patrick.net

KgK one says

Read Vegas, they figured some shit out 5 to 10,000 years ago.

Also the republic by plato. Socretes was his mentor.

The Republic by Plato is right here on my shelf, will read soon.

By Vegas you mean the Rig Veda, right? I have that too somewhere. Started it years ago but couldn't figure out what they were talking about. Maybe a bad translation, the Penguin version.

@"KgK one"

richwicks says

But if it was corrupt, they would have used it to go after him, instead of that silly bullshit over Russian Collusion, or The Steel Dossier. They would have nailed Trump on anything, even if Obama, Biden, or Clinton did IDENTICAL things.

No, not on anything. Look at his cabinet appointments. Look at his defense budget decisions. If you continue backing the bankers and the MIC, no one says a peep.

richwicks says

Read Saul Alinsky's Rules for Radicals.

You can get an audiobook of it here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQoh-vTRPVQ

Recall, this was written in 1971. I've only gone through the 1st chapter, but I'm a bit surprised that he was ever considered intelligent or smart.

Also, although it's frequently claimed, Saul Alinsky never said "accuse your enemy of what you are doing, as you are doing to create confusion". If you prefer to read it, here's a PDF:

https://historyofsocialwork.org/1946_Alinsky/1971%20-%20Saul%20Alinsky%20-%20Rules%20for%20Radicals%20-%20OCR.pdf

When Obama won his first term, Alinsky's son lauded Obama and his team for utlizing his dad's strategy.

Patrick says

KgK one says

Read Vegas, they figured some shit out 5 to 10,000 years ago.

Also the republic by plato. Socretes was his mentor.

The Republic by Plato is right here on my shelf, will read soon.

By Vegas you mean the Rig Veda, right? I have that too somewhere. Started it years ago but couldn't figure out what they were talking about. Maybe a bad translation, the Penguin version.

@"KgK one"

Yes rig Vedas. Germans have largest collection of sanskrit books they took from India. Except for electronics , lot was discovered while ago

Patrick says

In my early retirement, I've decided to read at least an hour a night in real paper books. So far, I've read:

- my dad's old college English book (always felt I needed to improve my grammar)

The classic grammar text from the '60's on was Warriner's English Grammar and Composition. You can usually find copies cheap used. These texts taught sentence diagramming, which is never taught anymore. If you can use this technique, your grammar will be impeccable (barring Google/MS "corrections"). There are 7 books, meant to be taught from 7th grade through 12th. I recommend the Third Course (Grade 9) to start; that was the single greatest education in grammar I have experienced.

@stereotomy My dad's book was Harbrace College Handbook, very well done.

I also have Warriner's English Grammar and Composition from my old high school years (I kept a worn copy they were throwing out). It's much longer.

I did learn sentence diagramming and it helped me a lot. I got 750 out of 800 on the English part of the SAT, which was in the 99th percentile. Had a fantastic English teacher, Mr Terpstra, whose father was a Calvinist minister. Real hardass, but you learned the shit. He kept the blinds closed so students couldn't look out the windows, had nothing on the walls. If you were daydreaming, he'd throw his keys at you. He probably couldn't get away with these things today, sadly.

Patrick says

This makes me think that the Chinese have read The Prince and are using BLM, gays, and militant feminism as allies in their fight against America.

Sun Tzu wrote 'Art of War', two millennia prior to Machiavelli's own book with the same namesake.

It's been said that Napoleon used to carry a copy of Tzu's book w/ him and ppl confused it for Machiavelli's.

So using the enemy's minority groups as a fifth column is an M.O.

With Tzu in mind, I believe that the PRC, using the Belt & Road initiative in Central Asia, was able to get post-Soviet Kazakhstan's govt to suppress their own ethnicities, in supporting Kazakhs on the Chinese side of the border who're suffering oppression.

Patrick says

@stereotomy My dad's book was Harbrace College Handbook, very well done.

I also have Warriner's English Grammar and Composition from my old high school years (I kept a worn copy they were throwing out). It's much longer.

I did learn sentence diagramming and it helped me a lot. I got 750 out of 800 on the English part of the SAT, which was in the 99th percentile. Had a fantastic English teacher, Mr Terpstra, whose father was a Calvinist minister. Real hardass, but you learned the shit. He kept the blinds closed so students couldn't look out the windows, had nothing on the walls. If you were daydreaming, he'd throw his keys at you. He probably couldn't get away with these things today, sadly.

The English teacher that introduced me to Warriner's was a 400 lb. goblin of a man. His almost claim to fame was that he was offered the part in the Alka-Seltzer commercial "I can't believe I ate the whole thing," but he declined. Like your English teacher, he was a character, although more in a Bronx Italian way.

I can say that Catholic school was excellent at teaching me to read and write, but it sucked when it came to math/science.

Patrick says

That sounds about right to me. I was in Catholic school only for 3rd grade and freshman and sophomore years of college (Notre Dame).

You lived in Indiana?

I used to work for RCA. It (was) at Meridian (31) and 465 about at the northern tip of Indianapolis.

Side off tract:

Warriner's English Grammar and Composition. Should I get it for My daughters, they will be taking SAT in few years. ? I guess it can help with grammer.


Big issue has been reading comprehension. That's hard to learn, kids been reading tons of books mostly fiction but it might help.
Math I got 800, so helping them with it . One can get 720in 7th grade so I am OK with it

KgK one says

Side off tract:

Warriner's English Grammar and Composition. Should I get it for My daughters, they will be taking SAT in few years. ? I guess it can help with grammer.


Big issue has been reading comprehension. That's hard to learn, kids been reading tons of books mostly fiction but it might help.
Math I got 800, so helping them with it . One can get 720in 7th grade so I am OK with it

Yes, I would recommend "Warriner's English Grammar and Composition" though the version I have is from 1962. Hopefully it's not changed too much.

richwicks says

I will still argue that the fall of this country began when George W. Bush lied us into a war in Iraq and we didn't hang the mother fucker for doing it.

My bigger issue isn't where the start was, it's where it's going. Watching my state and my country completely fall apart, and create a cycle that leads to more and more shit just feels hopeless. Like what future are my kids gonna have?

Misc says

Oh, the $100 million fund?

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/05/21/529417148/saudis-and-the-uae-will-donate-100-million-to-a-fund-inspired-by-ivanka-trump

Although Kushner's purchase of thousands of apartments via a loan backed from Fannie, probably netted them more.

https://www.propublica.org/article/the-kushners-freddie-mac-loan-wasnt-just-massive-it-came-with-unusually-good-terms-too


I don't see why anyone is quibbling about $250000 art masterpieces.

Neither are credible sources. I need to see their supposed sources.

NPR and PBS are, at this point, no better than CNN or Fox. I can't trust them.

There's this circle jerkoff about other "news" sources that are complete bullshit. Find an ultimate source that I can check myself, or it didn't happen. This goes for Democrats as well.

I'm tired of fucking claims, pointing out what I know are propaganda sources as credible. PBS ended as a news source when Robert MacNeil left in 1995. Jim Lehrer sold out, I noticed when he was reporting on the "weapons of mass destruction program in Iraq".

All we fucking get is propaganda.

If those two "news" articles are accurate, why weren't they used against Trump? Either Trump is more controlled opposition (possible), or it was bullshit (find that Russian Collusion yet?). I don't know and I recognize either is possible. But I need to see original sources at this point and an explanation of why our "intelligence" agencies didn't pick it up.

You may not understand, the election of Trump wasn't that people expected him to change things, it's was a one fingered solute to the assholes that have been running this country, EVEN IF he was controlled opposition. Hopefully he was the real deal, but EVEN IF HE WASN'T and we've seen a play for 4 years, FUCK YOU criminal syndicate that runs this nation. He was a protest vote and I continue to protest.

FortWayneAsNancyPelosiHaircut says

richwicks says

I will still argue that the fall of this country began when George W. Bush lied us into a war in Iraq and we didn't hang the mother fucker for doing it.

My bigger issue isn't where the start was, it's where it's going. Watching my state and my country completely fall apart, and create a cycle that leads to more and more shit just feels hopeless. Like what future are my kids gonna have?

Any future you allow to be made.

I was continually pissed off with the Boomer generation. As I age, I'm getting pissed off with Generation X - MY generation.

These fuckers in power seem to want to knock over every goddamned table before they take their dirt nap. Well, if we let them, we deserve what we get, and what our progeny gets. The only solution in my awareness it to allow people to know what is going on. The fact there is state sponsored censorship, shows we're making progress - perhaps not quickly enough, but we're making progress.

FortWayneAsNancyPelosiHaircut says

richwicks says

I will still argue that the fall of this country began when George W. Bush lied us into a war in Iraq and we didn't hang the mother fucker for doing it.

My bigger issue isn't where the start was, it's where it's going. Watching my state and my country completely fall apart, and create a cycle that leads to more and more shit just feels hopeless. Like what future are my kids gonna have?

@FortWayneAsNancyPelosiHaircut

I think there is hope as long as we all do whatever we can to apply and keep the pressure on the corrupt oligarchy.

"Every country has the government it deserves" -- Joseph de Maistre

I was pretty discouraged last night, but reading https://twitter.com/RWMaloneMD really encouraged me today. The evidence is getting to be overwhelming that the jab is the worst thing ever done to humanity, but the mandates that all government employees, Facebook employees, Google employees, and Morgan Stanley employees submit to it may well lead to a revolt against it, even among the elite.

They are evil, but they also do not want to die of stupidity just to make Big Pharma richer.

Patrick says

but the mandates that all government employees, Facebook employees, Google employees, and Morgan Stanley employees submit to it may well lead to a revolt against it, even among the elite.

Oh, please let this be suicide in a needle...

Couldn't be a more deserving group of people.

richwicks says

NPR and PBS are, at this point, no better than CNN or Fox. I can't trust them.

Oh, NPR and PBS are far far worse than CNN or Fox.

They have this thin veneer of Ivy League respectability, which is all our elite classes need to instantly believe whatever murderous nonsense they spout.

Patrick says

richwicks says

NPR and PBS are, at this point, no better than CNN or Fox. I can't trust them.

Oh, NPR and PBS are far far worse than CNN or Fox.

They have this thin veneer of Ivy League respectability, which is all our elite classes need to instantly believe whatever murderous nonsense they spout.

Back in the day, 30 years ago, I still believe the Macneil/Lehrer report gave out good information. Just a kid then, maybe don't know what the fuck I'm talking about, but Nova and Frontline were decent, in my recollection.

I remember in the early 1990's during the "partial birth abortion" issue, that it was NPR that informed me, finally, that nearly in all cases, it was just horrible slut mothers that did it, and it was rarely used as an emergency to save the life of the mother. They USED to admit their mistakes. They stopped doing that by 2000.

Fox, CNN, MSNBC, CBS, NY Times, The Atlantic, blah blah blah - they NEVER admit error even when they are caught flagrantly lying. They were always useless.

Finally finished Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire.

The Byzantine Empress Theodora started out as an actress and prostitute.

She wished for a fourth alter on which she might pour libations to the god of love.

Woah. Rather roundabout way of saying she enjoyed it every which way.

Patrick says

She wished for a fourth alter on which she might pour libations to the god of love.

Woah. Rather roundabout way of saying she enjoyed it every which way.

Musta been a squirter.

Ceffer says

Musta been a squirter.

Patnet members opinions of squirters... anyone?

I have not experienced this squirting phenomenon.

Patrick says

I have not experienced this squirting phenomenon.

Well put it on your bucket list...Its pretty amazing.

Finished Decline and Fall and now I'm on to Fredereic Bastiat's "The Law".

30 pages in and it's very good. Didn't know they had socialism and communism in 1850.

Patrick says

Finished Decline and Fall and now I'm on to Fredereic Bastiat's "The Law".

30 pages in and it's very good. Didn't know they had socialism and communism in 1850.

Hi Patrick is this the one? I saw several different books with that title, just want to get the right one, same one you reading basically.
https://www.amazon.com/Decline-Fall-Roman-Empire/dp/1354279492/

I'd recommend this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_International_Jew

(there's tons of copies online).

Would also recommend The Protocols of the Elders of Zion.

I have a particular fascination with what is considered banned, subversive, or propaganda. Rules for Radicals is a particularly hated book that I was told was filled with horrifically immoral, dastardly devious advice. The simple truth is, there's a lot of people that don't want you to read it. That's true of MOST books that are denounced.

FortWayneAsNancyPelosiHaircut says

Hi Patrick is this the one? I saw several different books with that title, just want to get the right one, same one you reading basically.
https://www.amazon.com/Decline-Fall-Roman-Empire/dp/1354279492/

@FortWayneAsNancyPelosiHaircut No, it's this one:

He really challenged my vocabulary, using a lot of words in archaic ways ("specious" means "good-looking" and "insensibly" means "gradually" for examples).

But you don't need to get every word or turn of phrase to enjoy it.

Patrick says

KgK one says

Side off tract:

Warriner's English Grammar and Composition. Should I get it for My daughters, they will be taking SAT in few years. ? I guess it can help with grammer.


Big issue has been reading comprehension. That's hard to learn, kids been reading tons of books mostly fiction but it might help.
Math I got 800, so helping them with it . One can get 720in 7th grade so I am OK with it

Yes, I would recommend "Warriner's English Grammar and Composition" though the version I have is from 1962. Hopefully it's not changed too much.

It pretty much hasn't changed from the '60's. For that matter, that was the high point of American English; everything else subsequent to this was downhill.

Back before the SAT was PC'd to uselessness, the vocabulary part was chock full of words that used Greek or Latin cognates. All you had to do was memorize about several hundred of these to ace the vocab section.

Interestingly enough, MENSA considers any SAT exam after the early 90's to be invalid proof of IQ. IFAIR, that's when we began the long slide into national and cultural bullshit.

Yes, wokeness has destroyed academic integrity.

Fortunately, it's never entirely over. We can and must fight back against the evil of wokeness.

Wokeness is a religion as harmful to free speech and human progress as medieval Catholicism or Wahhabi Islam. And you know for sure that if the woke get enough power, they will be burning people at the stake and beheading people in public.

Finished The Law by Bastiat. It's very short, only 67 pages in a small format.

His themes:

- The sole purpose of government is to ensure justice, so that no one may plunder or otherwise harm anyone else.
- Taxing some citizens to give to other citizens is still plunder and is unjust.
- Normally, the few plunder the many, using government as their instrument.
- Under communism, everyone is attempting to plunder everyone else at the same time, using government as their instrument.
- Legislators invariably see themselves as superior to the plebeians, who are to them merely clay to be molded according to the legislators' ideals.
- Legislators are not in fact any smarter than other people, and often make truly horrible mistakes with disastrous outcomes.
- When the masses of people expect the government to "give" them things, they tend to revolt when they don't get them.

He's the proto-Libertarian. He would not have the government provide schools because it is unjust to tax people and then have the government decide what will be taught using that tax money. I think I agree on this one. At least I would restrict schools to teaching basics like reading, writing, and math, and leave ideology entirely out of education.

He would not have the government provide anything at all, other than courts and police and military. That seems too far to me. I think public roads are a good idea, for example.

Just finished Going Solo by Roald Dahl, the children's writer. It's about his time before WWII in East Africa, and during WWII as a British fighter pilot.

It was very well written and interesting. Felt like I zipped right through it.

Being an RAF pilot was ridiculously dangerous. About 50% of them died in the war.

Patrick says

Wokeness is a religion as harmful to free speech and human progress as medieval Catholicism or Wahhabi Islam. And you know for sure that if the woke get enough power, they will be burning people at the stake and beheading people in public.

Notice the flip from "Tolerance for all points of few" to "Deplatform 'hate' speech*, Cancel 'misleading' speech**" in about a decade among the Left.

* Speech I hate
** Speech that leads away from conclusions I prefer.

Patrick says

Finished The Law by Bastiat. It's very short, only 67 pages in a small format.

His themes:

- The sole purpose of government is to ensure justice, so that no one may plunder or otherwise harm anyone else.
- Taxing some citizens to give to other citizens is still plunder and is unjust.
- Normally, the few plunder the many, using government as their instrument.
- Under communism, everyone is attempting to plunder everyone else at the same time, using government as their instrument.
- Legislators invariably see themselves as superior to the plebeians, who are to them merely clay to be molded according to the legislators' ideals.
- Legislators are not in fact any smarter than other people, and often make truly horrible mistakes with disastrous outcomes.
- When the masses of people expect the government to "give" them things, they tend to revolt when they don't get them.

He's the proto-Libertarian. He would not have the government provide schools...

“If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind?”― Frederic Bastiat, The Law

Patrick says

FortWayneAsNancyPelosiHaircut says

Hi Patrick is this the one? I saw several different books with that title, just want to get the right one, same one you reading basically.
https://www.amazon.com/Decline-Fall-Roman-Empire/dp/1354279492/

@FortWayneAsNancyPelosiHaircut No, it's this one:

Thank you

Now I'm on to The Wealth of Nations by Adam Smith. Even longer than Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire and much more dense. I'll see how it goes, not promising myself that I can finish it.

Ironically, those two books came out just about the same time, and use the same florid and convoluted English - Edward Gibbon was a fan of The Wealth of Nations!

Good quote from The Wealth of Nations:

It is not, however, difficult to foresee which of the two parties must, upon all ordinary occasions, have the advantage in the dispute, and force the other into a compliance with their terms. The masters, being fewer in number, can combine much more easily: and the law, besides, authorises, or at least does not prohibit, their combinations, while it prohibits those of the workmen. We have no acts of parliament against combining to lower the price of work, but many against combining to raise it. In all such disputes, the masters can hold out much longer. A landlord, a farmer, a master manufacturer, or merchant, though they did not employ a single workman, could generally live a year or two upon the stocks, which they have already acquired. Many workmen could not subsist a week, few could subsist a month, and scarce any a year, without employment. In the long run, the workman may be as necessary to his master as his master is to him; but the necessity is not so immediate.

Relevance to today: the oligarchs can conspire against the rest of us much more easily than the reverse, and they can hold out much longer in any dispute.

Yes, one of my favorite bits of WON - the kind of bits that Free Marketeers like to gloss over.

The most deliberately misrepresented statement in the book:
By preferring the support of domestic to that of foreign industry, he [every manufacturer] intends only his own security; and by directing that industry in such a manner as its produce may be of the greatest value, he intends only his own gain; and he is in this, as in many other cases, led by an invisible hand to promote an end which was no part of his intention.

In other words, by pressuring the government to IMPOSE tariffs to help HIS business, the manufacturer does good he does not intend - in his own self-interest to draw more business to himself and AWAY from foreign manufacturers, he creates more wealth and jobs and larger tax bases for fellow Britons. Free Marketeers have long distorted the context of the Invisible Hand to promote preferring Foreign Imported Goods, which reduce jobs and tax bases, if not overall Wealth, when Smith claimed the very OPPOSITE; that Tariffs were Good.

I mention this one because actually reading the WON and coming across this passage was like a slap in the face, back when I was very Free Market. We could never support the Trade Deficit and mass importation we have in place now WITHOUT a fiat currency running on maximum printing speed; we'd be long out of Specie by now.

Is Mein Kampf on your list yet?

https://www.cnet.com/news/hitlers-mein-kampf-a-brief-kindle-best-seller/

MisdemeanorRebellionNoCoupForYou says

In other words, by pressuring the government to IMPOSE tariffs to help HIS business, the manufacturer does good he does not intend - in his own self-interest to draw more business to himself and AWAY from foreign manufacturers, he creates more wealth and jobs and larger tax bases for fellow Britons.

Ha! Looking forward to running across this. A good argument to slap those tariffs on cheap Chinese goods.

Booger says

Is Mein Kampf on your list yet?

https://www.cnet.com/news/hitlers-mein-kampf-a-brief-kindle-best-seller/

Yes, and I intend to read it in the original German, otherwise what the hell is my German degree for? I need to find a paper copy in German though.

I also have a copy of Das Kapital in German. I intend to read that too.