patrick.net

ZippyDDoodah says

1. it’s patently false since Obama/Pelosi’s deficits exceed Reagans in size and in percentage of GDP.

It's like W and his FY09 budget never existed.

ZippyDDoodah says

After Dems decimated our national defense under Carter, Reagan had to spend $$ to rebuild in order to win the cold war

your history is faulty. For one, the Cold War was won more by Levi's, Apple Computer, the crazy industriousness if not inventiveness of the Japanese, and rock music than defense hardware, and at any rate the hardware we did have in the 80s was initiated and/or developed under Carter's admin not Reagan's, for obvious reasons if you understood military procurement. Eg. the M-1 Abrams went from prototype in 1976 to production in 1980, curiously coincident with the Carter administration you so wrongfully impugn.

ZippyDDoodah says

and the resulting deficits which resulted from this spending.

O'Neill said he tried to warn Vice President Dick Cheney that growing budget deficits-expected to top $500 billion this fiscal year alone-posed a threat to the economy. Cheney cut him off. "You know, Paul, Reagan proved deficits don't matter," he said, according to excerpts. Cheney continued: "We won the midterms (congressional elections). This is our due."

-- from Paul O'Neill's expose of the late and unlamented administration, a sorry excuse for a government that is so quickly disappearing down the memory hole.

I will grant you though that the Republicans deserve just as much credit as Clinton for putting the nation on a solid fiscal course in the 90s (well, except for their total opposition to the tax rise in 1993, which they so-incorrectly claimed was going to destroy the universe). It was painful holding the 90s (non-black budget) defense establishment to under $300B/yr, but we did it, together.

National debt held by the public was $550B in 1977 and $800B in 1981, an actual decrease in real terms.

In 1989 the national debt held by the public was $2.2T, which was a clean doubling of the debt in real terms.

Clinton (and the Republicans running Congress 1994-2000) inherited a $3.25B debt in 1993 and left us with it at $3.32B in 2001. Nicely done!

(I don't count intra-governmental debt since it, in isolation, isn't a bad debt to have on the books -- retirees have to put their savings somewhere, and a forced investment program in T-bonds is a win-win when run responsibly)

Bush took this $3.32B from FY01 and ran it up to $7.5T at the end of FY09, "only" a 75% increase in real terms, so he was no Reagan in the end.

In the first six months of this FY the national debt has increased $800B, quite an impressive rate of increase given the free money the government is getting with interest rates from our creditors. If this nominal rate of increase remains constant the national debt will be $20T when Obama is elected for his third term in 2013 (the 2012 election will be delayed due to unfortunate disturbances in the Hope & Change reeducation centers).

Nevertheless liberals still deny the individuals full ownership of himself, denies his right to control his person and property and declares that a very great deal of his time effort and assets are at the disposable property of the state, to be redistributed to others at the discretion of government officials. On this premise, the liberal mind assumes the right to tax and regulate the citizenry but denies those activities are theft, coercion and domination.

Similar actions apply to the liberal agenda's intrusions into the world of contractual agreements and social relationships. The entire liberal enterprise is rationalized as beneficial, while the people who have lost sight and vision of individual liberty and individual responsibility, are duped into voting for manipulators masking as statesman with noble purposes.

In short, the government invites the citizen to vote for the candidate who promises what a parent promises a CHILD. It invites his to assume the DEPENDENT ROLE of the CHILD, to surrender his personal sovereignty to the state, ignore his obligation to take full responsibility for his material and social welfare, and to empower government hacks to be his MOMMY.

THIS IS A PERSCRIPTION FOR PATHOLOGICAL DEPENDENCY for weak minded, narrow minded, short sighted, controlling, do-gooders. Its commonly referred to today as the "Nanny State", "cradle-to-grave welfare", or "the road to serfdom".

Todays book: "From Dawn to Decadence" by Jacques Barzun

Abe--

So what you are saying is-- don't let the facts get in the way of my good story... "Nevertheless....."

We need to get back to the original intent of this thread. The challenge for all those that love BIG GOVERNMENT, TAXES, etc. is to participate in this fund raising drive of which I am an enthusiastic supporter. I'm thrilled to give liberals an opportunity to prove they are not hypocrites by making it easy for them to donate towards the cause. Why wait for Big Brother to raise taxes? Take charge and raise taxes on yourself. Again, GIVE UNTIL IT HURTS !

RayAmerica says

We need to get back to the original intent of this thread.

If the original intent of this thread was to point out that liberals have a place to donate, you failed. The link isn't specific to liberals, conservatives, etc. And why do you keep yelling at us?

;RayAmerica says

GIVE UNTIL IT HURTS !

Honest Abe says

THIS IS A PERSCRIPTION FOR PATHOLOGICAL DEPENDENCY

Your "perscriptions" seem to be working, btw.

Do ya'll really believe that if you perceive no one is listening, all you have to do is repeat yourself loudly? Sure doesn't seem to be working.

elliemae says

If the original intent of this thread was to point out that liberals have a place to donate, you failed.

I take that to mean you aren't going to donate. How sad. So much for putting your money where your mouth is. LOL

RayAmerica says

I take that to mean you aren’t going to donate

Take it however you would like (you don't need my permission, but it's nice that you asked).

RayAmerica says

So much for putting your money where your mouth is.

How much did you donate?

Nomograph says

You throw this all away in exchange for AM talk radio propaganda and a victim mentality. It’s both a shame and an embarrassment.

...and constantly attacks little ol' me. If I weren't a mature woman, I'd be hurt over his constant attacks upon me and what he perceives to be my beliefs. Instead, it's merely comical that he's unable to see how each attack endeavors to make him look boorish.

Did I use too many big words?

bob2356 says

As a patriotic true American you must as a matter of ethical purity turn all your friends in for cheating on their taxes.

Dear Bob2356:

My name is jethro (name changed to protect the guilty) and I - gasp - lied on my taxes. Maybe not lied - more like omitted the truth. An entry on my form was incorrect - which substantially changes my liability and therefore renders my tax return incorrect. I don't know what to do - as a patriotic 'merican should I turn myself in? If I do, will I receive a reward? I realize that the amount of the fraud, including penalties, interest & fees/fines etc, must be at least two million dollars - but I'm confident that the malfeasance involved will be egrigious enough to warrant a full investigation.

Line 19 on Schedule A was underreported by $600; ellie (I mean jethro) recently found the receipt but the taxes were already filed. This changes her (I mean his) tax liability by about $10 (less, not more). Elliemae was well aware that he/she was underreporting this amount (and the pup whose photo appears on the site was complicit), yet due to her/his lack of ability to maintain an adequate filling system the correct amount wasn't applied when considering her/his share of taxes used to support lazy, shiftless, welfare-abusing liberals.

My question is this, Bob2356: I intend to wear a light-colored sundress when I become a turncoat - must I wait until after Memorial Day to wear the white shoes that match it or should I go with a conservative dark non-matching color of sensible shoes?

Jethrelliemaero

Sorry to point this out, but the dems are tax and spend; however, the republicans are borrow and spend. http://www.lafn.org/gvdc/Natl_Debt_Chart.html

just want to point out cuts in defence spending aren't dead. You could cut defence by two-thirds and we wouldn't be any less secure. It's all in the way we fight wars. Obliterate the enemy and walk away- forget about trying to get everybody to believe we're the good guys. They're just lucky we don't go after the spoils of war. Do that a few times and they'll stop fuckin' with us. Save our money and political will for a truly dangerous enemy like China.

Isn't it easier to blame all of our problems on the other guy? Only, in this case, the other guy is a friend, a neighbor, or some cute lil' pup on a real estate forum on the interweb?

RayAmerica says

Weimar Republic here we come!

Yes, because there is no in-between. You're either the US or the Weimar Republic..

How has a weak currency worked for China for the last 10 years? Doesn't seem like some a bad thing to me...

China is the next bubble waiting to bust.

China will call all debts due and come to collect ..... we will play the part of Mexico while they play the part of France.

Additionally, I've asked Ray on more than one occasion to detail exactly what he would cut from the Federal budget that is large enough to make a difference. Please share Ray.

tatupu70 says

Additionally, I’ve asked Ray on more than one occasion to detail exactly what he would cut from the Federal budget that is large enough to make a difference. Please share Ray.

LOL. I've stated it a number of times on this site on other posts. You either fail to read my statements or can't comprehend. Which is it?

... or is that a Goose?

For some strange reason, I have a hard time taking seriously anyone that uses a photo of a duck that breathes out of his mouth.

RayAmerica says

LOL. I’ve stated it a number of times on this site on other posts. You either fail to read my statements or can’t comprehend. Which is it?

I failed to see them. Perhaps you could be a good chap and re-post your thoughts?

I've heard it said that communism over time moves toward capitalism and that over time capitalism moves toward communism.

Religion is the opiate of the masses- Karl Marx.

So what you're saying here is, now is the time for Rush Limbaugh & Glen Beck to move to China. It will be the Capitalist Paradise in no time! I look forward to this.

Ha, that's right they'll be in capitalist hog heaven in no time.

Is there such a thing as a fundamentalist buddist?

:)

Oh yeah, they're called the communist party- stay within the lines.

Ray-

Still waiting to see what you'd cut from the Federal Budget that saves enough money to make a difference....

tatupu70 says

Ray-
Still waiting to see what you’d cut from the Federal Budget that saves enough money to make a difference….

As I've stated to you in the past: a drastic and dramatic cut across the board on all Federal Gov't spending. Shut down the Department of Education. Drastically cut military spending across the board as well, including the elimination of most military bases around the world. Bring home the troops from most of Europe, South Korea, Iraq & Afghanistan, etc. That's just for starters and off the top of my head. Do you think that might make a difference?

The lad doth protest too much, methinks.

RayAmerica says

I didn’t say that. I did say liberals and Hitler share the same economic views, such as inflationary public works programs.

Sometimes you've got to inflate to stand still, ya know?

http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/graph/?chart_type=line&s[1][id]=MZM&s[1][range]=1yr

The totalitarian Keynesian economy of Nazi Germany did not result in domestic inflation per se -- according to wikipedia real wages fell 25% from 1933 to 1938 as the Nazi Party established and enforced wage/price controls, eliminated collective bargaining and even the individual worker's absolute right to change employment.

Obama so far has shown himself to be a centrist -- somewhat to the right of Nixon -- and hasn't done much of anything that surprising on the economics front.

The whole f---ing thing is stoved in from the beating it took from the previous crew. Jesus.

Congratulations on proving what a liar you are by taking out of context what I actually said.
Nomograph says

RayAmerica says
Please tell me the difference between FDR, Obama and Hitler

Actual quote: RayAmerica says

Please tell me the difference between FDR, Obama and Hitler’s public works “stimulus” programs?

I am a liberal and I will glady donate to the pay.gov site. But I want something in return. Something along the lines of a no bid contract or no show job. I would like that.

Housing,

I think they call that "PayGo." You pay and then you go get your no bid contract.

RayAmerica says

Housing,
I think they call that “PayGo.” You pay and then you go get your no bid contract.

Unfortunately, after Citizens United I'm afraid it will become more and more the case...

tatupu70 says

Unfortunately, after Citizens United I’m afraid it will become more and more the case…

Right. I find it kind of interesting too that Obama's biggest contributor was Goldman Sachs. I wonder why? Do you think it was all because they believe Obama would be indifferent and objective when it came to the interests of GS? Both parties are corrupt because the process is corrupt.

RayAmerica says

Right. I find it kind of interesting too that Obama’s biggest contributor was Goldman Sachs. I wonder why? Do you think it was all because they believe Obama would be indifferent and objective when it came to the interests of GS? Both parties are corrupt because the process is corrupt

Well, I find it ironic that you are wrong (again). Goldman wasn't Obama's #1 contributer, it was the University of California system. Goldman was #2, and was the #4 contributor to John McCain's campaign.

Instead of quibbling about who gave how much to what campaign, how about we get some real campaign finance reform and end this issue once and for all..

Well, I find it ironic that you are wrong (again). Goldman wasn’t Obama’s #1 contributer, it was the University of California system. Goldman was #2, and was the #4 contributor to John McCain’s campaign.

These massive contributions to Obama from the financial sector need to be juxtaposed with Obama's shameless lying about what he was doing at the time http://ur.lc/j73

"I am in this race to tell the corporate lobbyists that their days of setting the agenda in Washington are over. I have done more than any other candidate in this race to take on lobbyists - and won. They have not funded my campaign, they will not get a job in my White House, and they will not drown out the voices of the American people when I am president."

In hindsight, it's incredible the lies that he's gotten away with.. yet there are so many many who defend his lies.. for the "greater good" of course.