patrick.net

It's all so Cool And Hip, A.I., etc.

Legal liability can likely get in the way of it.

HeadSet says

It would be much easier to build a self flying plane than a self driving car

See Can Cargo-Carrying Drones Jump Over Air Freight’s Logistical Logjams?
Also, vertical takeoff and landing.

B.A.C.A.H. says

Legal liability can likely get in the way of it.

Since some random pedestrian was killed by a self-driving Uber test car in Phoenix back in 2018, the public should expect at minimum, a million dollars in survivor benefits for its victims, considering that in the current world, vehicular homicide involves jail time.

HeadSet says

It would be much easier to build a self flying plane than a self driving car. No obstacles or people pulling in front of you. Autopilots are pretty advanced anyway, they can even do a full instrument approach. Taxiing could be controlled by buried wires in the taxiways and runways.

And it'll be under the FAA, where safety and documentation are paramount, unlike the streets of Phoenix (or any other city) where the mayor threw in some kickbacks at Uber to test their vehicles on an uninformed public.

Booger says

I don't think that a self driving car could handle Pittsburgh with a little snow.

And much of the rest of the country outside of SoCal (and the Southwest) where there's snow, sleet, heavy rain, fog, and a host of other situations where the navigation could be rendered inoperable and you're looking at a major accident.

they still dont have an answer who is legally responsible for when the car crashes and kills someone.

TrumpingTits says

I think a better hypothetical moral test would be you're driving on a narrow street, and an out off control wide truck is barreling down the street head on to you.
On the right is 1 person or on the left sidewalk is 5 people, which side would you take?

I'm not going to be on the tracks, at a switch and wouldn't know which is which at that point. But if I were close enough, I would just yell, "TRAIN!!!"

TrumpingTits says

NancyPelosiHaircut says

they still dont have an answer who is legally responsible for when the car crashes and kills someone.

And they won't. Because politicians will have to be accountable for that. The insurance companies will push this issue, tho.

Right now, they're charging that Uber backup driver for negligent homicide in AZ.

https://www.wjsu.org/post/backup-driver-autonomous-uber-suv-charged-negligent-homicide-arizona

I'm sorry but this is wrong. When a vehicle is 'self-driven', a driver is not in some 'driving mode', He's in some distracted state, listening to music, reading, or whatever. Sure, he's suppose to take control when the computer tells him but in that case, why have the computer at all and just drive the car?

The company, Uber, is liable and not the test driver. They should pay the victim's family a million or two.

We all know what's coming: two tiered insurance. Guess which policy will be cheaper (bonus points, guess who the first pat.netter to complain will be?)

Hircus says

But long haul trucking seems within reach

Agreed, that's already happening. Also the $ saved when they caravan and draft each other makes it worth it.

Rin says

m sorry but this is wrong. When a vehicle is 'self-driven', a driver is not in some 'driving mode', He's in some distracted state, listening to music, reading, or whatever.

This might evolve in case law once end users are being ferried about by mature self driving technology. She was in a testing and development platform of what's still just an advanced prototype. This is grist for the "You had ONE fucking job!" mill. I do agree with the finding that the pedestrian was partially at fault for crossing in the dark with no lights while not in a crosswalk and disregarding approaching traffic. "Pedestrians always have the right of way" is abused by self-serving pricks as badly as "The customer is always right." People in the ghetto-ass neighborhood where my shop is located are especially bad about stepping randomly off the curb and mean mugging the people who had to screech to a panic stop to avoid hitting them. Recently I pulled out for a right turn when a homeless punk speeding the wrong way on the sidewalk ran his bike into my fender. He cussed me out, and complained, "You didn't even look!" I said of course not, you're riding against the flow NOBODY is looking for a speeding conveyance approaching in that direction, and to ponder having "He had the right of way" on his gravestone. That's when he punched the mirror, cussed me out more, and sped away in the wrong direction in traffic lanes now causing another car to honk and swerve 60 feet further. So yeah I'm unsympathetic to belligerent jaywalkers finally meeting their chrome plated fate.

Wait another 70 years.

"Well Done, Accord 452"

www.youtube.com/embed/F2iRDYnzwtk

Hircus says

But long haul trucking seems within reach for AI - they mostly drive straight or hit the brakes. For scenarios where the truck needs to navigate something difficult on the hwy, I think they can just let someone drive remotely.

Are all the trains broken?

Automan Empire says

and to ponder having "He had the right of way" on his gravestone

lol

Booger says

Hircus says

But long haul trucking seems within reach for AI - they mostly drive straight or hit the brakes. For scenarios where the truck needs to navigate something difficult on the hwy, I think they can just let someone drive remotely.

Are all the trains broken?

Why do they use long haul trucking now?

NoCoupForYou says

Wait another 70 years.

"Predigested food cooked by infrared. "

This was a time when magazines actually had Lime Jello with Green Olive jello mold recipes.

So what technical problem is the self-driving vehicle suppose to fix? It appears that the primary motivation is to remove ppl from the transportation industry and save some money.

Here's the thing, oil refineries are in a contained space. The same goes for manufacturing of rubber tires, steel pipes, etc. This development, between the 1870s and the 1970s, spurred the modern world and today, it's done in safe, contained environments where the average pedestrian isn't being lambasted by chlorine gas or sulfuric acid.

In contrast, aside from the firing of individuals, self-driving cars will not have nearly the same effect on society as the aforementioned. It's at best, a consolidation of money from national trucking firms like Schneider or local livery services like Boston Taxi, into one or two monopolies like Uber or Waymo.

HeadSet says

It would be much easier to build a self flying plane than a self driving car. No obstacles or people pulling in front of you. Autopilots are pretty advanced anyway, they can even do a full instrument approach. Taxiing could be controlled by buried wires in the taxiways and runways.

You know aviation better than I from past comments. I agree that drones or planes are more realistic than self driving cars. You can already plot a path with a drone from launch to landing. Weight is the biggest issue. If they can lessen the weight of batteries in half, we'd have drones flying people around tomorrow. I'm actually a little surprised that Musk isn't taking this on. It would benefit his EV's and also open up pandoras box for air transportation.

WookieMan says

I'm actually a little surprised that Musk isn't taking this on.

People will be falling from the sky onto other people. Let small package transport in narrowly defined lanes build out the tech first.

Tenpoundbass says

If the AI has NEVER seen a large white sign on the left hand side of the road

On his 570 AM Saturday morning program Wheels with Ed Wallace in the DFW area, Ed ridiculed A1 and the example he used was what happens where there's a blonde, blue-eyed seven year old girl with pigtails in the path of the A1mobile to make it sufficiently heart rending. That was two years ago and today that would be considered some kind of phobic thing.

Hircus says

Are all the trains broken?

Why do they use long haul trucking now?

Because they are stupid, I think.

call what? are you saying that there were people that actually thought self driving cars would happen before lets say 2050?

Something to contemplate. In three years time when Tesla is selling a sedan for $25k, Elon Musk will have all the data he needs to determine if autopiloted vehicles are safer than human drivers. At that point , a Tesla auto insurance subsidiary can offer a substantially discounted insurance plan to autopilot Tesla drivers. Trout will be the first to complain....

https://driveghost.com/

CBOEtrader says

https://driveghost.com/

That's a bit scary too.

I've always wanted cars to have inner rims that would allow them to ride on train tracks as well.

CBOEtrader says

https://driveghost.com/

"Equipped with 8 cameras capturing 360˚ HD clarity, Ghost sees it all, from merging vehicles to shadowed pedestrians."

Still no lidar?

Back after a break... Self driving Trucking is already here and operating on our highways.

TuSimple in San Diego has routes running from Pheonix to I think El Centro. Exactly what we thought... long stretches of straight, pretty empty road with almost no weather.

I think at this point they have moved off of safety drivers and just have remote control drivers. Not positive on that.

As far as cars, there are a couple competing business models out there. Uber and Google as we know, but then also Cruise(GM), Zoox, Argo (Ford), Baidu(China) and a few others. The GM, Ford, and Tesla plays are clear.. branded navigation for their car line. Uber and Google are taking the taxi approach, but on car manufacturers platforms, so not integrated. Zoox is starting with integration on Toyota Highlanders, but they are actually developing a "self driving platform" that is like a car, but actually isn't. It's more of a cube on an electric chassis, with no ability for a human to drive. This is also targeted at the taxi market, but clearly differently.

An interesting wrinkle in the Uber/Taxi market is I've heard nobody wants to share ride spaces in the COVID market.. Makes sense. Also of note are some other players like CommaAI. They wanted to develop a small video only plugin that consumers could buy third party to drive their car. They actually put something out on the market and its almost terrifying. They were shut down by regulators, but then put out an open source product that they claim is just for experimentation, and not for on-road use. I BET there are people letting that thing drive around for them though. I think Comma may now be out of business.

Finally, we have the drone space. It's interesting in that in 3d space, we can use communication to maintain separation, and there aren't really obstacles to need avoiding in the air in the same way they are on the ground. Some of the smaller drone AI makers targeting the military might be able to compete with Boeing since Boeing has never really been known for their software excellence. Obviously we have higher safety challneges though in that you can't just "hit the brakes" in the air with no energy maintenance cost. Seeing a place to land and doing it safely is a rather important thing. ALTHOUGH, it would be HIGHLY interesting to see dirigible Air busses flown autonomously. They can actually get decent speeds over medium distances (10-20 miles), if we could figure out how to load and unload them. Might be an interesting alternative to bulldozing in train tracks for public transport in the suburb commute spaces.

https://jalopnik.com/autonomous-cars-are-getting-in-the-way-of-emergency-res-1850393777

Autonomous Cars Are Getting in the Way of Emergency Responders in San Francisco