patrick.net

Quigley says

If you’re not Indian, your “caste” is effectively nothing, the lowest caste. That’s why almost nobody converts to Hinduism. Aside from having to believe in a bunch of silly looking gods, you’d be signing up to be the lowest class of Hindu society. Much better to be and stay a foreigner.

Oh and yes, uppity Indians of higher castes will back off if you call them out.

Low caste Indians tend to convert to Christianity in fair percentages. Lots of incentive!

Do you guys even know what is caste? Is your knowledge about caste from "english authors"? Its not low caste hindus who convert to christianity. It is uneducated hindus who convert to christianity. They are gullible and believe all the shit missionaries preach.

If you think christianity is so great convert a strong believer with arguments. Not a poor person with bribes.

Internet is full of people who are recording their conversion from idiotic christianity and islam to hinduism. Regarding your comment "uppity indians of higer caste". Dont be a dick. It is not higher caste, its higher class just like in any other part of world who behave idiotically.
It will be better if you understand the difference between "class" and "caste".

Patrick says

“How can you have a servant at home who keeps their own passport with them?

Patrick says

“If they run away and go back to their country, who will refund me?

Give them student loans and credit cards. After a while they will return and be obedient servants.

Quigley says

Low caste Indians tend to convert to Christianity in fair percentages. Lots of incentive!

They also converted to Islam in large numbers historically, resulting in Pakistan and a large Muslim population still in India.

Apologists for Islam do have the point that there is no caste system in Islam. A Pakistani friend pointed out that that's only in theory though, and that the Arabs of Saudi Arabia and neighboring countries have nothing but contempt for darker-skinned Muslims.

Disobedient slaves are a lot more fun because you get to punish them so much more.

indc says

Do you guys even know what is caste? Is your knowledge about caste from "english authors"? Its not low caste hindus who convert to christianity. It is uneducated hindus who convert to christianity. They are gullible and believe all the shit missionaries preach.

The real reason they convert is to be an equal, and not be treated as a low caste. Why would anyone want to live as an inferior being when they can live as an equal?
I think any low caste Hindu who does not convert is gullible to believe they are inferior and low caste. They should convert to any other religion, preferably to none, but definitely not to Islam.

Ceffer says

Disobedient slaves are a lot more fun because you get to punish them so much more.

HHmmmm. I'll trade you my disobedient slaves to your obedient ones. How's that?

someone else says

Quigley says

Low caste Indians tend to convert to Christianity in fair percentages. Lots of incentive!

They also converted to Islam in large numbers historically, resulting in Pakistan and a large Muslim population still in India.

Apologists for Islam do have the point that there is no caste system in Islam.

If you guys really want to talk about conversion. Find out how long it to took to convert europe to be christian continent. How long it took to convert whole of middle east to be muslim. How long it took to convert the americas to be christian.

Even after 1000yrs of invasions (800 yrs of islam and 200yrs rule of christians) India is still majority Hindu...

Now these invaders after looting for so many years are talking about their superior culture. Think of any other culture which can retain its roots even after constant seize for 1000yrs.

Strategist says

indc says

Do you guys even know what is caste? Is your knowledge about caste from "english authors"? Its not low caste hindus who convert to christianity. It is uneducated hindus who convert to christianity. They are gullible and believe all the shit missionaries preach.

The real reason they convert is to be an equal, and not be treated as a low caste. Why would anyone want to live as an inferior being when they can live as an equal?
I think any low caste Hindu who does not convert is gullible to believe they are inferior and low caste. They should convert to any other religion, preferably to none, but definitely not to Islam.

Do you think they are treated equally even after converting. Do you think african-american are treated equally after converting to christianity?

indc says

If you guys really want to talk about conversion. Find out how long it to took to convert europe to be christian continent. How long it took to convert whole of middle east to be muslim. How long it took to convert the americas to be christian.

Even after 1000yrs of invasions (800 yrs of islam and 200yrs rule of christians) India is still majority Hindu...

Now these invaders after looting for so many years are talking about their superior culture. Think of any other culture which can retain its roots even after constant seize for 1000yrs.

If you consider all of former India, which was 100% Hindus, and now barely 50% and declining, you must conclude Hinduism is on the decline. Don't get me wrong, Hinduism is a much better and a lot more peaceful than Islam. But facts are facts.

indc says

Do you think they are treated equally even after converting. Do you think african-american are treated equally after converting to christianity?

Are you saying they are better off being inferior under Hinduism? Really?
Christianity does treat them better. Buddhism treats them better.

Patrick says

The Kuwaiti was a domineering entitled bitch. So this article sounds quite familiar.

She may have been Palestinian. Many Kuwaitis really are Paleban.

Strategist says

indc says

Do you think they are treated equally even after converting. Do you think african-american are treated equally after converting to christianity?

Are you saying they are better off being inferior under Hinduism? Really?
Christianity does treat them better. Buddhism treats them better.

I just gave you an example how african-americans are treated even though they are christians. I think Buddhism will be better option and many educated lower caste people do that, I am ok with such educated conversion.
TwoScoopsOfWompWomp says

Prejudice against low caste Indians is wide-spread, Often the police don't investigate. If you ever hear some wisecracking Dem voting Indian blather about the KKK, note there hasn't been a KKK lynching in the US in many decades, but this is quite common, happening frequently in India:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2069220/Low-caste-boy-killed-high-caste-man.html

You found an 7 yr old article to make your point? if you see these news its mostly in impoverished states. Its like in US 1940-50s maybe. Once such places develop you will see less of such incidents.

Strategist says

Buddhism treats them better.

Quite a lot of low-caste Indians did became Buddhist:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Buddhism_in_India#Dalit_Buddhist_movement

Strategist says

former India, which was 100% Hindus, and now barely 50% and declining

Wikipedia has it at almost 80% Hindu:

79.8% Hinduism
14.2% Islam
2.3% Christianity
1.7% Sikhism
0.7% Buddhism
0.4% Jainism
0.9% others

rando says

Strategist says

former India, which was 100% Hindus, and now barely 50% and declining

Wikipedia has it at almost 80% Hindu:

79.8% Hinduism
14.2% Islam
2.3% Christianity
1.7% Sikhism
0.7% Buddhism
0.4% Jainism
0.9% others

Former India is supposed to be all of Afganistan,pakistan, bangladesh, tibet, myanmar and India. Now india is 50% of landmass compared to its previous self. I think Strategist is talking about that. Not the population of present India.

indc says

I am ok with such educated conversion.

Who the f are you to be telling other people which of their religious beliefs you are "ok" with? Please enroll this gentleman in remedial "America 101".

indc says

TwoScoopsOfWompWomp says

Prejudice against low caste Indians is wide-spread, Often the police don't investigate. If you ever hear some wisecracking Dem voting Indian blather about the KKK, note there hasn't been a KKK lynching in the US in many decades, but this is quite common, happening frequently in India:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2069220/Low-caste-boy-killed-high-caste-man.html

You found an 7 yr old article to make your point? if you see these news its mostly in impoverished states. Its like in US 1940-50s maybe. Once such places develop you will see less of such incidents.

Once they dump Hinduism, these places will develop. You really expect a society to develop when a large part of it's population is treated like inferiors?

indc says

Former India is supposed to be all of Afganistan,pakistan, bangladesh, tibet, myanmar and India. Now india is 50% of landmass compared to its previous self. I think Strategist is talking about that. Not the population of present India.

I am talking about the percent of Hindus that existed before vs today in the same geographical areas.
I would rather they remain Hindus than fucking Muslims, only because the world is better off with Hindus, than Muslims.

chinook06 says

indc says

I am ok with such educated conversion.

Who the f are you to be telling other people which of their religious beliefs you are "ok" with? Please enroll this gentleman in remedial "America 101".

I dont care about individual's right to religion. I care about mass conversion and the hatred they spew after conversion.

chinook06 says

indc says

I am ok with such educated conversion.

Who the f are you to be telling other people which of their religious beliefs you are "ok" with? Please enroll this gentleman in remedial "America 101".

He is giving his prejudiced opinion. Let the converts decide for themselves. If the lower caste is worse off as Indc implies by converting, let them say it. Not that I see anyone converting back to Hinduism to be a low caste.
The worst thing about anyone converting to a different religion is, you end up jumping from one sinking ship to another.

indc says

Who the f are you to be telling other people which of their religious beliefs you are "ok" with? Please enroll this gentleman in remedial "America 101".

I dont care about individual's right to religion.

That is pretty obvious.

indc says

I care about mass conversion and the hatred they spew after conversion.

If they didn't hate being inferior, they would not have converted to begin with. The way they have been treated, I'm not at all surprised.
By the way, I doubt if they care what you think.

Strategist says

indc says

TwoScoopsOfWompWomp says

Prejudice against low caste Indians is wide-spread, Often the police don't investigate. If you ever hear some wisecracking Dem voting Indian blather about the KKK, note there hasn't been a KKK lynching in the US in many decades, but this is quite common, happening frequently in India:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2069220/Low-caste-boy-killed-high-caste-man.html

You found an 7 yr old article to make your point? if you see these news its mostly in impoverished states. Its like in US 1940-50s maybe. Once such places develop you will see less of such incidents.

Once they dump Hinduism, these places will develop. You really expect a society to develop when a large ...

Dude, do you know the whole reality of India, or you just read western media about India's news? The new generation does not care about other's religion or caste. Its the older people who are like that. Just like the old racist people in US, they dont know nothing better. They just have to die.

Well you must be part of the older people who are like that based on your comments.


indc says

Once they dump Hinduism, these places will develop. You really expect a society to develop when a large ...

Dude, do you know the whole reality of India, or you just read western media about India's news? The new generation does not care about other's religion or caste. Its the older people who are like that. Just like the old racist people in US, they dont know nothing better. They just have to die.

indc says

I care about mass conversion and the hatred they spew after conversion.

Indc:
"I dont care about individual's right to religion."

Strategist says

Well you must be part of the older people who are like that based on your comments.



indc says

I care about mass conversion and the hatred they spew after conversion.

I don't care about what they think or do. I care that they start spewing shit after conversion. The problem is with abrahamic religions which want to spread using hatred.

They have concept of "my-way or high way"

Indc:
"I dont care about individual's right to religion."

I meant to say I dont care what an Individuals opinion about his/her religion.

indc says

I don't care about what they think or do. I care that they start spewing shit after conversion. The problem is with abrahamic religions which want to spread using hatred.

Really? I don't see any love by the so called superior borns, for the inferior borns.

indc says

They have concept of "my-way or high way"

And Hindus don't? Ever considered making everyone equal?
300 million Gods, and not one of them could prevent starvation. Not one of them stood up for equality. Not one spoke out against the caste system. I would normally never ask anyone to give up, but after 300 million Gods with no success? I think you really should give up.

Man, talk about fucked up religions.

Strategist says

indc says

I don't care about what they think or do. I care that they start spewing shit after conversion. The problem is with abrahamic religions which want to spread using hatred.

Really? I don't see any love by the so called superior borns, for the inferior borns.

indc says

They have concept of "my-way or high way"

And Hindus don't? Ever considered making everyone equal?
300 million Gods, and not one of them could prevent starvation. Not one of them stood up for equality. Not one spoke out against the caste system. I would normally never ask anyone to give up, but after 300 million Gods with no success? I think you really should give up.

Can you please tell me which GOD considers everyone equal? Are you equal to Hitler since you are both christians? Do you think all your kids are equal? They get same love from you? From your wife?
Hinduism says all are not equal based on their deeds. Hinduism considers everyone is part of GOD. so we dont have to be afraid of GOD. The caste devisions are mostly class devisions. If you want to understand it read about Hinduism from "Rajiv Malhotra".

indc says

Can you please tell me which GOD considers everyone equal? Are you equal to Hitler since you are both christians?

None. No God I know of considers everyone equal. All Gods are phony's. I am an atheist.

indc says

Hinduism says all are not equal based on their deeds. Hinduism considers everyone is part of GOD. so we dont have to be afraid of GOD. The caste devisions are mostly class devisions.

Really? What wrong deeds did a newborn born of a low caste ever do? Why is that baby and it's future generations deemed to be inferior for ever?
You will never win an argument by supporting primitive beliefs deemed immoral and against the law in this country. Even India made the caste system illegal, but as we can see, it still persists.

Strategist says

indc says

Can you please tell me which GOD considers everyone equal? Are you equal to Hitler since you are both christians?

None. No God I know of considers everyone equal. All Gods are phony's. I am an atheist.

indc says

Hinduism says all are not equal based on their deeds. Hinduism considers everyone is part of GOD. so we dont have to be afraid of GOD. The caste devisions are mostly class devisions.

Really? What wrong deeds did a newborn born of a low caste ever do? Why is that baby and it's future generations deemed to be inferior for ever?
You will never win an argument by supporting primitive beliefs deemed immoral and against the law in this country. Even India made the caste system illegal, but as we can see, it still persists.

Good that you are an atheist, I am an atheist too.
But only religion that recognizes atheism is hinduism. You and i will be killed in any other part of world except in India. In traditional hinduism nobody is born with their caste. They got their caste based on their qualities. Think harry-potter where hat decides where you belong. It became more hardend in recent 600yrs.

And dont worry about India's development. Its growing at 6 to 7 percent for past 20 yrs.

indc says

Good that you are an atheist, I am an atheist too.
But only religion that recognizes atheism is hinduism.

How is that possible with 300 million Gods? You must be talking about Buddhism. It has no God. It's the most peaceful of major religions.
Buddhism is an offshoot of Hinduism, but as I don't believe in reincarnation, I would make a rotten Buddhist.
I would admit, Hinduism is a much better religion than the Abrahamic religions. The worst part of Hinduism is the caste system, which comes close, but not close enough to slavery that Abrahamic religions endorsed.

Strategist says

indc says

Good that you are an atheist, I am an atheist too.
But only religion that recognizes atheism is hinduism.

How is that possible with 300 million Gods? You must be talking about Buddhism. It has no God. It's the most peaceful of major religions.
Buddhism is an offshoot of Hinduism, but as I don't believe in reincarnation, I would make a rotten Buddhist.
I would admit, Hinduism is a much better religion than the Abrahamic religions. The worst part of Hinduism is the caste system, which comes close, but not close enough to slavery that Abrahamic religions endorsed.

Like I was saying you are just commenting based on your perception. You should really understand the religion. And hinduism does not have 300 million gods. When someone says that we can tell they dont have any understanding of its concept. It has only 1 GOD, and there are 300 millions manifestations of this "GOD head".

Human beings are hierarchal creatures, and religion has always been an effective means of consolidating hierarchy based on particular mythologies of God and spirituality.
It seems that so called egaligarian Americans spend a lot of time entertaining themselves with dramas of British aristocracy, which has thousands of widgets designed to draw distinctions between people of different classes.

The caste system is interesting because it is both very old, very specific, very rigid and apparently very effective in assigning hierarchies and roles to the 'believers'. Whether one calls it 'inferior' or 'superior', members get specific roles with specific rights. That's not really that much different from any other religion, except there is more fine print and rigid glass ceilings.

I am not sure what 'caste' I would be assigned to in a Hindu society, but it probably wouldn't seem fair and wouldn't be flattering. Hierarchal social contracts aren't really designed to be fair, they are designed to create maximum order and predictability to religious, social, legal and political interactions, and to establish traditions that everybody understands.

someone else says

Quigley says

Low caste Indians tend to convert to Christianity in fair percentages. Lots of incentive!

They also converted to Islam in large numbers historically, resulting in Pakistan and a large Muslim population still in India.

Apologists for Islam do have the point that there is no caste system in Islam. A Pakistani friend pointed out that that's only in theory though, and that the Arabs of Saudi Arabia and neighboring countries have nothing but contempt for darker-skinned Muslims.

In late 90's I heard from a co-worker in middle-east that people from around Indian subcontinent, can not visit masks of locals, the mistake will result in almost death punishment. All brown skin Muslims are unteachable people, they all have to go to their own separate Masks.

Quigley says

If you’re not Indian, your “caste” is effectively nothing, the lowest caste. That’s why almost nobody converts to Hinduism. Aside from having to believe in a bunch of silly looking gods, you’d be signing up to be the lowest class of Hindu society. Much better to be and stay a foreigner.

Oh and yes, uppity Indians of higher castes will back off if you call them out.

Low caste Indians tend to convert to Christianity in fair percentages. Lots of incentive!

>Low caste Indians tend to convert to Christianity in fair percentages. Lots of incentive!
You are right, the incentives come from the people who are not converted yet.
In India, there is a ironclad "reservation system" for the "minorities" who are Christians and mostly Muslims.
"Constitution" guarantees the massive quotas for them in the universities and government jobs irrespective of their merit.
When I visited few Bayarea churches on (non religious) events, I saw pictures on display, some are from India.
Most of them are obese, from my experience, people of this type, I can tell they mostly never try to
look for jobs. They know that there is a great demand here for sad stories and photo oped sad looking pics.
and how to make it work for them. Its a win-win situation.

Religion is a by product of human evaluation, it/they served its purpose and now
fading fast with scientific knowledge and spreading through internet.
One may be less evil than the other (we know some are deadly), otherwise all religions effectively are evil (particularly God).

Strategist says

indc says

Do you guys even know what is caste? Is your knowledge about caste from "english authors"? Its not low caste hindus who convert to christianity. It is uneducated hindus who convert to christianity. They are gullible and believe all the shit missionaries preach.

The real reason they convert is to be an equal, and not be treated as a low caste. Why would anyone want to live as an inferior being when they can live as an equal?
I think any low caste Hindu who does not convert is gullible to believe they are inferior and low caste. They should convert to any other religion, preferably to none, but definitely not to Islam.

>preferably to none, but definitely not to Islam.
Of course no one will disagree.

indc says

Regarding your comment "uppity indians of higer caste". Dont be a dick. It is not higher caste, its higher class

This is the fundamental cultural divide between Americans and Indians. The Indian immigrants I’ve known have been universally obsessed with status and class, and their pursuit of such is annoying as fuck to native born Americans. They’re unabashedly interested in self promotion, self aggrandizement, and selfish agendas. They have to make sure everyone knows of their accomplishments and anyone who is famous they have some connection to or just pestered into doing a selfie with at a concert or speaking engagement.

To Americans this is LOW CLASS behavior.

To Indians, this is them trying to assert that they are high class. And in this, they fail.

Quigley says

indc says

Regarding your comment "uppity indians of higer caste". Dont be a dick. It is not higher caste, its higher class

This is the fundamental cultural divide between Americans and Indians. The Indian immigrants I’ve known have been universally obsessed with status and class, and their pursuit of such is annoying as fuck to native born Americans. They’re unabashedly interested in self promotion, self aggrandizement, and selfish agendas. They have to make sure everyone knows of their accomplishments and anyone who is famous they have some connection to or just pestered into doing a selfie with at a concert or speaking engagement.

To Americans this is LOW CLASS behavior.

To Indians, this is them trying to assert that they are high class. And in this, they fail.

I am not questioning your observation. I am questioning your use of terminology "caste". Its negative connotations is what I want you to understand. What you say is applicable to all asians(middle-east, east asia, south-asia) I think.

indc says

I am not questioning your observation. I am questioning your use of terminology "caste". Its negative connotations is what I want you to understand.

There is nothing positive about a primitive caste system that claims some people are born superior, and some are born inferior.
You are not assigned a caste based on deeds as you claim, but by birth. Fucking stupid religious nonsense.
You can put all the lipstick you want on a pig, it's still a pig.

indc says

Quigley says

If you’re not Indian, your “caste” is effectively nothing, the lowest caste. That’s why almost nobody converts to Hinduism. Aside from having to believe in a bunch of silly looking gods, you’d be signing up to be the lowest class of Hindu society. Much better to be and stay a foreigner.

Oh and yes, uppity Indians of higher castes will back off if you call them out.

Low caste Indians tend to convert to Christianity in fair percentages. Lots of incentive!

Do you guys even know what is caste? Is your knowledge about caste from "english authors"? Its not low caste hindus who convert to christianity. It is uneducated hindus who convert to christianity. They are gullible and believe all the shit missionaries preach.

If you think christianity is so great convert a strong believer with arguments. Not a poor person with bribes.

Internet is full of people who...

I don't think it's the same thing. I live in Princeton, and the rich white assholes just bitch and moan behind you while you are in line. The Indians will try to walk right in front of you like you don't exist.