patrick.net

UkraineIsTotallyFucked says

richwicks you do need help. Seriously.

Well, I'm not going to get any, so fuck off with that shit.

It's not me that is crazy, it's this fucking world. You watch television? I guarantee you're nuts JUST because of that. Hardly anybody lives in a natural state, they are just a pig that is fed bullshit all their lives, and they never question it.

WookieMan says

I don't get it. I've not agreed with you all the time and we've had back and forth. His comments always fucking lead to Iraq and WMDS's even if the topic is about gays humping dogs.

@WookieMan - give me an example, instead of just libeling me. How can I take you seriously when you so blatantly lie?

Also note, I can't be certain if you are lying or actually believe I did something remotely like that.

The Iraq War is a serious issue that has led to 25 years of foreign policy disaster one after the other. Ukraine is not much different than Iraq. For SOME reason the US wanted war there, they LIED to start it, they propagandized the public into supporting it, and it's a disaster as a result. The US is hurt by it, Ukraine is destroyed by it, and Russia is stronger for it.

You realize we're just going to do this again? We couldn't learn the lesson in the first time. Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Syria, Yemen, Somalia, and now Ukraine. We've had ample time to learn, yet we don't. It's appaling.

Honestly as well the reason I keep going back to Iraq is that is the subject people are MOST likely to be familiar with. Your average person doesn't even really know we were at war with Syria and they don't even know we bombed Libya. Iraq was the LAST WAR we had any significant resistance against so it's at least remembered.

He acts like the Iraq war was some uniquely horrible and evil act by America.

At the end of the day, the US and coalition forces toppled Iraq's army (3rd or 4th largest in the world at the time) in a couple weeks and quickly empowered the MAJORITY and repressed population (Shia and Kurds) to have a rightful democratic say in their governance. The MINORITY Sunni Baathists were pissed they lost dictatorial power and allied with their fellow Sunni's Al Qaeda (and later ISIS) and created a big civil war that ultimately dragged in Shia Iranian proxies from next door.

America is guilty for being too idealistic and not being able to keep the Muslim crazies from killing each other. While the Muslims were killing each other 500 at a time by blowing up each other's mosques and parades, US casualties were remarkably light all things considered. Russia loses more troops in a single week in Ukraine than America lost in Iraq in 12 years.

It was never about oil or some bullshit conspiracy shit the 9/11 troofers always trot out. Just government incompetence and Islamic barbarity.

socal2 says

He acts like the Iraq war was some uniquely horrible and evil act by America.

It was.

The US intelligence agencies allowed the WTC centers to be attacked, 3000 people were killed that day, there were many more that died from asbestos inhalation, the US then used it as an excuse to go into Afghanistan and later had George W. Bush said it didn't matter if binLaden was captured or not (and he was a former intelligence asset during the Russio-Afghanistan war), then it was used to lie the public into the Iraq War not only over "weapons of mass destruction", but over Anthrax which was blamed on Saddam Hussein (remember the anthrax letters?) - they were probably done by Israel, and also claims that binLaden worked with Hussein.

I have never seen such outrageous bullshit in my lifetime until then, and now I see it every time we start a war, and people remain ignorant of it, and invariably support the next war.

Iraq WAS unique, it's just the gold standard now, of a banana republic with a totally uniformed and disinterested population. I was worried in the early naughts about us sliding into fascism and dictatorship, and that's what happened. We're there now, we can't even elect the puppet that we want anymore, all the intelligence agencies and media establishments line up against it. We are at the point where the only remedy will be revolution.

And this happened on MY watch, and your watch too if you're around my age. Boomers failed too, but they were getting on in years by that time, in my early 30's I was of course at my peak, and although friend and colleagues resisted the Iraq bullshit, just 10 years later they were all on board to blow up Libya and Syria and it was the same pattern of bullshit and hysteria. The wars there weren't about "defense" though, it was about "human rights".

To get a Democrat to support killing a nation, call the war "human rights", and to get a Republican to support a war, call the war "defense of strategic interests". It's not either. None of these wars help us, and it's destroyed the nation. Good job everybody being asleep at the wheel. People who think "oh, it will be fine", have no idea - no it won't.

socal2 says

He acts like the Iraq war was some uniquely horrible and evil act by America.

Seriously? While gulf war 1 was a contractual obligation fulfilled to an equally (if not more, women under Saddam were quite liberated) oppressive regime, and a quick pushback into Iraqi bounds, Gulf War 2 certainly was horrible and evil, and that's an understatement, it was a major genocide/infanticide perpetrated by war criminals, under completely made up / false pretenses.

WookieMan says

gays humping dogs

That thread even exist?

It would be more interesting than rehashing the Iraq war for the quadrillionth time.

The Iraq war was just more government graft for the MIC. Plus Hussein threatened the Petrodollar so had to be made example of by the powers that be. But now that we live in a post-truth era where truth is treason in this empire of lies, it seems passé to constantly harangue on a war decades ago when the lies of today are sufficiently evil and warrant more urgent concern.

PeopleUnited says

It would be more interesting than rehashing the Iraq war for the quadrillionth time.

It's a reference to people infecting dogs with monkeypox. Draw your own conclusions of what happened.

Once dogs and kids were starting to get monkeypox from being around gay males, the whole monkeypox thing went away and they renamed it to "m-pox". It was going to be the "new pandemic" if you recall, but I think unlike the Iraq War, people did learn their lesson with these health panics. That killed it.

If you recall in the 1980's, authorities falsely claimed that heterosexuals were at the same risk of HIV as homosexual couples were. Not even close, anal intercourse allows a much easier infection route, and also lifestyle - homosexuals have far more sexual partners than heterosexual couples. I've read about this, it was apparently a deliberate attempt to reduce population by reducing sexual interaction - at least some claim.

It's not even known to this day if HIV is actually the cause of AIDS. Kary Mullis didn't believe it was, although if HIV become detectable in the blood, you have AIDS. HIV may be a benign virus that only becomes apparent once the immune system is compromised. One hypothesis is that people with AIDS actually are getting it from excessive drug use which is also rampant in the gay community. If HIV isn't the cause of AIDS, all the attempts to attack and eliminate HIV are worthless, and it's possible HIV is a symbiotic virus rather than just a parasitic one, and if that's the case, eliminating HIV in a human body may have deleterious effects.

PeopleUnited says

The Iraq war was just more government graft for the MIC.

No, it wasn't just "more". That war changed our nation's direction. We allowed torture due to that war, the Patriot Act, we setup "free speech zones" (remember them), had a "terror alert level" which was used exclusively to get the administration out of trouble when placed under scrutiny, and established the concept of "pre-emptive war", which up until that point was unthinkable, because "we cannot wait for the final proof in the form of a mushroom cloud".

Any credibility left of the media, across the board, was destroyed in those years. NPR and PBS still did decent work in the 1990, but by 2005, they may as well have been CNN today.

With that war, justification for war was thrown away, replaced with absolute nonsense. I know a person that read the Economist religiously, and thinks that the Syria war was all about the US going into Syria to cool the civil war down. He has no idea that the US funded ISIS, that Israel treated and supported the group, and that the US (or Israel or the UK, whatever) staged the Douma Chemical Attack. It's quite probably that the chemical attack in Ghouta probably DID happen, and WE did it. Our government may very well have poisoned a population in order to start a war, if that doesn't brown your pants a bit, you're not thinking about enough.

PeopleUnited says

But now that we live in a post-truth era where truth is treason in this empire of lies

What does post-truth mean?

What was before? PRE-TRUTH? What you're experiencing is an entire population SLOWLY becoming aware of what is going on. I'd argue our media has always been garbage pumping out bullshit all my life. I became aware of this in my early 20's starting with the Nayirah Testimony. The difference with the first Iraq War (Desert Storm) and the later one is that the propaganda was exposed PRIOR to the war starting. It could have been prevented.

The limitation on the Syrian war was in part that so many people were aware that the government was lying about it and knew. That's why ground troops didn't go in. It's pretty well known that ISIS was a US proxy in some way, that the White Helmets didn't exist, and the Kurdish population was simply used as a weapon against Syria - they're just the PKK, a communist terrorist group, a terrorist group according to our government anyhow.

PeopleUnited says

it seems passé to constantly harangue on a war decades ago when the lies of today are sufficiently evil and warrant more urgent concern.

It's a touchstone to get people to realize that the current new lies, are the same as the old ones. The point of the Iraq War is that 1/2 the country resisted it, and at least that 1/2 was reachable for a long time. It's taken time, but "Conservatives" have finally become aware of it. It took them a full decade to realize it wasn't a mistake.

So if I want a cheap commuter EV I might be able to find a $10k Model 3 in about 6 months it seems…. Only entertaing due to free charging at work that would delete my fuel bill

ForcedTQ says

So if I want a cheap commuter EV I might be able to find a $10k Model 3 in about 6 months it seems…. Only entertaing due to free charging at work that would delete my fuel bill

Look at leasing. I think the Leaf was leased for $50 a month for a while. Probably that deal is gone, but there are some pretty sweet incentives for leasing, as long as you don't mind soaking the taxpayer for your almost free vehicle.

richwicks says

socal2 says

He acts like the Iraq war was some uniquely horrible and evil act by America.

It was.

MORE people died in Chicago than ALL US troops in Iraq AND Afghanistan. Much of the of the civilian deaths in both countries was attributed to the US, but was actually Muslim infighting between sects. Shia and Sunni. This is why no one has ever been successful in ever taking control of these countries 100%. They are fucking crazy people.

I agree we made a dip shit attempt to try. We have FAR bigger bigger problems at home. We're more war torn here than there. So maybe move there if you think they're better. It's water under the bridge and you cannot or don't even try to control it, just bitch. Enjoy a miserable life.

richwicks says

ForcedTQ says

So if I want a cheap commuter EV I might be able to find a $10k Model 3 in about 6 months it seems…. Only entertaing due to free charging at work that would delete my fuel bill

Look at leasing. I think the Leaf was leased for $50 a month for a while. Probably that deal is gone, but there are some pretty sweet incentives for leasing, as long as you don't mind soaking the taxpayer for your almost free vehicle.

My financial principles preclude me from leasing or financing an auto. Also not going to soak the taxpayers. Hell, I won’t even DIY solar on my house with an FTC claim. I’ll pay for it myself.

WookieMan says

MORE people died in Chicago than ALL US troops in Iraq AND Afghanistan.

I'm not complaining about the US troop deaths. I'm complaining about spending 1 trillion dollars or whatever to kill 800,000 Iraqis for no discernible benefit.

I no longer appeal to the morality of the situation because people just simply don't care about that. It cost $1,250,000 to kill each Iraqi about. For what benefit to the United States?

WookieMan says

Much of the of the civilian deaths in both countries was attributed to the US, but was actually Muslim infighting between sects. Shia and Sunni. This is why no one has ever been successful in ever taking control of these countries 100%. They are fucking crazy people.

Would the sectarian violence have happened if the United States didn't go to war? And who cares about the violence really? What strategic or financial advantage did the US gain in this war? Halliburton made a ton of money, as did Offense Contractors. The US taxpayer paid for it, and got absolutely nothing out of it other than a bill.

WookieMan says

I agree we made a dip shit attempt to try. We have FAR bigger bigger problems at home. We're more war torn here than there. So maybe move there if you think they're better. It's water under the bridge and you cannot or don't even try to control it, just bitch. Enjoy a miserable life.

If you IDIOTS can't learn from the past, you will repeat the same bullshit in the future. It does appear to be impossible to get you paramecium to understand this. You think the Iraq War has absolutely nothing to do with our current state, it has EVERYTHING to do with it. Our surveillance state was setup as a result of it.

It's also not water under the bridge, we live with the consequences of that war, and because it wasn't stopped, Syria, Libya, Yemen, Somalia, and Ukraine have happened and they also have no financial or strategic objectives, or if they do, they aren't announced. I don't see any. I know some investment bankers are going to make a shit-ton of money off from Ukraine, because Ukraine is going to be slaves to them.

What the MIC does to foreign adversaries, they will eventually do to US. I know you can't comprehend that, but this empire has quite a long way to fall, and they aren't going to go out with a whimper like the USSR did.

ForcedTQ says

My financial principles preclude me from leasing or financing an auto.

You may want to reconsider buying an EV at this time. Their lifespan is about 10 years. Replacement of the battery is basically a new car. I'm leery of them. I doubt there's a single Tesla on the road that was built in 2014 that's on the road today.

There's a very hard limit to the number of charges and discharges, and the battery discharges even when NOT in use. I think the whole industry is crazy. It doesn't solve any problem. It's greenwashing in my opinion. I'm sure you've got a smart phone, do you keep the old one when you replace it? I find that the lfespan of a phone with relatively heavy use is about 5 years due to battery deterioration. I used to use my old phone all the time to listen to podcasts, until it would finally not accept a charge any longer. Miss that phone.. All you can buy are these giant notepads today.

It's Solyndra 2.0:



https://nypost.com/2024/06/05/business/democratic-senator-blasts-5b-program-as-failure-after-only-7-ev-charging-stations-open-in-3-years/

DemocratsAreTotallyFucked says

It's Solyndra 2.0:

I don't like EV's as you know. But how hard is it to put in a charging spot? Pull a permit, talk to the electric utility for trenching and meter, do a locate and put in the charger. There's no EPA testing that needs to be done as most chargers, at least in IL, are at gas stations anyway. All the heavy lifting has been done.

$5B should have gotten 1,000 chargers easy. The problem is shit like prevailing wage and unions. Maybe just hire a small company to install said chargers and they pay their employees what they want. Federal money is a flying bitch with diarrhea to deal with. Doing it now with my board. No one has inside connections but we're basically limited on what and who we can use for a construction project. Can't use local companies for things like plumbing or electric that could be on site in minutes. Nope, has to be some union company from Chicago 60 miles away.

I legit shut down at my last board meeting. Told them I was pissed off and didn't say another word the whole meeting. We are basically forced to hire certain companies by the Federal government, as a government body because we got money from them. I've know it, but the whole fucking thing is a racket.

socal2 says

Russia loses more troops in a single week in Ukraine than America lost in Iraq in 12 years.

Source?

What are the actual casualties in the Ukrainian war?

WookieMan says

But how hard is it to put in a charging spot? Pull a permit, talk to the electric utility for trenching and meter, do a locate and put in the charger. There's no EPA testing that needs to be done as most chargers, at least in IL, are at gas stations anyway. All the heavy lifting has been done.

In case this isn't rhetorical, I answered this very issue here:

https://patrick.net/post/1381647/2024-07-13-assassination-attempt-trump-butler-pa?start=400#comment-2081538

Onvacation says

socal2 says

Russia loses more troops in a single week in Ukraine than America lost in Iraq in 12 years.

Source?

What are the actual casualties in the Ukrainian war?

What source would meet your standards? Obviously US and UK intelligence estimates is no good. Ukrainian? Even worse. How about Pukin
himself? Good enough?

Russian President Vladimir Putin has stated that the Russian army loses 20,000 combat troops in Ukraine every month.
...

According to analysts, Putin has suggested that 5,000 Russian soldiers die in combat in Ukraine every month. Considering the standard ratio of wounded to killed as three to one, approximately 15,000 Russian servicemen are wounded every month.

Wikipedia puts US KIA at 4,507 for the whole Iraq war.

@RWSGFY what the hell is this Ukraine stuff doing in this thread?

DemocratsAreTotallyFucked says

RWSGFY what the hell is this Ukraine stuff doing in this thread?

Ask @Onvacation.

RWSGFY says

DemocratsAreTotallyFucked says

RWSGFY what the hell is this Ukraine stuff doing in this thread?

Ask Onvacation.

ask @socal2

Onvacation says

ask socal2

Of course.

Rumor has it that Ford is dropping electric F-150.

RWSGFY says

Rumor has it that Ford is dropping electric F-150.

Nooooo shit.

RWSGFY says

Rumor has it that Ford is dropping electric F-150.

I actually wanted one of those. Maybe now the price will come down to reasonable.

HeadSet says

RWSGFY says

Rumor has it that Ford is dropping electric F-150.

I actually wanted one of those. Maybe now the price will come down to reasonable.

Fiskers got reasonable, lol.