patrick.net

There are very real (not psychological) compression points in stock, because most stock is sold by algorithm these days.

P/E is a shitty way to value stock. If you looked strictly at P/E, you would have thought buying Apple or google stock in 2005 to be a terrible idea, and Palm a great one.

simchaland says

John McCain, Sara Palin, and the Bush and Cheney crime families. Aren’t they your heroes?

Not a single one. I have no use for any of them. They're not conservative enough for me.

elliemae says All that I can say is that I hope these two people are placed in general population, and that their deaths are equally slow and painful. elliemae says

I believe that these people deserve the death penalty, but the type where they take several days or weeks to die while they’re in pain and horrible distress.

Shocking statements from the left. Ellie is not only in favor of the Death Penalty, she favors a method that would prolong the torture of human beings from a minimum of "several days" to "weeks." I think this is a real window into the soul of the left.

Torture is un-American. It doesn't matter if you claim to be on the left or on the right. Every totalitarian regime, i.e. Nazi Germany, Maoist China, Lenin/Stalinist USSR, Castro's Cuba, Saddam's Iraq, etc. have all employed torture. When you begin to justify their torture techniques on convicted criminals, no matter how hideous the crime might be, it is a very thin line to cross whereby others in society may be the victims of torture. In a practical sense, a policy of non tolerance of torture in a society is a protection against the potential abuse of the power of government against citizens that they may consider to be "enemies of the state."

Bap33 says

So, that is how my conservative Christian mind, heart, and soul feels we should protect our clan from anti-social deviants that hurt others. Good punishments are great detourants.

Please direct me to the passage in scripture that grants the power to secular authorities to apply torture to convicted criminals.

Well, rayray. RayAmerica says

A person that has a desire to torture other human beings “for weeks to die while they’re in pain and horrible distress” is very disturbed.

I do wonder why you aren't outraged at this crime. Is it because you support the act of child abuse, of torturing a small child and holding him captive for days, denying him medical care and watching him die? Is it because you've perpetrated such an act upon someone - and you've become hardened to the pain of little children? Does your network of friends email back & forth, identifying potential victims? Has Chris Hansen popped out of a closet while you were visiting one of your little "friends?" That's just sick and wrong. Why do you support child abuse? Why do you refuse to condemn such a heinous act? Why won't you tell us where you were when these little girls were possibly raped & murdered? Oh, rayray - it's safe here. We couldn't possibly think any less of you than we already do. I just hope, for your sake, that the authorities get to you before Bap does.

elliemae says

Why do you support child abuse? Why do you refuse to condemn such a heinous act? Why won’t you tell us where you were when these little girls were possibly raped & murdered?

More slanderous venom from a desperate, very disturbed, bitter, hate filled person. I've already said if I ever witnessed a child being abused, I would probably kill that person myself. In the real world, prison is the convicted molester's worst nightmare, far worse than the death penalty because of the "justice" they know they will receive from the convicts inside the prison. It is a well known fact molesters suffer greatly in prison, more so than any other inmates. What I'm against is your desire to have the state TORTURE these people for "weeks" before they are executed. By the way, you never answered my question as to what your position was regarding torturing known terrorists.

ellie .... Seriously, why are you so bitter and full of hate? What is it that happened in your life to make you this way?

RayAmerica says

By the way, you never answered my question as to what your position was regarding torturing known terrorists.

The punishment should fit the crime. RayAmerica says

It is a well known fact molesters suffer greatly in prison, more so than any other inmates.

rayray, It's a well-known fact that child molesters are kept out of general population as much as possible for this reason. RayAmerica says

I’ve already said if I ever witnessed a child being abused, I would probably kill that person myself.

Does this mean that you keep your eyes shut? I'm not surprised that you are able to justify yourself out of this one. RayAmerica says

ellie …. Seriously...

We're being serious? I wish that you had told me this before, because I rarely see anyone taking you and your ludicrous posts seriously. Is it fun always being the butt of the joke, rayray?

Repeat: RayAmerica says

ellie …. Seriously, why are you so bitter and full of hate? What is it that happened in your life to make you this way?

elliemae says

We’re being serious?

Now she attempts to say this was a joke: elliemae says

I believe that these people deserve the death penalty, but the type where they take several days or weeks to die while they’re in pain and horrible distress.

Rebuked by a radical leftist for her radical, Nazi like position: simchaland says

I am 100% against the death penalty. That’s the easy way out. Let them rot in jail for the rest of their lives if you really want to punish them. I have to disagree with you. I believe that mental health issues are at the center of this case.

Thanks for playing ellie. Have a real nice weekend.

RayAmerica says

Thanks for playing ellie. Have a real nice weekend.

rayray, Love the nazi comments. But try as hard as you may, comparing me to a nazi is a pathetic attempt to play the game. The main reason that this game is fun is because you don't understand the rules. The more you post, the more ridiculous you appear. I appreciate that you want me to have a nice weekend. I shall - it's currently 65 degrees out and beautiful.

Ray, my friend, to stone someone would be a long and painful death - it's one suggestion in God's word. Another is to cast them from the midst of the clan - that means they starve or get used and abused by whomever finds them - or get ate by a lion - and that too is a punishment given by God. If you are suggesting the Christ does not expect the lives of innocent kids protected, maybe you missed how he felt about what should happen to anyone that so much as "harmed one hair on their head." Now, when Christ told the group about to stone the hooker that only those who are sinless should judge the woman, it was not about protecting innocent lives. Hookers, like drugs, have always been part of the human experience - and nobody has ever been forced to seek out a hooker. Christ's point (I think) was this: She was only a hooker because someone was seeking a hooker. So, the whole community was part of what created a hooker, and that means they cant blame her without blaming themselves. And, if one looks into the law given to Moses, it's hard to see what law a hooker is breaking if she aint married and the John aint married. There is a law against Adultery, but not against Fornication. And how could there be, any sex without the express intent of making a baby is fornication. Anyways - I am not Christ, I am a believer that he was the perfect sacrifice to cover all sin so we can get into Heaven - where sin is not allowed. I am a sinner. I do not feel sorry for people that do bad things. I feel sorry for innocent victims. I know full well that once a person is dead they no longer feel any pain - so, as long as a person goes from hurt to dead, the pain ends. How long it takes only matters to those who are still living after the screaming stops. Ok, this last sentence is the gold coin at the bottom of the purse: The reason for the public torture (or my other favorite, public hanging for all gang members) is not only about the punishment of the crime, it is also about the prevention of repeat offenders, as well as, new offenders.

Bap, You're wasting your time. rayray's posts are all about the hate, all about the attacking of others for what he imagines their views to be. At this point, he's trying to be clever by comparing my denouncing of this couple's actions to the beliefs of a nazi. He possesses a lack of compassion for this child, as evidenced by his attempt to turn this into yet another attack on me. He has long projected hatred, bitterness while asserting himself to be virtuous. He lost his credibility on this forum long ago, and is able to take satisfaction in having become the victim that he claimed to be all along. Every thread he creates is an attempt to manipulate facts & situations to support his status as a victim. Don't try to reason with him, because he can only view the world as against him in every instance. He doesn't play the game well, which makes it more fun for the rest of us as he isn't smart enough to figure out what the game's about. I've enjoyed playing this game very much.

elliemae says

At this point, he’s trying to be clever by comparing my denouncing of this couple’s actions to the beliefs of a nazi.

It has nothing to do with your "denouncing this couple's actions." It is about your desire to TORTURE them for "weeks" before their ultimate execution. Only when it comes to torture can a comparison be made between you and Heinrich Himmler, who enjoyed watching people suffer while hanging from meat hooks. Their deaths would have taken, I would guess, far less than the "weeks" of torture that you prescribed. So in that sense, I guess the case can be made that you favor torture to a degree that is worse than the worst of Himmler's methods, which is very, very interesting. Don't you agree?

Bap, IMO, your references are in OT law and do not pertain to NT. Woman caught in adultery was to show the hypocracy of the Jewish religious leaders that were full of sin themselves (He knew they could not cast the first stone). He also told the woman "go and sin no more." Paul does condemn fornication outside marriage in several passages of his epistles.

yawn.

Nomograph says

You are so far out there that you actually consider Bap33 a leftist.

Of course I know he's not a leftist. We're having a discussion, is that a problem?

Nomo .... Just for fun: do you think it is "lefist" to want to torture someone for "weeks" before you finally execute them?

People that use "this" is the new "That" are only trying to create a New reality for them selves.

When we talk torture, we all must agree that each person is unique in their degree experienceing an activity before it is called torture. For example, for me it would be torture to have my hands cuffed behind my back. It would drive me nuts. And then, if I were placed in a squad car and strapped in with no way to protect myself or save myself in case of a crash ... that would be torture to me. Could I claim torture since that is my personal view? Those abu-grab murdering thugs were able to push their personal view .. (by the way, aint it odd that Gitmo just dont get any play time now that Lord Barry is in charge? .. same prison, same prisoners, same Halliburton .. go figure.)

Bap33 says

When we talk torture, we all must agree that each person is unique in their degree experienceing an activity before it is called torture.

Bap, You are correct in saying that torture is subjective. For some of us, torture would be having to spend time cornered at a party with rayray. Seriously, you're trying to have an intellectual conversation with a child who lacks the ability to comprehend abstract thoughts. I think the only thing that rayray has proven here is that he believes that a child being beaten and left to die for days is okay in his book. Seems like the rest of us tend to believe that it's not. I don't know if I could be the one to torture these people, and I hope that I never have to find out if I possess the ability to do so. rayray say:

Nomo …. Just for fun...

But unlike rayray, I'm repulsed by their behavior and don't find anything about this subject alluring or amusing.

the subject is horrible.

Yea. Simcha mentioned that he's a psychotherapist (I believe) and, in that vein, believes in treatment and prevention. I gotta hand it to him - I was in school when I realized that I couldn't work with offenders. I believe that it's important to have people who can treat offenders. My friend works with drug & alcohol abuse and has seen and heard some heavy shit. It seems that many offenders are vicitms themselves. The question is whether or not they have the desire to stop the cycle of violence. I can't imagine what this child felt, locked in a room in pain - dying - while his mother and the piece of shit that beat him got married. I can't imagine what was running through the mind of his mother, or his offender. Maybe nothing, maybe they lack human emotions. I don't know. Like I said, I don't understand people who can commit such heinous acts of violence. May God have mercy on their souls because no one else does.

Nomo .... why are you subscribing to me a quote I never made? You can do better than that. If you are going to debate, at least make a half hearted attempt at being honest.

elliemae says

I think the only thing that rayray has proven here is that he believes that a child being beaten and left to die for days is okay in his book.

Another complete lie from the the Slander Queen. It must be a very bitter experience waking up in the morning knowing that your whole life is based on a lie. That is not a baseless claim. If you are willing to blatantly lie on a meaningless site such as this, I'm sure you lie constantly in whatever you do.

elliemae says

I believe that these people deserve the death penalty, but the type where they take several days or weeks to die while they’re in pain and horrible distress.

Ellie believes not only in the death penalty, but in torturing human beings from "several days" to "weeks" before they are executed. Nazi SS Chief Heinrich Himmler enjoyed watching people die slowly while hanging on meat hooks. If we advocate this type of torture, regardless how hideous the crime, are we (uh, pardon me, I mean elliemae) any better than the Nazis? Civilized societies NEVER advocate inhumane torture, NEVER.

RayAmerica says

Nomo …. why are you subscribing to me a quote I never made? You can do better than that. If you are going to debate, at least make a half hearted attempt at being honest.

Actually, rayray, this quote - made by Bap - was thoughtful, meaningful, and worthy of discussion. Therefore no one would ever actually believe that you would be responsible for it. It is ironic that you would defend you would make such a comment. RayAmerica says

elliemae says

I think the only thing that rayray has proven here is that he believes that a child being beaten and left to die for days is okay in his book.

Another complete lie from the the Slander Queen. It must be a very bitter experience waking up in the morning knowing that your whole life is based on a lie. That is not a baseless claim. If you are willing to blatantly lie on a meaningless site such as this, I’m sure you lie constantly in whatever you do.

You're not very good at playing this game. Gonna give you a mulligan.

RayAmerica says

If you are willing to blatantly lie on a meaningless site such as this

Sure seems to mean something to you...

no need for bitterness. well, unless you are making a bitter dessert ... but how often is that - really.

elliemae says The mother is being held on $100k bail; the abusing step-father is being held without bail. Another interesting little observation: these people haven't even been convicted yet. I thought in the good old USA, you're "INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY." Ellie is advocating torture and execution for people that haven't even been convicted by a "jury of their peers" yet? Interesting. Very interesting. elliemae says

I believe that these people deserve the death penalty, but the type where they take several days or weeks to die while they’re in pain and horrible distress.

Elliemae is prosecutor, jury, judge, torturer and executioner all rolled into one big happy face. And these people haven't even had their day in court yet! Amazing. Kind of reminds me of Hitler's infamous "People's Court" where the "citizen" was guilty and sentenced before they even entered the courtroom.

Ray, I am pretty sure you are swinging your hammer at every nail you see. When there is a target in front of you that presents itself as an adversary, your actions make perfect sense to me. I have done the same, many times, and been where you are too. But, when you are tageting an non-agressive (even if only on this thred) you take on the light of a bully. I had a similar situation with a few of the left-leaning posters, where they would follow me from thred to thred, continuing the attack, away from the "battle field" - for lack of a better term. They looked like bullies, because they would not focus on subject matter. I humbly suggest that you look at this subject matter, realize ellie's actual reason for posting this topic, and avoid unnecesary barbs that might lead someone to feel you are simply trying to bully someone. To counter ideas on merit and offer alternate ideas is something you are good at. To know when there is no oposite view to defend is not your best suit. I seen you get pounded on other stuff in a very rude and agressive manner. Do not think I have not been there myself. It sucks. The lefties on here group together very quickly and are rude and agressive - and pretty dang smart too. So, I get where you are coming from. But, to take an agressive stance in this topic removes some very important realestate from your position, and soon you will not have any ground to stand on. Do not fall for the victim role, take the high ground and stay on the right side of things - that is my free advice to you. It all boils down to simple right and simple wrong. Right minded people can see those two things and believe they are exclusive, where left minded folks do not belive in absoluts (a failed idea - but thats another chapter). So, on this subject, on this site, on this planet, would you please stand-down and give quarter? It is the RIGHT thing to do. Thank you.

Bap .... It's pretty tough to go soft on someone that has repeatedly, in numerous posts, accused me of being a "child molester" and states that, in "my book," it's "okay to beat a kid for days and leave him to die." This is way over the line. I honestly think the woman is crazy. I don't support, watch or listen to Glenn Beck, but take offense that she refers to him as a "child rapist and murderer." Anyways, you are right and I appreciate you taking the time to tell me how you feel on this. I should be above this and ignore it but it's not easy to let her get away with this slander.

well .. follow this logic for a quick minute .. we are on-line here .. you have no idea if she is a "she". She may be a "he" named Frank that lives in a trailer park in Texas and is just role playing. He is 15, and gets no porn time on the computer since his mom got a good block system up, so he is bored and comes on here to mess with you. See how it works? The persona of each poster is created in the mind of the reader. You are creating your adversary. So, re-create "ellie" into something you are not threatened or angered by. Make her hot, or old, or skinny, or pale white with bright red hair and freckles ... it's all in your head my friend. I may be a rapist, or a murderer. That does not change my points on a topic, it only changes how you view my position. Actually, I am a murderer, but that was a long time ago and I repented from that sin. I'm an adulterer too. A liar too. Heck, not long ago I was a young black single mom too. No worries Ray, no worries. Hakuna Matata.

RayAmerica says

I don’t support, watch or listen to Glenn Beck, but take offense that she refers to him as a “child rapist and murderer.”

I agree. Nothing has been proven in that matter to my satisfaction. But, why won't Glenn Beck just come clean and address the issue?

not an issue - just an accusation - like J. Flowers, M. Lewenski, and all them other gals that Clinton "knew". Oh, wait, there is no "blue dress" in Becks past. Darn the luck, huh libs? The difference? Beck is a radio personality, and Clinton lied under oath to Congress while serving as The President. See the difference yet?

Why is it that conservatives just can't resist bringing Bill Clinton up in just about any conversation about anything thinking he's the least bit relevant to any topic today? Give up the ghost already. He left the Presidency in 2000 and then we experienced the 8 years of the Bush Regime where the Bush and Cheney crime families perpetrated heinous crimes against humanity on a global scale. The difference is quite stark. Bill Clinton got head in the Oval Office and lied about it under oath. Bush, Cheney, and Company started at least two wars on false premises that have killed THOUSANDS while torturing others and intruding into the lives of common Americans with draconian measures such as written into the Patriot Act. None of these things are easy to dismantle in just over a year. Hmmm. Let's see, what would be worse?... Getting head in the Oval Office and lying about it or killing thousands of our own young people (to say nothing of innocent bystanders in Iraq, Afghanistan, and Pakistan) in two needless wars based on false premises while torturing others and eliminating certain elements of the Bill of Rights. For me it's not even a close call. But alas, none of this has anything to do with the OP. Get it Bap? Clinton has nothing to do with anything being discussed here. You were making sense a few posts above. Now get back to making sense and let's end this side show that elliemae, you, and Rayray have decided to allow yourselves to be side-tracked with. I'm still concerned about real justice in this case, whatever that means, and whatever it looks like. Is anyone else?

oh, sim, buddy, check tatupu's post and get back to me with an apology - thanks. My post was in response to that filth, and nothing more. We were attacked many times before 9/11 ... the arabs didn't figure on getting hit back since Clinton was too much of a coward to do anything but kill innocent Christians in Africa and Kosovo. If you would have rather not hit back, that is your choice and I am glad you were not the one to make the choice. My choice would have been to drop a nuke on each city that had people celebrating the attacks .. so, I guess it is good I was not making the choice either. As for the case of this child ... for some perspective, there have been five (5) mexican gang murders in my little town of 8,000 in the past 2 months. That would be national news if not for the fact that it would give more credit to what Arizona is trying to fix. And for some more perspective, there were ALOT of innocent folks murdered on 9/11 by some crazy arabs in a very brutal and scarry and long process ... burning alive, jumping to their death instead of burning to death, laying under a desk in the dark, in the smoke, hearing the screams, smelling the burning flesh, and then a long slow thunder comes to squish them to a grease spot. I agree sim, we need some justice. Lets go after the crazy arabs just as you would these two creeps that hurt this little boy. Deal?

Bap33 says

She may be a “he” named Frank that lives in a trailer park in Texas and is just role playing. He is 15, and gets no porn time on the computer since his mom got a good block system up, so he is bored and comes on here to mess with you.

1) I prefer "Frank" or "Frankie. 2) One can drive with a learner's permit at 15 yrs in Texas, so I'm more grown up than you might think. 3) The porn thing sucks... but I'm making it through okay... rayray lost his perspective, if he ever had it. From day one he has been confrontive, aggressive, condescending & rude. Had he ever presented an argument that didn't include a slam on the libs, he wouldn't be crying victim now. rayray can't take the shit he shovels. he has no problem hijacking threads and being a nasty little troll, but can't stay on subject. he can't see the difference between personal attacks and spirited discourse. If he continues to make asinine statements such as: RayAmerica says

Spell check? LOL! You keep proving yourself “so smart & stuff.” Too funny.

This changed the subject from the OP. RayAmerica says

I poke a little fun at ellie “I never, ever insult anyone” mae and this is how she responds: elliemae says

But then, I wonder, why does rayray refuse to discuss this specific issue? Why does he skate around the issue of Glen Beck and the girls he may or may not have raped & killed?

elliemae says

Is it possible that he, himself, is guilty of being a child molester?

Yep folks. I have a little fun with ellie over her use of the word “piece” instead of “peace” and she responds by calling me a child molestor! LOL !!!

I was merely pointing out that he hasn't responded to the subject, instead preferring to attack me personally. That he appears to lack any compassion: RayAmerica says

elliemae says

I believe that these people deserve the death penalty, but the type where they take several days or weeks to die while they’re in pain and horrible distress.

Heinrich Himmler had similar thoughts and desires. He enjoyed hanging people on meat hooks to suffer in misery until they died. Is that kind of what you meant by your torture reference “type where they take several days or weeks to die while they’re in pain and horrible distress?” By the way, do you favor torturing terrorists?

troll, as long as you hijack every thread to your agenda, you won't be taken seriously. You actually have made a few intelligent comments along the way, although I disagreed with them. But you attack personally rather than have a conversation most of the time. I can't help it if your panties are in a wad because you lack the ability to have a reasonable conversation. Don't expect compassion, troll. If you had anything to bring to the table beyond "I'm a victim of the liberal system," or "I attack people on anonymous interweb forums because I lack self esteem," we might stop fucking with you. But it's fun. You're clearly outwitted and we're laughing at you. You personally - whom I imagine to be a scrawny little whiny guy without friends who corners people at parties (on those few occasions you're invited) who swallows everything you read on Godfearingproductions. Francis.

tatupu70 says

I agree. Nothing has been proven in that matter to my satisfaction. But, why won’t Glenn Beck just come clean and address the issue?

That's his personal judgment on the matter. There is a rule of thought that says if you answer these ridiculous allegations, you give them a degree of credibility. For example, I think Obama has taken the high road against the "birthers" by not answering these people. It's a total non-issue and he knows it. What point would it serve to answer every crazy accusation? Maybe Beck is thinking along the same lines. Furthermore, in Beck’s case, if there is evidence to support these allegations I’m sure, being he is such a high profile person, there would be charges. Anyone in the law enforcement field would make a huge name for himself in such a case, including the prosecutor. So in that sense, these public personalities are bigger targets. My take is that there isn’t any substance to the charges and he’s simply chosen the high road and ignored them.