patrick.net

Strategist says

Tesla isn't a car. It's a spaceship from the future.

This is sounding like my dad's geriatric DeLorean fans talking. And yes, those did look like spaceships which is why Doc Brown put his flux capacitor in one and the kid back in the 1950s thought there was an alien invasion.


bill says

I kinda agree with Warren Buffett when he says Apple should not buy TSLA. Warren is not always correct, but I believe him when he says everybody and his dog will make an electric car. Also, the self-driving car will mean that fewer cars are sold. One car will be able to serve 5 people. I don't own a car anymore. I use UBER and trains and busses and maybe I'll try a LIME (maybe NOT!). And, added hazard, you gotta realize Chinese competition will be fast and ferocious. SAIC BAIC BYD all have better financials than Tesla.

Buffet definitely sees the market for self-driving vehicles clearly. I'd even say that my experience, as an executive, is that that I don't enjoy driving and would rather be chauffeured from place to place while eating, drinking alcohol, reading, or listening to some music or lectures. And my company pays for my limo service. Eventually, the average person will be having a robotic livery service, shuffling him around all day, without having a huge bank.

Right now, Tesla's primary market penetration is for the luxury sports car demographic and in particular, the ones in west coast markets where the weather is warm and ppl like to show off their vehicles in the sun, much more that in the east, where there's snow/sleet/ice, and this massive multi-state daily gridlock between Boston MA and Richmond VA where charging stations regularly have ppl shouting obscenities at each other since no one has the time for a bay.

When want to be alone, I'd much rather drive my Accord, which is right now gathering dust in the basement garage (since I don't have a need it for it, for my daily routine), than be in a shouting match on i-95. I can always rent the Porsche for a joyride.


https://www.gothamdreamcars.com/exotic-car-rental

mell says

They need to turn consitently profitable soon without accounting gimmicks.

Exactly. He can't make money on the Model 3 at $50K - $60K, but he wants everyone to believe he'll be profitable with $35K Model 3s... because he'll make it up on volume, right Fanboys?

Strategist says

A very honest company founded by a man who is not human. He will go down in history as the man who destroyed Big Oil, and brought the Saudi Kings to their knees.

Where have I seen this type of FanBoy-ism.... Let me think.... Oh yeah, like this:

MrMagic says

Where have I seen this type of FanBoy-ism.... Let me think.... Oh yeah, like this:

Still, cellphone .... make that mobile computing, is a viable long term market, which isn't disappearing though it may evolve into clothes, eye wear, upholstery, etc, instead of a handheld device.

In contrast, a car is still just that, a mode of transportation. Ppl needs transportation tools, to get from point A to B, not an expensive toy.

And there's a huge difference between $1K and $50K for the average consumer.

Rin says

Still, cellphone .... make that mobile computing, is a viable long term market, which isn't disappearing though it may evolve into clothes, eye wear, upholstery, etc, instead of a handheld device.

That's true, but the original Apple fanboys felt it was worth it to pay DOUBLE for a iphone versus an Android..... Just because...

Rin says

In contrast, a car is still just that, a mode of transportation.

Exactly, but the Tesla fanboys think it's worth it to buy a Tesla versus a Volt (see my comparison with the iphone).

Rin says

And there's a huge difference between $1K and $50K for the average consumer.

and there's a huge difference between a $60K Model 3 and a $30K Volt, yet they both get you from Point A to B.

MrMagic says

Tesla still has over 3,300 Model 3 vehicles in its U.S. inventory,

I'll take one of these off Elon's hands today. But for no more than $35K USD.

MrMagic says

and there's a huge difference between a $60K Model 3 and a $30K Volt, yet they both get you from Point A to B.

And don't forget the $17K Corollas & Civics, which also get the job done, saving even more money for gas.

MrMagic says

pay DOUBLE for a iphone versus an Android

That's fashion statement stuff, like paying $400 vs $200 for a pair of shoes.

Rin says

MrMagic says

and there's a huge difference between a $60K Model 3 and a $30K Volt, yet they both get you from Point A to B.

And don't forget the $17K Corollas & Civics, which also get the job done, saving even more money for gas.

Absolutely... that $30K - $40K savings on the car purchase will pay for a hell of a lot of gas.... and you don't have to wait 8 hours to "fill" your tank when empty.

Rin says

That's fashion statement stuff, like paying $400 vs $200 for a pair of shoes.

Welcome to the world of Tesla owners!

CBOEtrader says

E-man says

Life is too short to make small bets - CEO of Soft Bank. ???

Survivorship bias.

This is a low resolution algorithm guaranteed to fail most people. You are correct though, for someone to go fron normal life savings to rich betting the farm on one risk exposure is a strategy. We have a pat.net contributor doing that w weed stocks now.

Low resolution algorithm or not depends on how we think. Our thinking is limited by our knowledge and our knowledge is limited by our understanding.

I had this convo with my wife. Here are 3 choices to go through life assuming we have 50 years after college:

1) Work hard for 10 years to set ourselves up financially. Then take it easy and enjoy life for the next 40 years.
2) Take a government job and work for 25-30 years and retire with a pension for another 20-25 years. In general, one would feel the pinch after a decade as the COLA would be lagging behind inflation.
3) Work for a private sector for 40 years and retire with less for the last 10 years of our lives unless we get lucky working for a unicorn company and hit it big with stock options.

We chose option 1. As I get deeper into this option, I realized that we are much more capable than we think we are. We just don't push ourselves hard enough. In fact, we don't know what we are capable of. My initial goal was to have a $2M real estate investment portfolio and let it grow over time. Then 2 years into it, I revised it to $5M as it feels so attainable. Then I met my partner and now we're having a $24M real estate portfolio together. We sat down and said we could easily 10x this number if we want to. The question is how hard do we want to work and at what cost? We're feeling a little overwhelm with our current holding and looking to hire a full-time handyman even though we have a full-time property manager.

If anyone asked me this question 5 years ago, I would have said it's crazy, but now it seems so doable. For this, I admire Elon Musk greatly. He could have retired after the sale of PayPal and enjoyed life with $170M. Instead, he took the money and plowed it into Space X and Tesla. The man is on a mission. His personal life has suffered due to his work ethics. For people to say this man is a con artist is just sad. If I have to make a bet between Elon vs. Someone else, I know where my bet would be.

MrMagic says

Rin says

That's fashion statement stuff, like paying $400 vs $200 for a pair of shoes.

Welcome to the world of Tesla owners!

Many of them really, are borrowing from their future earnings, by wasting it today. Most ppl can recover the temporary loss on overpaying for a pair of wing tipped Oxfords but nearly every Corolla owner makes out like a bandit in terms of gas and maintenance costs.

mell says

They need to turn consitently profitable soon without accounting gimmicks.

Accounting gimmicks? There are huge capital expenditures for building factories and supercharging stations across the country. To be profitable, the company just had to scale back its capital expenditures. Elon already said the company would stay profitable going forward so there's no reason not to believe the man. Watch Tesla will be profitable this 4th quarter again.

Rin says

Strategist says

Tesla isn't a car. It's a spaceship from the future.

This is sounding like my dad's geriatric DeLorean fans talking. And yes, those did look like spaceships which is why Doc Brown put his flux capacitor in one and the kid back in the 1950s thought there was an alien invasion.


bill says

I kinda agree with Warren Buffett when he says Apple should not buy TSLA. Warren is not always correct, but I believe him when he says everybody and his dog will make an electric car. Also, the self-driving car will mean that fewer cars are sold. One car will be able to serve 5 people. I don't own a car anymore. I use UBER and trains and busses and maybe I'll try a LIME (maybe NOT!). And, added hazard, you gotta realize Chinese competition will be fast and ferocious. SAIC BAIC BYD all have better financials than Tesla....

@Rin,

Thanks for the link. Ted Kennedy's wife rented an Aston Martin for a weekend to fulfill his dream? Wow....

A car is a lot more than taking a person from point A to point B. I don't want to be like one of those people who just rents an exotic car on a weekend. I want more than both. I want a car that not only takes me from point A to point B, but a car that I enjoy driving everyday, not just on the weekend. Tesla fits the bill. After 15 months of owning it, the car still puts a smile on my face every time I drive it. What say you @Strategist and @gsr?

CBOEtrader says

E-man says

Life is too short to make small bets - CEO of Soft Bank. ???

Survivorship bias.

This is a low resolution algorithm guaranteed to fail most people. You are correct though, for someone to go fron normal life savings to rich betting the farm on one risk exposure is a strategy.

Exactly. The problem is that the winners will always be the singled out story while nobody talks about the losers outnumbering the winners 1:10. I think big bets can work if the you're betting on something that is very likely to turn profitable and mostly debt free going forward, but this was a risky bet. Look at crypto, many put their life savings in it or rode from 500K to millions back to less than 200K. Still it is true that many of those success stories come from big bets while there are more wealth people who made the same amount or more in a "boring" way, but those are not stories people want to hear about.

MrMagic says

mell says

They need to turn consitently profitable soon without accounting gimmicks.

Exactly. He can't make money on the Model 3 at $50K - $60K, but he wants everyone to believe he'll be profitable with $35K Model 3s... because he'll make it up on volume, right Fanboys?

Yeah I think he should also be worried about competition, even if they initially swing to a profit. Porsche, Mercedes and others will catch up on a big scale.

E-man says

mell says

They need to turn consitently profitable soon without accounting gimmicks.

Accounting gimmicks? There are huge capital expenditures for building factories and supercharging stations across the country. To be profitable, the company just had to scale back its capital expenditures. Elon already said the company would stay profitable going forward so there's no reason not to believe the man. Watch Tesla will be profitable this 4th quarter again.

Just referring to last Q, which mainly were accounting gimmicks. Doesn't mean they cannot swing to profitability in a durable manner, but needs to be proven. In a way it already has been a success story as the stock went from $20 to $300+, so I'm not debating this. A lot of bigger investors never selling their shares helped them a lot. Going forward though will be a tough ride with all the competition they will be facing. Not betting on it, neither against it.

E-man says

A car is a lot more than taking a person from point A to point B.

I don't concur because I'm being driven around by livery service and thus, I have a lot more fun eating, drinking, & doing other stuff in my limo than in worrying about the road. Remember, we have bad weather around here, along with crazy drivers.

E-man says

I want more than both. I want a car that not only takes me from point A to point B, but a car that I enjoy driving everyday, not just on the weekend. Tesla fits the bill. After 15 months of owning it, the car still puts a smile on my face every time I drive it.

You said that you've finished working for a living so in effect, you've decided that your retirement is that of a "roadster" but personally, I'd rather be a roadie and be following around rock bands. But since rock died back in 2000, that option has gone with the wind.

Instead, I'll be 'olde' New England money and be driven around, enjoying fine foods, workshops/seminars, etc, wherever I go.

Rin says

E-man says

A car is a lot more than taking a person from point A to point B.

I don't concur because I'm being driven around by livery service and thus, I have a lot more fun eating, drinking, & doing other stuff in my limo than in worrying about the road. Remember, we have bad weather around here, along with crazy drivers.

E-man says

I want more than both. I want a car that not only takes me from point A to point B, but a car that I enjoy driving everyday, not just on the weekend. Tesla fits the bill. After 15 months of owning it, the car still puts a smile on my face every time I drive it.

You said that you've finished working for a living so in effect, you've decided that your retirement is that of a "roadster" but personally, I'd rather be a roadie and be following around rock bands. But since...

@Rin,

I enjoy the conversation as both of us have taken our own path, and there is no right or wrong way for each of us. My partner and I had this talk where both of us came to the same conclusion. It's a curse and a blessing that we both have a family. Both of us could see the positives and negatives of being singles and married so I respect your choice of staying single. If you're happy with the decision, that's all that matters. ;-)

Our difference is that I enjoy driving instead of being a passenger especially with an Asian woman behind the wheel. ;-)

MrMagic says

Rin says

And there's a huge difference between $1K and $50K for the average consumer.

and there's a huge difference between a $60K Model 3 and a $30K Volt, yet they both get you from Point A to B.

I have both. Tesla and the Volt. Returning the leased Volt 2017 early as the mileage is all used up.
The Nissan Leaf is to replace the Volt.
The Tesla is to replace the Electric Mercedes B Class.

E-man says

Tesla fits the bill. After 15 months of owning it, the car still puts a smile on my face every time I drive it. What say you @Strategist and @gsr?

It's not a car. It's a Tesla.
All our anti technology, anti progress, anti visionary friends from the stone age are still using 2 sticks to make a fire.
My Dear Stone Age Friends,
How many Leopard Skins are you willing to trade for a match?

mell says

CBOEtrader says

E-man says

Life is too short to make small bets - CEO of Soft Bank. ???

Survivorship bias.

This is a low resolution algorithm guaranteed to fail most people. You are correct though, for someone to go fron normal life savings to rich betting the farm on one risk exposure is a strategy.

Exactly. The problem is that the winners will always be the singled out story while nobody talks about the losers outnumbering the winners 1:10. I think big bets can work if the you're betting on something that is very likely to turn profitable and mostly debt free going forward, but this was a risky bet. Look at crypto, many put their life savings in it or rode from 500K to millions back to less than 200K. Still it is true that many of those success stories come from big bets while there are more...

@mell,

I think the difference between cryptocurrencies and weed stocks are that these companies are not being run by geniuses like Jeff Bezos, Steve Jobs or Elon Musk. Those companies are much more speculative rather than the true geniuses who are running a company to change the world.

My tennis friend made a bet on TSLA stock based on something he read in Steve Jobs' book and it resonated with him. I'm glad it worked out for him. He could have been wiped out completely at the age of 47. Instead, he bought a million dollar house and paid cash for it. His wife told him as long as the house is paid off, he could do whatever he wanted with the rest of the money, and that was exactly what he did.

For me, I could control my outcome with my bet/investment strategy. If it didn't work, I couldn't blame it on anyone else. I made a calculated bet rather than a speculative bet, and it has paid off. I didn't rely on others for the outcome. Now that the method has proven, it's a rinse and repeat. It comes down to how hard do I want to work? 6 hours a week, 12 hours a week or 18 hours a week?

Since the finances have been in order, I had a new challenge this year which was to shed 15 pounds off. I went from 185 pounds to 170 pounds. Two months before this year ended, I had another challenge and that was to have a 6-pack abs in 60 days. I went for it too. These experiences have also given me valuable lessons. Basically, great results could be achieved in a short amount of time if we put the time and effort into it. I'm 5'10 inches by the way.

Now, the goal for 2019 is to have a body like it's carved out of stone. We all can do, but not all of us will. It takes time, effort and discipline. Sounds simple isn't it?

Strategist says

anti technology, anti progress, anti visionary friends

Actually, it's sex robots which will change the world!

Cars, whether they're electric or gas, will be another automated commodity item in 15 years, as self-driving tech goes mainstream. By 2075, ppl will remember manual driving with the way we remember the telephone switchboard operator.

E-man says

In light of that, another luxury automaker influenced by Tesla’s ongoing success is Bentley.

Bentley is the same company as Porsche: both are owned by VW, as is Audi. All those variants are just platform sharing. As for following / copying Tesla, VW has at least one thing down pat: making shoddy cars.

Rin says

Strategist says

anti technology, anti progress, anti visionary friends

Actually, it's sex robots which will change the world!

Cars, whether they're electric or gas, will be another automated commodity in 15 years, as self-driving tech goes mainstream.

Car on auto pilot. Hot chick in the back seat. Dark windows. What more can you want?
Look at all the money that can be saved by not renting at Motel 666.

Strategist says

Car on auto pilot. Hot chick in the back seat. Dark windows. What more can you want?

Rin Wah Law! Rin Wah Law!

Strategist says

The negative articles on Tesla and Musk that have recently swamped the media are sheer nonsense, most likely funded by those who would be hurt by the end of fossil fuels. Even the SEC probe seems to have an agenda in my opinion. No matter how much Big Oil tries to suffocate electric cars, they cannot and will not succeed. They may have US corrupt politicians in their pockets, but they do not have all the countries determined to end fossil fuels in their pockets.
Lets face it.....New technology that is more efficient, economical, and does more good will always end up replacing old technology that is not needed anymore. Those who are not open to welcoming new technologies are welcome to live like cave men on an island. Who knows, they may even discover fire.

Since nobody is talking about building more hydroelectric plants or nuclear power plants, most incremental electricity generation will come from natural gas . . . as will make-up generation for when solar panels don't generate electricity at night. Tesla as a company makes two categories of products that will help maintaining a price floor for natural gas, which are what new wells are producing nowadays as they dig deeper into the ground.

E-man says

mell says

CBOEtrader says

E-man says

Life is too short to make small bets - CEO of Soft Bank. ???

Survivorship bias.

This is a low resolution algorithm guaranteed to fail most people. You are correct though, for someone to go fron normal life savings to rich betting the farm on one risk exposure is a strategy.

Exactly. The problem is that the winners will always be the singled out story while nobody talks about the losers outnumbering the winners 1:10. I think big bets can work if the you're betting on something that is very likely to turn profitable and mostly debt free going forward, but this was a risky bet. Look at crypto, many put their life savings in it or rode from 500K to millions back to less than 200K. Still it is...

lol make sure you don't get tempted once you sport that body and abs. This is an extremely hard goal to achieve, so kudos. I "just" keep in shape and standing tall but I have found out that even slight muscle tone and workout glow will make women come on strong, so be careful with that marriage!

Rin says

Still, cellphone .... make that mobile computing, is a viable long term market, which isn't disappearing though it may evolve into clothes, eye wear, upholstery, etc, instead of a handheld device.

In contrast, a car is still just that, a mode of transportation. Ppl needs transportation tools, to get from point A to B, not an expensive toy.

And there's a huge difference between $1K and $50K for the average consumer.

Correct. Ultimately (perhaps within a decade or less), electric cars will be much cheaper than ICE cars. It's just like flat panel displays cost much more than CRT's back in the 1990's, but I predicted early on that flat panels will ultimately cost much less than the CR's (which eventually reached a price point of about $1000 for a 21" model, a price point below which no manufacturer could make a profit making new units; the glass tube and Invar mask cost real money). As for Tesla, it will either be bankrupt or make self-driving logistic/killer robots for the military.

E-man says

Sounds simple isn't it?

It is simple. Just ignore all your human animalistic impulses to drunk beer, eat cake, and not be in daily pain from 2 hour workouts. Simple strategy, close to impossible to execute. You seem like a dude who could pull it off though.

I had a college teammate who ate 1 snickers bar in 2 years as his only sugar, no beer no bread no sugar. Dude was ripped, and somehow was still an enormous vag from always stressing about his diet. So yeah, simple as can be but not easy at all.

Strategist says

Car on auto pilot. Hot chick in the back seat. Dark windows. What more can you want?
Look at all the money that can be saved by not renting at Motel 666.

And the leveling of home prices. A commute of 1-2 hrs each way from Sillycon Valley to Inland Empire would be nothing when one can eat, work out, and sleep in the car during the commute. How then would one justify paying $1mil for a shoebox apartment in the sillycon valley when 1/3 that price can get a house in the location an hour or two away with a yard, to be mowed by a self-driving robot lawn mower.

Reality says

Strategist says

Car on auto pilot. Hot chick in the back seat. Dark windows. What more can you want?
Look at all the money that can be saved by not renting at Motel 666.

And the leveling of home prices. A commute of 1-2 hrs each way from Sillycon Valley to Inland Empire would be nothing when one can eat, work out, and sleep in the car during the commute. How then would one justify paying $1mil for a shoebox apartment in the sillycon valley when 1/3 that price can get a house in the location an hour or two away with a yard, to be mowed by a self-driving robot lawn mower.

Pretty good point. Some people could just live in a large RV, and let the Auto Pilot find parking in the outskirts of SF. In the morning while you are getting ready for work, the RV will be heading to your office and drop you off just in time.
Further in the future people can live in large drones. You will have a wonderful 360 view, and the drone will take you anywhere you want for the weekend while you were sleeping.

Rin says

Guys, what you think my current lifestyle is like, with free livery service? I basically get driven from my home to wherever I want, whenever I want. I listen to a lecture and before I know it, I'd traversed from Boston to Ipswich and I'm nibbling on some fried clams while my driver is then take me to down to Danvers for a slice of Beef Wellington. By the time I'm back home, I had two North Shore specialties while listening to a few lectures and sipping on some gin. If that's not freedom then I don't know what is.

No whore?

Strategist says

Reality says

Strategist says

Car on auto pilot. Hot chick in the back seat. Dark windows. What more can you want?
Look at all the money that can be saved by not renting at Motel 666.

And the leveling of home prices. A commute of 1-2 hrs each way from Sillycon Valley to Inland Empire would be nothing when one can eat, work out, and sleep in the car during the commute. How then would one justify paying $1mil for a shoebox apartment in the sillycon valley when 1/3 that price can get a house in the location an hour or two away with a yard, to be mowed by a self-driving robot lawn mower.

Pretty good point. Some people could just live in a large RV, and let the Auto Pilot find parking in the outskirts of SF. In the morning while you are getting ready for work, the RV will be heading to your office and drop...

Guys, what you think my current lifestyle is like, with free livery service? I basically get driven from my home to wherever I want to be, whenever I want. I listen to a lecture and before I know it, I'd traversed from Boston to Ipswich and I'm nibbling on some fried clams while my driver is then taking me to down to Danvers for a slice of Beef Wellington. By the time I'm back home, I had two North Shore specialties while listening to a few lectures and sipping on some gin. If that's not freedom then I don't know what is.

In fact, that last time I'd driven myself around the greater Boston area, I was very annoyed with the drivers, traffic stops, etc. I wanted to ditch my automotive freedom, just to be free of wasting time in traffic.

Strategist says

No whore?

That's when I'm in Montreal, where my driver Yves Gauthier (yes, not his real name but a stereotypical French-Canadian one), picks me up at the airport and takes me to the VIP suite downtown. That part is easy.

Reality says

Since nobody is talking about building more hydroelectric plants or nuclear power plants, most incremental electricity generation will come from natural gas . . . as will make-up generation for when solar panels don't generate electricity at night.

Nuclear power, even though it can generate lots of cheap electricity is out of favor in America. They take 10 years to build, cost a hell of a lot, and only the government will insure them because insurance companies can't figure out the risk of nuclear power plants. Germany is dumping every one of their nuclear power plants.
By the time a nuclear power plant is ready in 10 years, renewable power prices can easily drop by more than half. We would be stuck with an uneconomical giant for decades to come. Even natural gas plants take 3 years to built, and not likely to be competitive with solar and wind.
Best to promote renewables with more innovations and let the price drop even further. Energy clean and cheap as dirt will give our living standards a huge jump start. Everything from prices at Walmart to Uber rides will drop like a rock.

And don't even get me started with the harm renewables will do to the fucking Saudis and Islamofucks. That alone is worth ending the world's dependence on fossil fuels.

Where do I start? BEVs are not for everyone. I agree, just like a bicycle is not for everyone. But it is damn good tool if it’s right for you. If you live in an apartment, perhaps you can wait for the charging infrastructure to catch up. I live in a SFH with a garage. It takes me 5 seconds each day to “fill the e-tank”. I drive a 1 year old PHEV, so occasionally I have to buy petro. It reminds me how outdated this fossil fuel way of life is, truly the “frog in the pot” mindset.
My PHEV is Camry sized, has an e-range under 50 miles, and beyond that it becomes an hybrid. To me, it is a good compromise. I have no range anxiety. I use 95% electricity and the rest I use petro, at 1/6 the equivalent price my “neighbor” pays for fossil fuel with his ICE Camry. (To be fair you must compare similar size/class of vehicles) I get the equivalent of 230mpg based on $3/gallon petro, ($.09/Kwh EV rate, solar panels and free charge). I get to use OPE (Other People’s Electricity), free charge at work for half my daily commute. You don’t have that, that sucks, give your $ to the Saudi’s, lol.
Very important consideration - efficiency and simplicity. I am ME by training, although I have retired from it, today I teach which is much less stress. I don’t dread Mondays anymore. EVs are so much more efficient than ICE from the energy standpoint. ICE should be called heat generators, because 2/3 of the dinosaur juice is wasted to heat. Fossil fuel is a single use commodity that will run out in 100/200 years at best. What to do then? Think about it, oil, water, petro and friction/heat waste, resulting in unburned hydrocarbons, CO, CO2, noise, smog. How can that be good for a sustainable earth, as billions more of the 3rd world fight to have what Americans have today?
Like him or not, Musk had single-handedly force MB, Porsche, Audi, GM, Jaguar, VW...to react to the Tesla challenge. He may go down in flames, car making is an unforgiving business, it buried many hotshots. But he will have left his mark, maybe that is enough.

kt1652 says

Where do I start? BEVs are not for everyone. I agree, just like a bicycle is not for everyone. But it is damn good tool if it’s right for you. If you live in an apartment, perhaps you can wait for the charging infrastructure to catch up. I live in a SFH with a garage. It takes me 5 seconds each day to “fill the e-tank”. I drive a 1 year old PHEV, so occasionally I have to buy petro. It reminds me how outdated this fossil fuel way of life is, truly the “frog in the pot” mindset.
My PHEV is Camry sized, has an e-range under 50 miles, and beyond that it becomes an hybrid. To me, it is a good compromise. I have no range anxiety. I use 95% electricity and the rest I use petro, at 1/6 the equivalent price my “neighbor” pays for fossil fuel with his ICE Camry. (To be fair you must compare similar size/class of vehicles) I get the equivalent of 230mpg based on $3/gallon petro, ($.09/Kwh EV rate, solar panels and free charge). I get to use OPE (Other People’s Electricity), free charge at w...

Beautiful. Thanks for posting.
The reluctance of mostly conservatives to see the obvious is perplexing. Conservatives and the religious are fanatics when it comes to opposing change for the better. I can understand Big Oil and the Saudis opposing electric cars, but individuals? Why would the average Citizen want to support fossil fuels that:
1. Create unhealthy levels of smog.
2. Costs a lot more.
3. Earns $100's of billions for terrorist countries.
I understand we are still dependent on oil, and will be for quite some time, but to prevent and bad mouth the development of clean energy is just silly.

1. All nuclear power plants currently exist on this planet are primarily for weapons production, not for power generation; the primary goal is attainment of plutonium (Pu), which doesn't exist in nature, but has much lower threshold for Criticality (minimum mass / diameter of the sphere required to capture neutrons in order to sustain nuclear fissile chain reaction; i.e. the ability to go boom and generate a mushroom cloud, or as the detonator to set off a thermonuclear device for an even bigger mushroom cloud) than U-235. Pu doesn't exist in nature (due to its much shorter half-life than Uranium), so has to be produced by bombarding U-238 with neutrons in breeder plants. That's the primary function of all nuclear power plants in the world. If power generation were the real goal, the power plants would be using Thorium as fuel, not Uranium. Thorium plants would be much safer, but wouldn't produce Pu in usable form. It's quite possible that the existence of massive nuclear arsenals is the reason why there haven't been any major direct confrontations among/between the top powers in the last 70+ years.

2. Saudis and other oil exporters use the money they earn to buy US treasury instruments and park their earnings in investment vehicles conjured up by NY banks. They are part and parcel of the global dollar recycling process. When someone like Qaddafi became too full of himself, he and his entire ill-gotten gain were harvested . . . just like pigs and cattle are slaughtered after they convert grass and slop (nutrients inedible to human) into meat (edible to human). Oil is a vehicle by which the US taxes the rest of the world to finance our military dominance (Saudis and other oil exporters are tax-farmers). If countries like Germany, Japan, Korea, Taiwan, China and India could all become energy-independent by putting up some solar panels and windmills, how could they be induced to help pay for US military (or exporting consumer goods to the US, so US companies can specialize on military weapons)? If/when that happens, how would anyone be able to convince the American public to finance the very expensive military entirely on our own tax burdens alone?

These are the two main pillars of post-WWII world order, supplemented by a third leg of periodic brandishing/exercising US military muscle against relatively trivial opponents, both to convince the world that the US-dominated system works and to get field test/training for the equipment and personnel.

Strategist says

MrMagic says

The end of the year push to try and sell vehicles using a $7,500 Federal tax credit as a bargaining chip appears to be falling flat on its face for Tesla. A new report by electrek published on New Year’s Eve says that Tesla still has over 3,300 Model 3 vehicles in its U.S. inventory, which sent the stock sliding lower by about 2% in morning trading.

Wow. No one wants those rotten, useless cars. It's a complete failure.
Oh wait a minute, they have so much demand they can't keep up with the deliveries. LOL. LOL. ROFL.

Even from the useless zero brain website....."This, again, comes on top of recent news that Tesla is now has offered to shell out cash for those who have who will miss the full tax credit benefit due to delivery problems "

From a more reliable source:
https://finance.yahoo....

Not sure why you even bothered to respond to this post. Tesla is up to producing 7,000 cars/week. 3,300 cars is 3.5 days worth of inventory. It’s such simple math that the simpletons at zero brain didn’t even know how to do the math. ???

Reality says

2. Saudis and other oil exporters use the money they earn to buy US treasury instruments and park their earnings in investment vehicles conjured up by NY banks. They are part and parcel of the global dollar recycling process. When someone like Qaddafi became too full of himself, he and his entire ill-gotten gain were harvested . . . just like pigs and cattle are slaughtered after they convert grass and slop (nutrients inedible to human) into meat (edible to human). Oil is a vehicle by which the US taxes the rest of the world to finance our military dominance (Saudis and other oil exporters are tax-farmers). If countries like Germany, Japan, Korea, Taiwan, China and India could all become energy-independent by putting up some solar panels and windmills, how could they be induced to help pay for US military (or exporting consumer goods to the US, so US companies can specialize on military weapons)? If/when that happens, how would anyone be able to convince the American public to financ...

A portion of the oil money Arabs derive goes to fund terrorism. Probably a hundred times that amount is spent by the rest of the world to fight those same terrorists.
The US does not derive money directly or indirectly by taxing the rest of the world for oil. If anything, the US spends a lot more to defend countries that should be spending more for their own defense. Their defense does not come from some kind of a tax imposed on them by the US.

Reality says

1. All nuclear power plants currently exist on this planet are primarily for weapons production, not for power generation;

Not sure what you really mean here.
19% of the total electricity generated by the US comes from nuclear power plants.
80% in the case of France.
Germany and Japan both have lots of nuclear power plants, but no nukes.