patrick.net

HeadSet says

Money IS created by government.

Money? Or Currency?

My silver bitcoin will still be valuable long after our fiat currency fails and the last bitcoin is "mined".

Glock-n-Load says

stereotomy says

GNL says

stereotomy says

hey changed the law 20 years or more ago. If they can't deliver, they can just give you fiat cash.

Can you show me this law please?

https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-17/chapter-I/part-190/subpart-B/section-190.06

Thanks, I’ll take a look.

Just thinking out loud here but, how does this affect silver prices? It seems as though they never have to deliver. A shortage isn’t the problem?

As it turns out, the change to allow PM futures contracts to be settled in cash was done by TPTB to save the counterparties on the hook for the Hunt Brothers' attempt to corner the silver market back in the late 1970's. There's some discussion of this on Financology.net:

https://financology.net/2025/12/17/outlook-2026/#comment-8314

Onvacation says

My silver bitcoin will still be valuable long after our fiat currency fails and the last bitcoin is "mined".

If the US Dollar fails, that silver bitcoin will be the same as bullets, canned food, or cigarettes - something to barter with whoever will accept it.

HeadSet says

Onvacation says

Gold and silver will approach infinity as the dollar goes to zero .

That would also be true for a barrel of oil.

Same with real estate.

The value of the loans outstanding also go to Zip.

HeadSet says

If the US Dollar fails, that silver bitcoin will be the same as bullets, canned food, or cigarettes - something to barter with whoever will accept it.

In cannibal anarchy, liquor, cigarettes and bullets will be MUCH more valuable than bitcoins, gold, or silver.

Onvacation says

When MAGA fails we’re headed for communism (Rebranded as democratic socialism) or cannibal anarchy.

Fixed it for you.

stereotomy says

They changed the law 20 years or more ago. If they can't deliver, they can just give you fiat cash.

I was hoping that you assumed that I already knew that...My point was, if you are an industrial user and you need tons of silver on a regular basis, where do you get it? Wasn't the commodities market the place to go? You could buy futures contacts and take delivery. Now if all they will give you when the contract expires is paper, then what is the point? I think we both know the answer to that...It's just a rigged gambling game involving paper. It has nothing to do with real precious metals.
The problem is that the coin dealers want buy at that low fake price...As long as sellers refuse to sell at that rip off price, no harm done.

komputodo says

stereotomy says

They changed the law 20 years or more ago. If they can't deliver, they can just give you fiat cash.

I was hoping that you assumed that I already knew that...My point was, if you are an industrial user and you need tons of silver on a regular basis, where do you get it? Wasn't the commodities market the place to go? You could buy futures contacts and take delivery. Now if all they will give you when the contract expires is paper, then what is the point? I think we both know the answer to that...It's just a rigged gambling game involving paper. It has nothing to do with real precious metals.
The problem is that the coin dealers want buy at that low fake price...As long as sellers refuse to sell at that rip off price, no harm done.

I agree - the whole futures market has become completely corrupted by TBTF bankster speculators, defeating the purpose for these markets to exist in the first place. Futures markets were set up to protect commodity producers and industrial users from wild swings in prices and were regulated to only permit certain business entities from engaging in trading operations. Once non-industrial banks and hedge funds were let in, everything went to shit.

Gold and silver new record high, silver passes 90$.

RC2006 says

silver passes 90$.

Some people are predicting $300 per ounce. That seems unreasonably high.

I'm pretty sure that the gold and silver price rising is just a sign of the dollar falling.

Back in the day, EJ from iTulip thought $5000 - 10,000 would be the peak for gold in $. Afterwards, a new currency or something post Bretton Woods / Petrodollar.

Onvacation says

RC2006 says

silver passes 90$.

Some people are predicting $300 per ounce. That seems unreasonably high.

I'm pretty sure that the gold and silver price rising is just a sign of the dollar falling.

This is exactly what scares me. I think it's going to go up a lot more, because we are borrowing money to pay the debt, inflationary. That's not a financial territory any empire, that I know of, recovered from. Markets that are propped by inflation, and being fiscally responsible to fix it, makes one an enemy. It's scary man, I don't know what our kids will have to live through.

Silver price can and have been manipulated in the past but gold is another story its pretty much a currency onto itself. Both going up this fast isnt a manipulation its currency depreciation but of the flip side at least all currencies seem to be going the same direction to gold.

Gold is going up because there are too many central banks buying way too much bullion for the Fed and its conspirators in the commodities markets to counter, especially when the Fed also has to buy trillions in bad loans for QE infinity; i.e., they've run out of pilots for the helicopters.

Silver closes above $90 for the long holiday weekend.



It's exciting to see what will happen Tuesday morning; the curse of living in interesting times.

Has silver found its new level? It's no longer a monetary metal and its main uses are industrial and investment. Has silver become so essential and precious that one ounce is worth more than a barrel of oil?

What is the price of a barrel of oil today?
WTI Crude 61.19 +2.84%
Brent Crude 65.57 +2.66%
Murban Crude 65.31 +2.24%

https://rudy.substack.com/p/surely-youre-joking

From 2008 to 2011, gold went from a major low of $680.80 to a peak of $1920.30, up 2.82x.

From 2022 until today (1/14/26), gold went from a major low of $1613.60 to $4586.43, 2.84x.

I have no idea if this means anything.

Patrick says

https://rudy.substack.com/p/surely-youre-joking

From 2008 to 2011, gold went from a major low of $680.80 to a peak of $1920.30, up 2.82x.

From 2022 until today (1/14/26), gold went from a major low of $1613.60 to $4586.43, 2.84x.

I have no idea if this means anything.

Because your paper dollar ain't worth shit.

I don’t know how we aren’t in at least a recession if not worse.

Glock-n-Load says

I don’t know how we aren’t in at least a recession if not worse.

High inflation is stimulating - since people are increasingly desperate to get rid of dollars, this increases monetary velocity. Deflation is much worse, as people hoard money and thus bring the economy to a standstill. At least that's what the Fed thinks, and why they're doing what they're doing.

TPTB learned the hard truth about industrial economies and financial panics in the Great Depression. Initially, they tried what they used to do back in the 19th century - let prices crash and stand by while their cronies fleeced the overindebted plebes. The problem was that an industrial economy can't take a sudden stop without catastrophic damage. We almost had full-on class warfare in the early 1930's, and the economic misery boosted the cache of communism that wouldn't fade for another 50 years. We had widescale hunger and despair - TPTB never want that much revolutionary kindling to accumulate again.

stereotomy says

Glock-n-Load says

I don’t know how we aren’t in at least a recession if not worse.

High inflation is stimulating - since people are increasingly desperate to get rid of dollars, this increases monetary velocity. Deflation is much worse, as people hoard money and thus bring the economy to a standstill. At least that's what the Fed thinks, and why they're doing what they're doing.

TPTB learned the hard truth about industrial economies and financial panics in the Great Depression. Initially, they tried what they used to do back in the 19th century - let prices crash and stand by while their cronies fleeced the overindebted plebes. The problem was that an industrial economy can't take a sudden stop without catastrophic damage. We almost had full-on class warfare in the early 1930's, and the economic misery boosted the cache of communism that wouldn't fade for another 50 years. We had widescale hunger and despair - TPTB never want that much revolutionary kindling to accumulate again.

At what point do people lose ground to this inflation to the point something breaks? Trump wants lower interest rates even.

Glock-n-Load says

I don’t know how we aren’t in at least a recession if not worse.

Oh we are, money printer and low rates, that masks everything. It’s why inflation went 100% and everything doubled in price last few years.

There’s no free market, economy is in full managed mode. Trump too keeps bailing out investors. Tons of bad debt.

Glock-n-Load says

stereotomy says

Glock-n-Load says

I don’t know how we aren’t in at least a recession if not worse.

High inflation is stimulating - since people are increasingly desperate to get rid of dollars, this increases monetary velocity. Deflation is much worse, as people hoard money and thus bring the economy to a standstill. At least that's what the Fed thinks, and why they're doing what they're doing.

TPTB learned the hard truth about industrial economies and financial panics in the Great Depression. Initially, they tried what they used to do back in the 19th century - let prices crash and stand by while their cronies fleeced the overindebted plebes. The problem was that an industrial economy can't take a sudden stop without catastrophic damage. We almost had full-on class warfare in the early 1930's, and the economic misery boosted the cache of communism that wouldn't fade for another 50 years. We had widescale hunger and despair - TPTB never want that much revolutionary kindling to accumulate again.

At what point do people lose ground to this inflation to the point something breaks? Trump wants lower interest rates even.

In the US, we're in a unique position wrt inflation. 70-80% of trade worldwide is in USD, so the worst effects of inflation are mitigated at home at the expense of exporting inflation to the rest of the world. If the world ditches the dollar, then we're fucked, but that can't happen for at least another decade - it's hard unwinding that which has been built up over 80 years.

Short answer: if you're boomer or gen-x, this isn't a problem. Millenials will be somewhat fucked, especially if they don't inherit the boomers' wealth. Zoomers and beyond might as well start learning how to grow yams and eat face.

Glock-n-Load says

don’t know how we aren’t in at least a recession if not worse.

The GDPNOW forecast for the 4th quarter is a 5.3% annualized growth rate (they base that rate as after inflation). The economy is booming The unemployment rate dropped from 4.5% to 4.4%.

About 2.5 million illegals are outta the country over the last year.

Retail sales up 3.1% over last year to a new record.

US savings rate is about 4%. The people have record high amounts of financial assets, including record amounts of cash (money markets/savings(. They also have record amounts of physical gold & silver.

The trillions of dollars Trump negotiated to be invested in US based industries is starting to take place. We're gonna see other manufacturers increasing production and hiring. Example: Boeing has a backlog of 11-12 years production.

Sure, there's some weak spots like private equity and private credit that need some extra papering over, but right now we're in a good spot, and Trumps working on getting construction of SFH going as well as extra production lines opened up by Defense contractors.