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Real Estate Experience


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2024 Apr 5, 8:35am   527 views  25 comments

by BigSky   ➕follow (0)   💰tip   ignore  

I would like to make a "go to" spot for specific real estate interests. Not that I mind the pinup pics (the obvious AI reminds me of the old Vargas art) or the politics, or the tall tales, but I think a section dedicated to real estate would be useful.

Anyone know of any transactions since the NAR lawsuit? Did the realtor dispense with the 6% standard? Has anyone seen any change in how realtors conduct business?

How about actual homebuilding? It takes a long time to read through this website, but as I recall, there is a poster in Florida rebuilding a fire damaged home and another poster in Illinois who is contracting a new build. How are those coming along? Now that my wife no longer wants to go back to Montana, I am looking to contract a home myself on the east coast.

I friend of mine just bought a gorgeous vacant lot on the Albemarle Sound in North Carolina. This is a clear one acre square shaped lot with a gentle slope to the water. Perfect for a luxury home with dock. Inexpensive as well, despite good paved roads and not too isolated. I may buy in that area as well, as soon as I determine the reason it is relatively low priced.

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1   UkraineIsTotallyFucked   2024 Apr 5, 10:29am  

Did you even bother to search for all the threads on RE here?
2   BigSky   2024 Apr 5, 11:38am  

UkraineIsTotallyFucked says

Did you even bother to search for all the threads on RE here?

This is what I get when I search threads under "Real Estate"



Even so, I was hoping to hear from anyone who is building or anyone who noticed realtors changing business practices from the NAR ruling.
3   HeadSet   2024 Apr 5, 12:03pm  

BigSky says

I may buy in that area as well, as soon as I determine the reason it is relatively low priced.

Schools. North Carolina had so many poor performing schools that the state took over many school districts. Also, historically Black areas tend to have lower prices. Of course, this depends on the exact location.
4   RayAmerica   2024 Apr 5, 12:24pm  

It is not going to change anything. All real estate brokers are independents that by law have the legal right to set their commission fees at whatever they decide.

This suit was all about the policies that the National Board implemented regarding the listings of discount brokers on Realtor.com. What will change is how Realtor.com will no longer be allowed to discriminate against discount brokerages.
5   zzyzzx   2024 Apr 5, 12:32pm  

BigSky says

Has anyone seen any change in how realtors conduct business?


It's too soon to tell.
6   WookieMan   2024 Apr 5, 2:25pm  

BigSky says

another poster in Illinois who is contracting a new build.

My situation is unique. Former realtor, management not sales. My mom is buying our house so I don't know the commission game anymore. My guess it hasn't changed at all. If was still in the game, as douche as this sounds, you're still gonna get charged 6%.

Building has been a bitch. We're doing custom though and not subdivision builder trash. We'll have the nicest home in my town by a magnitude of 2-3. Though not obnoxious.

Time is gonna be your biggest issue if you want to build and not buy cardboard crap houses. Anythings post 90's (ish) is pure trash. Better off remodeling a 50's-70's house. But bids are going to take months if you're going custom new construction.

BigSky says

How are those coming along? Now that my wife no longer wants to go back to Montana, I am looking to contract a home myself on the east coast.

I'd go to Montana in a heartbeat unless it wasn't for work. Is that the issue? If you've lived in Montana, given the username I assume so, I'm not sure you'll like North Carolina. I actually really like southern folks, but it's a weird part of the country. It's a mix of the Northest and South. My number 1 would be to go back to Montana. I'm out there about two times a year for the last decade.

Bozeman/Belgrade area and enough Missoula experience. It will be expensive, but you can get land outside of town. Building something you actually like or settling for contractor grade builds is going to be tough. The price is double for custom. East coast will likely be even more than what I'm dealing with. I'd say go back/stay in the state with under 2M people that is huge.

Wife forgot work shit and I had to drive rural IL this morning.. I went 20 miles and saw 5 houses at one portion. All cornfields. No mountains, but not that much different than Montana. There's just nothing outside of town and I love it. You won't get that in the Carolinas. Maybe a mountain(ish) property. But it's going to be hard to get away from people. Which is what I want. Your choice though. Just one midwestern opinion.
7   GNL   2024 Apr 5, 3:30pm  

I own a real estate photography company and know hundreds of Realtors. The feedback I’m getting is not a whole lot will change. I did have one buyers agent almost break down crying. I would imagine “something” will change, even if just something small.
8   beershrine   2024 Apr 5, 3:34pm  

They only way to dispense with the high commission is to not use a realtor. It can be tough when most buyers stupidly go to a realtor to find a house they can easily do better themselves. Most realtors are using 2-1/2% on most properties still way to high for whats involved.
9   RayAmerica   2024 Apr 5, 4:01pm  

beershrine says


They only way to dispense with the high commission is to not use a realtor.

Here's the problem; a homeowner attempts to sell the property for what primary purpose? To SAVE money. The buyer comes along and sees that the seller is asking market value for his home decides that he too wants to save money and his offer deducts the typical commission.

Another problem is that the entire process ends up getting muddled because neither the seller nor the buyer have any expertise in how to proceed. Most for sale by owner contracts end up failing, because the seller and the buyer do not have a wall that separates the two parties, which makes negotiations much easier, being that the emotions are not being held in check by a professional negotiator. That's just my opinion ... but based upon experience.

One more quick point; like it or not, real estate companies have inventory. In a normal market, a buyer can look at dozens of homes that may meet their needs.

Have you ever dealt directly with a homeowner? They usually are know it all types and think that their home is worth way more than actual market value. I once talked to a 'for sale by owner' and he told me he was 'firm' at $269,000 and that he wouldn't budge one dime from that price. He tried to sell it on his own for a very long time. A real estate agency finally picked it up, had it listed for over a year, had numerous price reductions and ended up selling for $164K. The crazy guy was off by over $100K.
10   HeadSet   2024 Apr 5, 5:29pm  

beershrine says

It can be tough when most buyers stupidly go to a realtor to find a house they can easily do better themselves.

Too many people cannot even manage simple W2 taxes without an accountant or tax company, so they definitely will not have the confidence to buy/sell a house on their own. The realtors do a needed service, just that with today's house prices 6% is too high. I have bought at least 3 houses without a realtor but was only able to sell one house out of about 10 without a realtor.
11   HeadSet   2024 Apr 5, 5:33pm  

beershrine says

Most realtors are using 2-1/2% on most properties still way to high for whats involved.

Is that a 5% total split between buyer and seller agents evenly? Or is it still 6% with a 3.5% Lister and 2.5% to selling agent?
12   BigSky   2024 Apr 5, 6:00pm  

WookieMan says

We're doing custom though and not subdivision builder trash.

Please share details as you go along. You may even get some ideas from people here. What is the feature you want most? Outdoor kitchen? Basement man-cave (hopefully no radon in your area)? Does the wife want certain kitchen features? Are you doing a full poured foundation? From your post I presume you have architect plans for a specific lot.
13   BigSky   2024 Apr 5, 6:20pm  

WookieMan says

I'd go to Montana in a heartbeat unless it wasn't for work. Is that the issue?

I know Montana well. I recently retired (for good this time). Funny you say "I'd go there in a heartbeat unless" since I have heard so many people say that. It seems everyone has Montana as their second choice. In my case, all the older folks I knew are dead and their kids have all left. I also tire of the Montana winters. I am looking to build or renovate on coastal land with a dock, and the Pacific states do not interest me.
14   BigSky   2024 Apr 5, 6:36pm  

WookieMan says

But bids are going to take months if you're going custom new construction.

I am considering upscale modular. This is where you have a custom home built in a factory and then shipped and assembled on the lot. For this to work, the foundation has to be absolutely perfect to accept a structure where the walls are absolutely true.
15   WookieMan   2024 Apr 6, 5:29am  

BigSky says

Please share details as you go along. You may even get some ideas from people here. What is the feature you want most? Outdoor kitchen? Basement man-cave (hopefully no radon in your area)? Does the wife want certain kitchen features? Are you doing a full poured foundation? From your post I presume you have architect plans for a specific lot.

Outdoor kitchen - yes. Basement man-cave recording room (drummer) - yes. Actually played in a band with two buddies that live in Bozeman and Belgrade so I was going to record drum tracks and we record albums remotely.

Basement theater - yes. Pool and hot tub - yes. Basement Bar - Yes. Outdoor bar off the kitchen with swing open window - yes. Double oven is a must in kitchen. Low voltage speakers throughout. I think I've designed about a 40 speaker indoor and outdoor system.

We''ll install the radon pipe during construction, so it will be cheap and not ugly like the add on pipes on the side of the house from the basement. I'm a bathroom junkie, so that will be maxed out for the master. We'll have the hot tub, so our shower is going to be rather large since we don't need an indoor tub. We had a builder try to change all my ideas to lower cost and it didn't change a damn things. If building don't ever resist telling someone to F off. It's just business.

I'll post the plans at some point. I may have already.

BigSky says

I also tire of the Montana winters. I am looking to build or renovate on coastal land with a dock, and the Pacific states do not interest me.

I get that. I like snowboarding and ice fishing, plus used to IL winters that can be just as harsh temperature wise and our cars get trashed because of the salt when it snows. Carolinas can still get cold and snowy at time. I'd talk to @Ad about the Panhandle of FL over the Carolinas. Both areas can get hurricanes. Over 15 years my parents had 3 houses in Milton, FL just East of Pensacola with access to Escambia Bay, Pensacola Bay, East Bay, Santa Rosa Sound and the gulf if you have a big enough boat.

I'm 40 and have traveled there about two years of my life. If I didn't discover the USVI's it's my number 2 retirement spot. Anywhere from Orange Beach, AL to the west, to St. George, Fl to the east. Best beaches in the country. Rough water days it's not great, but calm days it's beautiful emerald water. If you're inland say 20 miles, a hurricane generally shouldn't mess you up outside of wind. Storm surge never caused problem for my parents properties on the water. My mom just sold the houses about a year ago. You could get a boat in there with a 5' draft at low tide. The neighbor had about a 50' boat. My mom sold the houses for $275k... Houses were nice, but the area was a touch southern and rough around the edges. Good spot though.

Summers are humid and buggy. You could always get a lanai. But that would be the other drawback. But no income tax if you'll be collecting taxable income.
16   beershrine   2024 Apr 6, 10:41am  

RayAmerica says

Another problem is that the entire process ends up getting muddled because neither the seller nor the buyer have any expertise in how to proceed. Most for sale by owner contracts end up failing, because the seller and the buyer do not have a wall that separates the two parties, which makes negotiations much easier, being that the emotions are not being held in check by a professional negotiator. That's just my opinion ... but based upon experience.


Based on my experience as well but today's information online can easily help people that don't know how. In some states finding standard forms are difficult but now it's all filled in online, You can start a sale on paper and escrow companies will input a standard offer and do almost everything this it's almost a secret in the industry. Always use a real escrow service. I've done it 3 times with 1031 rentals
17   just_passing_through   2024 Apr 6, 11:07am  

Interesting, I had never heard of a radon pipe. Looked it up. So in parts of the country that have to deal with that, is the radon ONLY in basements or is it seeping out at ground level everywhere?

Maybe it does but it only gets concentrated in houses/basements?

Apparently it needs to be vented 10ft above ground and away from doors and windows.
19   HeadSet   2024 Apr 6, 12:03pm  

beershrine says

Based on my experience as well but today's information online can easily help people that don't know how. In some states finding standard forms are difficult but now it's all filled in online, You can start a sale on paper and escrow companies will input a standard offer and do almost everything this it's almost a secret in the industry. Always use a real escrow service. I've done it 3 times with 1031 rentals

It is not an issue with paperwork, as any title company or real estate attorney can handle that. The only true purpose of a realtor is to find a buyer. But finding a buyer is difficult unless you happen to have someone already interested in your house. How did you find those properties you bought for the 1031 exchange, and how did you find buyers for the previous rentals?
20   WookieMan   2024 Apr 6, 12:46pm  

just_passing_through says

Maybe it does but it only gets concentrated in houses/basements?

Apparently it needs to be vented 10ft above ground and away from doors and windows.

It's usually fine if you don't have a sump pump. It's bad in my area, so we'll put a vent in on the build. Just glad I can put it through a wall and roof and not the exterior. Most people in town have an ugly ass 3-4" PVC pipe coming out the side of the house. As I've mentioned I'm a minimalist and that pipe would piss me off every time I saw it.

Sump pumps are the enemy with radon. Depends on the style if it's an open pit or pipes that run beneath earth for drainage. I don't have a sump pit, so not all that worried about it with sealed concrete in the basement currently. I honestly don't know how I don't have a pit. No proof, but when raining I hear water running from the floor drains in the basement. They're trapped and connected to the sewer. Illegally likely. Never have had a drop of water in the basement. No radon concern since we don't have seepage. Pretty damn well sealed.

We also have radium issues with water supply. They got it within EPA specs for the town water supply, but I still don't drink it. Beer will do fine for now... lol. Beer I drink is basically water anyway.
21   BigSky   2024 Apr 11, 6:06pm  

WookieMan says

I'll post the plans at some point. I may have already.

I presume you are on an acreage, so do you plan an outbuilding garage/workshop in addition to that mancave basement? I assume you will have an attached garage for the main car and golf cart. Have you planned the plumbing, such as using pex as a manifold or branch system? Mini-slits or central? Tankless water heater? Maybe even floor radiant heat. Any fireplace? This sounds like a fun project, and I am looking forward to starting on mine as soon as I find a suitable lot.
22   BigSky   2024 Apr 11, 6:16pm  

GNL says

I own a real estate photography company and know hundreds of Realtors. The feedback I’m getting is not a whole lot will change. I did have one buyers agent almost break down crying. I would imagine “something” will change, even if just something small.

I can understand the 6% commission back when a good home was $100,000 or so. But now that homes are commonly 5 times that, the commission of $35,000 seems excessive. I am surprised there is no market pressure for some enterprising realtors to advertise listing for 1%, while giving 2% to the agent who brings a buyer. After all, $5,000 is a nice cut just for entering a listing into a data base and putting a sign in the yard. I was hoping that the recent NAR ruling would have thrown off whatever collusion was keeping the rate at 6% despite the massive increase in price of homes.
23   WookieMan   2024 Apr 11, 8:40pm  

BigSky says

After all, $5,000 is a nice cut just for entering a listing into a data base and putting a sign in the yard. I was hoping that the recent NAR ruling would have thrown off whatever collusion was keeping the rate at 6% despite the massive increase in price of homes.

Big assumption it sells depending on the market. GNL's marketing for sure helps, but at the end of the day it's price. I was a broker at the time and my SIL convinced my MIL that her house was $420K. I told her $380k best case. I was going to do a flat $2k commission. Listed at $419k. Fucking crickets. 2 years and I just said fuck it. She ended up selling it for $360k after about another $30k in property taxes with no kids in the school. Literally lost $100k roughly by not listening to me. If it hasn't been noticed my wife's family should chow down on turds. They're idiots.

This is a personal example. We maybe sold 60-70% of our listings. You spend money, overhead in office space, employees, accountants and it's not as glorious as it seems besides the write offs. People think the uber wealthy are telling the truth. Most real estate "moguls" are bull shitters on the precipice of bankruptcy. Paper assets are just that. Until someone buys it, it's technically worthless.
24   zzyzzx   2024 Apr 12, 5:12am  

BigSky says

I am surprised there is no market pressure for some enterprising realtors to advertise listing for 1%, while giving 2% to the agent who brings a buyer.


Redfin, flat rate realtors. People need to start using them.
25   WookieMan   2024 Apr 12, 7:05am  

zzyzzx says

BigSky says


I am surprised there is no market pressure for some enterprising realtors to advertise listing for 1%, while giving 2% to the agent who brings a buyer.


Redfin, flat rate realtors. People need to start using them.

Eh... they have been. Back when I was a broker they were trash to deal with. Didn't do anything, didn't respond. It was a volume business. Get a listing or contract and let the other broker do all the work unless it was dual agent or in house sales. We wouldn't deal with the broker 90% of the time, just the actual buyer.

Commissions are way too high. But low commissions are trash brokers. Like I said, it's volume. They get a deal and disappear and let a 20 year old college drop out deal with the biggest purchase of most people's lives. Yeah, that works out well. Brokers need to be involved. It's just at some point there might need to be a regulation. I'm anti regulation, but I agree with the fact if I sell a $100k home at 3% on the list side, should I get 3% on a $1M home? No.

My office has made $120k off one sale. That's insane. As someone that's benefited from it I don't think it's right. But if I work and sell a $200k house I see no problem with 6%. Those prices aren't all that common anymore. But getting 6% dual agent on a $2M deal is stupid for the work we did.

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