patrick.net

Here's a music video of a Boston band, Extreme, now well over 20 years ago, but it's still valid even today.

What you see is still a part of Boston's rich culture of outdoor music, audience participation, & a general sense of community, when it's not winter-time ...

http://www.youtube.com/embed/I-h4A7bF8wQ

APOCALYPSEFUCKisShostikovitch says

the J Geils shit they used to play

J Geils rock, or at least, they used to, back in ancient times ...

http://www.youtube.com/embed/w5h0A1u-XsE

rooemoore says

My mom's side of the family came to California in 1842. Over the years I've had ancestors who've lived all over the state, including SF.

The truth is San Francisco has ALWAYS been considered dirty, and filled with degenerates. It has also ALWAYS been expensive.

But hey, I love San Francisco. I also like Boston and Philly.

SF and LA prices were comparable in the 1980s. Monthly payments today are the same in LA adjusted for inflation as in 1980s. Not so in SF. SF is still stuck in a tech boom.

Rin says

vibrant music scene plus an avant-garde bohemian thing going on

Um, the musicians and "avant-garde bohemians" all got priced out of SF, mostly during the 1st tech boom, while the rest got booted this last downturn, quickly replaced by geeky, yet oh so trendy software engineers, so I am not sure what you were expecting, maybe a Summer of Love Haight-Ashbury Revival?

Next time try Oakland.

We need to clone Charlie Manson and release a couple of dozen into the SF homeless/hippie scene to give SF a publicity bump.

Indiana Jones says

Rin says

vibrant music scene plus an avant-garde bohemian thing going on

Um, the musicians and "avant-garde bohemians" all got priced out of SF, mostly during the 1st tech boom, while the rest got booted this last downturn, quickly replaced by geeky, yet oh so trendy software engineers, so I am not sure what you were expecting, maybe a Summer of Love Haight-Ashbury Revival?

Next time try Oakland.

I was expecting Boston but what I saw was Philly.

Perhaps what's always buffered the city of Boston is that during any academic year, there are upwards of 100K students living in the city, not including the 'burbs, where the grand total could swell up to 200K. The so-called musicians and such, seem to mingle with this crowd first, before adopting the region as a whole.

And then, the more traditional neighborhoods, like an East Boston for instance, have retained their soul over the decades. And sure, most everyone's priced out of downtown/Back Bay but it isn't all that necessary to be exactly there, as there are plenty of gatherings of like minded folks, all over the place.

BTW, considered one of the worst (or cheesiest) songs of the 80s, here's Marty Balin & Grace Slick, paying homage to San Francisco ...

Starship's "We Built This City"

http://www.youtube.com/embed/K1b8AhIsSYQ

Ouch. That Starship song mentions at least three cities and the video adds several more; it isn't a homage to SF. While living in SF, Grace Slick wrote this:

http://www.youtube.com/embed/WANNqr-vcx0

And Otis Redding and Steve Cropper wrote this:

http://www.youtube.com/embed/PyxLaHmOaYM

Well of course, Jefferson Airplane's "White Rabbit" is pure classic rock. No argument on that point.

But that was a *Summer of Love* track, think Haight-Ashbury era, not a homage towards SF.

As for SF dedications, here's Harry Chaplin's "Taxi"

http://www.youtube.com/embed/4qYU9b5OF8M

And Blue Image's "Ride Captain Ride"

http://www.youtube.com/embed/UAx9h_R23PQ

curious2 says

Ouch. That Starship song mentions at least three cities

Tossing Abe Lincoln's memorial in there, doesn't make it a DC tribute. The idea behind that quip was to show that Honest Abe approved of all the great work that Jefferson Airplane/Jefferson Starship/Starship did for American culture. Basically, it's like saying that Abe handed them a Frank Lloyd Wright award for cultural greatness.

That Starship song also mentions "The City That Never Sleeps," which would be New York, certainly not SF which has last call at 1:30a and rolls up the sidewalks at 2. It also mentions Cleveland or something, and a lot of the video was shot in Las Vegas. And, it was written by Brits, not SF natives. So, even though the song mentions the Golden Gate Bridge, you can't fairly blame it on SF.

Well, here are the two of the Boston area's classic rock mainstay masterpieces:

Aerosmith's "Dream On":

http://www.youtube.com/embed/yyfNHlqymP8

Boston's "More Than A Feeling":

http://www.youtube.com/embed/SSR6ZzjDZ94

I love "Dream On" but it isn't specifically about Boston; if you're going to credit Boston with every song ever written by everybody who ever lived there, then SF gets The Grateful Dead, Janice Joplin, and countless others, even Green Day and Creedence Clearwater Revival (SFBA). Even "More Than a Feeling" doesn't mention Boston, but the band is called Boston so I accept that one.

I think part of my point is that Tom Scholz/late Brad Delp of Boston, Steve Tyler/Joe Perry/etc of Aerosmith, Seth Justman/Peter Wolf of J Geils, Ric Ocasek/Greg Hawkes of The Cars, etc, are members of the Boston community and are actually accessible (of course within limits/privacy/etc) to those aspiring musicians and talents in the area.

Part of the reason why the aforementioned, didn't move to NYC or LA, upon achieving their millions is that they like to be a part of an actual community than being in some security detail zone on the upper east side Manhattan or Bel Air LA, living in isolation from others.

Someone put out the following article, which seems to highlight my issue against SF, as a souless city ..

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/feb/23/is-san-francisco-losing-its-soul

curious2 says

SF gets The Doors

?, not sure I follow. Definitely a band formed in Los Angeles.

Point well made, though. San Francisco has an incredible history of inspiring amazing music, popular or not. Still going. It's not the way we'd like it, but San Francisco still has a huge number of amazing bands and musicians.

FunTime says

?, not sure I follow. Definitely a band formed in Los Angeles.

Thanks - deleted - somehow I thought they moved from L.A. to SF, but maybe they were only staying temporarily in connection with their concerts in 1967 and 68.

donjumpsuit says

First of all, people on the west coast, let's just say the SFBay, but it extends to the whole west coast, don't know how to express themselves in a honest and sincere way, and moreover, don't know how to deal with people who do.

Well, I'm from the west coast and let me say this as honestly and sincerely as I am capable of: You're a moron.

Your rant is just another example of a common theme on Patnet: People who project their problems on "the other". In your case -- "Not my fault, no it's the people around me!"

donjumpsuit says

Personally I will miss Tahoe, and that's about it.

Hey, don't let Nevada hit your ass on the way out.

Rin says

Someone put out the following article, which seems to highlight my issue against SF, as a souless city ..

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/feb/23/is-san-francisco-losing-its-soul

Thanks for posting that article. I'm hopeful that the latter part of the article which suggests possible positive outcomes will prove to be more true than the doom and gloom. We'll see.

In his book From Counterculture to Cyberculture, he even argues that today's tech culture is a direct descendant of the hippy movement. The techies are far richer and aren't a counter-culture, but like some hippies they have the same sense of social mission to transform the world for the better with technology. Likewise the way that tech culture mixes work and play and emphasises personal growth has echoes of hippy life. "The same logic that was driving the counter-culture – and that continues to drive much of San Francisco today – is the very logic that drives Google," says Turner. "In a limited sense, the 1960s are turning around to bite San Francisco."

curious2 says

Thanks - deleted - somehow I thought they moved from L.A. to SF, but maybe they were only staying temporarily in connection with their concerts in 1967 and 68.

Of course they spent a lot of time here! ; ) San Francisco was the place to be in those days. Always something interesting going on in Los Angeles too.

donjumpsuit says

It will leave the Chinese and Mexicans to hash it out. Literally and figuratively.

Typical backwards, traditional, racist East Coaster! ; )

Good luck with so many generalizations. I don't find them useful, but they are darn funny!
One of the most fun realizations of my life was visiting New York City for the first time. I'd had all these generalizations built-up over years of movie and TV references to New York City. I just expected everyone out there to be an asshole. It was really awesome to get there and realize how dumb all those things I'd seen portrayed or had been told turned out to be.

The insistence on categorizing regions of people is really amazing and confusing. We all have much more in common than in difference.

donjumpsuit says

Kardashian mentality.

Feminism too much for ya? ; ) Again, I find these kinds of generalizations really funny. Of course, there's some truth to them, but it gets overblown.

The East Coast often seems quaintly old-fashioned when it comes to male/female roles. I'm surprised women still put up with it.

donjumpsuit says

rooemoore says

Well, I'm from the west coast and let me say this as honestly and sincerely as I am capable of: You're a moron.

And you're a bitch who knows the meaning of "sex sells"

Have an opinion instead of a sexy image and maybe people will take you serious .....

however, based on your posts ... I doubt it.

Dude, you're a troll. You make a very negative generalization about millions of people who live in a certain region. Now some trolls really believe the shit they spew, while the others just want a reaction. So you are either a moron and an asshole, or just an asshole. Either way, you're a troll.

donjumpsuit says

Who is the most famous woman in California.

Nancy Pelosi did what!?

donjumpsuit says

I guess you aren't ignorant or racist if you call a specific demographic a "loser". That's just a generic good time.

Yeah, I agree with you. My comments applied to all the generalizations not just yours.

donjumpsuit says

Now, ask yourself this. Why do you think there is no "Housewives of Boston"?

Well, right there you're showing yourself to be short on TV history. Doesn't the East Coast lead in that category? Unless you're just exempting Boston, which is fine, but that's not how TV works. Don't be surprised to find a Boston version someday.

donjumpsuit says

I said her Vagina was all over the internet, not she had the face that resembled a Vagina!

Excuse my confusion!

donjumpsuit says

Someone specifically points to that and calls me (personally) a moron.

I am not attacking a specific individual, but I get attacked back as such.

Seriously, get a grip.

I'm sorry I hurt your feelings. I thought you Bostonians liked people who let you know what they thought of you.

For the record, I updated my opinion of you to:
troll, asshole & possibly moron.

donjumpsuit says

Another reason for me living on the east coast, in the suburbs of Boston in specific, is I can be in a crowd of 1000 people, and see only white people.

In California I can be in a crowd of 1000 people, and I am the only white person.

Well to each his own. Some like diversity, some like sameness. People's skin color doesn't tell you much about them though. Humans have more in common than in difference.

donjumpsuit says

Another reason for me living on the east coast, in the suburbs of Boston in specific, is I can be in a crowd of 1000 people, and see only white people.

In California I can be in a crowd of 1000 people, and I am the only white person.

I missed that part or don't know to what you're referring. Your wife is of Asian descent?
Well to each his own. Some like diversity, some like sameness. People's skin color doesn't tell you much about them though. Humans have more in common than in difference.donjumpsuit says

Kind of like calling someone with a wife who is Asian a racist.

donjumpsuit says

Another reason for me living on the east coast, in the suburbs of Boston in specific, is I can be in a crowd of 1000 people, and see only white people.

In California I can be in a crowd of 1000 people, and I am the only white person.

Those are the extremes, but I have experienced them both.

Ok, so you're a white guy who wants to hang around only white people. Instead of Boston, maybe you should head someplace even more regressive....maybe Jackson, Mississippi (but stay on the "right side" of town)

As for Boston, don't pretend it hasn't undergo some major clean-up of its own. I remember the Red Light District right next to Chinatown. That was a mess.

As for outdoorsy stuff, you lose. You're going to try to match Maine/Vermont with Yosemite/Tahoe/Carmel/Mendocino? Okemo versus Squaw or Heavenly? Sea Kayaking in New England versus Monterey or Tomales Bay? Cycling--Boston loses. Climbing--Boston loses (Gunks versus Yosemite, Pinnacles and Tahoe). Surfing--Boston loses.

Yeah, autumn is beautiful but I wouldn't trade it for no mosquitos and year round cycling.

donjumpsuit says

Kind of like calling someone with a wife who is Asian a racist.

I'm clearly the moron here, not able to use the patnet controls.

I must of missed a post or something because I don't understand your comment about the wife from the Asian continent.

donjumpsuit says

Also, sorry you personally got offended by me generalizing the city and state and people you love so much as 'insincere', but really, acknowledging the problem, is the first step in fixing it.

I think the phrase you used was "backstabbing cunts". A tad bit more inflammatory than "insincere".
donjumpsuit says

Conversely, people in the Bay area are backstabbing cunts, who say one thing to your face, and lots of other bullshit to everyone else.

If some doofus on this site went on a rant about Boston being America's most racist city, or some other bs, I would gladly call them out just as I've done with you.
donjumpsuit says

Lastly,

Trolls do things to make people angry, and could care less about thier points, that was not my objective.

Yeah, sure. Your thesis on the mental and social state of West Coast inhabitants was thoughtful, balanced and insightful.

donjumpsuit says

Moron. Not with the credentials I got lady. Let's just keep it at asshole and we will agree to agree

I'm not so sure. You seem to really believe the bullshit you've dumped here. That combined with your poor writing skills has me leaning toward my first impression.

But hey, you're from Boston. You can handle being called a moron. It will help you sleep at night, right?

donjumpsuit says

The take home is that you know where you stand with almost everyone in Boston. Something that should make you sleep well at night.

So, I've spent about fifteen years around the Boston area, and about the same here in the bay area. Overall, people in both places just want to mind their own business, live their life peacefully, and enjoy life. As with all large populations, there are a whole bunch of crazies too.

Around Boston, the crazies are in-your-face loudmouths who know better than you how you should live your life, and they'll tell you loudly and constantly, it's their way or none at all. "It's windy today" will result in "Why don't you grow a pair or get out if you can't handle it."

In the bay area, we're surrounded by fragile little multi-cultural liberal snowflakes who will find a way to take offense to anything you say, so you have to deal with them like you're walking on eggshells. "What a bright sunny day today!" will result in "what do you have against rainy days?"

Both places are nice in their own way, and both are infuriating. If you don't like it, you can indeed move :). The people who have chosen to live in San Francisco like it enough to put up with the local bullshit in order to live there, it is their choice. The only sad part is that the city is so anti-development that the less affluent people who want to live there can't anymore.

donjumpsuit says

I am from Massachusetts and have many thoughts on the matter.

First of all, people on the west coast, let's just say the SFBay, but it extends to the whole west coast, don't know how to express themselves in a honest and sincere way, and moreover, don't know how to deal with people who do.

There is too much massaging and ball cupping out here (not the gay kind either). In Boston, people are sincere. If they don't like you, you will know it, but it doesn't ruin your day.

The take home is that you know where you stand with almost everyone in Boston. Something that should make you sleep well at night

One of the reasons why I'd brought up MA bands like J Geils, The Cars, Aerosmith, Boston is that I know of at least one person, who're either friends or acquaintances with at least one or more of the local artists.

And as you've stated, we all know where one stands, so if Tom Scholz (of Boston) is playing hoops with one of my old pals or Joe Perry (of Aerosmith) is showing another friend how to play certain guitar licks, well, that says a lot. That's a total of one or two degrees of separation.

The eastern transplants in SFBA, at least the ones I know of, basically say that the area is a dead zone, in terms of authentic interpersonal ties and a sense of community. One of them did get into music and was somewhat successful but even his ties with other artists and performers, were tenuous at best. He's been talking about coming back in MA, during the past couple of years.

When I visited New Orleans a couple of years ago, I heard a lady from Boston describe her time living California.

She said it was a place where the animal rights activists kick the dog on the way out to the animal rights rally, and the same people who are claiming to be involved in liberal causes for the oppressed have no idea how to be civil and decent in interpersonal relations with their own neighbors.

She said she didn't like it at all, and I have to admit, she nailed a quality of California liberal righteousness that fits. Political correctness laced with interpersonal malice, just a battering ram to be an ASSHOLE.

Interesting the notation of east coast authenticity versus the west coast pose. Some SoCal curiosities I've noticed, having moved from NYC to LA 6 years ago: valet parking for hamburger joints; sunglasses worn indoors; nobody will drive more than a mile to meet friends, but they'll sit in traffic for 2 hours to go to work; being late is considered on time (if somebody is rude enough to call someone out for being late, "traffic" is always to be blamed); office hours are 10:30 to 4:30; everybody dresses like they are going to the playground when they are going to work, or like they are going grocery shopping when they are going out to dinner.

There's lots of other bizarrities here, but the interpersonal thing is the most corrosive. And last call at 1:30 is an affront to taste and decency.

The most pervasive, even socially acceptable thing, is the insincere "blowing smoke up your ass."

Californians will make five different sets of plans with five different sets of people, then at the last minute, pick the one they think is "best" and then beg off the rest.

Even "friends" do it to friends, adding an even greater layer of insincerity and mild betrayal to what should be small tests of loyalty, forthrightness, regard, ethics and bonding.

Philistine says

Some SoCal curiosities I've noticed, having moved from NYC to LA 6 years ago: valet parking for hamburger joints; sunglasses worn indoors; nobody will drive more than a mile to meet friends, but they'll sit in traffic for 2 hours to go to work;

I think the expression, Californication, is about the Lala land of SoCal and its delusional denizens. And thus, I think folks are prepared for that, when they venture into LA county.

On the other hand, SF was suppose to be something special, completely unlike SoCal.

Ceffer says

Even "friends" do it to friends, adding an even greater layer of insincerity and mild betrayal to what should be small tests of loyalty, forthrightness, regard, ethics and bonding.

The aforementioned musician in SF, the guy who's originally from MA, is thinking of moving back because even though he's only 35, he's worried about dying alone in SFBA, esp if his girlfriend and him don't settle down long term. He doesn't want to spend his middle years in a place where ppl don't really know how to make friends and keep 'em. Right now, he counts his transplanted high school/college pals in CA, as his only true friends in the region. From my perspective, that's almost like being a part of a diaspora than a part of America.

Well, I'm sad to think of the kinds of Californians you all have met. I'm a transplant, but your descriptions don't fit my experience in the many years I've been here. I immediately met incredible, genuine people who walk the talk. Good luck finding new friends! The ones you've made so far sound horrible!

I think they're mis-characterizing all Californians as those NIMBY busybodies and activist poseurs, just like they accuse Californians of mischaracterizing east coasters. The sort of people they talk about it are easily encountered in Berkeley, hipster enclaves of San Francisco, etc. Like I said before, most people are the good, friendly, caring sort and the fringe is what sullies the image.