patrick.net

I heard it is pretty much toast in the days of $1+ million 3 bedroom homes anyway. They have like 2% commission rates now.

I hope it kills 6% forever. That, and 15% 30-year mortgages will make a cash purchase for a home that much more affordable.

I heard about this trial a while back and have been eagerly waiting for results. Wall Street Journal apparently has a story about the trial, but it requires signing up. Hoping to get more information elsewhere.

Hopefully, this will expose and then bring an end to a bunch of the real estate cartel's practices. Maybe we'll even have bidding transparency during the bidding phase.

It depends on the cleavage and blow jobs at closing.

One indication of the dysfunction of the current system is that most agents spend most of their time looking for clients, not doing actual work.

Another major issue is that it's difficult to evaluate the benefits of an agent's work. The buyer's and seller's agents both win the jackpot if the house sale goes through, not if the sale price was a good deal for one party or the other or if the house is an exceptionally good fit for the buyer. In fact, the buyer's agent has incentive to have the buyer over-pay for the house so as to collect additional commission and also assure the seller will accept the offer over other offers.

I'm trying to brainstorm other ways used-house brokers could be compensated more reasonably. For the listing agent, I've often thought the owner of the house should consider a price that is somewhat low and then give the listing agent 20% of the sale price over that amount.

For the buyer's agent (supposedly called the "selling agent" in the industry — ponder that for a moment if you think the buyer's agent is on the buyer's side), it seems that an hourly pay rate would be more reasonable. It seems that the agent isn't coordinating any sort of house staging or open house viewings, but is merely someone to help a client view houses and walk them through the offer process.

https://t.me/EthanLucasShow/12841

The NAR has already appealed. It'll take a decade to wind its way through the courts.

Can someone walk me through why this ruling caused Zillow and Redfin stock to drop 6 and 5% (respectively) yesterday? I don't see how either is culpable for actions of agents that purchase their services.

The real losers would seem to be Keller Williams, Berkshire, and the other big realtors.

stfu says

Can someone walk me through why this ruling caused Zillow and Redfin stock to drop 6 and 5% (respectively) yesterday? I don't see how either is culpable for actions of agents that purchase their services.

The real losers would seem to be Keller Williams, Berkshire, and the other big realtors.

Zillow and Redfin, but primarily Zillow makes its money from advertising. It is the Real Estate agents that pay Zillow for sending prospective clients their way. If the Real Estate agents make less money per transaction, the value of the leads generated is less and therefore the advertising rates must go down. Therefore, ZIllow/Redfin profitability tanks.

They don't have to build new houses, or new Cities with room for large developments, just as long as Sheeples are quibbling over fees, that they think is at the root of Housing stock shortage and the unaffordability issues.
You can remove the fees, and make interest rates 0%, 90% of Americans will still never own a home at this rate.
We may as well just sit back and watch the Anointed RE monopolies buy up all of the single family homes in Burbdale USA, raze them to the ground and build Brutalist depressing Rental buildings, that most can only afford by working two jobs.

"Oh woah is me! Hep meh! Somebody is making a commission!"

America's downfall has been Americans listening to the Commies deride Capitalism, while perverting the free markets, to create monopolies for themselves, while at the same time getting the general public to bitch about fees, rather than the underlying grift, fraud, and outright destruction of food and housing security in America.

stereotomy says

That, and 15% 30-year mortgages will make a cash purchase for a home that much more affordable.

And would bankrupt probably 30-40% of loan holders who use their house as a credit card and cash out ATM to keep their lifestyles up. I'm good with current interest rates, maybe a touch higher, but 15% would destroy the economy the way it operates now and how people use their equity.

Put this way, there were zero side by side off road vehicles in my town when we moved here. Now there's a couple hundred. Not a joke. I know these people. They used their house to buy $20k toys as they for sure don't have the income to have 2-3 cars AND a side by side. They refi'd and bought them.

On the commission thing, it won't move the needle much. Performing brokers will love it. All the morons selling 2-3 houses a year will disappear. They'll suck up those deals and make up for the lower commission with volume. So open house Sunday Sally quits making $20k/yr as a house wife with her side gig. Boo hoo. She'll go sell jewelry or house products for some MLM scheme and get the same $20k.

Basically it's obviously good for owners and buyers. But as twisted as it sounds it's great for the good brokers that actually do good work. It will weed out the shit. In all 15 years of my career we at least weekly game planned for this if commissions were lower or if WE lowered our commissions.

IMO, just another attack on free market capitalism.

No one puts a gun to your head forcing you sign the Listing AGREEMENT. What most people don't stop to realize is that the Agreement is negotiable. If the agent wants the listing bad enough, they'll be willing to bargain. Include incentives, such as, if the property sells within 30 days of listing, seller to pay amount. If the listing agent sells the property, commission shall be reduced to _ (because of no co-broke), etc., etc. Also, a clause should be added that the listing agreement can be canceled by the seller with 24 hour notice if dissatisfied with services.
The consumer needs to be their own advocate, instead of relying on their Government Nanny to protect them.

Americans complain about the excessive power of government, and yet, they lead the cheering section when the government over-regulates industry.

Also, IMO, this will not hold up in appeals. No doubt, the NAR will take this case all the way to the Supreme Court if necessary.

RayAmerica says

What most people don't stop to realize is that the Agreement is negotiable.

True, but the best you can do is cut the listing agent commission. That is, something like 1% to the selling/listing agent 3% to the buyer's agent. If you cut the buyer's agent commission below 3%, or maybe 2.5%, no one will show your house. And even cutting the listing agent's commission will only be possible in a strong seller's market.

HeadSet says

RayAmerica says

What most people don't stop to realize is that the Agreement is negotiable.

True, but the best you can do is cut the listing agent commission. That is, something like 1% to the selling/listing agent 3% to the buyer's agent. If you cut the buyer's agent commission below 3%, or maybe 2.5%, no one will show your house. And even cutting the listing agent's commission will only be possible in a strong seller's market.

This. I read the contract and start crossing out shit, then it's a dick measuring contest to see if the other party will sign off on it. EVERYTHING IS NEGOTIABLE. If you don't want to be the dick or asshole who has to do it, then walk away.

https://www.thebignewsletter.com/p/the-middleman-economy-why-realtors

There’s another case in Chicago going to trial early next year, with potential damages in the amount of $40 billion. And the lawyers who just prevailed in Missouri filed a national class action lawsuit against NAR and major brokerages just hours after their victory in Missouri. In total, damages across the economy could amount to $400 billion, which would bankrupt NAR and every MLS brokerage in the country.

I started my career in tech way back in 1990 for an MLS. No internet at that time. They used TI terminals that printed out on thermal paper. 300 bps connection with your phone handset plugged in.

Even then, I questioned how any of this complied with antitrust law. I was told. "You're young, just starting out. So...we understand that you may not know the difference between knowing when to say things or knowing when to just STFU..."

I figured this day would come...but surprised it took so long.

PumpingRedheads says

"You're young, just starting out. So...we understand that you may not know the difference between knowing when to say things or knowing when to just STFU..."

Good advice.