patrick.net

SQT,

You are my hero(in). I also find the undertone of misogyny here a bit much at times. I really strains me that at least once on every thread someone makes a blanket statement that essentially declares that my wife is a [fill in your vitriol here].

I seriously don't understand why anyone would presuppose that they know what is best for all others. It is an arrogant, ironically "liberal" position to assume that you know how others should best live their lives.

Just keep in mind that the woman bashers are, with 100% positive correlation, the very men that are unsure of their own masculinity. If I weren't already married to a strong, intelligent, kickass woman, I'd be surely smitten by SQT.

Michael Holiday,

at age 39, I’m a “cusp” X’er. I have NOT had ANY good timing.

I’ve done nothing but play by the rules like they told me. I graduated high school. I joined the military and served my country. I joined the reserves when I got off active duty. I got a bachelors degree. I got an MBA.

I hear you. I'm making a generalization, of course. I'm 38, and I have hit some pretty rough spots in the past 5 years myself; which is why I went back for my MBA also. My point was that it only gets worse as you progress further into GenX. The younger GenX'ers didn't even have the hope for that which pisses you and I off for not getting.

Surfer-X: I won't even comment on X's last comment to my post, but he might be on to something. Boomers want the whole hog, if you know what I mean.

Randy: Yeah, I know where you're coming from. If I get hired by Honeywell, I might see if they would kick in a few bucks so I could get another masters degree in International Management from Thunderbird grad school. It's ranked #1 in International Business but would set me back over 60K. It's only worth it if they'll comp me some $$ towards tuition or forget it. It's just a vanity degree anyway.

Thunderbird grad school?

And I thought they were only purveyors of fine bum wine, did not know they had a "grad school" division. Must have something to do with the large bum wine profit margin.

.

surfer-x Says:

Thunderbird grad school?

'...did not know they had a “grad school” division. Must have something to do with the large bum wine profit margin.'

Ha, ha! Thunderbird wine is so bad, I tried it in the Army, it's so friggen' bad I had to hold my nose when I gulped, it then almost threw up. I couldn't drink that sh-t.

Thunderbird International Business school is a few blocks from my house in a suburb of Phoenix called Glendale, AZ. The school is, and has been, rated #1 in International Business. It's reputation is global, but it's price tag is stellarly-high.

Wouldn't mind going there, but it's very pricey. Nice diploma, though. It could open some doors in Silicon Valley. I might even be able to afford a condo after I paid off the tuition.

I swear, I'm a hair's breadth away from Bay Area law enforcement. I'm sure, with overtime, I could crack $100K. And even have half a pension in ten years. I could make 20 years worth of Arizona pension in ten, then come back here pimped out and maybe sell a few houses on the side for $$.

@Surfer-X & Michael Holliday,

I recommend spending some time reading up at: http://www.bumwine.com/

Red Whine should appreciate it too... not that he'd be caught dead actually drinking anything like that, of course.

Soo bad or so bad?

Soooooooooo bad...

Harm:

Ha, ha. Killer site. Never heard of Wild Irish Rose.

They make these wines expressly for bums. I read this story about it one time. Really sad.

Nobody, I mean nobody (except for maybe high school kids) drinks this
sh-t besides bums.

SQT,
You are my hero(in).

Ditto (and I'm not just saying that 'cause I'm trying to get into your pants --though I AM, of course). ;-)

I promised a serious analysis of this issue; with the threadmaster’s permission, I will try to put it up on Friday. right now it is a series of emails that need to be assembled into a coherent whole.

Joe,

All you need in order to get authoring rights is to register: http://patrick.net/wp/wp-register.php

Once you're successfully registered, let me know & I can give you those rights. I look forward to seeing your new thread.

***Its high school is Fremont High, where famous celebrities like Brian Boitano and Terry Hatcher graduated***

but what would Brian Boitano do?

Shmend Rick,

We're using the "twit majority" as proof of our arguments now? I remind you that the "twit majority" thought that debt=wealth, NAAVLPs=financial sanity and "it only goes up".

I've liked much of what you've posted here. Please don't earn the distinction of making my RSS newsfeed aggregator filter list. There are good women; there are bad women. There are good men; there are bad men. Life ain't fair. Dealing with it is a useful survival skill. Judge each person as they come.

New thread: So… Mr. Bernanke, what would you say ya do here?

Used home sales in Naples, FL down 50% in May. Prices continue to rise in the most unaffordable market in the country.

Many real estate agents going hungry. The dead money from unrealized sales is soring.

Patience boys and girls. The panic will be starting soon.

Randy H Says:

> SQT, You are my hero(in). I also find the undertone
> of misogyny here a bit much at times.
> Just keep in mind that the woman bashers are,
> with 100% positive correlation, the very men that
> are unsure of their own masculinity.

I have not read anything that I would call misogynistic recently. Most generalizations are “generally” true. I’ll try and say “most (but not all)” when I comment on a group of people. But just because someone writes “all 20 something chicks are nuts” does not mean that they hate woman it probably just means that they have dated 50 20 something women in a row and have not met a single one who:
1. Can name a top news story
2. Does not have a tribal tattoo on the small of her back
3. Can name a single elected official (other than Gavin Newsom and GW Bush)
4. Knows how to make a bed
5. Knows how turn a stove or oven on
6. Does not have at least six holes in her ears (and probably her belly button and nose)
7. Has not recently spent over $1,000 on jeans (and got less than 6 pair)
8. Does not expect you to respond to their unending text messages
9. Is not looking for a guy to spend tons of money on her

I could go on and on. The most disturbing trend I see in the increasing number of 20 something gals who are “large and in charge” and do not seem to get that guys will put up with a lot of crap from hotties who look like they could be in the Abercrombie & Fitch catalog, but not them. I have to deal with an increasing number of little chunksters (who have a fat pierced roll of goo hanging over the front of their $300 low rise distressed jeans and a matching tattooed roll of goo hanging out the back) who walk up and demand that you buy them (and the “little linebackers” they came with) a drink…

FAB,

With all due respect, your generalizations have been insulting to me, my family, and my life choices many times in the past. I recall about six months ago when you unknowingly declared that my family structure was "inferior". I'm sorry you have to endure such tragedy in your life, but when you make generalizations about "most but not all" you are merely self-excusing your own narrow perspective. You and I may agree on most financial and economic matters, but we part company when you suppose to know what's best for others. I'm not that liberal.

Seriously, you just sound like a grumpy old man complaining about piercings and tattoos just like the elders were complaining about you and I when we were their age.

Randy, you got some part wrong. FAB was boasting his conquests of young 20 something, 50 in a row, possibly over his half life time. Nevetheless, a marvelous achievement. Congratulations to FAB! Come to think of it, the number is a little sickening. But, I like variety, too.

I recommend a good Ouija board. I have one from c. 1975 I might be willing to part with for the right offer.

Please find out how things work before using them. Esoteric methods are not all the same. Some can have undesirable side effects.

SQT-

Thanks for proving my point for me. You're so threatened by the new generation of men who do all the domestic chores, all the cooking, the household finances, and breadwinning that the best you can do is
"you must be gay."

And, if I was, what would be wrong with that? "Bay Area tolerance" at its best.

Have fun engineering the next generation of "chubby divas".

SQT-

Gen X, not Y. Guess you haven't been reading my posts either!

I'm actually genuinely curious -- where do you live that you "don't see" any of this?

It's funny, last night I actually thought about your lambasting of my posts. The date I had last night, when I picked her up, she invited me in for about five minutes while she tied up a couple loose ends before we left for a show. The apartment looked like a tornado had struck it. Clothes and paper waste scattered literally everywhere. Cue tips on the floor like someone hadn't even aimed for the trash can. The sink so full of dirty dishes that you couldn't put one more cup in it. Like Former Apt Broker said, after seeing about 50 of these, you begin to draw some conclusions. It's only bizarre to hear a woman like yourself go into "defend and attack" mode rather than actually address how in the world it got to this point.

SQT-

Age 32.

"But I find the generalizations frustrating."

This is one of those times where I think "generalizations are generally true" -- at least of this one particular age group. And since I date exclusively within my age group (so far anyways), yes I'm a participant, not a victim.

Writing nasty generalizations, obviously I knew someone was going to take a swing at me, and let's be honest -- we were both swinging below the belt, that's just part of what goes down on these boards.

"And last time I checked, obesity was not gender specific. "

Don't tie any of that stuff to me -- while I'm not overweight, I'm not freaked out by a girl having a little extra weight, and frankly, I'm puzzled by people who have an extreme reaction to a little chub.

Red Whine,

Like Former Apt Broker said, after seeing about 50 of these, you begin to draw some conclusions. It’s only bizarre to hear a woman like yourself go into “defend and attack” mode rather than actually address how in the world it got to this point.

Unimpeachable logic. It must be that all the girls are the problem, not the one guy who has made the picks.

I'm sorry that you guys have managed to attract such misery and strife into your lives. You are clearly victims of an inequitable gender system that puts you at distinct disadvantages with regard to your relationships. I truly hope you find mates deserving of your well formed, mature perspectives.

Since we're using anecdotal life experience as evidence, I've found two truths to hold with certainty:

1) People mostly get what they deserve in a mate. Occasionally there's a mismatch, but after 10 (let alone 50), you're definitely finding exactly what you're seeking -- that is usually the best you are capable of attracting.

2) People who brag about their sexual exploits either directly or cleverly couched in subtle innuendo, are usually full of shit. Those who do so anonymously are almost always full of shit. Those who do so anonymously, off topic, on a blog are certainly full of shit.

Randy,

I haven't made any claims yet, so which ones am I full of shit about?

You're clearly looking for a fight, go take it somewhere else.

The whole reason I blog here in the first place is because it's a housing bubble blog that TENDS TO GO OFF TOPIC. Housing being my favorite topic, but when it spins off on "dating adventures gone wrong," sushi, and "favorite subcompact cars" -- that's what keeps me coming back.

But again, go pick your fight with someone else. I couldn't possibly be less interested in that.

American girls are like american real estate… way too expensive for what you get. bad p/e ratio. id just as well go meet some eager mexican girl… theyre nice, they want to pull thier own weight, usually good looking. The average american girl has been ‘flipped’ so many times I dont know what im getting.

...nothing more can be said. we've hit a new high of intelligent discourse on this blog.

I give it 3 months before we're the new Craigslist RE forum.

we’ve hit a new high of intelligent discourse on this blog.

Have you been to the Huh thread (not Duh)?

Randy,

In this thread, there have been plenty of accusations of people being "threatened" by this or that. On that note, why are you so threatened by the idea of men who insist on potential mates being 50% contributors? Isn't that what gender equality is supposed to be?

I'm sure you're going to twist this as Oedipal or something, but using my grandmother as the gold standard, a generation where women could truly "do it all", I don't think there is anything unreasonable about being disheartened by a generation where MANY (notice I did not say "all") of its women have shunned all thing domestic as beneath them. Real men cook and clean, but you know what? So do real women.

It's funny how "men are dogs" can be said over and over and over and everybody just chuckles, but when women are called to the carpet for undesireable trends, you feel the need to rush to their defense. From the looks of SQT, they don't need your feeble attempts at "chivalry", then can defend themselves just fine.

And dismissing high standards as "unintelligent" -- you can do better than that.

There is always the spam filter, right

Yep. I use a RSS Feed aggregator with a filter list I have labeled "asshats". Sadly, that list is growing.

I just love anonymous blogging big-talkers. They add such positive value to the discussion.

Btw, I would have categorized Have fun engineering the next generation of “chubby divas” as a bona fide Troll/flame bait and banned his ass for making a deeply personal insult were this my thread. I think an apology is in order for that shit. But since this isn't my thread, I guess it's filter/asshats/add-name.

Rick, ignore him, he's just looking for a fight.

Geesh, where do you guys find these generalizeably offensive women? I feel so innocuous now. The last three things my boyfriend chewed me out on were (1) going through a 25 lb bag of flour in 10 days (2) complaining about the lackluster non-Brad Birdness of "Cars" during the ending credits and (3) not reading and viewing TV programs in chronological order.

Astrid -
If you and your boyfriend only bicker over the little stuff, then life is good.

Where do I meet them? Geez, I guess I meet them all over. The last few girls I've met: In line at Starbucks, another a temp from work, and another a UCLA student that I met at a wine tasting (who failed to disclose that she was married!).
I know SQT disagrees with my harsh assessment, but it's just what I've discovered in the AGE GROUP that I date in. I'm 32, and am most comfortable sticking to the 30-35 yr old girls (not that I wouldn't make an exception, but I relate best to people my own age).

Also, upon reflection, I wonder if it could be that, once you reach your early 30s, maybe the dating pool has been stripped of many of the better candidates (many of the really "great catches" have gotten married and disappeared), and that I'm "bottom-fishing" a little bit. Also, having been with someone for 8 yrs up until very recently, maybe my expectations are a bit outdated.

another a temp from work,

Ahhh fishing off the company pier, always recommended.

surfer x-
They say "don't shit where you eat" -- but I was hungry, so I ignored this advice.

"I know a few single women in their 30’s and 40’s and they pretty much figure all the good men are taken."

I hear this a lot from my single female friends, but I usually take it to mean that the men aren't "marriage-minded". I think that's a big disconnect between 30-something men and women. The womens' clocks are ticking so they've accelerated the set of expectations, which doesn't always sit well with the men.

"And if a woman is divorced with children, most single men don’t want any part of that either."

As awful as it sounds, I'm in that camp. I'm too into traveling on short notice, sleeping in on the weekends, and having long unterrupted dinners with too much wine ....

"Also, since you found someone you could be with for a long time, whether you know it or not, you probably compare other women to her and find most lacking."

We were together 24-32, and REALLY grew apart. When one person changes with age the other doesn't, it's no good.

"I wouldn’t want to go back to the dating scene for anything."

Smart girl. The "good times" in a longterm relationship beat anything that can be found in the singles life. Especially the part where you're just totally comfortable with the other person. Reminds me of this exchange in Pulp Fiction:

Mia: Don't you hate that?
Vincent: What?
Mia: Uncomfortable silences. Why do we feel it's necessary to yak about bullshit in order to be comfortable?
Vincent: I don't know. That's a good question.
Mia: That's when you know you've found somebody special. When you can just shut the fuck up for a minute and comfortably enjoy the silence.

U2 Spy On You:

You're obviously a Tom Leykis listener. Without overgeneralizing (which seems to be the biggest point of contention on this thread-deviation/rantfest), there is a lot of truth to what you say, although I think the reasons why are terribly complicated and multifaceted. One thing I've always thought has been that people of both genders gravitate towards something they perceive to be "in demand" and/or difficult to obtain. If it comes easy, it is far less appealing. As a result, people are attracted to the worst types of mates (and overpriced housing, too).

I once worked in a store that sold used audio/video equipment and musical instruments. It never failed that, if we had trouble selling something, we'd put a sign up that said "Last One Left!" or similar, and then it would sell right away.

Rick,
That's hilarious. When I lived in the Bay Area, we called these guys "bus stop millionaires". I met so many guys who told tall tale after tall tale (usually about how rich they were[n't]) -- the girls would fall for it every time, and by the time a couple months went by and they began putting two and two together, the guys had already slept with them and scammed dinners, gifts, etc. off of them. Among the obvious clues:
1) The guys would never have a car (hence the "bus stop" part of their moniker).
2) They usually either lived with their parents or crashed at did the "sofa shuffle" between various friends' houses.
3) They always had some excuse as to why they were cashbroke, most often along the lines of how their countless millions were temporarily smartly invested, tied up in a legal dispute, otherwise unavailable, etc.

But the temporary delusion of having snared a millionaire jetsetter always seemd to cloud the obvious from these girls' view.

Yes, some of my fellow Gen Xers in SoCal are "actors" -- meaning they are waittresses and legal secretaries who go on a few auditions a year, swap headshots, and perform in these freebie local theater productions that are only attended by other non-actors. Every Monday morning they're talking about "box office receipts" for whatever movies had come out, which makes them feel like a participant in the world of Hollywood.

SQT,

My boyfriend claims to not like bread (not even parmesan artichoke rolls straight from a hot humid oven) and that I have a voice that carries. Cooking for him is kind of a pain, he doesn't eat any fresh vegetables unless they're served in restaurants.

I'm not convinced that women working is a good thing either, especially when this country lacks inexpensive childcare and the people who are having the most kids are the ones least prepared for them. It's so hard to raise well adjusted kids nowadays, even with a full time parent and tons of supervision.

About working moms:

There need not be a tradeoff between expensive childcare & working moms. This is a construct of the paradigm of the nuclear family. There is another paradigm, of extended family, which offers alternatives besides expensive childcare vs working moms.

There's more boxes we can think outside of besides the gotta-be-a-homeowner box. We can also strive to live outside of the nuclear family paradigm. Of course doing so would force many of us (including recent arrivals into Santa Clara County) to make other choices and compromises for example, not crowding ourselves from places all over the world into "Silicon Valley". It is just a value proposition (value as in "one's personal values", not as in money-value-proposition).

Yeah, his dislike of bread is quite depressing, since I bake bread to decompress. I guess I could give it to others, but it's a shame that I'm the only one eating them fresh from the oven.

He's not high maintenance per se, he just has the tastebud of a five year old. He likes salty, highly seasoned cuts of meat and pizza. He can't stand anything that has a slippery texture or require effort to eat.

Yeah. If I was making $300K a year, I'd make damned sure that at least half of that gets saved for a rainy day/retirement fund. While $300-500K in BA does not mean the person has gotten it made, they should be able to live frugally and comfortably by renting, and save plenty of money besides.

There's tons of people living on 1/10th of that salary, or less.