagree as to which side is stronger, and end when a consensus has been reached.

By the way, that applies to the non-human animals on this planet as well. Take just about any two males in any species and if they are about equally sized, they will fight for dominance. If one is significantly larger than the other, neither will fight and the larger will be assumed the dominant. Nice to know humans have evolved so much past their animal origins.

War is always profitable to the victor, via land and wealth acquisition.
Your statement below is unachievable.

Dan8267 says

War must not be profitable to anyone. This eliminates the rational causes of war.

That's like saying imagine a world without song, love, joy, happeness or empathy.

Religion isn't that thing that the right does that drives the left nuts, in turn makes the left do things that drives the right nuts.
That's something that will go on, with or without Religion.

Religion is a part of your brain, it's part of your soul. Spirituality is part of your intellect.
Even for the most Zealot Secular or the most Pious Atheists. It manifests until them riling against other religions becomes their religion.

Radical Secularist is fanning the flames of radical Religions. AND I'm quite sure that's what Hillary, Obama and that Gang had in mind.
Now if they can just get some of that anger that they created in Syria here in the US. That will show those religious right hacks.

You guys would be the first targets they blow up. I promise you that with all I'm worth. EVERYTHING!!!

SoftShell says

War is always profitable to the victor, via land and wealth acquisition.

Empirically false. Europe used to go to war with itself all the time. Now due to extensive commerce and interconnected economies a war among western European nations is unthinkable. Britain would lose far more than it could ever possibly stand to gain by going to war with France or Spain.

You are stuck in archaic times.

Tenpoundbass says

That's like saying imagine a world without song, love, joy, happeness or empathy.

Think ISIS.

Tenpoundbass says

song, love, joy, happeness or empathy

are not in any way related to religion. They are biological traits that precede not only religion, but even human life.

Dan8267 says

Tenpoundbass says

song, love, joy, happeness or empathy

are not in any way related to religion. They are biological traits that precede not only religion, but even human life.

Hey Dan, you said something sensible. I hope you are feeling fine.

After 911, many radio stations banned the song Imagine by John Lennon.

http://freemuse.org/archives/5679

"In the wake of the devastating terror attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon one of the programme directors and senior executives of Clear Channel Communications, the largest radio network in the US, created a list of 160 “potentially inappropriate songs”, according to Mark Armstrong who wrote the article ‘ “Imagine” All the Inappropriate Songs’ one week after the attacks.

The list was said to have been distributed to the network’s 1,200 radio stations across the country with the suggestion that the songs should not be played on the air. While rumors initially floated that the list was a corporate mandate, or a cruel hoax, the radio conglomerate insisted that the programme director created and distributed the list on his own initiative."

You use a snapshot in time as the basis for your statement.
History teaches us there are times of profitable cooperation between countries, AKA "peace".
When 'profitable' eventually takes a step back, and it will, well..go read your history books to see what happens...
With global warming coming up to the plate, water resources will become the new "profit"..

Dan8267 says

SoftShell says

War is always profitable to the victor, via land and wealth acquisition.

Empirically false. Europe used to go to war with itself all the time. Now due to extensive commerce and interconnected economies a war among western European nations is unthinkable. Britain would lose far more than it could ever possibly stand to gain by going to war with France or Spain.

So what?
If England decides to invade france and wins, they lose all peacetime profit generated between the countries, but gain a shitload of land and resources that far outweigh any lost profit.
My statement below stands on it's own as an irrefutable fact, even if the cost of war initially outweighs any immediate gains. Over time the invading party's balance sheet will go into the green.

Dan8267 says

SoftShell says

War is always profitable to the victor, via land and wealth acquisition.

Empirically false. Europe used to go to war with itself all the time. Now due to extensive commerce and interconnected economies a war among western European nations is unthinkable

SoftShell says

So what?

If you don't understand the significance of European peace, then all of history is lost on you.

Dan you fail to understand genetic differences in people. Wars aren't about resources per se, they are about power. Some humans have an intense strong drive for power. And because of that positions of power almost always get occupied by these sorts of people. Who sometimes use religion as an instrument to exert or expnd that power.

Banning religion won't do anything to stop war.

And world peace will never be achieved short of a totalitarian world government, incidentally predicted by the Christian bible.

Oh, I understand the significance of it....I just believe nothing is forever...as history has shown time and again.
Why do you hate facts?

Dan8267 says

SoftShell says

So what?

If you don't understand the significance of European peace, then all of history is lost on you.

dodgerfanjohn says

Dan you fail to understand genetic differences in people. Wars aren't about resources per se, they are about power. Some humans have an intense strong drive for power.

They also have a strong desire to rape, yet...

Same for murder...

And yes, even in war...

Your statements are disproved by history.

dodgerfanjohn says

Banning religion won't do anything to stop war.

9/11 would not have happened without religion. Nor would have the Boston Marathon massacre. To separate religion from these events is disingenuous.

As I stated, ending religion is a necessary if not sufficient condition to ending war. Banning religion would dramatically decrease warfare and warfare related death and suffering.
dodgerfanjohn says

And world peace will never be achieved short of a totalitarian world government

Feel free to support that wild assertion with actual evidence. The peace in Europe did not arise from totalitarian government.

You post, however, does demonstrate one thing. Conservatives cannot even imagine a peaceful world. And that is why they should have absolutely no political power.

Lol son, you don't have a reasonable view of the dangers inherrent in the world and that makes it even more surprising that you don't support law enforcement.

If you didn't get incredibly emotional at times, I'd accuse your entire persona of being a troll.

dodgerfanjohn says

Lol son, you don't have a reasonable view of the dangers inherrent in the world and that makes it even more surprising that you don't support law enforcement.

An unsubstantive argument like that deserves and unsubstantive response: Lol, son, you don't have a reasonable view of how to solve the problem of dangers inherent in the world.

See, I can simply assert things as well. Shall we continue this conversation ad nauseam until the heat death of the universe without ever introducing evidence to support arguments? We can simply go back and forth with "yes, it is" and "no, it isn't" until one of us gets tired. I'll be using a bot.

I'm not here to entertain u while u sit at home on the govt. dole.

Dan8267 says

Conservatives cannot even imagine a peaceful world

I wonder why, since it has never existed nor will exist.

Dan8267 says

Just say no to the most dangerous and unregulated drug

"Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people"
Karl Marx, Paris, March, 1844--same sentiments over a century apart.

You can be spiritual without doing cartwheels down the revival tent isles. Or without casting your lot with a rabble of misguided Worshipers.
Worshiping is where you can separate spirituality and religion. Do you have to participate in the group exercise of spirituality to be spiritual and have a soul?
No I don't think so.

And anyone that thinks Spirituality is not a human emotion or trait, has no soul.

The problem is people have Religious issues.
No different than they have Anger Issues, Depression, Lack of seriousness or have "Laughing issues", people have intimacy issues, they have cognitive issues.
Radical fundamentalists have "RELIGIOUS ISSUES" whether they are radical religious zealots or radical anarchist atheists hell bent on a creating a religious war for their own personal entertainment.

There are serious "Religious Issues" at play here.

The healthiest way to nurture your soul, even if you think organized religion is a bunch of Hooey(Which it IS), is to respect that THEY have religion issues.

I'm not even sure if there's anyone you should be praying to or not. But that does not change that one must ofter reflect on their spirituality to keep their soul healthy and clean. And it is the best way to NOT develop Religion issues.

P N Dr Lo R says

I wonder why, since it has never existed nor will exist.

And that worldview is exactly why conservatives should hold no political power. Those who firmly believe that the nature state of man is war will ensure that war is a constant state when in power. Those who realize that war can be minimized, even eliminate, will strive for and achieve a more peaceful world. Where there is a will, there is a way.

Tenpoundbass says

And anyone that thinks Spirituality is not a human emotion or trait, has no soul.

And anyone who thinks that spirituality is real, also has no soul. The soul is a Bronzed Age myth that fools believe in order to avoid dealing with their own mortality. Being delusional might make you feel better, but it does not change reality. Once again, religion is like a drug. It gives a false high based on delusions. It's no better than crack, and those who follow it are essentially crackheads.