patrick.net

I save even more money by not having a wife.

Lol, I won't even comment.

I still don’t see how you can make millions by being frugal and investing a modest disposable income. I’m not saying it’s impossible, just unlikely without some serious luck. The vast majority of people wouldn’t end up with millions even if they took 50% of their salary during their entire working lives and invested it all in some diversified index funds. Even investing their entire salary wouldn’t get most of them into the millions.

It absolutely can be done. I'm not talking tens of millions, but enough to comfortably retire on. My husband's the math guru, but he really did show me how it's possible.

The friend I mentioned that had saved so much also has frugal parents. (from whom he's learned his saving ethic) His father's a retired school teacher and his mom worked for Cal Farm ins before she retired. They lived very frugally most of their lives and were able to pay cash to build their dream house. They now live comfortably with the house paid off, no debt, a teachers pension and enough savings to last them their whole retirement. I don't know that they earned all that much over their whole career's but without investing in anything risky, they have a secure retirement. I'm not saying they're millionaires (I don't know how much they actually have) but they are without fianacial worries. That would be enough for me, I don't need to live an extravagant lifestyle or have a lavish retirement.

So I would suggest that the results from the feminist movement, when analyzed in a logical way, have been far from uniformly positive. I certainly think that women should get equal pay for equal work, but the feminists have created an environment where people (especially women) look down on women that choose to raise their children. Personally, I think everyone has different priorities and political correctness should not get in the way of women pursuing whichever avenue they prefer best.

There is a lot of truth in what you say. Fortunately for me, there is a much broader acceptance of women like me who choose to stay home. I'm encountering more and more stay at home mom's and I think it is such a positive thing. My hope is that my generation is going to start valuing family more and consumption less. But right now it's hard to see that being the case with all the conspicuous consumption going on. Maybe it's the boomers driving the consumerism right now and things will change as they retire, (and dare I say die off) at least I hope so.

Face Reality

I think the key has to do with keeping your money in a combo of stocks/bonds/cash at varying levels and adjusting how much you have in each as the market moves one way or another. The idea is to keep your returns as high yet predictable as possible. I am not an investment advisor (my husband is) so don't take my advise too literally as it loses something in the translation.

Maybe if you’re a sophisticated active investor you can pull it off, but I’m not even sure about that. Mutual fund managers certainly can’t do it.

It is because mutual funds do not engage in active trading. They just buy-and-hope baskets of stocks.

Hey East Bay Renter, thanks for the reminder about that book. I"ve been meaning to read it for a long time and kept forgetting about it. I'm going to buy it this weekend.

That sales are down, but prices are up, simply shows that those who insist on making purchases right now are subscribing to the RE dream.

Slower sales in the lower-end will also cause the median price to go up.

I visited a site which shows what realtors think of the market conditions within their particular area, and I came across this analysis from a realtor regarding the S.F. housing market and thought it was kind of interesting.

"...San Francisco: Median price sales of single family homes, condos & 2-4 unit buildings for the month of August in the City was $820,000 down from $849,000 in July

Nob Hill: The median price sale was $1,307,500 in August compared to $975,000 in July. This is a significant increase which seems to have been caused by a high price sale, $2,895,000, in August.

North Beach: The median price sale was $820,000 in August down from $900,000 in July.

Russian Hill: The median price sale was $1,001,000 in August compared to $800,000 in July. This again is a significant increase which appears to have been caused by a high priced sale, $5,000,000, in August.

Telegraph Hill: The median price sale was $1,860,000 in August compared to $1,300,000 in July. This again was impacted by a larger than normal sale, $4,550,000, in August.

An assessment of the San Francisco market would appear that prices are holding with many areas starting to drop slightly. The increases we have seen appear to have been the result of individual high sales."

Anyway, I thought it was interesting to see how the sale of one or two homes could affect or manipulate the stats of an entire district. Then again, this is the city of San Francisco we're talking about.

Van Kouver

I heard your argument about women in the workplace before, and even though I consider myself an independant woman, well-- it's still hard to argue your points.

I feel that society has actually suffered because of the mass entry of women into the workplace not just economically but socially. Before I had kids I was a school teacher and I saw a lot of kids at loose ends because both parents worked; I knew at that point that once I had kids I would stay home if I could. Fortunately I have been able to do that.

Another social effect has been the rise in divorce. I know a lot of women who would argue that the "old" way of staying home was just making them dependent on the men and staying in marriages only for financial reasons. That may be true to an extent, but I think that women have become so competitive in terms of their careers that they are putting them ahead of marriage and family. I don't see that as a positive side effect. I've also seen women who leave a marriage as soon as it starts to become difficult because it's easier than working it out and since they can support themselves they have no incentive to stay. I think people leave their marriages way to easily anymore.

And of course there is the economic effects. The cost of everything has gone up as a result of the extra money in the household. I also think that the extra income begets more spending on non-essentials and that has contributed to the debtor society we now live in. It's funny, when I was a young woman I assumed I would be the career go getter when I got older, but once I had kids my mindset really changed. I don't regret staying home at all. I don't miss the non-essentials I could have if I worked because the "cost" to my family would be too high.