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Collecting from FDIC


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2007 Mar 26, 11:42pm   23,481 views  194 comments

by Patrick   ➕follow (60)   💰tip   ignore  

FDIC logo

If enough mortgage debt doesn't get repaid, many banks may go under. I've been getting out of the stock market and into CD's, but now I'm starting to think there is risk there too. One of my CD's is from IndyMac, which has already taken a hit from the subprime mess.

IndyMac is FDIC insured, but how hard is it to collect from FDIC? Given that it's a government agency, I'm sure it's a real pain.

Then there is the more serious risk that FDIC itself won't be able to make payments if enough banks go under. But there's no need to be paranoid about that, right?

Patrick

#housing

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118   Peter P   2007 Mar 27, 2:25pm  

Peter - I don’t disagree, necessarily, but if that’s true, then where do you see the average retirement account going?

The numbers are growing. Does that mean that each and every retiree will have increase purchasing power? Or does that mean that early retirees (those who cash out first) will have better deals?

119   Peter P   2007 Mar 27, 2:27pm  

OT: Is WordPerfect any good? Or should I buy Office from MSFT?

120   B.A.C.A.H.   2007 Mar 27, 4:02pm  

The reason I don't worry about the FDIC making good on my deposit is because I don't use CD's. I just use the bank for paying bills and miscellaneous cash.

If I want a CD-type vehicle, I use the Ibonds instead.

I-bonds are not FDIC insured. They are better than that: they are direct Treasury debt. Of course, the Treasury could default some day, probably will some day, so that's why its good to also have a big chunk of your capital into some other store of value besides USD. (Like, home equity for example).

The interest rate right now is 4.5%, federal tax deferred, always exempt from state and local tax. So for most Californians that means tax equivalent yield of about 4.9%. Not as good as the highest yielding CD's, but then there is the tax deferral and SIT exemption.

There is forfeiture of 90-d worth of interest if they are redeemed early, not really much different from the CD penalties. The minimum purchase amount is $50. The max is $30,000 per year. So it's not really an option for the wealthy elites on this website, but it is for the blue collar types like me.

121   Different Sean   2007 Mar 27, 7:54pm  

I used and supported WordPerfect last quite a few years ago. I never liked it, as it still used those formatting codes which you toggled on and off. And it was pretty clunky in general with its formatting concepts. We had a hybrid 'best of breed' office solution at the time rather than using suites such as MS-Office, not that WordPerfect was really best of breed, it was just a management-speak cop-out for saying they bought the wrong product, and hadn't thought about the benefits of interoperating. I now do a lot of development and data analysis work in Access, including heavy ODBC querying, and port the results out to Excel for pivot tables or emailing, etc depending on need. I also embed Word docs in Access reports for mailshots and so on. So there's efficiency and capability dividends in interoperating...

122   astrid   2007 Mar 27, 9:55pm  

Peter P,

Download Open Office and try that first.

123   Different Sean   2007 Mar 27, 10:44pm  

I downloaded something called Star Office once, never installed it... :|

124   Different Sean   2007 Mar 27, 11:13pm  

hmm, just read about the openoffice-staroffice link. They have a built-in PDF writer, I had to get some flaky freeware thing called PrimoPDF to do that...

As Sun said, it was cheaper to buy another office suite company than it was to buy 42,000 MS-Office licenses for its employees...

There's a lot of mess in MS-Office, lack of consistency of interfaces and some funny dialogs and so forth, and MS-Access uses a mess of ADO and DAO technologies etc. However, I use VBA across all apps, especially in Access to automate a lot of stuff for our business, such as processing e-mail attachments and reading them into tables, and automation into our ERP, including producing a whole alternative front-end...

125   astrid   2007 Mar 27, 11:22pm  

I use Open Office on my new laptop. The interface can be a little clunky for new users, but all the functionality is there. It's good if you're not a heavy Office user at home.

126   DinOR   2007 Mar 27, 11:44pm  

"More than 40% of Newark homeowners spend more than half their income on housing" (NYT)

Uh... that's "normal" right? Sheesh.

127   DinOR   2007 Mar 27, 11:53pm  

Jimbo,

I figured as much. Many times an "investor class" share is offered without ANY load but often reps quote the "A" share b/c it has the longest track record. They rec'd NASD approval as the new share class (while identical) had zip historic data.

1% is actually pretty low in terms of overall transactions expenses, mgmt. and service. Merrill is about 2% and most are in between. My guess is the rep probably feels you are well established in your field, know everybody that's worth knowing and is at least attempting to leverage your referral base. Throw the guy/gal a few bones and see if s/he will negotiate down even a little further?

128   DinOR   2007 Mar 28, 12:02am  

What is the deal with the death threats!?!

First John at forsakencraft, the Marin site and I think Mr. Overvaluedblogspot was coerced or given "hush money" to cease and desist! HIM, I could see. He had his "Realtwhore of the Week Spotlight" that identified actual realtwhores and the link to their web-site etc.

Mr. Flippersintrouble doesn't name names (but gets the rest of the dirt to a "t"). C'mon perma-bulls, it's only money! Besides it's not like we were insulting your religion, right? :)

129   astrid   2007 Mar 28, 1:11am  

Greg Shrock,

Can you source that? My understanding is that the payout process comes after a long drawn out auditing process, and that it could take months or years before a check is cut to the depositor. I know this was the case in the 70s and 80s, but the policy may have changed since then.

130   lex   2007 Mar 28, 1:35am  

Against this backdrop, Sen. Charles Schumer (news, bio, voting record), D-N.Y., chairman of the Joint Economic Committee, and some other lawmakers said the Fed should be open to cutting interest rates.

"Another reason to be open to an easing of monetary policy is the concern that the housing market adjustment is far from over," Schumer said. "Recent housing data has offered little encouragement that the market might be stabilizing. So it is still too early to tell if the worst is over for the housing market," he added ...

The market is eventually stabilizing (prices going back to the mean) and this asshole wants to pump it further???

131   Randy H   2007 Mar 28, 1:56am  

That's it DinOR! I've had it with you! If I ever find you...

...I'm going to buy you a Leinenkugel.

132   Bruce   2007 Mar 28, 1:59am  

astrid:

When Hamilton Bank in Miami failed in 2002 more than $46mm in 3300 accounts were uninsured. Since then the FDIC has been selling Hamilton assets to cover the uninsured deposits. They've restored about 85% to each of them to date.

I don't know how promptly insured deposits were addressed, but the time it takes them to address uninsured deposits may be behind reports of audits and delays.

133   sfbubblebuyer   2007 Mar 28, 2:01am  

Politicians bug me almost as much as Realtors.

134   DinOR   2007 Mar 28, 2:08am  

Leinenkugel? They still make those? Outstanding!

I remember "Little Kings Cream Ale" (those were extree good)

I realize Michelle (Malkin) isn't exactly pop pop popular here but her message is to 1) Report threats to law enforcement, and 2) Keep' on blogging! Refuse to be bullied by anonymous cowards. I think we can all agree on that.

135   DinOR   2007 Mar 28, 2:16am  

Lex,

A few posts back I kind of dramatized the issue but I think there's little denying that "most" in America just "want this behind them". Personally I'm a little ashamed for them? They've had a decade long run of nothing but flipper profits and MEW extraction yet STILL seem to be against the ropes?

Now durn'it I can see if we had ten years of ever DECLINING values and seeking some form of "relief" but this is ridiculous! What's the msg. here?

Save us from ourselves?

136   Bruce   2007 Mar 28, 2:21am  

When a bank fails, the FDIC usually taps a healthy bank to step in and take over the insured deposits. Depositors have access to their insured funds the next business day.

Custormers with deposits over the insured limit get "receivership certificates" from the FDIC for the amount of the uninsured funds. As the FDIC sells off the assets of the failed bank, it makes peroidoc payments on those certificates.

The buyers of the failed bank is allowed to change the interest rate on acquired deposits [...] Savings and loans that went under during the 1980s were often paying exorbitant interest to attract deposits. That added to the ultimate $150 billion dollar cost of the S & L crisis.

If deposit rates are changed, customers can close accounts without early withdrawal penalties. But if the terms remain the same, customers are obligated to stick with their deposits.

Loan terms cannot be changed by a bank failure.

Sarasota Herald Tribune, March 28, 2007

137   astrid   2007 Mar 28, 2:33am  

Bruce,

Thanks, so only the uninsured funds are affected, right?

138   Bruce   2007 Mar 28, 2:44am  

astrid:

Please note they describe the simplest possible case - a healthy bank.

But AFAIK it's only uninsured funds subject to these particular delays.

How was the sourdough?

139   skibum   2007 Mar 28, 2:50am  

Just as Randy predicted, we now have a noticeable peppering from goldbugs and a sense of paranoia creeping into this thread...

140   Bruce   2007 Mar 28, 2:57am  

Same article outlines strategies and pitfalls of expanding FDIC coverege for married couples. Loners are pretty much SOL:

http://www.heraldtribune.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070305/BUSINESS/703050572/-1/140154

I must look into tinyurl.

141   skibum   2007 Mar 28, 3:01am  

Buying T-Bills through a broker like Schwab or ETRADE or TD Ameritrade is the safest way to park your money, safer and more convenient than buying CDs.

I have a chunk in T-Bills as well, but I bought directly through the Treasury. It's actually pretty easy to set up an account and use it, and you can buy multiple product types, including bonds, bills, and TIPS.

142   DinOR   2007 Mar 28, 3:07am  

"directly through the Treasury"

As a matter of fact I believe it's called "Treasury Direct". :)

143   skibum   2007 Mar 28, 3:09am  

DinOR,

Yeah, yeah, always the comedian...

For those interested, www.treasurydirect.gov

144   DinOR   2007 Mar 28, 3:21am  

skibum,

Well...? It was one of those obvious ones.

I direct clients this way b/c it keeps ROA down especially when it's nothing they couldn't do for themselves. Particularly charitable accts. etc. What escapes a lot of people is that if you start investing early enough in life you really don't have to take much if any risk.

145   skibum   2007 Mar 28, 3:21am  

OT, but here's a transcript of Bendover Ben's testimony in Congress that has caused some of the market turmoil today.

http://money.cnn.com/2007/03/28/news/economy/bernanke_remarks/index.htm?postversion=2007032810

This is getting more and more interesting...

146   Peter P   2007 Mar 28, 3:29am  

Jon and astrid, Thanks for your suggestions.

I will download OpenOffice and keep Microsoft Office in mind. There is not much of a discount on eBay even for an old version of Office like 2003.

147   Peter P   2007 Mar 28, 3:32am  

I downloaded something called Star Office once, never installed it… :|

I think StarOffice is similar to OpenOffice. Thanks for mentioning anyway. :)

I need a strong word processor with good real-time spell checking because I am a horrible typist. (I use only 4 fingers to type.)

148   Peter P   2007 Mar 28, 3:34am  

Benover said that economic expansion would continue and the market reacted badly. Hmm....

149   skibum   2007 Mar 28, 4:06am  

Benover said that economic expansion would continue and the market reacted badly. Hmm….

He didn't *really* say that. IMO, he spouted all these reasons for a recent economic slowdown, particularly housing (yeah!), and despite all this bad news, the economy would continue to hum along. No one believed him, is what happened. Who can blame them?

150   Peter P   2007 Mar 28, 4:37am  

what’s your email address?

I just sent you an email.

151   Peter P   2007 Mar 28, 4:38am  

Office 2007 is great. The UI is so much better than what went before and what is out there.

I heard great things about it too. However, I do not have Vista. I think it should run on XP SP2 but I am not sure.

152   EBGuy   2007 Mar 28, 4:47am  

This seems like a somewhat on topic hijack. I am considering rolling a 401k from a former company into a WellsTrade IRA. They offer free trades to accounts with certain "combined" balances (checking, savings, CDs etc). Does anyone have any experience with WellsTrade. I currently have some accounts with Wells"There is no subprime problem here"Fargo. Is rolling over a 401k fairly easy to do?

153   sobs   2007 Mar 28, 4:59am  

More wheels come off and the sparks from the rims are starting to show.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601170&sid=alOjASNOLKcQ&refer=home

P.S. Regrettably, DinOR is completely wrong about index versus active funds. There is no evidence that active managers have any timing skills, nor is there any evidence that advisors have any timing skills either. Buy some low cost funds, appropriately diversified among asset classes, and sleep like a baby. If minor fluctuations bother you, then you need to be reminded that there is no such thing as a free lunch, expected returns come from taking some risks, and if you really cannot stand it, accept that you're going to get less buying CDs - spreading the money around if you've got more than $100k - or Treasuries.

154   DinOR   2007 Mar 28, 5:23am  

"appropriately diversified among asset classes"

"sleep like a baby"

"no such thing as a free lunch" (yawns)

Actively managed funds/portfolios don't HAVE to outperform year in and year out to establish their value to clients. Even one break out year can have a meaningful impact to your net worth over time.

Punchbowl, since no one here has shared that they will be inheriting huge gobbs of cash is your position that if we were born without money then we weren't meant to have any? Younger investors SHOULD be more aggressive! Why is that such a revelation to you?

The media has the tail wagging the dog by being solely focused on expenses. If you think starting, operating and managing a COMPLIANT fund is THAT cheap I certainly invite you to do so. Good luck telling the NASD there's no need for auditing or compliance b/c afterall you're just a feel good index fund. Let me know how that works out.

155   Peter P   2007 Mar 28, 5:27am  

My instinct tells me that a passive, buy-and-hope, index-investment strategy is not very good.

156   requiem   2007 Mar 28, 5:30am  

Peter P: You can try the similar route of buying a few good companies and ignore them for a few decades.

157   Peter P   2007 Mar 28, 5:31am  

In a zero-sum game, you have to go out and (legally) snatch money from other market participants in order for you to have any real growth. Index-investing is quite far from that. True, you will be compensated for puting your money at risk, but that is merely compensation, not profits.

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