patrick.net

marcus says

Trump is at risk of making terrible war related decisions becasue of ego, thirst for power and approval/popularity.

Has he made terrible decisions so far? He has expanded drone strikes which noone talks about but should. This is probably bad. He also launched the MOAB based on questionable Syrian intelligence. Also not good. Otoh, he hasnt started any wars and seems to be ending the existing ones. I'd give him a B-, maybe C+ in how hes handled the military. W Bush and Obama both failed.

Seems like hes doing fine, but his report card will change depending on how this conflict plays out. It would help if the media would report on important topics like drone strike numbers and costs associated with it rather than on Tranny rights for minors.

Possibly the best meme on this subject yet:

marcus says

CBOEtrader says

How is this not orange man bad therefore this is bad?

I would ask you to see if you can not read and comprehend an entire sentence ?

"What I don't like is that it's Trump behind it, becasue everything that intelligent objective observers know about Trump suggests that the politics of it likely enters his calculus more than it should. And that's very scary. "

You might argue that even if politics did enter in to his rationale, it doesn't mean that it was strategically a mistake. Guess what ? I agree.

But yes even Trump himself was repeatedly making the point back in 2011 and 2012 that it's terrible and risky and just bad all around if a President makes war decisions based on a desire to be reelected.

So I stand by my fear, my concern, whatever you want to call it, that becasue of Trumps epic self contentedness and narci...

just_dregalicious says

Scott Adams has an interesting angle on all of this. He might have been an impediment to peace and the Mullahs and Supreme Leader wanted him taken out:

Could be. By all counts, he was hated and feared inside Iraq, but so powerful, the government was intimidated. No matter what the public posture, Iran may be glad he is gone.
Kinna like when Stalin finally punted.

For conspiracy fodder, it almost looks like it could have been a joint USA/Iran caper: "We can't have negotiations until this guy is gone, and we can't do anything inside Iran to do it because he is one unholy and invincible motherfucker. We'll get him out of the country, then we will tell you where X marks the spot. Of course, we will have to protest the deed vigorously."

marcus says

CBOEtrader says

How is this not orange man bad therefore this is bad?

I would ask you to see if you can not read and comprehend an entire sentence ?

"What I don't like is that it's Trump behind it, becasue everything that intelligent objective observers know about Trump suggests that the politics of it likely enters his calculus more than it should. And that's very scary. "

You might argue that even if politics did enter in to his rationale, it doesn't mean that it was strategically a mistake. Guess what ? I agree.

But yes even Trump himself was repeatedly making the point back in 2011 and 2012 that it's terrible and risky and just bad all around if a President makes war decisions based on a desire to be reelected.

So I stand by my fear, my concern, whatever you want to call it, that becasue of Trumps epic self contentedness and narci...

Trumps base is distinctly anti-war. Remember how his supporters were pissed while the MSM celebrated his MOAB airstrike?

A politician SHOULD consider the will of the people (politics) when considering military action. This one was acceptable to his supporters BECAUSE it seems like the right decision. (I agree w marcus that we arent in a spot to judge military decisions.)

If this escalates into a new war his supporters will not ne happy.

Remember when we pulled out of the Turkish-Syrian border area? And we were told Major Instability or even WW3 was a possibility unless we kept ground troops there?

Now we're told retaliating against the Iran-backed Embassy Attack by assassinating a long time Iranian General who specializes in assassination and destabilization will lead to Major Instability.

I get whiplash from how fast the Left changes it's stance depending on what Trump does.

CBOEtrader says

If this escalates into a new war his supporters will not ne happy.

True. I wouldn't call myself a blind supporter of Trump, but I think he's generally been a very good president.

And I will not be happy if this becomes a new war, mostly because it's what those Saudi fucks wanted all along.

What would really make me happy is if Iran obliterated Saudi Arabia, the source of the 9/11 hijackers and the source of almost all terrorism in the world.

personal

Patrick says

And I will not be happy if this becomes a new war, mostly because it's what those Saudi fucks wanted all along.

I'd put killing being wrong and costing too much money ahead of doing what the Saudis want, but I hear you

CBOEtrader says

Patrick says

And I will not be happy if this becomes a new war, mostly because it's what those Saudi fucks wanted all along.

I'd put killing being wrong and costing too much money ahead of doing what the Saudis want, but I hear you

Why only SA this and that, like Israel didn't want this even more.

All chest thumping and stupid memes aside. If you were the ayatollah and the man who is widely agreed to be 2nd most powerful in Iran was just assasinated at Trump's command. And the agreement not to build nukes was pulled out of by Trump. And you watch Trump sucking Kim's dick because he has nukes. It dont take a fucking genius to say I want nukes. Would Trump assassinate me if I had a nuke? No he would suck my dick too and maybe throw in a rim job for good measure.

So where does that lead us? WMD all over again and another war just like Pompeo, Cotton and fan boy Graham have been pushing for. Trump is clearly suffering from dementia...he forgot he didnt want a war.

Chiromancer says

All chest thumping and stupid memes aside. If you were the ayatollah and the man who is widely agreed to be 2nd most powerful in Iran was just assasinated at Trump's command. And the agreement not to build nukes was pulled out of by Trump. And you watch Trump sucking Kim's dick because he has nukes. It dont take a fucking genius to say I want nukes. Would Trump assassinate me if I had a nuke? No he would suck my dick too and maybe throw in a rim job for good measure.

So where does that lead us? WMD all over again and another war just like Pompeo, Cotton and fan boy Graham have been pushing for. Trump is clearly suffering from dementia...he forgot he didnt want a war.

No. There's nothing wrong with taking out a mass murderer and give justice to his victims as long as you don't start a war. If Iran starts one it's not the US fault. It's much better to take out assholes than innocent people. So that all assholes in the word are put on notice their day of reckoning may be coming soon. Hurray for precision targeted drone strikes!

#MAGA

mell says

as long as you don't start a war. If Iran starts one it's not the US fault

Right, they started it. So that makes it ok however this turns out. What do we need to do to "have started it"?. Does it matter to the people killed in Iraq that Sadam was a mass killer, gassed his own people. They are dead, the country a wreck, America is trillions in debt with a bunch of PSTD service people with missing limbs, that worked out great. Sure Iranian regime is terrible, so was the dude killed. Is this so called new great Trump America going to war over that?
The American people, will not buy it twice, save the neo cons and Trump chest thumpers.

Chiromancer says

mell says

as long as you don't start a war. If Iran starts one it's not the US fault

Right, they started it. So that makes it ok however this turns out. What do we need to do to "have started it"?. Does it matter to the people killed in Iraq that Sadam was a mass killer, gassed his own people. They are dead, the country a wreck, America is trillions in debt with a bunch of PSTD service people with missing limbs, that out worked great. Sure Iranian regime is terrible, so was the dude killed. Is this so called new great Trump America going to war over that?
The American people, will not buy it twice, save the neo cons and Trump chest thumpers.

Iraq was an unnecessary ground troop war - killing single assholes/dictators can be quite strategic besides delivering justice. Nobody said the US is going to invade Iran and they won't. This comparison is useless. Also Saddam was strategically important for the region as a counterweight to all the radical Islamists. Like those in Iran.

mell says

Nobody said the US is going to invade Iran and they won't. This comparison is useless.

Not necessarily up to the U.S. how this plays out. Anyone who believes they can predict the outcome is a fool. i don't know and you don"t know. Trump doesn't know and neither do the generals. But I will make an educated guess, just a guess. Make one, beg, borrow or steal Iran is going to do everthing possible to get a nuke. The great equalizer. How's Trump going to stop that?

Chiromancer says

mell says

Nobody said the US is going to invade Iran and they won't. This comparison is useless.

Not necessarily up to the U.S. how this plays out. Anyone who believes they can predict the outcome is a fool. i don't know and you don"t know. Trump doesn't know and neither do the generals. But I will make an educated guess, just a guess. Make one, beg, borrow or steal Iran is going to do everthing possible to get a nuke. The great equalizer. How's Trump going to stop that?

So nothing has changed. Good. Iran has always done everything to get a nuke. The world will have to deal with Iran then when the time comes. In the meantime one brutal asshole psychotic mass murderer less meeting his maker. Net positive.

RC2006 says

Why only SA this and that, like Israel didn't want this even more.

You're right.

Both Israel and Saudi Arabia dearly want the US to waste the lives of US soldiers invading Iran so that they can feel more secure.

American foreign policy is deeply corrupted both by AIPAC and Saudi money. Sad but true.

Salami was a good object lesson. Kim was watching also.

‘I Was So Happy’: Local Iranians React To Death Of Soleimani

https://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2020/01/03/i-was-so-happy-local-iranians-react-to-death-of-solemani/

“Nobody likes people get killed, but this person had a lot of history behind him, and that’s why it makes everybody happy,” he said.

Nooshin Mashkaty, a NASA engineer who was born in Iran but moved to Los Angeles as a child for school, agreed.

“Having a terrorist pay his due is a very happy moment,” she said. “Soleimani is the brain behind all of the terrorist attack, internal and external, so you could imagine how everyone was happy. He not only has killed many Americans, he’s killed many Iranians and many other people around the world.”