patrick.net

There is an ongoing clinical trial about mask effectiveness in Denmark:

https://www.clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/record/NCT04337541

When they post the results, we will know.

Summary of what different countries recommend with respect to masks:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7118603/

Very different recommendations.

APOCALYPSEFUCKisShostakovitch says

awaiting moderation

I do miss reading AF's unhinged comments in real time.

APOCALYPSEFUCKisShostakovitch says

The only cure for COVID is RALLY! and nuking the Post Office.

do BLM rallies/looting qualify or it is only MAGA rallies that cure corona?

theOrangeManIsBad says

The coronavirus is much deadlier than the flu

And this is where you are wrong. A bad flu year can kill 80k people WITH a "vaccine" that everyone is so excited to get. We have no vaccine and questionable therapeutic treatments for Covid and double the deaths of a "bad" flu year. It's substantially less deadly than your standard flu and probably by a long shot. Again, it's math. Look at the numbers.

And frankly if you're scared of it just put your mask on and stay home. You have no right to tell other people what to do. That ultimately is the core of the issue. The statistics show Covid is not deadly or as deadly as plenty of other ailments. You say it is deadly just because. You've yet to back it up how and why it's deadly, so you push masks with zero scientific evidence. Move the goal posts now to n-95 masks, when you were pumping all masks. You're tripping over your own shoe laces dude and blaming the kid next to you. Unbecoming.

theOrangeManIsBad says

You keep lying. Surgical masks reduce aerosolized coronavirus from positive people. P=0.02, which means 2% probability it was by chance. This link was in post #60.

Nope. You just keep ignoring the fact we have more cases with mask mandates and most everything shut down. It's indisputable. If mask were even remotely effective we'd have seen a flattening of cases and not a doubling of cases. That's not what is happening. Not even close. It's summer and any restaurant that has made it is generally feeding people outside where we already know masks are useless. We're social distancing and wearing masks and this is the result?

theOrangeManIsBad says

You're projecting your motivations onto other people, and it reveals who you are. The economy is in the shitter and people are dying. Some people ask what they can do to help fix the problem. Wearing the mask is likely to help and is pretty easy. Some people refuse to be helpful, because FREEDOM!
I'm not particularly worried about myself as a health individual under 50. But wearing a mask is an easy way to help, and I'm not a selfish douche bucket.

We are doing everything asked and cases doubled AFTER that fact and still with the social distancing message from late March and early April. If it worked even remotely, cases should be flat or down. Not happening. Has nothing to do with freedom or anything. I wear a mask indoors 100% of the time unless at home. I stay away from people and if I'm near people we try to be outside. Only one person in my family will enter a store and we wash and have hand sanitizer in the car. If myself and many other are doing all of this, why are cases doubling from a time when no one wore a mask and were on top of each other in areas, bars, concerts, etc. You keep ignoring this.

The fact is this whole deal has been manipulated and politicized. All you have to say is we're testing more, but that checks a positive box for Trump and you don't want to. There's no vaccine and limited therapeutic medicines available versus the flu that can kill 80k in a bad year. By next year we're going to look back on this and be embarrassed by the reaction. Estimates from NY are coming out that potentially 11k deaths could have been prevent by not throwing sick people in nursing homes. Those 11k people probably spread it to 60-80k people.

We got false positive tests. We have diagnosis' based on symptoms with no testing. The number of deaths attributed to Covid is 100% for sure inflated. Feel free to keep believing these lies. I choose otherwise. No motivations. In fact I'm rejecting others 100% wrong motivations and ideas on me all while still being respectful. Can't say the same for you. Glad you assumed I wasn't listening to the handlers....

theOrangeManIsBad says

WookieMan says

And this is where you are wrong. A bad flu year can kill 80k people WITH a "vaccine"

Look up infection fatality rate for flu and coronavirus. Coronavirus IFR estimates are much higher than for the flu, so if the average person gets Corona, they are much more likely to die than if they get the flu. Therefore, it is much more deadly.

A vaccine is available for the flu and if more healthy people took it, it would slow the spread and save lives. Most healthy people don't bother with the flu vaccine, because the risk to them personally is small. However, if everybody took the flu vaccine, the flu would spread more slowly, and less people would die. It's pretty simple, but most people don't bother thinking about that. Every year, loads of healthy young people get the flu and pass it on to some geezer in line at the grocery store. The healthy young person recovers just fine and...

It's not that easy. A vaccination is different from a natural recovery from the flu and has side-effects, sometimes serious. Furthermore the flu vaccine is highly inaccurate and a gamble each year until they can come up with a more general one that always works for the strain(s) of the year. There is no reason for a healthy person to get a flu shot, the body benefits from having a solid immune response and inflammation once in a while, acute inflammation is a healthy response (as opposed to chronic). If you're at high risk or very old you can protect yourself by getting the flu shot, instead of blaming others. By your logic everybody not interesting in driving a car or without drivers license should be able to mandate that all people stop driving cars to reduce their risk of killing them. That's the height of selfishness. If a disease is deadly enough the majority of people will gladly take a vaccine, as it happened with smallpox and polio. Also now that viruses are implicated in myriads of things incl. chronic disorders you want to forcefully vaccinate the whole nation against every virus strain in the world? Please. You don't have to be an anti-vaxxer, but a vaccine pusher is equally bad. Studies are clear that the enormous amount of vaccinations kids receive without break these days has consequences and side effects for them. What reason is there to vaccinate new born against hep B? Zero. Yet the hospitals will do so unless you object fiercely. Same will happen for sars cov 2 and I will not let anybody vaccinate my kid(s) against it. Once they're old enough they can decide for themselves if the want to take it or not. In fact a flu vaccine - although also mostly unnecessary - is more beneficial to a kid than a sars cov 2 vaccine would be with zero kids dying of Covid-19. I don't know a single kid who died of one of the common childhood diseases, but they are being vaccinated against all of them anyways, with the consequence that there's no natural lifelong immunity and then they forget about vaccination as adults and when there's an outbreak the disease is very serious (potentially deadly) for the adult (true for most except for whooping cough which declines in seriousness). Sometime you can use mass vaccination to try and eradicate a virus, but so far most if not all have resurfaced time and time again.

theOrangeManIsBad says

WookieMan says

You just keep ignoring the fact we have more cases with mask mandates and most everything shut down

That's a single correlation with no control and obvious flaws. It is only convincing to someone who is desperately hoping to find a cause and who is willing to ignore all of the more compelling evidence pointing in the other direction.
WookieMan says

All you have to say is we're testing more, but that checks a positive box for Trump and you don't want to.

Jesus Christ, I already wrote that. That's one of the obvious flaws that I referenced in your single correlation. You are correlating measured cases instead of actual cases, and the measured cases are now a higher percentage of actual cases. This can be inferred from the positivity and death rates. But that's not the only reason. Other reasons that ...

Most of the states with high or non-declining positivity have a significant decline in cases and deaths for a while, indicating they are about to reach or have reached herd immunity. High positivity rates is a good thing among declining cases, meaning only those really sick get tested and treated, and they become fewer and fewer.

theOrangeManIsBad says

Surgical masks

*surgical face masks*

One reason progressives should not wear mask, use hand sanitizer, or avoid infected people.

theOrangeManIsBad says

mell says

By your logic everybody not interesting in driving a car or without drivers license should be able to mandate that all people stop driving cars to reduce their risk of killing them. That's the height of selfishness.

I'm not suggesting that flu vaccine should be compulsory, and frankly hadn't considered the benefit of a real flu once in a while versus yearly vaccine. But, getting a vaccine that has very minimal risk (if that is the case) is a very minor imposition. That is not like not driving, which is a huge imposition. I would say it's more like not driving drunk, which does seem like a huge imposition to a subset of the population.

I've seen people arguing that the infection rates of 20-25% or so may be enough for herd immunity. I believe it's enough for to lower Ro below 1 when most people are social distancing. I don't think many epidemiologists think it's enough for peo...

The problem with vaccines is that the prevention of acute disease/death always sounds great and seemingly favorable, but jolting the immune system by instilling artificial immune responses, sometimes with adjuvants, may eventually have a chronic toll which is harder to quantify (aside from rare serious adverse immediate reactions), similar to shutting down the economy and those who are afraid of or cannot go to the MD for checkups/diagnostics. Longer term the shutdown likely will claim more lives and will leave many more ruined. Especially since we already have experienced max pain or near max pain from the Covid fallout and are now approaching herd immunity with falling death and infection rates. And if you adjust for the over-counting and that 80% likely could have been saved with early HCQ intervention there is zero reason for any measures as long as you have HCQ et al. ready and enough hospital beds.

mell says

enough hospital beds

You and I both know this was never of actual concern. The only area of concern was the Northeast due to self inflicted idiocy. You don’t put people with a virus around other mostly dead people. Even then we never actually saw any overload. A ship and convention center were equipped with all sorts of shit that wasn’t used.

After all that dust settles and we put masks on our cases double, but death rates plummet. Yet all people are hung up on are cases. Next it will be a vaccine and ridicule people that don’t get it because it was rushed through. This isn’t polio for fucks sake. Not even close. People need to grow up.

Brd6 says

I do miss reading AF's unhinged comments in real time.

If he would promise to stop talking about sodomizing Trump with barbed wire, OK.

I don't think he will promise that though.

Patrick says

If he would promise to stop talking about sodomizing Trump with barbed wire, OK.

I don't see anything wrong with sodomizing a politician with barbed wire (other than soiling a perfectly good roll of wire)

A video manual for proper COVID-19 mask use, no doubt @APOCALYPSEFUCKisShostakovitch would approve

www.youtube.com/embed/HWXbHQVMSwM

I have to wear masks around patients. Sometimes N95. I think the most effective thing to do is keep your hands clean and wear gloves and gowns as required. Add to that masks and I feel pretty safe around patients and they are safe around me.

zzyzzx says

Is that Scarlett Johannsen but with smaller breasts?

Patrick says

If he would promise to stop talking about sodomizing Trump with barbed wire, OK.

Lol! He's like an uncontrollable attack dog hahaha

Ok, I've found Scarlett with big boobs ...

Had no issue wearing my Trump 2020 mask in Newark, Delaware earlier today. Was kind of disappointed that I didn't trigger any libs.

Nobody is wearing a mask on the beach in AC today.

www.youtube.com/embed/QzYySCB_DMc

www.youtube.com/embed/vNg-Opf0_UE

www.youtube.com/embed/g3Z-_RmzxYM

Booger says

Just get a neck gaiter. The one I have is thin as can be and not restrictive. No one questions it. Funny part is these mask mandates have been working sooooooooooo well. "Wear a mask god dammit!" Oh wait, cases are increasing after we were told to were a mask. Interesting....

Given the world's data, it appears masks are ineffective. The only thing they might do is tilt a rate of transmission of 1.01 below 1 in the summer.

Karen Shields and KommieKunt Tyranny Symbols of Conformist Oppression.

The disease isn't in the mask wearers, it is in the berzerk authorities who mandate them.

At some point, we may need actual revolution against our "health" authorities, who are willingly being used to destroy democracy in the US.

I'm hearing rumblings about Covid-21 coming up.

WineHorror1 says

I'm hearing rumblings about Covid-21 coming up.

Improved? From China? OMG! Will kill everybody exept Chinese