patrick.net

Listen, at the end of the day, I'd actually think most Patnetter's would agree the military expenses and reach is over the top. The problem is our economy and frankly parts of the world have become reliant on our military and the threat of it. If we don't pull back carefully, our economy could suffer massively and then people would be bitching about that.

I do think we could reduce our footprint to an extent and would like to see it happen. But close a foreign base and guess what, someone else is going to fill the void. It has to be done strategically. Are trade routes protected that get us products or our products to other countries? It's not just about money or us being an evil empire. We're a global economy and more people would be dying if we weren't doing what we do. We kill, but more we be killed if we didn't.

Whether it's right, wrong or stupid, we are the stabilizing force in the world regardless of how many incursions we've been involved in. It wasn't the US starting WWI or II. I'd bet you can take KT's list of US "wars" and add up the casualties and it doesn't come close to touching WWI or II. We start or intervene in shit for sure, but nothing close to the magnitude of what Europe has done. Be pissed at them... and understand it was Europe that forced our hand into this position while they rebuilt from their bullshit. No MAJOR war (or even close) in 50 years and people don't even remember Europe couldn't keep it's shit together for 30 years before 2 of the globes deadliest wars? Fuck America though...

WookieMan says

America

The only bulwark against world wide forced conversion to Islam.

Taking land away from Peasants in Mount Pleasant is WINNING! Taking $4 billion from peasants to give to foxCONn in incentives is yet more WINNING!

jazz_music says

No coverage

Ask the NYT and WaPo why they stopped covering Afghanistan in 2009.

Lack of coverage is due to the WaPo assigning 100 staffers to "Git Trump"

WookieMan says

I do think we could reduce our footprint to an extent and would like to see it happen. But close a foreign base and guess what, someone else is going to fill the void. It has to be done strategically. Are trade routes protected that get us products or our products to other countries? It's not just about money or us being an evil empire. We're a global economy and more people would be dying if we weren't doing what we do. We kill, but more we be killed if we didn't.

Afghanistan could be handed off to India, which would be the most elegant solution. They have rough relations with China, the Russians won't want to muscle in on a top military customer, allows India to encircle Crapistan to the West, and gets us out of there.

kt1652 says

It is depressing to observe how the United States of America has become the evil empire.

OK - so does America get any credit for the remarkable peace and prosperity around the globe since we became an "empire"?

jazz_music says

Carter then said the US has been at peace for only 16 of its 242 years as a nation.

Carter missed the root cause. We've only been without a central bank twice in our history. Try fighting a war without the ability to print endless debt, doesn't work so well.

jazz_music says

18 years war in Afghanistan

Hopefully we all can agree here that 18-year war without any end in sight and at this point, without any reason is bad from all possible respects - fiscal, moral for troops, generating support for Islamists by constant bombing of marriage processions, etc. If someone should be worried about Islamists in Afghanistan, it is China, India, and Russia - let them spend the money and lives of their citizens.
NuttBoxer says

Try fighting a war without the ability to print endless debt, doesn't work so well.

Exactly. Or have a balanced budget amendment, where budget has to be balanced in all cases except official, declared war. Most of wars these days are not declared.

Patrick says

Yup. I mean, seriously, like what about the Mongols under Genghis Khan?

I always thought Jimmy Carter was a class act ex-President. For the last 30 years I have said he is best ex-President in History.
But like him, Bono, Gates, and the EU Do Gooders, every region they touched turned to shit and taken over by Warlords and created humanitarian crisis.

Those Water Wells and Measles shots came at a huge price. And what Measles shots?

Bill Gates fucking lied to the World He gave billions to Terrorists to create their shit, while telling us he eradicated Measles world wide. Now that the displaced refugees are in America. We're seeing where Billy boy Measle money went. Jimmy Carter too. Fuck them all. Lying Globalist bastards!

jazz_music says

U.S. solder killed in the Republic of Niger, shows his last moments via his attached body webcam

1. VKontact is Russian Facebook. I assume VK is the Russian Periscope to VKontact. I thought you didn't like foreign influence?
2. Niger is under Islamist Fundamentalist Attack daily. Hardly a week goes by without butchery of Christians in the name of Allah.
3. The music overlaying that is Muslim Jihad Victory A-Capella.

jazz_music says

We are basically at war with Iran again and wanting to force regime change there and in Venezuela. It's no coincidence we are all programmed to hate Venezuela's leader. When the straight of Hormuz closes a global chain reaction will be triggered and Venezuela's oil could save us from the collapse of the highly illegal derivatives market and so the global economy. Both China and Russia stand with Iran and they are protecting Venezuela from our regime change operations while we make their economy scream.

The Straits of Hormuz is an international waterway that all of the Gulf States and the World wants open. Iran's closure of it would be an Act of Aggression.

The USN will keep the Straits open in the name of Freedom of the Seas, which is an International Right the US protects for everybody because Cheap Europeans won't do it.

Jimmy Carter is a moron.

jazz_music says

You are not alone in the conclusion that we are not the world's altruistic guardian as the propagandists will have you thinking,

Who is responsible for the massive reduction in death and violence around the world from war since the US became the "Evil Empire"?

jazz_music says

WTF finally proof that Jesus is God it seems we'll have to fire our guns more often and achieve more massive reduction in death and violence around the world!!! YAYYYYYYYYYY!! LOL

Do you dispute the fact that there has been a dramatic reduction of death and violence from war since America became the "Evil Empire"?

If the America haters are going to blame every death in the Middle East and around the world on the American Military Industrial Complex. Logic suggests the US also gets credit for the remarkable peace and prosperity over the last half century.

socal2 says

If the America haters are going to blame every death in the Middle East and around the world on the American Military Industrial Complex. Logic suggests the US also gets credit for the remarkable peace and prosperity over the last half century.

That's not how it works with the Left, SoCal.

Why do you question the wisdom of oligarchs?

To the negative posters on this thread. Can one of you please explain socal2's graph that everyone conveniently ignored? WWI isn't even on there either. If you have a problem with a nation or region the finger should be pointed at Europe clearly. They fucked up twice big time and we took over.

Shits not as dark as y'all like to think, but keep believing the lie.

socal2 says

jazz_music says

U.S. solder killed in the Republic of Niger, shows his last moments via his attached body webcam

More American tourists likely die overseas than soldiers in the current environment. STOP TRAVELING PEOPLE!!!! Oh wait, one of the biggest reason they're able to travel is because we've made the world a safer place. Sometimes with a gun, but sometimes just being there. But hey, let's pull back and hope some Hitler type regime doesn't fill in the void. Has logic gone missing or something. Weird day today.

WookieMan says

If you have a problem with a nation or region the finger should be pointed at Europe clearly. They fucked up twice big time and we took over.

Three times: Vietnam was an attempt to mop up after French screwed the pooch there.

WookieMan says

More American tourists likely die overseas than soldiers in the current environment. STOP TRAVELING PEOPLE!!

Stop traveling to shithole countries.

APOCALYPSEFUCKisShostikovitch says

It's WINNING! twice if FOXCONN does nothing but complain the county won't let them run a massage parlor in the empty building that was supposed to be pumping out $1500 iPhones.

Triple WINNING! if peasants are sold for organ harvesting to PRC after their land and money has been taken! Otherwise their smell and complaints Burden Masters of Universe!

You mean the IRGC doesn't meddle in 17 countries outside of Iran?

jazz_music says

Iran’s independent-minded government

How fucking cute.

FIRING SQUAD, 2 TIMES! JUST IN CASE HE SURVIVES THE FIRST ROUND!

jazz_music says

The US should get credit for the remarkable peace and prosperity from the last half century

Definitely.

Si Vis Pacem, Para bellum

He's just been bum blasting the wrong people for leftovers. Time to start getting some of the high paying bum blasting in big government.

Tim Aurora says

“did not fully capture the context, nature, and substance” of Mueller’s work,

What did he miss?

Onvacation says

Tim Aurora says

“did not fully capture the context, nature, and substance” of Mueller’s work,

What did he miss?

Slow down. Answering your question would require logical thought, with neither memes nor innuendo.

not gonna happen.

Ex: hey @Marcus ... to what "evidence" are you referring?

CBOEtrader says

Ex: hey @Marcus ... to what "evidence" are you referring?

They don't have none.

Like my Black Liberal friend.

He keeps having to admit Trump is far better than any President in our lifetime or possibly if ever.
But he keeps saying now, Republicans do have the better policies than Democrats right now. It's just Trump! Couldn't ya'll have picked someone better to be President.

I keep telling him, we didn't pick him, he picked us. And NO! There isn't anyone better. Then when I press him, and ask him about what would he expect if Trump was just impeached or removed, or if the Liberals got their midterm Mulligan do over and Trump was thrown out and replaced. Who does he expect to replace him?

Liberals do not have a firm grasp of reality. If they did they would work on a message and look forward and strategize on how to win future elections.

Tim Aurora says

four-page memo to Congress describing the principal conclusions of the investigation into President Trump “did not fully capture the context, nature, and substance” of Mueller’s work

How could any summary ever capture the full context and nature and substance of any 400 page report? The important thing is that Barr didn’t lie or leave out anything germane to the investigation into Russian Collusion. And he later released as much of the report as was lawful to do.
Mueller is just butthurt that he couldn’t find shit on Trump after years and millions of man hours trying.
Done.

jazz_music says

And Iran threatens to shut down traffic in the Strait of Hormuz which is 20% of the world’s oil.

You think that might impact the markets?

They will get their asses handed to them on a plate a-la April 18, 1988. What happened to the markets on that day? Did it matter in the grand scheme of things?

Sometimes it’s not enough to simply growl to prove you’re the biggest baddest dog on the block. You have to actually tear someone’s ass off to maintain respect.
Iran has been asking for it.

Good!

"The US wants Iran to end all its nuclear and missile programmes, withdraw its forces from Syria, stop its "destabilising" policies in Iraq, Afghanistan and the Gulf, and cease its support for armed groups like Hezbollah, Hamas, and the Houthis in exchange for negotiating a new nuclear deal.
No one would have been more surprised than the US itself if Iran had said yes to any of it. These demands basically constitute total Iranian surrender, not only to the US but also to Israel and Saudi Arabia, Trump's key regional partners and principle drivers behind the new Iran policy."

https://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/arrogance-fanaticism-prospect-iranian-war-190430085736682.html

US labeled Iran Revolutionary Guard as Foreign Terrorist, that means open season for our military to attack, kill Iranian troops anywhere, anytime. There had been Middle East sources reporting US planes bombing Iranian troops in Syria.

Trump is placing a strangulation hold on Iranian people with a total oil export embargo.
This is old fashioned gun-boat diplomacy.
When Iranians are desperate and fight back, our superior military will slaughter them.
There is no need to declare war when a superior aggressor’s action directly lead to no other option but war.

Why? For Israel? Saudi Arabia? Petro-dollar hegemony? Re-election?

War should be the absolute last resort for defense.

kt1652 says

Trump is placing a strangulation hold on Iranian people

Not on the people but on the regime. The same regime the people protested against on many occasions and were brutally supressed.

I’ll be the first to say that we have no business screwing around in affairs of the Middle East. But going after Trump with what every president has done before him is ridiculous; we would probably be in multiple full ground conflicts if it was Hillary as our president. Liberals will be complaining no matter what Trump does, and every administration before his has totally fucked things up and made things worse since becoming world police. Their culture and way of life is not compatible with ours we should not be there and they should not be coming here.

Hugolas_Madurez says

kt1652 says

Trump is placing a strangulation hold on Iranian people

Not on people but on the regime.

Justification of a bully.
"These measures are pushing the Iranian economy to the brink. Oil exports, which have already dwindled from 2.5 million to less than 1.3 million barrels a day since last year, could drop even further, crippling the state budget. Ordinary Iranians, who are already suffering from the raging inflation (currently at 40 percent) and skyrocketing prices of goods, will likely bear the brunt of Washington's push to bring Iranian oil exports to zero. And this is only the beginning."

kt1652 says

Hugolas_Madurez says

kt1652 says

Trump is placing a strangulation hold on Iranian people

Not on people but on the regime.

Justification of a bully.
"These measures are pushing the Iranian economy to the brink. Oil exports, which have already dwindled from 2.5 million to less than 1.3 million barrels a day since last year, could drop even further, crippling the state budget. Ordinary Iranians, who are already suffering from the raging inflation (currently at 40 percent) and skyrocketing prices of goods, will likely bear the brunt of Washington's push to bring Iranian oil exports to zero. And this is only the beginning."

Ordinary Iranians are not fond of the regime. There has been many mass protests over the recent 10-12 years.

Ordinary Iranians are not fond of the regime. There has been many mass protests over the recent 10-12 years.

Problem is, if Iran is attacked, these people not fond of the regime would unite behind it.