patrick.net

We were in Afghanistan simply to get Bin Laden.

We were in Iraq simply to end Saddam due to his "WMDs".

We ended up staying in both long beyond.

The old "Problem-Reaction-Solution". Just find any reason to get in there, then stay a hella long time with the "Irresponsible to leave chaotic/broken" excuse.

Exit Strategy before Entering is the counter.

Next time, we shouldn't spend all the time countering the excuses to intervene, but demanding a specific quantitative exit strategy as part of Deal. IE Once Big Bad Faboozle/WMD is nullfied, we leave. If Big Bad Faboozle/WMD not found in a year of searching, we leave. We leave no matter what, we leave whether or not anything is broken, and whether or not claims he/it is right around the corner.

However, one thing I've learned is the Heart/Interpretation is MORE important than the words. Look at the Constitution since FDR. Constitution II must specify Original Intent as the SOLE legal interpretive philosophy. Also, no 3rd "Judicial" Branch of Government, an invitation to Tyranny - appointed for life schmucks, whose number is fungible, and threats of changing that number, can result in lifetime bureaucrats ruling in a way that keeps the President/Congress happy.

MisdemeanorRebellionNoCoupForYou says

we shouldn't spend all the time countering the excuses to intervene, but demanding a quantitative exit strategy

I agree, but the demands of the people mean less than nothing to the elite.

Democracy means nothing to them. We voted against their wishes, so they cancelled Democracy.

Our lives mean nothing to them. Mandatory injections of God knows what for everyone.

The Founders were entirely right, there's only two evolutions from the current environment:

1. We become the Establishment somehow - unlikely as the first thing the PoMo Establishment did was institute Purity Tests after decades of claiming "Let 1000 flowers bloom" and "Don't legislate morality" and "We need diverse voices (ie people who agree with us and not tradition)"

2. We know what this one is.

il Donaldo Trumpo
@ilSharko
Aug 16
The ruling class decided to steal an election so they could give power to a lying pedophile with dementia. What could go wrong?

https://twitter.com/ilSharko/status/1427294253164728324#m

Agree with leaving, disagree with not taking our hardware with us.

FortWayneAsNancyPelosiHaircut says

Trump was moving troops out, Biden I dont think he could have done anything different.

Oh, he could. First of all, winter is the time when moving around the country and fighting there is severely complicated by weather, so starting withdrawing in late fall and finishing by early spring while your adversary is mostly dormant and snow-bound, makes perfect sense. Doing the same over summer - stupid. Guess who wanted to do it by March and who wanted to do it by September because of some "symbolism".

There are other things which could be done differently too.

We're out of Afghanistan because Big Pharma shifted from Opiates to Vaccines.

Huh, that could be it.

But I was under the impression that most opiates these days were synthetic, not from poppies at all anymore.

Staying in Afghanistan beyond the dubious "Capture Bin Laden" mission was the shit show. It positively amazes me how many Republicans I've known since before the war started, who were all gung-ho to go, and all gung-ho to stay, are now critical of Biden and blaming him for the entire debacle.

All the way from the beginning "The Left" (to lump together everyone opposed to the war, which Republicans were nearly unanimously for) critics have been making the same critiques I'm hearing right wingers state sanctimoniously. I'm also pretty tired of the "DeMoCrAtS VoTeD FoR tHe WaR ToO!!!!!!" We KNEW the Yellowcake Uranium and WMD claims were bullshit, and we KNEW that Afghanistan couldn't be united into a country it never was before. We KNEW it drove the Soviets to bankruptcy and withdrawal, and we KNEW the same would happen to America. BUT... We put aside our doubts and partisanship, and put our trust in the President saying war was necessary to protect America. Of course, it WAS bullshit, but did Republicans ever acknowledge this about the war THEY hawked for? No, they've been trying to recon the situation into making the Democrats and entire American left share the blame and guilt that Republicans won't accept for their beliefs and behavior.

As of the 2012 election, Biden himself was advocating to hand the country back to the troops we trained, while the official Republican position was to ignore the sunk cost fallacy, jump into the hole they dug, and dig deeper at American taxpayer/American soldier expense. This songified version of the VP debate is a fun watch in its own right.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ksXRFRCUatc

Kind of Reminds me when the Democrats whinged that Middle Eastern nationals would be profiled and worked with Bush to prevent it. Now the Dem WH-Congress actively profiles, from the Military to FBI they control, American Born White Males with gusto. After decades of apologizing for radical groups from MOVE to the Weathermen to Antifa and BLM, the Democrats now cast a peaceful protest on 1/6 as the worst terror attack on US soil since the Civil War. Forgetting all about BLM-enabler Clinton-released Susan Rosenberg's BOMBING of the Senate in the 80s.

The two signs the Media is complete Pravda:
1. Not even a token voice of opposition (UNLIKE the Iraq War where Meathead, Garofalo, and others were present on almost every broadcast before, during, and after the invasion)
2. No comparing events at all (ie 84 Senate Bombing to 1/6, or the BLM-Antifa nightly "Mostly Peaceful" firebombing of Churches, Stores, then police stations and Federal Courthouses to Old Guys and Gals walking around the Capitol).

Oh, and a big third:
"Political Speech is the MOST Protected Speech" has become "Eliminate Misleading* Narratives"

* Misleading = Narratives that Lead Away from MY preferred conclusions.

Automan Empire says

No, they've been trying to recon the situation into making the Democrats and entire American left share the blame and guilt that Republicans won't accept for their beliefs and behavior.

What.

Is this what the rank and file Joe Blow Republican is saying, or is this what the NEWS media is saying? I find the rank and file is very often strawmanned.

I would't have considered myself a "republican" much less a "conservative" under George W. Bush's reign of terror, but I didn't consider myself a "leftist" or a "democrat" under Obama's new reign of terror. Those two are hands down the worst presidents in my lifetime. Far worse than Nixon of Jimmy Carter. Worse than Clinton. Biden doesn't seem any different or better than Bush or Obama though, but he's got 3 1/2 years to go.

gabbar says

I think we are probably being misled by the "withdrawal".

This is probably factual. I heard yesterday that my 2nd cousin was deployed to the region yesterday. Something is cooking.

Wait until Kabul is filled with Taliban!

AND FUCKING NUKE IT!

BoomAndBustCycle says

the January 6th capital attack.

What attack?

The "Insurrectionists" were ushered in.

BoomAndBustCycle says

WookieMan says

We were right to leave, but this mindset fails most of the time. 80/20 rule. 20% will do the work while the other 80% fuck off. You piss off the productive people by managing this way. Cause burn out and ultimately more time, money and employees leaving.

I was speaking more from the standpoint of “fair warning”… not springing weekend work on employees on Friday before. But saying … 2 weeks out we are going to be busy.. be prepared to work weekends. Biden didn’t really prepare Americans for the shitshow we saw on the news. That’s my complaint, that’s my bad management critique.

Failure of leadership either way. Not being prepped two days or weeks before something you know is coming is the definition of failure. You’re already behind at either point. You need contingency plans a month out. Be prepared to hire more people. Use a vendor that can get what you need.

Business is not complicated. When I go to a job I’ve got 6 batteries and 5 SD cards for 30-40 minutes of flight time. I could go non-stop with that gear for 12-18 hours no problem.

You prepare. You don’t work weekends or extra hours if you’re intelligent. I’d get a new job in you have managers that behave that way. They’re idiots. Biden is an idiot as shown. Most people agree.

Patrick says

Are terrorists so stupid

YES they are. Their training is memorizing 1300 year old tests in madrasses.

richwicks says

Dollars to donuts the US is just going to start another goddamned useless war.

income from vaccinations! might be sufficient for enriching our rulers.

Bd6r says

richwicks says

Dollars to donuts the US is just going to start another goddamned useless war.

income from vaccinations! might be sufficient for enriching our rulers.

The war against the invisible enemy is perfect! No collateral damage! People will die but collateral is not damaged!

Onvacation says

The war against the invisible enemy is perfect! No collateral damage! People will die but collateral is not damaged!

AND IT ALL IS DONE TO SAVE CHILDREN!

Patrick says

I don't think that "he" got us out at all.

I think the Taliban got us out.

I know you are not advocating for violence and extremism and neither am I. But if armed militants from the Taliban expelled a more powerful invader armed with nuclear weapons and F-15 fighter jets then Bidet is full of shit. In other word, the second Amendment was implemented to insure the rest of the bill of rights would be protected.

Bd6r says

AND IT ALL IS DONE TO SAVE CHILDREN!

Yeah, They already killed Grandma.

PeopleUnited says

I know you are not advocating for violence and extremism and neither am I. But if armed militants from the Taliban expelled a more powerful invader armed with nuclear weapons and F-15 fighter jets then Bidet is full of shit. In other word, the second Amendment was implemented to insure the rest of the bill of rights would be protected.

I know some former "operators" (special forces that "worked" in Afghanistan) that are really pissed right now.

Go try and take their guns, I dare you.

WookieMan says

You prepare. You don’t work weekends or extra hours if you’re intelligent. I’d get a new job in you have managers that behave that way. They’re idiots. Biden is an idiot as shown. Most people agree.

So Elon Musk asking people to work weekends for his space x launch or Tesla ramp up is because he’s not intelligent or just a bad manager?

I bet he pinched his nipple, too.

https://t.me/WeTheMedia/30110

https://t.me/CodeMonkeyZ/1175

It doesn't matter if the Taliban kill them, they will still vote....again, and again, and again.
https://t.me/WeTheMedia/30132

BoomAndBustCycle says

So Elon Musk asking people to work weekends for his space x launch or Tesla ramp up is because he’s not intelligent or just a bad manager?

Yup. 100% piss poor management. If you set a date and need overtime, you weren't smart enough to prepare. The classic over promise and fail to deliver. Business owners do it all the time out of fear of losing revenue. When they don't deliver, they end up losing more revenue instead of just being realistic and honest. I've ran a business and my own personal business quite successfully. I interact with the over promising people all the time and I can spot them a mile away. I avoid them like the plague as I know it would have hurt my business.

Musk could likely be even more successful if he just picked a lane. The guy is smart, but Tesla has had massive issues in the past with production. Took them years to get it normalized. I don't follow Tesla, but I still believe it's a problem. All his wealth is in what financial institutions, pensions, public shareholders, etc think Tesla is worth. It doesn't mean he's doing a good job. When institutions are throwing money at you, it's a lot easier. Doesn't mean he's a good leader, but probably a good salesman.

BoomAndBustCycle says

So Elon Musk asking people to work weekends for his space x launch or Tesla ramp up is because he’s not intelligent or just a bad manager?

I'll go with the latter.

https://babylonbee.com/news/biden-takes-more-vacation-as-a-reward-for-doing-such-a-good-job-this-week

Patrick says

I agree with you @FortWayneAsNancyPelosiHaircut

Our most important problems right now are:

1. not getting stabbed with the jab
2. not being threatened with job loss by the Biden administration's DOJ for refusing to submit to the jab (well, not my problem anymore, but for many millions, it's HUGE)
3. lockdowns that just cause suffering for no scientific reason

Normalization of sodomy and pedophilia is a huge country-weakening disaster as well, but first we have to escape from Fauci/Biden's death-needles.

much agreed

Biden reads what’s put in front of him. He is the press and those that run the planet. When it becomes obvious he is a screw up they will remove his cap, dispose of him and place the hat on a new head who will fool the people for a spell.

He can’t remember when he left Afghanistan it was not left to the Taliban but to the president and his 300k soldiers who would run the country being as good as any soldiers on the planet. For two days at least. No mention of this in his address a few days ago.

Now the Taliban have the country, that was not part of his plan but those people who run things. Now they run the planet through China more than the US. This is obvious now. What and which countries benefit China will dominate, regardless what Biden says. I look at what I see happening, not what I am told by television.

Invest accordingly.

Ok, any guesses on the number of deaths caused by starvation, warring between factions this will cause and the number of refugees fleeing a shithole going on full meltdown?


The humanitarian crisis is going to be monumental. We could have prevented all this by keeping a few thousand troops in Afghanistan.

My guess is a few million Afghans die outright over the next 5 years or so with 10 million displaced.

Misc says

The humanitarian crisis is going to be monumental. We could have prevented all this by keeping a few thousand troops in Afghanistan.

Was not sustainable, besides the powers that be probably know they will need them at home. After all the great leader of the Bidet regime was installed behind a barbed wire fence surrounded by 20,000 soldiers. How many is it going to take to keep the peace when the food or fuel shortages start to become severe?

PeopleUnited says

Misc says

The humanitarian crisis is going to be monumental. We could have prevented all this by keeping a few thousand troops in Afghanistan.

Was not sustainable, besides the powers that be probably know they will need them at home. After all the great leader of the Bidet regime was installed behind a barbed wire fence surrounded by 20,000 soldiers. How many is it going to take to keep the peace when the food or fuel shortages start to become severe?

Of course it was sustainable. We were there for 20 years, mostly with just a handful of troops.

You think waaaaaaaaay too highly of Americans to protest anything. During the Housing Bubble we had 8 million foreclosures over just a few years.. At 3 residents per dwelling that's about 24 million people. Double that for the number of renters impacted, and we economically displaced about 50 million people in the most heavily armed country in the world. The number of people protesting with firearms could be counted on a single hand.

BoomAndBustCycle says

Patrick says

Are terrorists so stupid that they always alienate the majority and let the real criminals live in peace? It doesn't add up.

Have to admit… that’s why I had some respect for the January 6th capital attack. Atleast they went after the source of the problem… the people they were angry with and didn’t take it out on civilians.

If they actually knew the source of the problem, they would have burned down the Federal Reserve.

PeopleUnited says

gabbar says

I think we are probably being misled by the "withdrawal".

This is probably factual. I heard yesterday that my 2nd cousin was deployed to the region yesterday. Something is cooking.

Some of our relatives deploying next month. Those orders we knew for a while now. Some shit is happening. Deploying to Kuwait.

Fortwaynemobile says

PeopleUnited says

gabbar says

I think we are probably being misled by the "withdrawal".

This is probably factual. I heard yesterday that my 2nd cousin was deployed to the region yesterday. Something is cooking.

Some of our relatives deploying next month. Those orders we knew for a while now. Some shit is happening. Deploying to Kuwait.

Iran possibly. It's madness of course, but it's been madness for 20 years.

Misc says

Of course it was sustainable. We were there for 20 years, mostly with just a handful of troops.

How many dead and wounded? How much money spent? That is what unsustainable means.

And regarding the need for troops at home, when fuel and food supplies run out, there won’t be protests, there will be survival of the fittest, and perhaps only the military will be able to prevent anarchy. But seeing as how we have anarchy to a small degree already in Chicago and other major dem cities civilization seems ready to disintegrate.

PeopleUnited says

But seeing as how we have anarchy to a small degree already in Chicago and other major dem cities

Not one politician has had an angry crowd take them out. In fact, those Chicago and blue city politicians will not even be voted out.

PeopleUnited says

the powers that be probably know they will need them at home. After all the great leader of the Bidet regime was installed behind a barbed wire fence surrounded by 20,000 soldiers. How many is it going to take to keep the peace when the food or fuel shortages start to become severe?

The soldiers are US.

When our government asks our soldiers to fire on US, they have lost all credibility.

Our soldiers won't shoot us because they are us.