patrick.net

"The economy is in a raft going down a “Deliverance” style financial white- water rapids BACKWARDS and in circles but going REALLY FAST and even breaking speed records"

Haha! I'd liken it to another film too, Herzog's Aguirre, where RE speculators are slowly consumed by the jungle and their own madness, chasing after the fabled "El Dorado"...

I will have to rent that one. (It sounds familiar somehow… )

Perhaps you recall the film's mad star, Klaus Kinski, lived in Langunitas in his later years. And yeah--he was Natassja Kinski's father. Another movie to watch is Fitzcarraldo

"We saw a documentary “My Best Fiend”, (not a typo) awhile back that was about Herzog and Kinski’s relationship...A few years back she used to see Kinski often, hanging out in front of a breakfast place on “B” Street in San Rafael"

"My Best Fiend"--saw that too. Remember the scene from Cobra Verde, weilding a machete? Man, that guy had some manic energy...truly frightening. Still, would've been cool to meet the guy. A prof of mine lived next to Kinski, who saw him one day, arms draped around a pony's neck, bawling his eyes out. Sad guy.

All,

Just returned & read all the posts from last 24hrs. I'm sorry about the increasing politicization of the previous thread and if my own comments helped to fan the flames higher.

We obviously all have strong opinions on politics and the response to Hurricane Katrina's aftermath, but as many pointed out, these are discussions best reserved for a different kind of blog. This one is about housing (and possibly Firefly).

Thanks to Prat for providing much needed levity and perspective, and thanks to SactoQt for starting this new thread.

Serfer-X

I truly have no idea what you just said.

Jack

I just deleted most of the nights posts, do you think it was enough?

That's a good point Jack. I'll look at another thread and see if the email address or IP is the same. It'll take a minute.

Same email Jack. And I think the last post sounds familiar. I just thing the cheif justice thing has him in rant mode.

Surfer-X

I truly think that any appointment by Bush that is too conservative will be blocked by any means possible. How many fillibusters have there been already over federal judge appointments? A couple at least. I've also heard political commentary that indicates the unlikelihood that regardless of how the supreme court is stacked that Roe v. Wade would ever be overturned. It's been around so long and the majority (as far as I'm aware) of the population support it. It's expected that the social upheaval would outweigh the desire of the conservative justices. Sandra Day O'Connor has said that she voted to keep Roe v. Wade just for that reason.

In San Luis Obispo there is a fucking church on every corner, worse in Cambria, every 1/2 block. Keep your “god” out of my wife’s womb, or give the people who have the children the money to give the child a decent fucking life. I am so sorry people because I just rant and rant, but I don’t know what the fuck to do.

Vote. Encourage others to vote. Can you image if the 50% who don't vote did??? It could change the whole framework of this country.

I gotta log off for awhile. Please behave all. ;)

I'm fine with the popular vote, it's all good with me. The whole vote thing would work. Hear me out. Most of the voters who vote now are the boomers and the elderly. The 18-25 vote is virtually nil. Again 50% of the population doesn't vote. If they did, screw the boomers, they're not powerful enough to outweigh the rest of us if we'd just vote. I vote, but soooooo many people I know don't bother. I'm tired of people who don't vote complaining about how things are.

Btw. I have a unique view on the whole pro-choice issue. I'm for it, I think it's necessary. But, I was adopted as a child before Roe v. Wade and I know if I had been concieved later, weeeeell, I wouldn't be here talking to you good people. I also have never had a pregnancy scare. Birth control is plentiful and effective and if actually used can pretty much prevent most unwanted pregnancy's. I've know women who've had 4-5 abortions because they were too lazy to use birth control and were then unable to have children. Did you know that every time a woman has an abortion it scars her womb? It does. But I still think a woman should have the right, and no woman should ever bear a child out of rape or incest.

Sacto, I don’t think there ever should be a question as to reproductive issues as women should be the only ones who decide when where and what a woman should do with their bodies.

I hear you loud and clear.

Surfer-X

My dad is also extremely passionate about the issue. I'm pretty sure it's saved his bacon some time in the past. And you seem very passionate about so many issues. Are you always like this or is the blog a place to vent. Me? I'm usually pretty even tempered. I figure I'll worry about it when the time comes. I don't think it's worth getting an aneurysm until I know for sure I need to get angry about something.

Surfer-X

I'm sorry if things have been hard. I guess I'm lucky to still feel glad to be here. My upbringing was less then stellar, but I'm learning that's more often the case than not. Oh well, move on. I know from your posts that you have a fabulous sense of humor and I for one am glad you're around to talk to us.

Well Jack, it looks like you've logged off too. Just as well, we can't seem to stay OT no matter what.

Well Jack, it looks like you’ve logged off too. Just as well, we can’t seem to stay OT no matter what.

Geez... should I take back what I posted earlier? I guess this is now the 'anything you're passionate about' blog.

Geez… should I take back what I posted earlier? I guess this is now the ‘anything you’re passionate about’ blog.

I am really passionate about food. Should we talk about sushi or Prime(tm) steak? :)

Anyway, my feel is... rate hike at measured pace until 4.5% - 5%. I guess we will hear more and more from the FED about hw "robust" our economy still is even after Katrina and that risks of inflation remain elevated.

Harm

I'm so so sorry. I deleted a bunch of inflamatory stuff, and then got into another completely random discussion with Surfer-X. I'm thinking about re-posting a "why so emotional?" blog. Tempers are a flarin' these days.

Peter P

I think the fed is going to keep raising rates too. I think the risk is greater if they don't for fear of sending "weak economy" signals out by not continuing the rate hikes as planned.

SactoQt, there is no more ways to spin this any more. Whatever signal the FED sends, it will be taken as a bad signal sooner or later.

We are actually in a situation that is very similar to 1999/2000. I was amused by the market seemingly cheering only at bad news.

The credit/liquidity bubble is undeniable. Its end is also near.

We are actually in a situation that is very similar to 1999/2000. I was amused by the market seemingly cheering only at bad news.

I'm not sure I understand the market cheering at bad news part.

Stanman

It really isn't what you think. I'm often more conservative in my opinions and thought there was value in much of what you said. The problem is that when people start arguing back and forth vs. having a real discussion that's on topic it contaminates the whole thread and no one really ends up participating. Surfer-X's comments do not represent my feelings but he wasn't engaging in an argument so I left them. If you find them particularly offensive, then heck, I'll go ahead and delete those too. Why not, this has not been a particularly productive thread. Maybe I should take the whole post down. I'm too tired to keep this up.

To be fair Jack suggested I delete his comments too. I'm sure he'll feel contrite tomorrow.

I'm not a Bush basher at all. I heard on the news a number of times that the Governor of Louisiana didn't request Federal aid when it would have done any good. It has also been said by a couple of media outlets that Bush wanted to get aid out asap but was hindered because of her inaction.

I’m not sure I understand the market cheering at bad news part.

The market was/is reacting postively to negative news (e.g. Katrina 2005) while reacting negatively to positive news (e.g. good employment numbers 1999/2000). Basically it was/is declaring itself a liquidity bubble.

Censorship is a tool for suppressing opposing views, nothing more. We can put a nice perfume on it to make it sound like it has a noble purpose. But the stench of censorship wafts through that. This is clear to any who step back from the specific situation and consider the broader ramifications of censorship. Who’s views are to be censored? What is acceptable, and what is not? Who decides? There are no unbiased people in the world, so there will never be an unbiased censor.

We may not like what some people say. We may disagree with their view. We might even find it offensive. If so, then we should speak our view and our objection. But censorship is a very weak response. We will not all find the same things offensive. Some people are easily upset and some are not. Never shall we be able to please everyone. No serious exploration of any topic can be completed if we are to avoid all areas of potential sensitivity. Censorship is the death of intelligent discourse.

I hope this forum will return to intelligent exploration.

On the other hand, there is certainly some value to be gained from having rules, provided the rules do not restrict the expression of viewpoints on the topic.

Some examples include “all posts should have some connection to the topic” and “No use of profanity” etc.

The response to rule violations must be uniform, regardless of how or by whom the rule is violated.

The most fundamental issue to determine is whether this forum is to be a discussion board that allows and explores differing viewpoints, or shall it be a “feel good” club, limited to like minded people and harmonious comment.

Jack, It is not possible for me to judge the comments by Iceman because I can’t read them. I gather that his comments were offensive and censored.

In looking back through the thread I find flagrant and repetitiously offensive comments by serfer-X left uncensored. So what is the standard for censorship. Who’s books shall be burned and whose shall be kept. Make some rules and enforce them evenly.

Jack, I do not know the history of MP so I can’t judge. During the limited time that I have spent on this board I never saw anything that would cause me to care one way or the other about his posts.

Jack, It is one thing to censor profanity including racial slurs. But this board seems to allow flagrant profanity. I don’t think it is good to allow it. Some profanity (such as racial slurs) is more broadly offensive than other profanity. But it is all offensive. Where will you draw the line?

If you allow some profanity and bashing, when is it ok to insult and bash, and when is it not?

Fill me in. Why was MP evicted?

Ok, So, I see that MP was considered to be disruptive to the value of the forum and (between your comments and what I remember of prior discussions) ignoring him was not practical.

Jack, I recognize that some people will be destructive to the value of this forum. Perhaps they are offensive (not because they disagree). Some are a problem because of how they post, or because they push the board away from the topic, or because they clog things up in general. Certainly a person can do these things without breaking specific rules, so rules will not cover all situations.

You ask what is wrong with a vote (to evict). Unfortunately, the very process of a vote is disruptive to the dialog of the board, and is subject to the happenstance of timing – voting is limited to those online at the moment. Voting works, but it is awkward if the need is more than a rare occurrence.

I don’t know how the mechanics of the website work, but it seems that the only efficient way to keep the forum on topic and away from profane insults, bashing and jamming is to have one person responsible for each topic thread, and have that person be the judge using a standard that is not influenced by topical bias or opinion.

I am only a visitor here. I share my observations for your consideration.

Oy Vey!
It seems trying to keep the blog civil is a no win. If I delete I offend, if I don't delete I offend.

Zephyr

I meant what I said earlier, it's the arguing back and forth that got deleted more than the context. It has a lot to do with 'I'm right you're wrong, so there.' Surfer-X can be offensive, but at the time no one was arguing with him or complaining so I let it stand. If there had been a large outcry that would be different. As it is there aren't any uniform rules, and I'm thinking it's time there should be.

What say you all?
Profanity?
Arguing in attack mode?
Content-- racism, politics etc.?
What kind of rules would you like?

Btw I'm going to be out most of the day, so I won't be here to delete today, and so things are going to have to run their course. Hopefully by the end of the day there will a consensus on a uniform rule of conduct that can allow us to proceed without all this nonsense.

Iceman

I'm sorry you feel slighted. I'm also sorry that you can't see how bringing race into the argument could be construed as offensive. I am not a liberal, and I don't vote liberal. I'm kind of a weird republocrat type who is more socially liberal but fiscally conservative. I try to be tolerant but there were two very quick votes to bump you off the thread. I didn't try to block you though, I never contacted Patrick and attempted to have you evicted, I simply deleted comments that there were quick, strong responses to. I am more than willing to listen to your arguments if you would just please try to keep in mind that there are some hot button issues that are perhaps best avoided. This is after all a HOUSING blog and all the discussions about politics are probably best had elsewhere.

Iceman

One standard that has been uniformly agreed upon is no personal attacks. You only prove yourself wrong when you do that. If they continue I will contact Patrick and have you blocked from the site.

I gotta go, please everyone try to behave like adults.