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Can't refinance under water


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2007 May 3, 4:35am   24,133 views  283 comments

by Patrick   ➕follow (59)   💰tip   ignore  

underwater houses

During the boom, if borrowers asked about the adjustable rates on their mortgages, they were told "oh, you can just refinance and start over".

But no one told them you can't refinance if your house is under water, that is, if the loan amount is more than the value of the house. Banks won't go for that, even in the continuing lax lending environment.

So their rates will adjust upward, and they won't be able to pay the mortgage, or refinance, or sell for what they paid.

Interesting times ahead.

Patrick

#housing

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204   astrid   2007 May 4, 10:12am  

azrob,

Is his girlfriend attractive enough to be your girlfriend? Might just be a case of sour grapes.

205   astrid   2007 May 4, 10:13am  

It's also very untactful, unless you know her well.

206   Peter P   2007 May 4, 11:16am  

I hear nothing but horror stories, that you can draw a paycheck for 4 months and do nothing and they wouldn’t know.

Horror? For whom?

207   Peter P   2007 May 4, 11:19am  

plus he got harrassed a few times because he drove a Nissan Sentra

I guess a Lexus would be fine at Ford.

Why Sentra anyway? I would take a Buick Lucerne over any Nissan. :)

208   HeadSet   2007 May 4, 11:22am  

I toured a Chevy S-10/GMC Sonoma factory in Ohio when I was at grad school. One item I remember is that although the welding was done by robots, they had a team of welders on hand. Every now and then, a welder would get up, go over and hit a spot the robot "missed." It was no secret the welders were superfluous. Wonder how much they were paid.

209   Brand165   2007 May 4, 11:22am  

Not if their reality is that house prices go up 15% per year just because they do. I wonder if David Lereah is a sophist?

No, David Lereah is unemployed. Although that may be the result of his failed attempt to be a sophist. Fortunately, even the empircal guys will admit that we have finally reached the bottom in the housing bubble, with the subprime problem contained and the inventory working its way out of the system.

I wonder if being a sophist tastes bad? Maybe bullshit is an acquired taste.

210   Peter P   2007 May 4, 11:28am  

GC, is your fund based in Grand Cayman Island? :)

211   surfer-x   2007 May 4, 11:33am  

trainspotting

212   surfer-x   2007 May 4, 11:39am  

Plus, what’s the hurry? A man can party until he is 35, that leaves plenty of time to marry and raise a family. Works out well, since the desire to party ebbs a bit at that age.

I can verify this.

213   astrid   2007 May 4, 11:41am  

I would imagine mostly as a meal ticket.

If I was a relatively successful guy, I would not marry people (just in case I was gay) from a lower socioeconomic class or countries with per head GDP under $10,000US. Possible exception for parts of Southeast Asia.

214   astrid   2007 May 4, 11:43am  

Peter P,

Sophist is a complement on you. I've never seen anyone defend hydrogenated fats with so much...charisma.

215   astrid   2007 May 4, 12:28pm  

TOLurker,

Pinetree has Cool Breeze, which is a short season cucumber that allegedly starts bearing in 47 days. I'll send some seeds soon.

Jimbo,

Sorry for taking absolutely forever. Would you be interested in sweet peas. They're perfect for a perpetually cool and foggy place.

216   azrob   2007 May 4, 12:42pm  

fantasma:

thats the best you got to make fun of my typing? go f*$ck yourself...

I love brazil, argentina and chile... I would go there even if I didn't find Latin women superior in every possible romantic way to gringas...

Go back to work and pay your rent... I own 3 homes free and clear, plus my consulting fees when I bother to work... Twice your income easily and 5 or 6 months of vacationing a year... I am learning chinese now too, I had a blast there last year.

Your best shot is trying to insult me, cause you will never have 1/10 the life I have.

217   azrob   2007 May 4, 2:29pm  

as opposed to squeaking by in california? hmm let me think... nope I'll stick with az... Saw enough of california during my graduate work at UCB, and a few years working and living in hermosa beach. I came to az in the mid 80's and bought several homes, as they went flying up I sold half and paid the rest off; If this bubble truly bursts big time like the future rockafellers on here keep expecting, I will buy as many as possible when the rent to price justifies it. Either way, in a few more years I am movin on, I think I will live in Chile for a few years,or maybe Thailand.. go ahead sling away with insults; like anyone cares...

218   ozajh   2007 May 4, 5:41pm  

GMH (General Motors Holden) is indeed a wholly owned subsidiary of GM.

The recent Pontiac GTO (left-hand-drive Holden Monaro) was small beer compared to the left-hand-drive Statesman sedans exported to the ME and badged as Chevrolet Lumina's.

The Statesman is a rear-wheel-drive sedan about the same size as (but few other similarities to :)) the BMW 7-series, and the optioned version is the limousine DS was referring to above. It's mildly interesting that Ford Australia had this local-luxury market sewn up for many, many years and basically lost it due to a decision to stop offering V8's. By the time this decision was reversed, that particular market segment was gone to GM.

At one point GM was seriously looking at importing the GMH Commodore ute to the US and badging it as a Chevrolet El Camino. Engine/gearbox would have been a slightly smaller GM engine in a lower state of tune (but probably with the GTO drivetrain as an option for an SS version or some such).

I believe the main impediment to them going ahead was the UAW.

GMH also has a successful engine export program from Australia for small 4-cylinder engines. I believe the biggest customers used to be Daewoo in Korea. Labour costs are not a big issue in engine plants, which these days are very highly automated.

219   Different Sean   2007 May 4, 5:57pm  

GM now owns the Daewoo plant in Korea, apparently, and is producing the 'Holden Viva' there (Vauxhall Viva in Europe, etc) -- a bit like buying an affordable Hyundai badged up as a GM. I drove one as a rental recently, it was OK, $20K on-road new. Obviously GM still has the successful Astra range andother offerings offsetting the 6.0L V8s which aren't selling terribly well at present.

GM-H now also produce a 4-door ute (!) which has a tiny rear cabin for the tradesman with kids, something like a station wagon with the rear roof cut off, I guess, or a 4-door pickup. I believe they had to use the longer luxury Statesman wheelbase to fit it all in...

220   Different Sean   2007 May 4, 6:09pm  

how could these beasts not sell !!?? I didn't realise the El Camino was a similar concept, thought it was some sort of pickup with a segmented rear tray, etc...

221   Peter P   2007 May 4, 6:46pm  

Sophist is a complement on you. I’ve never seen anyone defend hydrogenated fats with so much…charisma.

I do not defend hydrogenated fats. However, I will defend consumer freedom. :)

222   Different Sean   2007 May 5, 12:18am  

Randy H Says:
RE: Weimar & die Inflationszeit
This is *exactly* my point. Weimar had no credible military power. They hyperinflated as a result of crippling foreign debt obligations.

ah

223   Allah   2007 May 5, 2:28am  

FB's selling everything including their EDA's (toys).

224   Allah   2007 May 5, 2:30am  

...and here is what they paid for the townhouse in 2001.

225   cb   2007 May 5, 2:55am  

One item I remember is that although the welding was done by robots, they had a team of welders on hand.

I remembered some of the robots were in cages for safety reasons, not for safety of the workers but people were sabotaging robots in the early days.

226   Allah   2007 May 5, 4:16am  

If you don’t believe me, just go ahead and try and buy something.

Now, why would we want to do that? That's like saying, "Try to kill yourself! I bet you can't!".

227   Peter P   2007 May 5, 4:19am  

I like the hybrid concept but it has too much complexity. I prefer simplicity.

228   Brand165   2007 May 5, 4:44am  

Isn't the Tesla an all-electric racecar? Don't know if that's a babe magnet, though. Dual climate control, leather seats and a good European brand seem to go farther with them.

229   Brand165   2007 May 5, 4:51am  

I consider this a pretty hot car:

http://www.teslamotors.com/index.php?js_enabled=1

230   Randy H   2007 May 5, 5:08am  

Funny

I'm looking at April numbers from one of the big, top price agencies in SF and there are almost no multiple bids, and more sales for under asking than over.

Hmmm. Maybe BigBrother is looking at last year's numbers.

231   Randy H   2007 May 5, 5:11am  

My spy (who happens to have access to all coastal CA numbers for this agency) tells me they are under *strict* orders to not admit prices are going down, and to "tell everyone it is red hot with multiple bids". He also said a number of low performing agents are being let go. Is it normal to get rid of agents during the "spring selling season" BB?

232   Randy H   2007 May 5, 6:16am  

BigBrother

You are welcome to stay in an overpriced condo in the city. But, if you ever make enough money to afford an actual house in Marin, you'll be in for a big surprise. I'll inform all the people who actually own your client's places of work that they live in "the boonies".

You don't know the meaning of the word "boonies". While you're at it, look up "choad".

233   Allah   2007 May 5, 7:59am  

BigBrother, maybe "those people" that are bidding up prices should meet up with these people.

234   FormerAptBroker   2007 May 5, 9:07am  

Randy H Says:

> Hmmm. Maybe BigBrother is looking
> at last year’s numbers.

Or maybe things are so slow at the open house today that he is typing on his Treo trying to get some of us to rush out and buy…

235   Michael Holliday   2007 May 5, 11:49am  

HOUSING HAIKU 2007

This whole housing mess
is one big debacle. No-
thing more. Nothing less.

--MH

236   danville woman   2007 May 5, 1:13pm  

Need babe magnets? Try training a Guide Dog. Guaranteed to attract all kinds of women when you are out and about. However, can't leave the dog at home for long periods and takes lot of time and dedication.

237   Malcolm   2007 May 5, 2:32pm  

Peter P Says:
May 5th, 2007 at 11:19 am
"I like the hybrid concept but it has too much complexity. I prefer simplicity. "

Go test drive a Prius, it is the coolest thing you've ever driven. They are super simple, you don't even turn the key to start it. The smart key option is fantastic. Randy makes a true point though, you become obsessive with trying to get the most efficiency out of it so you do drive 65 to try to make the little graph go up. It is a little hypocritical I admit because then I jump in my Boxster and drive 95 without a care in the world about efficiency.

238   Malcolm   2007 May 5, 2:40pm  

Danville Woman Says:
May 5th, 2007 at 8:13 pm
"Need babe magnets? Try training a Guide Dog. Guaranteed to attract all kinds of women when you are out and about. However, can’t leave the dog at home for long periods and takes lot of time and dedication. "

San Diego has a couple of 'dog beaches' which I think are really good pick up places. If I were single I'd take my dogs to the beach a lot more. I think people buy dogs sometimes as a conversation starter. It is quite fun to stand around and talk to people about their dogs.

239   Malcolm   2007 May 5, 2:42pm  

I'll be interested to see what the upcoming auctions do to the median home prices in LA Riverside and San Diego. People who are saying prices haven't plummeted don't realize that the house has to actually sell to be included in the numbers. These auctions force the issue, and this is all part of a very clear scenario.

240   cb   2007 May 5, 4:04pm  

Malcolm,

You sound like a M3 driver, tailgating, going 95 :)

241   Randy H   2007 May 5, 4:06pm  

Tailing too close leads to far more deaths a year then DUI’s.

I'd like to see the evidence supporting this claim.

Regardless, the problem is Prius owners, and not just them but also any other self-appointed "slow down to my speed" zealots, do far more damage than good. Yes people drive over the limit. That is just the way it is. When you get in the wrong lane and drive like a moron you put everyone else at risk. How?

Have you ever been tootling down the 280 in the 3rd lane when suddenly the guy in front of you -- at a very safe distance -- going 75 jumps to the 4th lane, only to reveal some jagoff in a Prius going 50? Then you jump left. Then the guy behind you jumps left. And so on. If you're lucky, no one gets killed.

In most countries of the world where high-speed highways exist, there is a self-policed order to things. Slow people get right. Faster people get left. You don't pass on the right. You don't doddle on the left.

But you keep telling yourself you're holier than thou, azrob. I hope you have rear airbags for the time that 5 series ends up in your hatchback.

242   Jimbo   2007 May 5, 4:27pm  

People going fifty in the left lane are idiots. People going the speed limit in the #2 lane (the one to the right of the "fast" lane) are not. All, imho, of course and as someone who does not even own a car.

If you are going under the speed limit, you belong in the slow lane. That is what it is there for.

243   Peter P   2007 May 5, 4:37pm  

Tailing too close leads to far more deaths a year then DUI’s.

Huh? Well, I usually leave 4 seconds of space. I prefer staying below speed limit but if the flow is faster I will have to speed up. It is not safe to have large variance of speed.

However, I do not think it is safe to go more than 10mph above.

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