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Unity


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2006 Aug 10, 2:11pm   31,354 views  274 comments

by Randy H   ➕follow (0)   💰tip   ignore  

Unity

The housing bubble brought us together. A few brave blogs like Patrick.net provided a forum where we were able to find others like ourselves: people who dared to question soaring house prices and all the insanity that went along with them.

We were ridiculed. Not for a difference of religion, politics, age or wealth. But because we were all suddenly in the same place. We were outsiders. Contrarians.

But we found inspiration in one another. Many of us drew strength from this community; strength we needed to follow through on our convictions. Sometimes this put us at odds with co-workers, neighbors, friends, family, even spouses. But we had each other; and we knew we weren't crazy, everyone else was.

Now we know we were right. The herd awakens to that reality and slowly (or quickly) thunders back to where we are.

And so breaks our Unity?

For a short time, at least, we experienced the potential of a diverse group able to rise above ideology and partisanship.

--Randy H

#housing

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37   DinOR   2006 Aug 11, 1:32am  

headset,

This link kind of sums up where I was going with continued pressure on the middle class. Please to notice that most of the "TIUTA" was SELF INFLICTED! www.post-gazette.com/pg/06222/712559-28.stm.

Let me know what you think!

38   FormerAptBroker   2006 Aug 11, 1:33am  

astrid Says:

> I don’t know. The Republicans are very good
> at demonizing Democratic candidates.

I was punching buttons in the car this morning and clicked on KGO AM 810 in the middle of an anti-Republican rant by a crazy lady. I was surprised to hear Ed Baxter cut her off by saying "Thank You Congresswoman Pelosi"...

39   astrid   2006 Aug 11, 1:34am  

the_lingus,

Bush turned a 500,000 voter deficit into a mandate in 2000. And never misunderestimate these people's vote getting abilities. There's plenty of seemingly open minded people out there who share Bap33's opinions about Democrats. Beats me why, maybe their preachers told them Democrats were all born with 666 on their heads.

However, an anti-War Democratic win will push the US out of Iraq and maybe make some inroads to cut our crazy military expenditures. There's plenty of real problems to tackle at home without exhausting ourselves fighting neo-Colonialist wars in the Middle East. Wars are inflationary, so ending one ought to help curb the inflation pressures.

The NoVA area is awash in irresponsibly spent Pentagon dollars -- taking that money away (combined with other factors) should depress the prices nicely, I'd say 50-70%. Ten years ago you could buy a decent middle class home here for under $200K, now that place will go for $600K or more.

SHTF,

Frist? I would never vote for that cat murderer and callous legislator! Truth be told, I could never vote for anyone the Republicans could nominate, they'd all run way to the right of Nixon and Reagan and Bush I.

And look for Republicans to demonize anybody Democrats put on a ticket. They made Howard Dean look like a raving leftist lunatic when his legislative policy was fiscally conservative and socially libertarian. They made Kerry look ineffective and stupid when his legislative record pre-2000 is anything but. Americans have been trained to believe they should vote for the guy they'd like to have a beer with and make them feel good, whether that's with a George W Bush nationally or with SF "Progressives" locally. I still don't notice the electorate getting any smarter.

40   DinOR   2006 Aug 11, 1:36am  

Please use the link which takes you to the Post Gazette, then just plug "Mortgage" into their search and it's the first article that comes up.

Homeowners Feel Pain of Rising Rates

Mr. Technology, YEP that's what they call me. Mr. Technology.

41   HeadSet   2006 Aug 11, 1:37am  

DinOR,

You link gave me a "Missing Page"

42   DinOR   2006 Aug 11, 1:39am  

FAB,

LOL! Damn that is funny!

43   DinOR   2006 Aug 11, 1:40am  

Headset,

My bad. Like I say MISTER Technology.

44   Claire   2006 Aug 11, 1:48am  

DinOR,

That articles funny - if an accountant can't work out that the loans are a bad deal, then what about everybody else?

45   astrid   2006 Aug 11, 1:50am  

SFWoman,

Agreed, no Hillary! Now or ever! She's basically the Republican's dream Democratic candidate - polarizing, compromising, built in lady MacBeth persona, still married to Bill Clinton but doesn't have his personal charisma. I don't think Democrat outside of the DNC actually wants her to run, and I think she's smart enough to forgo it in 2008. I hear her name mentioned much more often by Republican pundits than Democratic pundits.

I really do hope the Democratic grassroots overwhelm the Beltway DNC bunch and pick a governor from outside of the Northeast. The Beltway bunch are just terrible: grey, overly compromising, defeatist.

The only exception might be Obama, but I don't think this country's ready for him yet.

FAB,

So what? How many sane congress people do you know of? The Republican leadership isn't exactly better. Pelosi's job is to motivate the House Democrats and keep them in line. She's never going to win a national office or even a state-wide one, so she can say whatever as long as the people of SF votes her back.

And as a Democrat, I'd say she's a damned sight better than her predacessor, at least she's willing to put up a fight against bad Republican legislation.

46   HeadSet   2006 Aug 11, 1:51am  

DinOR,

Sorry, I posted that before I saw you MISTER technology post.

Good article. I see it as irresponsibility coming to roost. Refinancing incures costs, usually thousands, even if the rate is lowered. I know, they roll the costs into the loan. Why do people always have to be in a monthly payment mindset? Why not forget about any home you cannot buy with a fixed rate, then work to pay off the mortgage? I would love to see a national mindset where people expect to own thier homes outright by the time they are 40. And only the very young would take out a loan for a car.

47   DinOR   2006 Aug 11, 1:53am  

the_lingus,

Yes, that is my answer. I worked a 40 hour + week for over 3 DECADES! I don't recall being treated remotely fairly by ANY of my employers (be the liberal or conservative) or who resided in the White House. So armed with a lower middle class upbringing and an Assoc. in Fire Science (and a TON of debt) a wife and teen daughters I started my OWN business and now find that I am treated quite fairly. I fund my OWN pension and have my OWN healthcare plan.

Guys like you need to stop blaming the administration, sack up and start making a meaningful contribution. Your presence on Blogs of this caliber is only for the shear joy of starting flame wars and nothing else. I also recall that folks over at Ben's are about as receptive. Be they liberal or conservative. Bye bye.

48   HeadSet   2006 Aug 11, 1:53am  

DinOR,

OOPS, did I miss the point? Was it about the financial illiteracy of not only the public, but the supposed experts?

49   Peter P   2006 Aug 11, 1:58am  

Guys like you need to stop blaming the administration, sack up and start making a meaningful contribution.

I agree.

I have a funny feeling about the future though.

50   Peter P   2006 Aug 11, 2:02am  

Patrick.net will have as much luck in banning me as Benny and his handjob queen Robert Cote.

Why? Do you want to try?

51   Peter P   2006 Aug 11, 2:05am  

About 20 minutes was spent on the psychology of people responding to fires, and it was fascinating.

Wow.

The scientist said another minute or so and the people would have collapsed and died, all because they didn’t want to yell or leave their place in line.

Huh? Silly. You will see me walking out the door calmly and quickly.

52   Claire   2006 Aug 11, 2:07am  

Damn, people are still buying houses in Mountain View, don't they know that we want it to crash??? If people who bought last year are going to be really FB's, what about the people that are still buying now?

53   DinOR   2006 Aug 11, 2:14am  

headset,Claire,

Lost a post there. Anyway, the article (in my mind anyway) just exhibits that people seem to understand how leverage works when things are working their way, and yet suddenly fail to understand it when it turns against them. This lack of financial understanding will lead to more self inflicted "un-doing" than anyone else could to you.

54   Peter P   2006 Aug 11, 2:19am  

Damn, people are still buying houses in Mountain View, don’t they know that we want it to crash??? If people who bought last year are going to be really FB’s, what about the people that are still buying now?

If people keep buying there may be a soft landing in certain locations. Mountain View is not a big place.

Be patient.

55   Claire   2006 Aug 11, 2:20am  

DinOR,

Yeah, I know, but it amazes me that supposed accountants are crying foul, if they can't work the figures and read the loan agreement, then who can?

"It was in the small print" - boo hoo

56   DinOR   2006 Aug 11, 2:21am  

SFWoman,

What's worse is that fire has this natural tendency to reach out and "grab you". The theory goes that as it voraciously consumes oxygen it creates a vacuum and actually draws flammable material into it. In this case YOU!

There have been so many advances since I worked in that field I doubt I could get through the "volunteer exam" these days.

57   Peter P   2006 Aug 11, 2:23am  

This lack of financial understanding will lead to more self inflicted “un-doing” than anyone else could to you.

It may not be about financial understanding. Some people choose to believe in the best case scenario. I choose to consider the worst case scenario. This is why I am always depressed. :(

58   Claire   2006 Aug 11, 2:25am  

Peter P,

If anywhere will be soft, it probably will be Mountain View, worse luck for me :-( I'm also interested in a house with a garden, so any bargains in the condo, townhouse market are out :-(

59   Peter P   2006 Aug 11, 2:25am  

What’s worse is that fire has this natural tendency to reach out and “grab you”.

The other theory: IF you are fated to die you will. I thought the word "fatal" comes out of the word "fate".

60   astrid   2006 Aug 11, 2:26am  

the_Lingus,

This is a RE blog first and foremost, and while politics comes up, it's improper to inject politics into your every comment - that goes for politics on the left and the right. Indeed, doing so, especially when your politics radically differ from others on the site and when you're not willing to listen to the other side, is highly disruptive and liable to get you banned even if you do have good points.

61   Peter P   2006 Aug 11, 2:28am  

If anywhere will be soft, it probably will be Mountain View, worse luck for me I’m also interested in a house with a garden, so any bargains in the condo, townhouse market are out.

Why Mountain View? Some condo/townhouses have gardens. Some SFHs only have small decks.

Will you consider Campbell? I may probably look there.

62   DinOR   2006 Aug 11, 2:29am  

Claire,

At this point, wether or not she/he claims they didn't read or understand really doesn't matter. They signed it, "I mean that IS your signature, is it not"? The other thing that was shocking was that the couple originally listed their MI home for 400K, now they're asking 270K! It will be so hard in the near future to determine who was truly an innocent (and who was a sophisticated debtor). No, I don't believe I invented the term.

Much of the "precedent" for our newly enacted FB laws will be contingent on:

Is this your first home purchase? No?

Is this the first time you've used a NAAVLP? No?

Do you own more than one property? Yes?

You're screwed. Next case.

63   astrid   2006 Aug 11, 2:32am  

George,

Good article.

The way I see it, if you give your parents money, they need to give you a share of control over their budget - at least enough to see that your money doesn't get wasted and hopefully enough to control their total budget so they can live within their means.

It's not as if parents would go absolutely destitute in this society anyways. There's tons of subsidized over 62 housing affordable on social security. That's not a lifestyle that gives access to whirlwind vacations or golf everyday, but if the spendthrift parents wanted that, they should have planned and saved for it.

64   lunarpark   2006 Aug 11, 2:36am  

I grew up in Mountain View. I still do not understand why anyone would want to live there.

65   Claire   2006 Aug 11, 2:37am  

Peter P,

My daughter is very sensitive to change, and I do not think she will handle a move again too well, so if I can keep her in the same school, it would help a lot. I have not located any townhouses in this area with a decent sized yard yet :-( If I wait 5 years though - the dog will no longer be here - so there won't be a problem there, but everyone likes playing outside a lot.

66   Peter P   2006 Aug 11, 2:38am  

I grew up in Mountain View. I still do not understand why anyone would want to live there.

Google that and you will find out. :)

67   astrid   2006 Aug 11, 2:38am  

Claire,

Why do you want a garden for? If it's attractive landscaping then many condo complexes will probably have better landscaping than you'd achieve on your own. If it's to exercise a green thumb, there might be community garden plots or farm workshare nearby. If it's to see things grow through the seasons, might I suggest bonsai?

I wouldn't buy in BA now though, unless you can afford to lose 30-50% of the value of the house if you're forced to sell at the low point. Otherwise, there's always the risk the purchase will totally ruin your financial life.

68   Peter P   2006 Aug 11, 2:41am  

Claire, if school is a constraint then it may be more of a problem.

69   Claire   2006 Aug 11, 2:42am  

lunarpark,

You know, if we could move to another state we would, but we are tied here with my husband's job at the minute. Mountain View is close to where he works (15 min drive) and the school district is okay, there could be a lot worse places to live. When we moved here, there were very few rental properties available in the whole of the surrounding area for what we could afford, and you should have see the state some of them were in when we were searching. So we ended up here.

70   Peter P   2006 Aug 11, 2:42am  

Well, renting is not so bad anyway. Don't worry.

71   lunarpark   2006 Aug 11, 2:43am  

"Google that and you will find out."

Even Google cannot answer this question...

Actually I understand the 94040, 94043 remains a mystery.

72   lunarpark   2006 Aug 11, 2:44am  

Claire,

It was nothing personal against you - sorry if I sounded that way. I just really didn't care for growing up in Mountain View. I looked forward to my parents sending me to Ohio for the summer.

73   Peter P   2006 Aug 11, 2:44am  

Even Google cannot answer this question…

Because Google IS the answer? ;)

74   astrid   2006 Aug 11, 2:45am  

Claire,

If you have only one daughter, maybe private school would be a cheaper bet than buying into a good school district at this time. Otherwise, maybe go look for a landlord who owned a property for more than 10 years and get a lease with the option to renew for at least the next 3 years. Or live in an apartment in a decent school district.

These aren't perfect alternatives, but they could be better than the alternative of being locked into an overpriced home you can't get rid of.

75   lunarpark   2006 Aug 11, 2:47am  

"Because Google IS the answer?"

Perhaps :p

76   Randy H   2006 Aug 11, 2:48am  

Patrick.net will have as much luck in banning me as Benny and his **** Robert Cote. Besides, patrick.net admin doesn’t ...
...the_Lingus

Two years without a single banning. Now 2 in less than 7 days. As traffic on this blog grows it may become very difficult to police the Trolls.

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