patrick.net

Bitcoin says

Zak says

No anonymity is possible

you Bitcoin haters should make up your mind.....on the one hand side you are saying only criminals use Bitcoin on the other side you say when you use Bitcoin your identity gets revealed. So which one is it?

Not expecting a cogent answer

Oh yeah.. and what is it called when you put the words of a failing argument in someone else's mouth then try to knock them down. ooooohhhh that's right.. strawman

I'll take 'signs that you don't have a winning argument' for 1000 Alex

LOLZ!!

Zak says

I'll take 'signs that you don't have a winning argument' for 1000 Alex

Did I miss something?

Bitcoin says

All we do is correct the misinformation that OV spreads. Correcting someone on false statements isnt hyping.

Ok, why do you waste your time correcting bitcoin 'misinformation"?

komputodo says

Bitcoin says

All we do is correct the misinformation that OV spreads. Correcting someone on false statements isnt hyping.

False statements?

Like Bitcoin is a scam?

Or, the only way to make money with crypto is to find a bigger fool?

Or maybe, Bitcoin is unsustainable?

What false statements have I made?

I'm not going to unignore Bitcoin to find out what they think.

komputodo says

Bitcoin says

All we do is correct the misinformation that OV spreads. Correcting someone on false statements isnt hyping.

Ok, why do you waste your time

I think OV and others deliberately spread false statements about Bitcoin because crypto is a threat for them somehow.

We know OV invests in silver coins and matchbox cars. Maybe he wanted millennials to fomo into silver instead of Bitcoin? I think there isnt any hope for him :)

Why are you on this thread komputodo? Do you own Bitcoin, ETH or any altcoin? Maybe Cardano?

Notice how the Bitcoin haters never post any articles? Its just spam and false statements but never any backup :)

On the contrary, many people on this blog correct the misinformation and post actual facts.

For instance:

Russia just declared Bitcoin legal tender:
https://www.fxstreet.com/cryptocurrencies/news/russia-recognizing-crypto-as-a-form-of-currency-validates-wells-fargos-hyper-adoption-outlook-202202091425?source=patrick.net

Sry Haters :)

Didn’t someone steal 120,000 bitcoins?
Nobody can do that to me.
I use voice recognition to access my accounts.
With my phone it’s my fingerprint.
If I am using the website, they send a code to my phone to get access.
My bank account never has shit in it so I don’t care about the ATM card being cloned.

clambo says

Didn’t someone steal 120,000 bitcoins?
Nobody can do that to me.

Of course not, you dont even own one Bitcoin! How could they possibly steal one from you.

I own 2 BTC, and they cant steal them because its on a cold storage. If you leave Bitcoin on an exchange, it can be stolen> Not your keys, not your crypto.

Leaving crypto on an exchange is like you leaving gold in a safe deposit box at your local bank. It can be stolen.

Instead, you store it on a hardware wallet/cold storage. Even if they steal your hardware wallet, they cant access it without your keys. :) It just cant get any safer!

Bitcoin says

Why are you on this thread komputodo?

Because I find it interesting to watch people argue over pointless bullshit.

$10 Trillion Asset Manager BlackRock To Offer Crypto Trading: Report
The world’s largest asset manager BlackRock, Inc. is reportedly preparing to
launch a cryptocurrency trading service for investors.

These bigger fools will need to buy crypto if they plan on managing crypto...

Checkmate ;)

Cash says

These bigger fools will need to buy crypto if they plan on managing crypto...

Do you think BlackRock is gonna HODL? Or do they just want to cash in on the fools buying crypto by collecting commissions?

I don't think they're HODLing.

Onvacation says

Do you think BlackRock is gonna HODL

https://www.benzinga.com/markets/cryptocurrency/22/02/25532512/10-trillion-asset-manager-blackrock-to-offer-crypto-trading-report?source=patrick.net

In reality if they are managing crypto for their clients they have no choice but to hold what ever clients allow them to manage. Or don't you know a thing about
what it means to be a custodian of a "clients assets"?

Checkmate still Stands!!!

I have traded both BTC and ETH and I related when I sold them both near the top.
Also I am not the biggest fan of either but I do know for a fact blockchains and associated protocols will
be around many many years after you and I are gone take it to the bank.

Watch the fools buy BTC up to a min. of 89k and possibly 104k and depending on when that comes about
and the data associated is available will go from there. For the most part I have moved to alts and once that season is over
I'm selling most everything except my XRP positions and going to USDC while the bears do their thing and dump crypto to it's
knees then I will be there to pickup the discounts. I target applications with real application like XRP which will be on the world
scene in a big way in the very near future.

Cash says

Checkmate still Stands!!!

OK.

I don't remember you saying how to get your money out without a bigger fool paying you more than you paid for it.

The only way to make money with crypto is to sell it for more than you bought it for. No dividends. No assets. No product. No service other than making it easy for criminals to move money.

Foolsmate.

Blockchains are fine. Stupidly inefficient, but fine. For a while, people tried to say they could provide a system outside of government control. China then banned mining in country, and the use shortly after, and we kind of saw that the idea of things "outside of government control" are still subject to the physical limitations of the real world.

People also tried to make the argument that no one could ever take your bitcoin. They leave out the statement "if you have some kind of perfect real world behavior." Humans are still the weakest link in the chain. For bitcoin, you still need to physically give your money to someone. The places facilitating these trades are called exchanges.They get hacked. In addition, even if you pull your bitcoin out of the exchanges.. you have to make sure your private keys are never seen. This accounts for the much of stolen/confiscated bitcoin. Its really really hard to have bitcoin be usable, and also keep anyone from seeing your private key (if they are really trying to see it). You don't need to hack bitcoin if you just hack the computer you are using your private key on, or have the surveillance of the FBI at your disposal.

How many fingers will an attacker have to break before you tell them where your bitcoin key is? None of this is any different than other forms of money, including gold. It's just to demonstrate that all the "bitcoin is perfectly secure" is just marketing to get you to believe it has some extra security properties that other things don't have. The form of security that bitcoin has is extremely specific, not some broadly "unhackable unstealable" thing. And worse, as I mentioned previously, all transactions are logged and publicly viewable. So your transaction profile can identify you with very little other metadata needed to fully unmask you (say a shipping record from one of your transactions).

If you take all this problematic bullshit, and add to it a hugely expensive proof of work waste of global computing power and electricity, you get a largely slow, expensive, inefficient distributed database that doesn't really store a lot of data. There is some small value in the distributed log nature of the blockchain, but the "currency value" is largely due to everyone speculating that the price will rise, and they should buy some to participate in the speculation.. The alternative nature would be that everyone was trying to get bitcoin because it was so much easier to conduct online transactions, or store your facebook profile for sharing with friends or something. No one cares about any of that shit. You ask them "why should I buy bitcoin" and the answer is "because the price will go up.".

If bitcoin was a relatively stable thing, and you could buy 1 bitcoin for 1 dollar, and sell it for 99c (transaction fee), and you asked someone "why should I buy bitcoin" .. they would just say "I don't know" . Now, bitcoin people will love to point out the deflationary nature of bitcoin... There are a fixed amount of 21 million, and more can't be made. This is only true of "bitcoin" TM as a single entity. But at the same time, clearly bitcoin "clones" were made. Etherium. etc.. In pointing out that bitcoin can't be inflated away, there is nothing really as a magical benefit that is provided. The whole crux of the matter is pointing out a weakness in FIAT currency. This FIAT currency weakness is well known, and the US dollar is currently rapidly inflating away (7.5% official).

But bitcoin itself is FIAT currency. It was made to represent work completed, not useful work output. Well anything can represent work completed. That's why ethereum could just be made right alongside bitcoin. Nothing of value in bitcoin was created that would provide an enduring value and reason to use it instead of ethereum. Contract this to a commodity. Lets use gears as our example commodity. A finished gear is a proof of work. The bevels and teeth and tolerance are all observable measurable properties. And further, a finished gear can be placed into a machine and do useful work. You also can't just swap out a piece of paper for the gear. You actually need that work completed to accomplish that task.

A "finished" blockchain can do almost nothing, except record a transaction of itself between two wallets. And there are 10,000,000 other ways to also do this, and for a lot cheaper. Paper FIAT money is also proof of work. Clearly you can see the ink was placed onto a rectangular sheet of paper very carefully and with some very hard to replicate authentication mechanisms. The fundamental problem is the useful work that the output piece of paper can do. There is none other than physically representing moving between people's wallets as an indication of wealth transfer. And it shares the same problem as bitcoin. Even if there was a hard limit of 21 million US dollar bank notes...you can just print euros instead of dollars. There is nothing fundamentally value creating about printing currency. And if I wanted to record some distributed transaction, I could just use etherium instead of bitcoin. Nothing is distinct or special, or uniquely needed about the work done in a bitcoin blockchain, other than it is in an incompatible ecosystem to all other digital records (yet another drawback).

In order for a currency to truly have value, it must represent value created and able to be used. A gear preserves the value of the machine work that went into creating it. Beans and rice preserve nutritional value from the labor of the farmer growing it and harvesting it. Metal coins preserve the mining extraction and refining values of the metals they are minted from. I'm not saying this can't occur digitally. In fact it DOES, in the form of software. Software represents the work of engineers that went into writing and compiling that code, and the useful utilization and output of that software. I don't know how software could be treated as currency though. Only the restriction of software through keys and login access to remote systems can create value. Software itself, once produced can be copied infinitely with near zero degredation.

So instead of worrying about buying my depreciating share of digital tokens representing a ponzi scam of artificial scarcity, my personal choice is to create the value of write once, run millions of times software. And I try to invest a chunk into other people also doing that, because it truly seems like a world improving thing, as opposed to bitcoin, which is just another system of control and false scarcity.

Cash says

$10 Trillion Asset Manager BlackRock To Offer Crypto Trading: Report
The world’s largest asset manager BlackRock, Inc. is reportedly preparing to
launch a cryptocurrency trading service for investors.

Amazing. Fidelity, JPM....now Blackrock. All big players are entering the crypto game! Fabulous!

komputodo says

Bitcoin says

Why are you on this thread komputodo?

Because I find it interesting

Same here! I love the topic. We live in such exciting times! Crypto is emerging as a new asset class and we are still early during this evolution. Soon there will be hyper-adoption.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/crypto-is-like-the-1990s-internet-nearing-a-hyper-adoption-phase-wells-fargo-says-11644354647?source=patrick.net

Wells Fargo got it right:
"Crypto is like the 1990s internet, nearing a hyper-adoption phase, Wells Fargo says"

I am so glad to be alive and invested in it!!!

Bitcoin says

komputodo says

Bitcoin says

Why are you on this thread komputodo?

Because I find it interesting

LOLOL.....just like the MSM...only quotes part of what I said......my original statement was "Because I find it interesting to watch people argue over pointless bullshit."

Crickets?

Zak says

Crickets?

Don't expect cogent answers and you won't be disappointed.

Zak says

Crickets?

When Bitcoin's momentum is up, the haters dont say much....when Bitcoin is correcting, they all put their cheerleader gear on. Looks like Bitcoin recovered and ended the downtrend.....so dont expect to hear much.

Usually the only stories in the media are pro-crypto because the exchanges are the ones paying the authors of the stories.

Looks like someone with media spending ability went short crypto 'cause there are starting to be anti-crypto stories.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/savingandinvesting/more-than-half-of-bitcoin-investors-are-in-the-red/ar-AATHCon?li=BBnb7Kz&source=patrick.net

https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/savingandinvesting/more-than-half-of-bitcoin-investors-are-in-the-red/ar-AATHCon?li=BBnb7Kz&source=patrick.net

For the past year, when BTC reached its first breakout high in Mar 2021, it's been forming a bullish channel, ever since.

That mean a major sell off, results in a higher lower, with the consequential run up, leading to a higher high.



So far, I don't see the meltdown until this changes.

DUMP IT.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=61Q6wWu5ziY&source=patrick.net

Here's the thing, since the Russell 2000 has held its year long price box & both the EURUSD & GBPUSD are not testing lower lows, then for all intensive purposes, the big broad-based market 'meltdown' has been postponed.

If you're what's called an "intermediate term" style trader and don't like the idea of using these hackable digital storage (or whatever), you can do a short term trade on the futures based ETF, like XBTF, and get a slice of the re-test of BTC's 64K level & do pretty well between now and tax day.

Sure, this is not your buy-n-hold A-list basket of ATT, Altria, & Chevron but hey ... those stocks have distributed some dividends & how much of a risk is it to place a one quarter bet using that free money?

Trust me, next quarter, ATT, Altria, & Chevron will send you the same cash amount to your account. I promise you that. Your risk is basically is fraction of a quarterly dividend distribution because the ETF won't go to '0' that quickly.

Tonight I was in a West Palm beach mini market buying milk and I saw an ATM type machine that took your money and it gave you crypto currency.
It was not in a high rent neighborhood.
I asked the guy working “Do people put their money into this machine?”
“They do.”
I guess it’s the same loser get rich quick mentality as buying lottery tickets.
It will likely provide the same results for them.

BITCOIN FOR TRUCKERS
GOAL REACHED
USD $ 926366.03 raisedgoal $ 881321.19
https://tallyco.in/s/lzxccm/?source=patrick.net

It looks like a lot of smalls some .50 but it all adds up apparently

I have to admit that Bitcoin has a huge advantage in its ability to completely bypass the banking system.

This may really help the truckers in their fight for freedom.

Patrick says

I have to admit that Bitcoin has a huge advantage in its ability to completely bypass the banking system.

The thing about BTC it is not the quickest or cheapest crypto/route but it gets the job done and leaves SWIFT in the dust.
https://fiatleak.com/?source=patrick.net
Just close the pop-up

Patrick says

Bitcoin has a huge advantage in its ability to completely bypass the banking system.

That's what the human traffickers like about crypto.

Onvacation says

Patrick says

Bitcoin has a huge advantage in its ability to completely bypass the banking system.

That's what the human traffickers like about crypto.

Patrick is right, Crypto/Bitcoin is a huge disruption to our outdated financial systems. Your cash on your checking account doesnt earn any interest. My Ada and Dot earn 5-12% staking rewards.

@Onvacation, you might want to align with the other Bitcoin hater @Zak who believes there is no anonymity in crypto. So, if your theory is correct and only human traffickers use Bitcoin, wouldn't they be caught easily? Not expecting a cogent answer - as always. Just trying to help you haters out.......better align instead of contradict each other. Otherwise we have to ask, which on is it?

Is Bitcoin anonymous or not?

The id-to-id transfer of Bitcoin is anonymous, but when you go to convert it to cash, I think you usually have to give id of some kind to get the cash. Unless you can get some person to hand you the cash.

Patrick says

The id-to-id transfer of Bitcoin is anonymous, but when you go to convert it to cash, I think you usually have to give id of some kind to get the cash. Unless you can get some person to hand you the cash.

All US based exchanges are subject to KYC rules. Similar to a bank, those exchanges will have a record of your identity/SS and bank account. In addition, if your portfolio exceeds a certain $ value, they send a 1099 to the user and report to the IRS.

Why does Patrick get this but onvacation and Zak dont?

OV and ZAK look at this big fool!!!
WARREN BUFFETT INVESTS $1 BILLION INTO CRYPTO FRIENDLY BANK
https://procoinnews.com/?source=patrick.net

It's funny, you link to a pro bitcoin news source, it's not even the article that you are mentioning, and there is no description of what the bank does.

After looking at what you are saying, it turns out it is nubank: https://nubank.com.br/en/?source=patrick.net

a Brasilian bank, that doesn't even say the word crypto, bitcoin, etc on the homepage in the link above (though they do say credit card in pretty big letters).

Then you try to leech off Warren Buffets name and imply I'm an idiot by throwing up a strawman that I am calling Warren Buffet a fool for investing in a bank that has some marginal tie to crypto.

Hmm, so it looks like yet another pathetic defense of crypto thru logic fail , as opposed to actually addressing any of the direct and valid points I made.

But.. BUT, lets PRETEND that Warren Buffet bought 1 billion dollars of bitcoin DIRECTLY. Lots of other "rich" money managers certainly have! My following statement will apply equally to them. The expected return of any purchase of bitcoin SOLELY rests on their expectation that there is a higher future return value, and that they will be able to SELL it to another person at a higher real (inflation adjusted) price. Now Warren Buffet has EXPLICITLY stated this is the only reason he or any other person would buy bitcoin (which I agree with), and thus is the reason he would NEVER buy bitcoin. He believes buying other assets that have a "productive value" are simply better purchases, because at some point there will be no "greater fool" to sell crypto currency to at a higher price. Therefore, even if the price TOPS OUT, and magically stays stable, there is no further appreciation due to there being no productive value.

Thus, presumably, Buffet (if still alive, progeny if not) would want to SELL his "crypto asset", as he had extracted all potential real value return, and wishes to purchase more productive assets. To whom will Buffet sell his crypto? Since no one expects to purchase any more crypto for the purpose of riding the appreciation wave (lets assume 100% of the population now has crypto! (except me) ) , who will trade their time or goods for crypto? Why will they do so? The only way you would do so is if the government mandated that their currency for payment was that crypto. Lets say they did that, and it was just like getting paid in dollars currently. This means we collectively through mass adoption of crypto, broke the governments monopoly on the ability to mint and print coin, and to inflate away its value and overspend. So great! If I'm WRONG, it's because you crypto bugs have managed to wrest all the money power out of the hands of the government, and the government is now beholden to the few brave and noble souls who invested early, to dole out crypto money securely as they see fit, because crypto is secure and the government SURELY can't force them to give any of their prize to a wimpy government. Lol, I guess you are right. What a rube I am!!

So If I'm WRONG, then the world will be a Utopia, and I'm ok with being wrong because all the excellent socialists will just be taking care of me with their amazing generosity and foresight anyway. But if I am RIGHT, then you are fucked out of any money you put into crypto, and to the extent you are selling at a higher price to others, you are fucking them, and are basically a shit human participating in and promoting a ponzi scheme that will cause a lot of pain and human suffering.

Note that Warren Buffet DOES own insurance companies, which produce nothing physical, but do produce "value" to the shareholders in the form of earned risk reduction to their customers (premiums). Also note, banks take transaction fees. And I bet Warren is buying into this bank because he likes the transaction fees as a revenue stream that the bank is charging.

Zak says

imply I'm an idiot

No your response proves that point on your own....